All right, good evening, everyone. We're going to get started here just a minute. So this is a little different than our normal kind of formal council meeting and the reason why the council wanted to move this into more of a workshop event is so that it could be a two-way, an easy two-way discussion, unlike public comment at council that's very formal and you have a time limit. There's no time limit tonight. This is going to be recorded. And it will be available on the city website. So if you have friends or others that you think would benefit from watching this, please invite them. You can forward them the link. As far as wanting to, again, have a two-way conversation. Christina's got some speakers cards or speakers cards out front just so that we can stay somewhat coordinated. Go ahead and just fill out a speaker card. If during the event there's something you want to talk about and you haven't filled out a speaker's card yet just raise your hand and we'll Probably the easiest way to manage it so Let me quickly do some introductions so I don't know if everybody know who who's up here But there's several volunteers that are here. So I have the chair of two of our committees here in the city. So Ray Fernandez is the chair of our planning committee. Quonley is the chair of our emergency preparedness committee. Again, two voluntary positions that we have here in the city that look after the various aspects of our codes and ensuring that we are as prepared as we can be for any event that happens. To my left, I'll let the gentleman over here introduce themselves and their roles, but Chiefs, if you guys want to start, and we'll go from there. Okay. So my name is Edward Martin. I'm the Lahab-Rahid's deputy chief. Thank you very much. My name is Ryan Jorgensen. I am the Battalion Chief of Fire Prevention and EMS. I'm your Fire Marshall. Hello, my name is Dante Corného. I'm with my Safe LA. I'm our Wildfire Operations Supervisor Captain. So we reached out to Firesafe and Dante for a couple of reasons. Number one, like to understand what's going on across LA County in the region when it comes to how our other cities getting prepared and what changes are they making to things like codes both from a code enforcement perspective but also from a building code perspective and a planning perspective so that we can understand what's happening across the county across the region in this space, Understand some of the best practices that are going on and be asking the Planning Commission and our Preparedness Committee to start looking at how we begin to adopt some of these practices that we see. Cause I've heard from several of you that are here tonight that have done some recent home remodeling and other work that maybe we weren't as progressive as we thought with our fire codes and some of the building codes as we should be. So Dante's going to help us understand what's going on across the region in that aspect. Our fire chiefs will help us understand what the fire department is doing in this area. Specifically, you know, I'm looking for our fire marshal this year to be, and I'll use a term here and please don't take it the wrong way, but given what has happened, I'll say it this way, incredibly aggressive with how we manage the vegetation and brush this season. I think everyone knows we haven't got a lot of rain this year. There was a lot of growth last year and we've had just enough rain this year to drive significant growth again this year. So looking to have a conversation about that, and then, I'm looking to kind of start pulling a lot of this together from an emergency preparedness perspective, especially beginning, and I know there's a gentleman, John Dominguez, is here too that's been working on evacuation planning. One of the things that I think a lot of us saw horrifically on January 7th was bulldozers pushing cars out of the way in the palisades because people couldn't evacuate. We can't have that happen here. So again, focused on what do we do to to make sure we have safe and effective evacuation planning and evacuation routes. The EPC last over the last couple of years has been working on that. I know we did a lot of tree removal along Hossie Endon, some of the other roads to make sure that we began to get rid of some of the more dangerous trees in the city and then Ray from a planning perspective we obviously have some code enhancements that we're gonna need to get pretty aggressive with with moving forward. So that's kind of the It's gonna be pretty free-flowing. We're gonna start with with my my safe LA and a presentation. I've got two speakers cards Steve and Glenn do you guys want to speak now or do you want to speak during the event? Steve wants to speak now, okay. Thank you, Steve and Black and Citroen Road speaking on my own behalf. Has a home ever been lost in the harbor heights to a brush fire? Even the 1955 fire memorialized out front had no loss of homes. This could be good to know for getting house insurance. Clearing dry and dead brush is good. We've seen that certain flammable trees are far worse, spreading sparks, flames, and embers. The city weed abatement brochure could encourage removal of eucalyptus, fan poms, and Italian cypress trees with pictures of them. We've also seen an article has been written about the protective nature of other trees and vegetation. In Altadena people reported seeing flying burning embers landing in deodor cedar trees and being extinguished. Coast live oaks also were reported to block flying embers. There are so many pictures of homes and scineray to ash, yet surrounding trees and bushes are green. I have seen this in pictures of many fires for many years. After a fire up north, a fire official attributed avocado groves is saving the city of Galita from burning down. In Irvine, avocado groves were incorporated into a fire protection plan for housing tract. It is easy to say remove all the most vegetation from round houses. There will be nothing or little to burn. However, healthy trees and bushes not only make the city more scenic and provide privacy, they also can be protective against fire. I have four to five foot high jade plants adjacent to parts of my house. They are standing water. I am more defended with them than I would be if they weren't there. More focus should be placed on home hardening. Maybe are alternate years with focus on weed abatement one year and home hardening the next. Just as, if not more important than fuel modification, home hardening is ignition prevention. While we have seen damaging recent fires, there were millions of other just as flammable acres that did not burn. Why? No ignition. Nothing started a fire. It is somewhat a misnomer to call these wildfires, and they are man-made and most entirely preventable. Whether started by homeless parties, vehicles, arson, or power lines, they're all man-made. I heard two recent fires made and started by someone firing a flare gun into a canyon. Pretty sad. There were regular fires in the hills above my house, the Skyline Ridge Line. Most people lighting fires after accessing the hills through the Punta de Leste gate, since that has been closed. The fires are few. A lot is said about the threat of power to canyon. There are no coyotes as squirrels dropping lit cigarettes. The real problem is protecting power to canyon from people. It could be prudent to close Fulge and Road and Skyline Drive along power to Canyon to non-resident traffic on red flag days. There have been fires along Haasienda. It would similarly be prudent to close Haasienda to truth through traffic on red flag days. The power lines along the northern city border are a risk. I heard that one of the line sets is not used but don't know for sure. Would that be good to find out? While the towers, the tallest towers were proposed, the city could have joined Chino Hills to get them placed underground. Council members Bergman and Carol spoke before the Public Utilities Commission at the time, but the rest of the council opposed requiring Edison to put them underground. In summary, encouraged removal of flammable trees, allow healthy trees and bushes to remain and be placed around new construction. Encourage home hardening, close roads to non-residents, and take measures to protect the city on red flag days. Thank you. Thank you, Stephen. Glenn, did you want to? Hello. Glenn Peterson, 441 West Skyline Drive. I'm actually going to dive into a fairly specific item that John asked me to come up and talk about. That is a recent roof installation project that I've completed. What preceded this was my insurance being canceled and a 30 item list of fixates. One of the items was rubbed. My roof didn't need fixing. It was the best as shingle land. It was the best as shingle land. It was asphalt shingle. But you know, you just can't, there's no way to talk to the insurance underwriter and their agents are kind of powerless when it comes to when they want to cancel you. So anyway, to the roof, one of the things they asked for, I guess it was not the roof, but associated with the roof, is a 16th inch mesh screening on all my vents to prevent embers from entering the attic. And so I did this, but it wasn't easy. My contractor didn't know what to do about it. They just are familiar with their lineup of products that they offer. And I checked all their products out. The roof bench for all eight of an inch, the ridge meant was even worse. It was eight of an inch to a quarter inch, and it was slots. You know, so I found that kind of interesting that they could go polar permit using those products. And I'm pretty sure they could with the city, but I didn't go that route. I knew enough to require them to go 16th of an inch which became a big go-around with them because they didn't really know how to accomplish that. I mean I eventually bought a roll of 16th inch mesh from Home Depot and every opening in my roof got 16 inch mesh laid down over it and then whatever they wanted to provide they provided on top. I still had two vents put in where the rufflers are so unfamiliar with doing this that they just forgot and they they put it in and I'm with my flashlight peeking in there and I realized they had quarter inch or eighth in the bench, I'm not quite sure which. And so they had to come back and redo those. When I spoke to the inspector, when they came out, I mentioned this to the inspector. And the inspector told me that the city doesn't have a 16th-inch requirement, that an eighth of an inch is all that's needed. Found that odd and I would like to see, I hope we changed that. And it's about it with that experience. I did want to echo what Stephen said about the plants, you know, and particularly in the five foot clear zone and even around the house. The type of plant makes a difference. Let's get rid of the, let's work on the flammable ones, but keep the ones that are known to be fire resistant. Back to my insurance experience, I have Jade Plant 2, and the only person I could really get any info out of was the inspector that they sent. The inspector just says I take photographs and write up a checklist. I asked him about the Jade plant. You know, or what is a flammable shrub or what's a shrub in my clear zone. He pointed to my Jade plant and said that one qualifies. It would need to go. I'll leave it with that. Obviously that plant did not need to go. Thank you. Thanks, Gwen. All right. We'll move to our fire see. I think you have a presentation. That is correct. Do you have a presentation? It'll be pulling up on screen and then I'll have my laptop just so I can kind of follow along as we present. If you guys have any questions, feel free to raise your hand. I'm used to standing up all doing this, so forgive me as I kind of want to get a little jump in and stand up. But if you have any questions, feel free to raise my hand. If I don't know the answer to your questions, I'll write them down. And I'll try and get back to you and try and research that as much as I can. A little bit about my background. I reintroduce myself. I'm Don Te Cordejo. I form a while in Firefighter with the US Forest Service. I was with the Paloma Hot Chots for several seasons and been an EMT for the past six years. Just graduated with my bachelor's degree in fire administration and I've been with my safe LA for just over a year now. But I oversee all of our wildfire resilience operations within LA County and Riverside County. I try and keep myself as educated as I can when it comes to what the current standards are and what ensures are offering in terms of requirements. There's been a lot of changes. Like I said, if I don't know the answer, I'll try and research and get back to you, but this is the the presentation I have for you guys tonight. So first off, welcome to the CERWALD Fire Preparedness Representation. We can go ahead and go to our next slide. So I have it designated into several different parts just to kind of make it a little bit easier to follow along. This first part is just kind of going to be a quick overview. So these are the current threats in terms of what is currently going on within the county of LA. Are next slide please. So LA counties we know is pretty much surrounded. LA county is currently the highest risk, as we know a lot of our canyons are filled with excessive vegetation, doing part two. The strong winter rains these past couple years. All of the fire, all the correction, all of the pictures in our presentation have been taken in-house from our photographers. But as we've know, there's been, there was multiple, several different brush fires within the summer of 2023 and we had many different brush tires brush fires to start off this new year of 2025 Thank you so current numbers on a wildfire this is currently out of date but from FEMA so the LA counties ranked at the top 100% in the US at risk for wildfire. Approximately 500,000 of its homes or properties within LA County are at risk, which is about a quarter of the homes within LA County. So there's a significant risk, which I'm sure as you guys know, which we just experienced at the start of this year. 2021 study supported by NOAA, which is the National Oceanic Atmospheric Association, concluded that climate change has been the main driver with the increase of wildfire. So as we know, things have been kind of going on. We've been having weather winters, hotter summers, and we've just kind of returned to transitioning from La Niña to El Niño, so from a lot of rain to a lot of two more drier climate. So these are pictures that we know, I'm sure you guys are kind of familiar with in terms of your area of what some areas might look like. So this is what area might look like today, and this is what it could possibly look like so this is what area might one this is what one one area might look like today and This is what it could possibly look like tomorrow So when it comes to preparing it's best to start in terms of preparing for wildfire starting today or as soon as you can because as we know We don't know when the next wildfire will happen But what we do have control over is when we start to prepare for it. So as wildfires become more dangerous, the best resistance is to limit the ignitability of your home and property. So when we talk about that, it will be going into our next section of both home hardening and defensible space efforts in terms of what to focus on. And there's two things when it comes to walled fires and defending your home and properties. I break it up into risks and hazards. Risks is something that you have control over. You can lower your risk of something affecting you. When it comes to hazards, you can only identify them and just know how to act. So a hazard would be a wildfire. A risk is going to be the vegetation around your home or your current status in terms of home hardening. You can better prepare your home. You can only just prepare in terms of a wildfire and what actions you'll take when that happens. So this is going to be our next part in terms of home hardening. So this is how kind of my safe LA helps out. So we are the regional fire safe council for LA County. If there's, I can kind of all dive into that a little bit later, but there's two different programs that are free. One is called the California Firesafe Council and the other one is going to be the NFPA Firewise Community, which I'll dive into about that a little bit later. So when we kind of discuss preparing, it all starts with a plan. So you wanna make a wildfire plan, you wanna plan to prepare, you wanna make a preparedness plan, and ultimately plan to survive, and what's gonna come after, how to recover. When we talk about making sure that we're notified, there's multiple ways of getting notification systems. One of them is going to be notify LA. I'm sure everyone is familiar with watch duty and I'm sure people have nightmares with that notification system of that ringing going off. There's multiple different avenues of getting yourself notified of when a wild fart would be potentially approaching. Another one would be getting yourself a NOAA radio. These radios work by the National Oceanic and atmosphere association will notify you if there is a natural disaster in the area where it's tornado earthquake, wildfire, and they naturally trigger themselves. How they work is it plugs into the wall, you kind of set it and kind of forget it in the sense of you plug it in, it has a battery backup. If the power were to go out, that battery backup would take over so you do still, so you would still get notified as well. We'd also recommend that you build a wildfire go kit in the sense of if a wildfire happens in the build of the night, you at least have some materials in terms of important documents, extra clothing, et cetera, ready to go in case that happens in your cutoff card with that. Also creating a family communications plan, identifying if someone's at home kind of what steps are you going to take in terms of if someone's at home and someone's at work, how are you going to notify each other, where are you going to meet potentially, also having an area outside of the city or county if you have to evacuate having a potential person as a place to go or a person to call if as things kind of get inundated with evacuation centers and hotels if that's possible. And then ultimately it comes with creating defensible space around your home and home hardening. And when we talk about kind of developing a plan, you want to practice as much as you can. If you, if that's creating a contact list and putting it on to your refrigerator, just in case technology goes out, you at least have that in case your phone dies and you don't have any of your emergency contacts number saved. So just kind of doing that. And then joining a group of other homeowners to share with our parents information, it's a community effort, it's not a solo endeavor. So working together, there's plenty of us in this room right now, if we all go out and find one thing about wildfire, that's a wealth of knowledge that we can all share and share with each other. And then ultimately ensuring your home and property if possible. And we'll kind of talk about that in terms of what's going on with the insurance and then how to ultimately better prepare yourselves to be as insurable as possible. So a good point was brought up both twice earlier when it comes to home hardening. Home hardening is going to be one of the two key things that you can do in terms of reducing the chance of your home being destroyed by a fire. So when we talk about home hardening, there's several different things to focus on. One major component is going to be vents. And the current recommendation is a 1-8 inch mesh green on your vents. However, some insurers are acquiring a more stringent and that would be a 1-16-inch. I would recommend with the 1-16th as well just for the reason being the reason why vents are screened is in a wind-driven fire, embers are going to be flying through the air, embers can spot up to a mile ahead if the winds are strong enough. So when your events are appropriately screened with a finer mesh, the size of the ember that will get through is going to be a lot smaller. And if it does land, there's a less of a chance of it possibly igniting. If you have a one-quarter inch screen, the embers that can get through are a lot bigger and they can start to accumulate, which can, how a lot of houses catch on fires is going to be from the attic with that screening. So if you go with a finer mesh, these sides will be a lot smaller and potential to cause less damage. And I always say potential because it's never 100%. You can take all the steps, but ultimately, it's never going to be 100% just to be fully transparent with everyone, but you can lower your risk as much as you can. When it was also brought up about roofing, so there's different classifications of roofing, there's a class A roof, which is going to be the most accessible roof. And when we talk about class A roofs, it's, they're going to be kind of the ones that are going to be metal or Spanish tile or clay. When we ask about roofs or going to be classified as a class C, so that's probably why you're unsure, requested you to upgrade it. Although it can be pretty expensive, that's going to be something that kind of ties into home hardening. And when we talk about home hardening, it's all about kind of taking it in pieces, especially it can be very expensive if you try to do it all at once. So identifying one thing to kind of focus on, that would lower your risk a lot more if you left it than as it is. So if you focus on your rents, work on your rents. As soon as that's done, identifying what the next part is, whether that's boxing in your eaves, as you can see in the second row of pictures, that middle picture there, as you can see in the Second row of pictures that middle picture there if you can see it that's what open eaves looks like and that Picture to the right of it is going to be boxing those in so and the point of boxing in your eaves with a windroom fire When the wind is coming in it'll hit your house or the just any wall and it will kind of eddy up into a current effect up into your roof or into where those eaves are and it will kind of start to throw embers up into those eaves if they are not maintained. So boxing that ends just helps lower that risk overall. So the next slide is going to be about events and I have kind of touched on that. So these are some different examples of events. The bottom picture is going to be foundational events. But ultimately, the overall goal is to screen in all the events you have, whether it's your attic vent, foundational vent. And then one of those pictures there is going to be a spark, a rest or over chimney. Spark resters are important in terms of if you use a fireplace or not, but it's good for keeping the embers from your fireplace out from getting out and starting a walk far that way, but ultimately if embers do get into your fireplace, they're not really getting go anywhere. But using home hardening and screening all your events going to be super important. The next slide is going to be talked about windows and shutters. Swapping your windows from a single pane to a dual pane tempered glass is going to be very important. Although this can be, like I said, expensive, focusing on one thing at a time is going to be the easiest way to tackle all of the stuff. But when it comes to swapping your windows, the reason why we recommend dual pain is because they are more heat resistant. And if one does break, there you have a secondary backup layer as well. Tempered glass also does break into smaller pieces versus your single pane are going to be break into larger pieces and going to be a lot sharper. And why we recommend shutters over windows is, sorry, shutters over curtains. Courts can be flammable. So if your window does break, the embers can hate your curtains and then potentially ignite your curtains and then the rest of your house from there. Whereas shutters, it could be a lot more resistant. And the next slide is going to be talked about roofs which I've touched on. And then our next slide is kind of what to do if all this is kind of too expensive. So there's things that you can do or that all it takes is your time and energy. So when it comes to taking steps to decrease the ignatability of your home, a lot of the stuff can kind of seem like common sense, but it might not feel like that because there's a lot of unknown. So focusing on different things is going to be super important when we talk about fire prevention actions. So if you have stacks of wood that are right next to your house, grabbing that and moving them at least 12 feet away from your house is going to be better than keeping it right there, or moving it to the edge of the property line. So that's something that all it takes is your time and energy is to pick it up and move it over there. Any overhanging branches that might touch your roof or decking, removing those limbs from touching your roof and decks for two reasons. If there is a canopy fire, if that tree does ignite, that's a potential pathway to having your house ignite. Or from the leaf litter or dropping from that fire, can accumulate onto your roof and potentially start a fire that way. Cleaning out any decks and pool areas, you'd be surprised how much dead vegetation can accumulate under deckings and pools. So if you have access to getting under that area, cleaning it up as much as you can is going to help reduce that risk as well. Keeping your gutters clean and considering covering them with protective shields. What we mean by that is if you have open exposed gutters, going in and making sure that there's not a, that there's not a lot of dead vegetation that is just kind of staying stagnant in those gutters, and then you can screen them with a gutter guard. That is metal. And what that does is if you do have a tree that throws a lot of deadly use onto your roofs or guttersters it stays on top and it makes it easier for you Just to kind of take the leaf blower if you have access to it or just go up on a ladder or if you have a person that Cleanes it just wipe it off that way and clean it off just so that vegetation does not accumulate inside of the gutters Installing shutters on windows if you can't afford dual-pane replacements. So So, shutters is going to be a lot more safer than curtains if you can't afford dual pane replacements so shutters is gonna be a lot more safer than curtains if you can't afford dual pane but ultimately dual pane is gonna be the safest way to go but these is just kind of some low cost options while while you focus on other things moving patio furniture at least eight feet away from your home a lot of people we have patio furniture, especially wooden patio furniture. That is right next to our doors and stuff. Moving that as far as possible, at least eight feet out of that five foot zone, or I'll kind of discuss that momentarily, is going to be a lot safer. Also, if you have cushions on your patio furniture, I always recommend kind of starting to develop a, I guess, when it rains, we know to grab a raincoat and umbrella, but when it's fire season, we don't know what to do in the sense of we have to start adapting. So when that humidity drops and that heat goes up, starting to do a few things. So if you have cushions on your patio furniture, going out and removing those cushions, because there could be potential for a wildfire event. So cushions can be pretty flammable, they're gonna be lump or flammable, then your current patio furniture. So if you have removable cushions or covers, taking those off and bringing those inside so that they're protected, so those are not igniting. Not letting any toy stack up against your structure. So kids toys, plastics, those are a lot pretty flammable in the sense of plastics or oil-based. So if there's a good radiant heat that will start heating that up and potentially melting down all that plastic material which can then ignite your house as well. So either keeping those inside or putting those away as far as you can. And then ensuring that your garage door closes and seals completely. There's many times where I've gone out and I've done a wildfire home assessment on someone's property and the seal on the garage door. There's very big gaps and the garage door doesn't seal the way. And especially from this past fire, a lot of homeowners were telling me that they had a lot of ash in their garage and they couldn't figure out why. And I took a look and I was like, you have a gap like this big in the corner. So just, you know, you guys know your homes and you guys might not see these things, but trying to take a deeper look with a finer microscope and just identifying possible pathways into your home is going to be a lot safer. So our next part, we're going to be discussing a study I apologize. We're going to be discussing a defensible space. So 13 of the most destructive fires have happened since 2017. This is also out of date. I forgot to accumulate from these past two. But 20 of the most destructive fires have happened in the past eight years. Combined with these fires combined, they've nearly destroyed about 40,000 structures and structures and killed about 150 people. So creating defensible space is going to be super important especially by establishing a buffer zone. So the reason why we discussed defensible space is to reduce ignition points around your property. And in terms of if a fire is coming there there's going to be less and less fuel as it approaches your property. And by taking defensible space actions, you can reduce the chance of ignition by a two from 25 to 75%. Like I said earlier, it's never going to be 100% because there's going to be a lot of variables that can plane to how a structure burns or what not, but you do lower your risk overall by taking these steps. So our first thing is going to be talking about zone zero. Has anyone heard of zone zero at all? Raise a hand. Who's not familiar with zone zero? Okay. So I'll discuss zone zero. So if you guys can kind of see that. So what zone zero is, we are talking about the zero to five foot zone from your structure. So from any wall out five feet, that is going to be referred as zone zero. So zone zero is actually a law that was passed in 2021, that's not currently enforced. However, insurance companies, many of them have zone zero requirements. So what zone zero means is no flammable material within that zero to five foot zone. So no vegetation that could be potentially flammable. And some insurance insurers actually state no vegetation at all. So just having a non combustible area within that zero to five foot zone, such as River Rock, Peace Zone. And the reason why this is important is because a lot of studies are showing that in a windroom fire when those embers do hit your house and they bounce off, they land within that zero to five foot zone. And that's a major factor in terms of igniting a lot of the structures in wildfires. Our next zone is going to be zone one. And so when we talk about zone one, this is going to be that zone a little bit further out, five to 30 feet out. And what to focus on in this first zone is going to be removing any dead plants grasses weeds trying to think lean and green so trying to Fin out as much vegetation as you can removing dead or dry Leaves or pine needles in that area trimming trees regularly and keeping a minimum of 10 feet from other trees if possible But ultimately we want to try and create as much separation as you can But in some places that's not fully realistic. So It's trying to do it as best you can and also when we can talk about trimming trees We want to trim it the overall size but all we also want to limb them up So from zero to six six feet, we don't want any limbs hanging below that. So we want to shrink trees at least six feet up from the ground as well. And then from, are we talking about creating separation between the trees, also shrubs and other items that could potentially catch on fire, such as patio furniture, wood piles, swing sets, etc. And when we discuss these two zones, we're also kind of looking at other ignition points as well. So when we discuss that zero to five foot zone, if you have a wood decking, replacing potential panels within that first zero to five foot zone to a metal material, or if you have a wood fence, swapping that out to a non-combustible material as well, is something that we're looking at well when we're talking about home-harding and defensible space within that zero-to-flight-foot zone. And then zone two is going to be 30 to 200 feet out. And kind of what we're looking about that is you can have some vegetation, but we're just maintaining it all throughout. So making sure that we're cutting or mowing our grasses to a maximum of four inches, this is what Cal Fire states, just keep, we don't want to let it go, go grow out of control. You don't need to take a ruler to make sure it's four inches, but making sure that we're keeping it down to a minimum. And ultimately creating more horizontal space between trees, creating vertical space between grasses and shrubs. So, and there's a diagram that'll kind of illustrate this a little bit better as well. And then keeping on with what we've learned from zone ones and zero of cleaning up any dead vegetation and making sure that we have a lean green environment and creating that space. And then if you have any propane tanks making sure or any outbuildings, making sure that around any propane tanks that if possible, there is at least a 10 foot barrier around of non combustible material. So if you have to desegate an area for propane tanks, please do so. But we want to make sure that there's no clammable material around them if possible. So when we talk about vertical spacing, this is kind of what we're trying to illustrate in terms of horizontal spacing and then vertical spacing. So horizontal spacing is going to be the different spacing. So if we look, and it's all depending on slopes, but overall in that top row, as you can kind of see that there's some plants on fire, that's what we refer to as ladder fuel. So in terms of climbing the ladder, you climb wrong by wrong, but when it comes to wildfire, removing some of that vegetation and breaking or removing parts of that rung, parts of that rung of the ladder, it'll be harder for vegetation to climb up into those trees. So if you're trying to climb a ladder and there's three rungs missing, you can only go so far up that ladder. So it's kind of that same mentality when we discuss creating vertical spacing. So we don't want any shrubs or vegetation under the canopies of trees just to eliminate those possible ladders. And then also tree to tree ignition or vegetation under the canopies of trees, just to eliminate those possible ladders, and then also tree to tree ignition, or vegetation to, or shrub to shrub ignition. So, in terms of, use these as an example, if these water bottles are butted up against each other, and we're not gonna call them water bottles, we'll call them trees, but if these were next to each other, if this one were to catch on fire, do you think it would catch this one on fire? Yes, right? But if we create a little bit more spacing, it would be a lot harder for that to ignite same thing if it's like this, all right? If this is the vegetation here or shrub under a tree, if they're buttered up against each other, it's a lot easier for this tree to catch on fire versus if we kind of space it out a little bit, we create that space, we're breaking it up a little bit. And then when we talk about if your house is on a slope, we want to increase that space on the steep of the slope is. So I know I've kind of given a lot of bad news, but so there is some good news. So when we talk about potential discounts and making yourself more insurable by doing these things This is with the California fair plan if you guys have heard of it If you've hardened your home and defended your property Many insurers including the California fair plan offer sliding discounts determining on Based off of the things based off the steps you've taken in terms of home hardening and defensible space. However, just as a resident had, he was inspected by the insurer. So you'll take all the steps in terms of making, in terms of defending your home and making your home as safe as possible in terms of home hardening and defensible space, but the insurer will send an inspector out on their behalf to come out and look and kind of assess. So some of the discount requirements is going to be just kind of all out of what I talked about, but clearing vegetation debris from under decks, removing combustible sheds and other buildings from the immediate surroundings to the home to at least 30 feet. Defensible space compliance from that zone 01, 2 and 3. So trimming of trees, brush removal, debris from yard, and then that's in compliance with the state law and local ordinances within, uh, of where you reside. And then also structure protection. So making sure you have a class A roof, making sure you maintain that five maintain that five foot amber resistant zone, which is referred to as zone zero. Non-combustible materials, six inches at the bottom of exterior walls. So if you have wood-siding walls, the last six inches should be retrofitted to be a non-combustible material. Whether that's stuck stuck-ode or if you swap to metal or cement or something that's non-combustible, that you would also have to comply with that too. Having ember or fire-resistant vents, upgrading your windows and also enclosing your eaves. Yo, next slide, please. So, do you think this home would qualify? No, right? So, just kind of identifying different risks and ultimately trying to push forward. So, this home would most likely burn in a wildfire, but in order to potentially get these discounts, you have to put in the work. Part four is going to be, we're just kind of discussing evacuations in terms of what happens, how evacuations work, and just the overall process of it. So there's an acronym here, PACE. Has anyone heard of this before? One person. So PACE stands for primary, alternate, contingent, and emergency. So when I say pace, it's identifying your primary evacuation route, an alternate evacuation route, a contingency of that primary and alternate don't work, and ultimately your emergency route. When I get a lot of questions in terms of what route will I take when there's a wildfire and I tell them I don't know. In the sense of we don't know what the wind conditions will be that day, we don't know where the fire is going to be burning or what direction is going to be going in. But I do tell them to identify all the possible routes because if you start to lock in on one route and that route is potentially closed or it's used for emergency apparatus to enter into that area, you might start to be like a hamster, it's kind of spinning in a circle on that wheel. So, identifying all the possible routes will make you that much more safer when it comes to evacuating. In terms of evacuating, what do most people do wrong in relative to wildfire evacuations? Exactly. Most people leave too late. So, when we discussed evacuations in terms of, at the start of this presentation of preparing, you should start to take steps to prepare for an evacuation if needed, and leave while there's a voluntary evacuation so you're not getting stuck or leaving too late. This next picture is from the camp fire in Paradise. These were vehicles that burned. These were not people that burned in, but these were vehicles that were left behind. But ultimately we don't want to leave too late. Luckily they got out on foot, but these are pictures from that. So how do evacuations work? So there's a lot of kind of unknowns in terms of how evacuations work or who orders them so fire officials will map out Likely where the fire is burning and heading So they kind of map out where the fire is currently going and potentially where it's heading and then the fire officials at the instant command post will then issue A call for an evacuation Local law enforcement are typically responsible for enforcing the evacuation orders. And then one thing to know a lot of people think that if I live in your fire road, I'm going to use that as my evacuation route. Fire roads are for emergency responders and not for residents unless authorized by fire or law officials. So that's why leaving early is going to be your safest bit when it comes to wildfires. To learn more about us and our organization, I have a slide just to our website, it's wildfirela.org and mysafela.org. There'll be the next slides here. Thank you you. There is more stuff on that. Ultimately, I do have some brochures and stuff to hand out. I'm more than happy to take some questions if you have any. But if not, thank you guys for your time. There are a few websites that I can go over as well. I do see a hand raise in the back. Yeah, last year, so everyone can hear me. Many of the streets here are one way and one way out. How do you handle that? So in terms of identifying one way and one way out, I'm not very familiar in terms of the full layout of law rights to be fully honest with you, but when it comes to getting an evacuation order from law enforcement, most likely is all transition some roads. If even if it's a one way out or whatever, they'll make them two ways. If it's one way and one way out, they'll make them two ways just to help the flow of traffic. But ultimately it's depending on what the current conditions are. I doubt that's why when I discuss, I apologize, this doesn't fully answer your question, sir, but discussing pace and identifying what the possible routes are is going to be your safest bet when it comes to that. Especially if roads are one way and one way out and knowing that what the traffic is like on the day. I mean, if it's going to be in the afternoon, people are going to be returning from work and stuff. Yes, sir. Yes, chief. So we're in the position of doing that. We're organizing streets and identifying the roads that you would take to leave. And I'm wondering, who's up for having to drill once a year or something so that we can identify the problem areas ahead of time? Everybody, everybody should want to do a drill. That's what I'm working on. So what happens with evacuation is you're going to be notified well ahead of time. I'm not ever going to put you in a position where we're going to wait. It's an hour out. It's two hours out. If there's any threat to us, we're going to go now. And the point is to get you out as quickly and as safely as possible. Identifying the routes to do that is the problem that we're having right now, because you already know, living up here, our roads are very narrow. And so we're, John's working on a plan. We're trying to make one or two roads one way only so as you're leaving no other road, no other cars will be coming up in the opposite direction. So to do that we have to plan ahead and we have to go on and look and then we have to drive them. So if I get your cooperation and we get a little drill going we'll be able to say well can we come down in Canada? Can we come down? Hacienda is going to be a nightmare because we will have to order the police department to stop traffic coming way over on Kaleema and then we'll have to have them on Whittier Boulevard too so it takes a while to get that in place but we a large animal evacuation day and we should also include large animals in our drill. At. At some of the other discussions we've had that issue and that question come up before and there was a person, a party that identified herself saying that she would be more than willing to put her trailers up to help get the horses out. So we have to identify all those problems and work in it way in advance, not wait till the problem comes. Yes or go ahead. Yeah, come on up to the microphone because we do, A, we're recording this and B, there are people watching at home. I know it's a relatively new concept, is there any information on possibly retrofitting our homes with sprinklers to utilize the pool, the water that we have in our pools? Sure that's at your own discretion. I have gone out to several homes and identified a lot of the homes that I've looked at and told the residents that that would be an option for them because a lot of your homes are wood-sided. And you can treat it with all the chemicals you want but those chemicals would eventually be washed away by the rain. So if you have wood-sided or wood-panalized construction, it doesn't matter what your defensible space is. If you're zero to 1,000 yards away, if you get an ever cast onto your property, you're going to have problems. Yes, ma'am? OK. What's the paint made out of? Right, but you're talking about complete fire retardant paint does not exist. Yeah, so and then it's costly. We entertained a a long time ago when I was with Deli City, we used barricade. Barricade is a product that was put on homes when we were going into a structure defense. And it's a product that's actually made from the stuff that they put in the gel that they put in the baby diapers. The only problem with that is you can treat your home with it, but in the end, it's very costly to get it all off of your home after you've treated it. And you have to have the right machine to spray it on and how many residents do we have? How many homes do we have? How much barricade can we put on there? Yes. Go ahead. Mark. Thanks, chief. You used a word that maybe not everybody understands. I know I did it until recently speaking with some of your people. What exactly is an amber cast? An amber cast. So just to give you an idea, so we're talking about putting mesh on your vents. Everybody, does anybody not know what we're talking about as far as 116th and 118th and all that? that. Numbers don't mean anything to me. I want you to be well informed and know what it is that you need to put on your vents to protect your property. For me, I would completely close off the vent. I wouldn't even give it a chance with a quarter or a what 16sixteenth of an inch of a spark trying to get in there. So it's basically a spark arrestor similar to what you put on your chimney. So the amber cast is the product that comes off of fire that's burning. I'm sure you've seen your fireplace and you see those little whips of little fire that come out of the wood. That's an ember. So as it's going up into the atmosphere and the wind gets a whole of it, that's an ember cast. So it goes up in the air and then the wind catches it and it casts it onto your property. And that's where the problem comes because it could be as far away as three miles. Yes, ma'am? So the question for those at home is do we have a procedure in place to have well called non-essential large vehicles not enter the city in the event of a evacuation. Right there would be a problem so we would have to organize them also and let them know and make notification that to prevent any large truck. You see all the trucks and the Sheriff's Department is working diligently every day to keep all those huge trucks that come up as the end of, they still come up there. And they go down some of the roads and they'll get stuck on Encanada. And there'll you folks know that. John let's take a note of that for our evacuation planning. All right yeah John work on the big trucks. Any other questions for our fire? We have John speak upon Genesee which is an evacuation notification. Yep that's correct's correct name. We're trying to get residents to download onto your app. It'll kind of map out our five zones that the city is divided and if John can speak on that. And you folks, if you're about to self-own, open up your app and download it now. It's the beginning. It's called Genesee, G-E-N-A-S-Y-S. And it notifies all the fire areas and what's activity that's happening all across Southern California, IE. It talks about the land movement and rolling hills area right now that's going on. We saw it with the fires that happened. So John's been working on trying to map out our evacuation routes with our five zones and identify what zone you live in because that's going to be the key. Okay, so I'm going to have John speak on that. Thank you. Thank you. Genesis, yes, let's know with the app. If everyone can download that app, that's going to be a help. So you can identify for yourself what zone you're in. We've got five zones. 771 through 775 are the La Haber Heights zones and to give you the idea how important it is and useful it is before the Althadena and the Pellestates fires we had we had our zone already mapped out and it's publicly available on the public website for everybody to see but at that time before the fires we were like an island. We were the only ones that were mapped out. Other than West Covina had some zones mapped out. Palisades had some zones mapped out, I believe. And some northern towns of Northern LA area. After the fires, half of the LA has gone on to Genesis. So they're all half of the city at least, half of the cities within the LA County now have the Genesis map, online, publicly visible for all those residents who live in that area to be aware what the zones are in case they need to evacuate. So in our case, I believe it's zone 775, maybe wrong, that is the power canion. So that's the starting point that needs to be evacuated. You'll see that on the map turning red. It needs to be evac, you need to evacuate. Genesis also, the information that's available on Genesis, it's also forwarded apps such as what Watch Doody app. And Watch Doody has a lot of information to begin with if you download Watch Doody app, what actually beep at you when there's a fire, every time there's a fire within the Illinois County area, it's going to beep at you letting you know where the fire is at. So that would be a good starting point for you to be aware there's a fire somewhere. Find out where it's at, so at least you know whereabouts with the yellow county is at. And so they tie in together. There's different information available on one app or the other, but Genesis is the bottom base level of information. Genesis creates the zones. They are contracted by the Office of Emergency Management, I believe, or something of the sort. I'm not quite sure. And so technically, would estimate about half of, as of now, cities in California have that app. I have the zones mapped out for their city and others are coming along. And it's not just California, there's a lot of cities, a lot of other states. We have some other cities mapped out and it's coming on. It's going to be more and more. And really the basic examples to realize that before the major forest we've had lately, there were not that many zones available to look at. Now it's much more. So it's very important. Download that app. Get used to what it looks like. Check it once in a while. If there's something going on, turn it on, see what's going on, see what colors the zone may be. Different zones, different colors for any zone will represent different things. Whether it needs to be evacuated, whether you need to be ready to be evacuated. And really like that we're talking before, if it's something like it's in the state, it's about to be evacuated. Maybe you should just evacuate on your own instead. Not wait for the last official time to evacuate Mitch. By then it may be difficult considering our roads and how narrow they are. So yes, please download that app. That's really the main point. Get used to it for a yourself with it. It includes other things such as it can point out to you what roads are closed off, traffic control points. It might it will tell you if there's a need for to go or to evacuate to. Eventually we're going to get to the point where we can actually identify where to take animals to or options where it take animals to but that's all taking time and it's an ongoing process. John, would you be willing to stick around this evening and help people if they need help getting that? Sure. Okay, thank you. Okay. Any questions? Yes, sir. Go ahead and come up to the podium. Okay. Okay. Go ahead and come up to the podium. Okay. Any questions? Yes, sir. Go ahead and come up to the podium. Okay. Yeah, if you have questions for John, John, stick around. John, thank you so much. All right. I think. Hi. My name is Chris Landis. I've been in Lahabah Heights for 35 years. And in the last probably two or three years, my house has been the cover boy of the compliant brush clearance brochure that's sent out around. If you look on the brochure every year, the last couple of years our house has been listed as. The good house, right? As the good side, as compliant. Well anyway, I wanted to tell this little story because I think it's important. My question is I don't know how many people have gone through this recently, but I had a call from my insurance company recently and they sent an inspector out. And the inspector came out and my first reaction was you, you're not welcome here on my property, your goal is to try to cancel my insurance and get rid of me. And I'm compliant, I have evidence from the city. Anyway, then my insurance company, and I called them and they said, no, you must let them on, or you're going to be canceled. So the lady came on my property, went around and then about three weeks later I got a notice of non, I'm trying to think of the exact name. Non-renewal. Non-renewal. Non-renewal. Okay, so they sent me a notice of non-renewal and I said we're the poster child for the city on compliance. If you look at my property, it was perfect. There was a few tree branches that were out Swarton near the house and then they saw some leaves in my rain gutter And from standing back from a distance. Well every year we have a service come out and clean out the leaves from our rain gutter. And before, the week before, I actually got the letter, they had come out and cleaned out the rain gutter. And those things change all the time because if you have trees with leaves that are gonna change. So it changed in the, anyway. So then I get this notice that they're not going to renew my insurance. And so then I started complaining, me pitching a fit and it looked like I was bound for California Fairplan and it was going to be at least two times my insurance policy. And then I start walking around Lahober Heights. My neighborhood that I've lived in for decades, and my house was the best house anywhere in the area, and I didn't see a house anywhere near me that was remotely compliant. To, they all, in terms of the map, I went on Le Haber Heights website and I saw the pictures that you had about the zones. I didn't see anybody that was compliant within those zones. It's a mess. And here I am and I'm being turned down from my insurance. And I'm just curious about a couple things. If this is happening to other people, it's a financial catastrophe to try to go with the California Fair Plan. The other problem is real estate sales that if you wanna move or someday sell your property, you're gonna have a problem that're going to have to, that the new buyers will not be insurable, that insurance is going to be an epic problem in this community, and anybody wanting to sell their property will not be able to find insurance companies to sell their, I'm aware of from talking to my agents that they're finding many come home buyers are not able to be insured and it's a big issue. I called my brother who lives up in right wood and he says we'll get used to it. He says I've been on California fair for since I bought property up here that it's just a thing possibly of the future for us because the insurance companies want out. And they're getting very aggressive and proactive about trying to cancel people's insurance policies. Luckily, I've been with the same insurance company for, since I was like 21 and for long time. And anyway, we worked it out. And so my insurance is now being renewed, but it was the beginnings of a large battle and a problem. But I'm just curious if other people have had this issue. And I'm also curious about the concerns for selling property if it's getting more and more difficult to sell or get insurance for new buyers. Thank you. So, Quann, I know you've been doing some work on this so maybe you can just take a minute. Yes, so let me just kind of, as a result of where we live, home hardening and defensible space is a key. And keeping up maintenance. A lot of folks think, okay, clean my own, I brush clear, but my roof is 30 years old, and I don't have the 20,000 to replace it. Or some of you may still have what we call wood shake, roofs that are 30, 40 years old, and definitely a fuel. And so just give you a real story that came across last year. A gentleman from the Eden Fire Area called me about a year ago, just for advice, he's a friend. And he told me my company's non-renewing me because I have this wood shake rough. So I talked to him, explained to him. If you put the investment in, it'll pay for itself over the next five years, because you're going to save yourself on the insurance cost. And then you're also going to protect your home. Fast forward to eating fire, a block and a half away from his home. All the houses burn. He has a class A roof. It's survived. Yeah, he has some sudden damage, smoke damage,'s home stands. So, yeah, it's part of as a homeowner, we need to do our part to maintain the home, home hardened. We've been having these education, unfortunately, yeah, we had these seminars, we had 20 some out folks come, we have over, you know, 2,500 residents here, 1,600 homes. But we get 25 people, it's just, It's, you know's kind of, we lose the balloon that we're trying to build to get our folks to come and get involved because we can get all the information out. But if we don't, we're not going to get it now. Going back to the insurance. There are a lot of things insurance companies are working on right now. They're doing aerial photos. They're flying over our properties all the time, taking photos as these properties come up for renewal. Usually about 90 to 120 days out. And then they're going to send out a notice like I forget the last name, Mr. Landis. They'll fly over and the first things they're looking at is there any trees hanging over your house. The defensible space zero to five zero to 30, is there any potential fuel exposure? Is a roof outdated or does it have algae growing on it, which means there's moisture, correct? There's a lot of things that the insurance companies are looking at, and they're going to send out a letter to you. These are the things we see and you need to correct. And if you don't, your policies are going to be non-renew. How do you respond to? First call your agent and say, what are my steps that I need to get this thing reinstated? Well, these are your three or four things that you need to correct. Correct it if you can. I mean, because it's to save your home. And you're doing it for the long term, not just for that one policy here. And if you can't afford it, there are the the solutions that we've been able to get for some of the folks what we call. So if you're at a lower level, it's called a low slope. If you're at top. here and if you can't afford it there are the solutions that we've been able to get for some of the folks what we call So if you had a lower level it's called a low slope if you had top of the hill it's high slope fire burns up correct So the risk for homes that are up on top of the hill is more than likely going to burn with the fire going up so California fair plan is a solution just for the fire protection. It doesn't protect you for any other perils. Then there's what's called a wrap around or difference in condition policy, which is the second policy that most insurance companies are offering. So is the Haber Heights insurable? Yes. But only time is not going to be insurable is if you don't maintain. There are solutions. There are other third party what we call excess and surplus insurers companies that will write the whole policy. But that premium is going to be probably five to ten times what you're paying today. So the key things I recommend you do after you walk away from this event today, survey your home. What was done? Do I have documentation? All my work was done. Roof, electrical, HVAC, plumbing. Was it all done by a contractor? And do I have proof that it was a licensed contractor? Not a handyman. Because that's what insurance companies are going to look for. So look for that, put that in, organize it. Look at your home. Is there a fascia paint peeling? Because we had one gentleman last year, I think, called. That was one of the reasons one of the insurance companies decided to non-renew him because all along his face a bore, the paint was cracking and wood was exposed. And if there's lumpy areas, embers are going to get caught. It's going to catch on fire. So if you have an opportunity a couple times a year, paint the facial board so you can close all the potential exposures and maintain maintain if you try to do it once a year in April when the notice comes out they got a pressure you know clear your brush and you're trying to get a contractor you're not gonna find one it's gonna cost you ten times more than what you would normally do if you do a maintenance I remember the last years some of the folks called I gotta get this in clear you know it's many coming around and nobody could find a contractor, could come out and clean out your brushes. And that's a lot of land we have to clear, correct? And so when you call somebody in emergency again, you're gonna pay for it. So continue maintenance, keep an eye on your home, take owner of pride, pride of ownership, because that's gonna be the key word that we're to look at. As an insurance company, they're going to look at it, say, this person really have pride in ownership or, I just neglecting it to let it run like this home that we saw earlier where all the paint and all the wood was chipping away. So, you know, to take away from this today on this thing here, is how can you help yourself do your own checklist and make sure your home is up to date, and that'll make it much, much more insurable. Thank you, one. Great. Don, this is question is for you. I was building a home for a friend of mine, a custom home in Claremont, when this big fire came through. And the fire came within 75 feet of the house, was across the street, and the portable toilet that was on our side, 50 feet away, melted to a little ball on the ground. And I always wondered, you keep talking about the defensible space, and I get all get all that but a lot of people maybe not so much in the city live and track homes where they're 10 feet away the house next door so if your neighbor's house is burning and you've done all you can with your house your 116 things vents and all that isn't it possible your house will burn just from the heat of the house next door, like maybe like a spontaneous combustion. Is that possible? Most definitely. So what he's kind of referring to is radiant heat. So with these most recent wildfires, let's speak on the palestates, for example, a few hours after that fire started, it went from wildfire to a conflagration. So what that is, is structure to structure ignition. So what Ray's referring to is your next or neighbor, if they're house on fire, a lot of that radiant heat houses, when house fires burn, they're going to burn a lot hotter than the normal vegetation just because of all the synthetics that we have in our house. They're going to burn a lot more hotter and faster. And so a lot of that radiant heat, along your structures, especially if the side setbacks are pretty close to each other, it's going to be a cause for concern. So ultimately working together to, you're doing your part, but also trying to work as a community. So everyone's doing their part is ultimately going to make your communities a lot safer. Hopefully, does that answer your question, sir, in terms of the radiant heat in terms of? Yes. Yeah. So what can you do about it? I mean, can you, for example, can you install maybe some rain birds, sprinkler heads on top of your roof and when you're evacuating, you know there's a fire coming and turn them on and would that cool the house, your own house enough for it to not catch on fire is that possible? It's possible but there's a lot of variables that kind of go into it and our chiefs right here they can kind of discuss it a little bit more but sometimes in wind driven fires if you have those rain birds with if there's strong enough winds that where that water is intended to go will potentially go into a different direction instead of calling your house is going to call your neighbor's house So there's a lot of variables that kind of go into play when when when kind of discussing that and chief you feel like to kind of chime in a little bit here and So I think what you're getting at is If your house if your neighbor's house is on fire and that's the only house burning your house, if the fire department gets there, the chances of your house getting on fire pretty remote because we'll be able to contain that one to one house. What you're talking about, I'm assuming, is a major conflagration. When you add all the determining factors that we had evident in these past fires, the palisades and the Eden fire. You had measures beyond comprehension. There was no way to avoid that fire. You could have had 10,000 to 100,000 firefighters on the scene at that moment and you would not have been able to put that fire out. Because just think about it, if you wake up in the morning here in La Haber Heights, if you all woke up at 6 o'clock tomorrow morning, every single 5,200 of you and turned on the water, what do you think would happen to your pressure? So we had 1,500 engines opening up 800 fire hydrants and then the power went down. So understanding how our hydrants work as we have, we're gravity fed here. So, we're pretty lucky that water is just going to keep coming. My engine out there in certain areas of the city, I don't even need the pump on my engine. I can use the gravity. It comes from the hydrant at a pressure of 140 pounds. The normal, you go down here in Elly County, the normal hydrant pressure is 85. So I don't even need my pump because I'm putting out, I could just attach a hose with nozzle at the end and I'll put your house out. That's how much pressure. But think of it, there's 5,200 homes and if they're all burning at once, no way to put that out. So, and answer your question, if it's just a single house, chances are your house is going to survive. that radiant hate isn't going to come into factor because you're not going to have the sustained winds at 100 miles an hour. That's just imagine flames is up like this, 100 miles an hour, your flames like this. It's like a blowtorch. You just open it up, you see those movies where they get those torches in the amenate people and the it shoots out that way. That's how the fire with a hundred mile per hour win is. There's no way. I've been I've been a firefighter for 47 years. I've been to many many many fires and these fires that we had in Maui, these fires that we had in Palisades, and they even fired. Those are catastrophic events that are totally imperventable. There's nothing you can do about that. Not enough water, not enough manpower. Take three engines for each home. So if you just do 5,200 homes, think about how many engines you would need for just La Habra Heights. There aren't enough engines in the state of California that you could have put on any of those fires. So what the young man here is trying to tell you is that do your due diligence. Let's work together. I'll help you identify just like I've done to several of you already. What area you can improve in? What is really gonna do at maybe a low cost? You talk about the, you wanna use sprinkler system, okay? What's your water sources? You have a pool? Yes. Perfect. There you go. That's your water source. 30,000 gallons. 20. 20. That's enough. I'll tell you to put out a house, 1600 square foot house, you only need above five to 600 gallons of water, a house burning. One single tank, if you use your water judiciously, if you have a bigger house it's going to take two three engines with all their 1500 maybe 2000 gallons of water won't take much and then the amount of water that's coming out of that sprinkler It's not very much. It'll last you all day long, but It'll be affected by like the young man said, wins. Wins will affect it. And then once you lose all the water, you know, you're done. But like I said, it's just a matter of getting your house prepared. And I'm going to throw some things out at you just to finish up for my part. When you, I'm going to use some of the stuff that we use. There's a lot of nomenclature that I can put out there, but I'm not going to because you won't understand it. It's what we use in the fire service. So a couple of them is when we do an initial assessment, think about yourself. Can you survive here if a major fire is coming? The answer should be no. If not, leave now. Remember that. I think, Connor, Mayor Papisa said it. Don't wait, don't hesitate. Get out. If you have problems, we need to identify that John Dominguez is working on the, we have neighbors. We have to take care of them. There are a lot of neighbors that we have that can't get out on their own. So we're going to have a program designed to identify them so we can help them. But all I can tell you is that it's very hard to try to do anything about a fire that's got 100 miles per hour winds behind it. We cannot get ahead of it. That's our success rate. This is the how far ahead can we get to the fire? If we can't get ahead of the fire we're not going to be very successful. Thank you. All right. So yes, Stephen. Thank you. Thank you. One, Ray will mind me about setbacks. We have large setbacks, but there are also setback encroachments. So we need to maybe look at the code and reduce the amount of feed that people can encroach into the setback because that's put them closer to the neighbors. And then our insurance, I've had three companies leave the state. So something to think about, maybe someone knows about this, is if we formed a mutual insurance company just for fire protection, first couple of years, you have to build up some capital, but we could probably make it so at least we could depend on having insurance all the time. Then water supply, we have gravity, but it's supplied by pumps just like in the palisades. In fact, we have the up-to-zone four million gallons of storage exactly the same as the palisades had. But if the power goes out and the pump stop work, and they don't have the generators, those tanks are empty and at some point, there's nothing left. So just be aware of that too. Thanks. Thank you, Stephen. Mayor, can I finish up? Absolutely. On my comments. Yes. Chief Martin, thank you for those comments. And I want you to know that I'm very worried about fires, okay, because I'm in the middle of about a 10 acre parcel, the only house. And I'm on the top of the hill so the fire would come up and get my house. So I've tried to make my home as far as safe. It's all smooth stuck-o, boxed in-ease with no vents. Everything is screened. But that's not enough for me. So I've taken one of my pool motors and installed a line that goes to the outside, all the pumps are in a building. And on the outside I have two wise that come out with a valve where you can attach an inch and a half fire hose. And I'm just finishing it up and I'm going to make a nice plaque with very clear directions push this button to turn it on. But see that's not enough because what if the electricity goes out then that pump won't work. So I've put together a fire pump and this is the gentleman that was asking about the pool. Now you can buy these online and they probably start about 2,000 and I've seen them 7 or 8,000. But me being the frugal guy that I am I bought a trash pump at Harbor Freight for $400. They have another more super duper one for 800. And for total of all the parts and hoses, I have a fire pump for about a thousand bucks. So, and that's gonna be in that pool room, in case you guys show up, I want you to save my house. It means a world to me. So you'll have the pump from the motor and with, oh, and it's on a real outside with a hundred feet of hose and a nozzle so you don't even have to bring your hoses down to the pool. And then there'll be the fire pump. And one last comment, Don, you said at zone zero, you don't want any bushes, nothing. That's contrary to the American home. Everybody has nice maybe roses around the home. Isn't that a little bit over the top? I mean, do you really expect people to have maybe five feet of concrete or just dirt around their house? I don't quite get that. Yeah, so with the whole zone zero, that's, I mean, I don't expect anyone. I mean, there's a few people that have had it perfect. Typically, most people have vegetation in that area. But this is kind of, I'm just sharing what insurers are requiring and just kind of educating people on what is kind of going on out there in terms of what the requirements are and what how things are kind of looking to change in terms of that direction. But what does help is at least limiting a lot of that vegetation that is in that area. So if you do have a big hedge, possibly maybe swapping that hedge and putting some stuff in planters that you can move out if needed. And instead of having grasses there, putting rocks or gravel or just and limiting the amount of vegetation there pots and planters are great Just don't keep them super heavy. So if you do have to move that vegetation away It's not gonna be very cumbersome or it's gonna be easier to do or if you do have a cement Areas in that area putting stuff on rollers is very good because as, like I said, moving it away, you can easily roll it away or you can readjust and kind of re-decorate as you see fit. But in terms of going on and expecting people to do that, I mean, I don't expect anyone to do it. But in terms of recommending, the science is kind of showing that it is beneficial to at least reduce as much of the vegetation as possible. Yes, sir. So I too like Mr. Ray and Frugel, and during the floods last year, I did buy a trash pump from Harbor Freight. It's a 3-inch inlet outlet and I bought about 75 feet of 3-inch hose and about 100 feet of 2-inch hose. So that reduction or that increase in pressure from the 3-inch to the 2-inch allows me to spray about 75 feet because I retrofitted all of my threading connectors with a camlock, you know, which is much, much better, much faster. So in case there's a fire, what you do is you get all the hosing, you roll it out and with a camlock system, I mean, you're in and out in seconds rather than trying to thread on a 3-inch MPT pipe. So I did that and I mean it's Step one of my plan to help if there's ever a fire. Step two is also going to be to retrofit the house with sprinklers, but a trash pump is I mean you cannot go wrong with the trash for sure. And especially if you have a water source like a pool, if you, you know, in case of the fire, the city is almost 100% certain to cut off the power to all the power lines, you know, to stop from the fire from spreading. So having a gas-powered trash pump is the way to go. And so yes, I do agree with you. That's definitely absolutely the first thing you should do. And also having a sprinkler system on the house. You know, and I was quoted. I have a friend that owns a sprinkler company. And he did all those sprinklers at our business. And I said, hey, can you come to the house and give me a quote on how much you would charge me to put the sprinklers on the house. And oh my gosh, I mean, thank God I was sitting down when he told me the price because I almost fainted. It was about $80,000. You know, and he said that because he knows me, he would do it for 60, you I said, I mean, that's just out of control. But the system was so robust. I mean, it was so advanced. There was, I mean, they tapped into the pool pump. And I have two pool pumps, three and a quarter horsepower. So they're very powerful. And they had a, just so you guys can understand what you're gonna face if they do come out. It's, I mean, for something, for that money, you're paying for a backup generator, you're paying for, you know, an app that can control it from your phone. So you don't have to go home and turn on the generator to turn on the pump to water the house You know you can do it from anywhere in the world. So it's I mean very very advanced Very expensive too, but you can also do that for a fraction of the cost if you know what you're doing on your own Which this is what I plan to do so There are many ways to Skin the cat I guess you could say but having a trash pump so your end your you have your independent so you're independent, water source, which is your pool and your independent power source, which is the gas power motor, is definitely the way to go. Thank you. All right. I'm wondering on the 16th inch message you're talking about is that available also on the for fire or restors? Home Depot Lowe's and then any any general lumber yard they can tell you that mesh But the problem is who's gonna cut it for you have to cut it as Just make sure you take measurements And then talking about the large animal evacuation, is there any thought or designated places set up where these animals are going to be taken to and then those horse trailers that are doing round trips back and forth that some kind of clearance that those vehicles could be, let's clear them off and get them in here because more animals, because it's not going to be one trip of one horse trailer going to one house and they're out. I'm just thoughts on that. I think we've identified a couple of spots. The park is one. We're also thinking of the church on Harbor in Fullerton. There's another one that's remote. Ellie County does a pretty good job once there's a fire bringing in resources. I noticed that Eaton. They had massive amounts of resources coming in there from both the animal services side and also work ordining volunteers that we're bringing you know large, large animal evacuation vehicles in. So not that we want to put our hands, our, all our eggs in that basket. You know, one of the issues that was clear from eating and palisades is resourcing. When you have a massifier in LA County, especially like palisades, youades, a lot of the resources moved over to palisades. And then when the heat and fire broke out, it was very hard to resource that fire. Even the basic things that normally would have shown up took hours if not a couple extra days to get over to eat. Just because it was the second fire. And that's what concerns me is really the resourcing issue when you have multiple fires breaking out. And in LA County or in the Southern California area. I'm gonna do some closing, I don't know. Chief Jorgensen, if you had anything you wanted to add? Or comments? I think Chief Jorgensen will talk about the brush. So So May 1st is definitely when we are going to kick off or initiate our brush clearance program for 2025. It's going to look a little bit different this year and when I say a little bit different historically, you know, to be quite honest with everybody in the room, There was a lot of lag time given when it came to cleaning up the areas in the city and some of it never got done until the following calendar year. And we're not gonna be doing that this year. And some of you may have already, I don't know if anybody in the room has experienced this already because I've gotten a lot of concerned residents who asked me if brush clearance has already started the season that is. And yes, it has. And what I mean by that is it's an ongoing year-round endeavor. And I know I'm probably preaching to the choir with everybody here. However, the reality of it is that we have seen unprecedented fires this year, this calendar year, and this is how we started 2025 off. And quite honestly, I know I'm not alone in this, but nobody wants to see what happened to our neighbors to the north, happened here, or really in any other community that, you know, for that matter. However, we do live in a very high fire hazard zone and that being said, we have the most restrictive brush clearance and vegetation management protocols in place and what I'm going to do, just so you're aware, is we are bringing on some additional help. We do have our code enforcement inspector as well, he's dual cross trained as a brush inspector as well, he is my right hand. And as the season progresses, what we're gonna do is we're gonna be bringing on an additional. From my understanding, we've been budgeted for one additional seasonal inspector, which that seasonal inspector typically works between May and, or I believe, April and October around Halloween. And then we're going to be bringing on a couple of interns from Mountsack College, Mount San Antonio College, to assist as well. So if in the event, I've been trying to relay this information to many of the residents that I come in contact with throughout my inspection processes that if you've already done the work and your case has been officially closed but yet during the cross-training phase of these new inspectors, if you happen to find that you received another notice in the mail and it was very recent that your case has been closed, just reach out to me. My name will be at the bottom of the notice. I'm used to the phone calls and I really personally enjoy getting out to the community and meeting all of you and working with you. And I don't want you to feel that this is going to be a situation in terms of our brush clearance This is going to be a situation in terms of our brush clearance season, this is gonna be a situation where we're not gonna work with you, this is just, you know, it's black or white and this is, you know, the buck stops here, that's not the case. What I'm referring to in terms of it being a little different is that you're gonna see me out in the community, you're gonna get to know me. You're if you ever feel that you're brush clearance inspection to your neighbor, does not match yours. Well then, go ahead and reach out to me. This is a primarily complaint driven division. And that being said, it's very challenging for us to hit every parcel, every inspection cycle, but that is my goal. And not only is that my goal, I tend to accomplish my goal, so this will happen. However, again, what I want to reiterate is that I want to work with everyone and I understand I'm very empathetic to people's situations, whether they're financial, health-related. Recently I met with a resident who is dealing with a lot of health complications within his family. And he was questionable if he had the financial means to get the work done. And it was a heavy, heavy lift. And granted, the notice did give him a hard deadline to get this done. However, what I did was I actually went out there and I met with him in person. I looked at the amount of work that needed to be done and, you know, essentially I asked how long you think he would need it. He told me four weeks, I gave him six and the work got done within three. So I am very empathetic to everybody's situations and I don't want you to feel that for lack of a better term There's a new sheriff in town, but there is and I want you all to feel comfortable in knowing that I am out here Doing the work in your best interest running and managing our fire prevention program for the safety of everybody here some of it may not look, at times it may not seem like the work is getting done fast enough. However, what I want to instill in everybody is a sense of comfort in knowing that I am here to help all of you, and I'm here not to only help all of you coming up with some solutions to your problems, but also maybe You know to enforcing some of those Challenging neighbors, you know to get their brush currency done as well because at the end of the day if it's not done We will abate the property and if and we will push it the lean and I don't I don't like having to do that But I'm not afraid to do that Okay, so if anybody has any questions right now, or even after this workshop, I'll be more than happy to take any an answer. Yes, sir. Come on out, Bruce. Before I say anything bad, I have total respect for these fire department guys. I spent 35 years in this department as a volunteer. So I've seen a lot of it. One thing that's not been brought up, we need volunteers in the city with the Firewatch group. These guys can't do their job unless we report the fire. And every minute that that fire gets going makes it twice as big as it needs to be. Without you folks, city people watching, looking, reporting, smoke, be aware of it. They can't do their job. It takes them five minutes from here to there. That five minutes makes a fire twice as bad as it needs to be. So if we don't report it, it takes them time the same if we have a major evacuation. We aren't going to have a sheriff up here for half an hour to an hour to do any good. We need to be observing all over the heights. I happen to live on top of the hillside, get to a lot, watch a lot of it. And it does happen. When I was in the department, we had five chiefs. We had volunteers all over the heights. So they were watching all over the heights. That's why we never really had a bad fire up here. I've been here 70 years. And it's changed. These guys try. Don't get me wrong. Tell the respect for every one of them. But they can't do it by themselves. If we don't report it to them, they aren't going to see it. Fire watch is one of the reasons that they get the information. And we need more volunteers. That's all I want to say. They do a good job. No question. Thanks. Thanks, Bruce. John. Okay, so he's inspired me to speak out of turn. Yes, we do need more volunteers. And one of the volunteer projects I'm working on is to get a volunteer list going to get volunteers to help hopefully with brush clearance for people who may be elderly who may need help in doing that. So yes, like Bruce was saying we need more volunteers and I think that would be one of the projects that we need to get started on is to help people who may not be able for whatever reason, it doesn't matter. I live here too, and if they're in a situation, I'm gonna be in that same situation. So we need to help each other out and get a volunteer, a list of volunteers published on the internet, on paper, the magazine, anywhere, everywhere to get more volunteers to start helping out with the brush clearance. Thank you. Thanks John. Keep. So just the clothes, I also, Mr. Fernandez, I'm concerned with the fire dangers that are here in La Habra Heights. To that end, the last two years we've conducted a brush drill so that you will not be too worried and concerned at the end of this month, the 27th, 28th and 29th, we will have a joint effort of all our partners, Brea Fullerton, Orange County Fire Authority, LA County, Santa Fe Springs, will all work together to have a joint brush drill. It'll last year was at the park, this year it will be at Murphy Ranch, but La Haber Heights will be included. So when we do something like that, we set up strategies for the what if, what if this happens, what if this road is closed? So just so you know, just so you're aware that's coming. And don't be alarmed and tell your neighbors that we're going to be out here in force. Last year we had 60 engines participating. I anticipate this year to be 80 to 100. More and more people want to get involved. And so we're hoping to partner and work with them to that end. Thank you. Do you have anything else? I got a few things. If you haven't joined Facebook page for the obrites, it's a good communication tool. It has to be admitted, so once you answer a few questions, it has to be addressed. You'll be admitted, but it's a good communication tool. I believe there are over 300 members on that page. Number two is April 26 is Love Our City campaigned at most of the cities are already adopted. We don't have one of those here in Moabrites, but we do have our quarterly cleanup. So we were thinking as emergency preparedness community to get more volunteers. To utilize the April 26 to call it love La Habra Heights and then expand our road cleaning from just away from Hoss Yanda to East West Road. So maybe folks, we just take just a second because I don't know a lot of people know about that. John, you organize it. So we can explain about what the road cleaning is where it is. So the last couple that we did as quarterly in conjunction with our trash cleanup, Dup-Day, is to walk up and down Hie in the road and pick up trash. And we're picking up a lot of potential flammable goods. I mean we picked up nitrogen cartridges up in the hill and a lot of cigarette butts. I mean people are throwing out their cigarette butts at the top of the hill and I would say each session need personally I picked up over a hundred 100 cigarette butts on Hasey under road. That just me out of the 20 volunteers. So we do need volunteers and this is a good way to get to your neighbors. There are a lot of good people. There are a lot of good folks that want to come out and that one and a half to hours of just socializing and picking up and then at the end some of those folks will go have breakfast together and just get to know each other a little bit better. But it's a good way to know picking up. And then at the end, some of those folks will go have breakfast together and just get to know each other a little bit better. But it's a good way to know your neighbor. And John spoke about the five zones. If you don't know what that is, let me show you a quick map. And you can, the Genesee has been designed just like this. This is our original map, but Genesee was designed to mirror this. So identify what zone you live in and reach out to your neighbors and get started getting information. Do a ch... This is our original map, but Genesee was designed to mirror this. So identify what zone you live in and reach out to your neighbors and get started getting information and do a checklist. The other thing I want to talk about is how many of you guys are aware that you're were the only city in the USA recognize as a city as a far-wise USA community. Did you know you're getting an insurance discount on your policy? Okay, so look at the bottom of the discounts. You're going to see a fire wise USA community. The reason why is we are a hundred percent brush clearance city. What does that mean? We got to comply. What, you know, our fire marshal was trying to do is clear brush. So that's one of the steps and the other is home hardening and defensible space. Defending your to your neighbors and then you know as time changes next week Smoke what it smoke alarm battery checks, correct? Please do that and then finally With John and the others requested we need volunteers The more folks come out and partake in these emergency preparedness committee committee meets every third, third day here at six o'clock. And usually only about half an hour long. We had one session that went a full hour because a lot of issues came up and there were a lot of questions. We're available to give you resources. What we don't know, we'll find it for you. But just to mirror what our presenters talked about, He talked about 0, 1 and 2 areas of defensible space. Farway, USA call it immediate, which is 0 to 5. Intermediate is 5 to 30, an extended zone to 30 to 100, and then, and beyond if you have 10 acre lots like Mr. Fernandez has. There's other things you must do beyond that zone. So we have these available. I will order more of these. These will be going out from the Fire Marshal's office about brush clearance. And this is a great resource. It also has a checklist. Okay, so that's all I have to share. Again, you run into any issues with insurance issues of people that are listening from home. Reach out to us. At least we'll give you a direction how to resolve your issue. And I think we resolve almost every single situation because we're going to go back to say, did you do these instead of trying to find something to replace, but did you prevent from the insurance company finding a reason to get off the policy? So we're here for you. Come and participate with us, be a part of us, and let's make the city a safer place. Thank you. Thank you, Juan. Right? Thank you for saying I'm on a teneca property, but I don't own teneakers. I own one, but I'm surrounded. I don't want the fire marshal to make me clean up 10 acres okay But anyway, I just want to close with something you know I love this city. I'm a developer and Some people think that I want to you know turn one acre lots into quarter acre lots Nothing could be further from the truth. I love the one acre, one home per acre zoning is kind of a sacred thing to me. And what a great beautiful city we live in. You know, when I'm having my coffee, I see the sun rising in the east and dinner. I'm seeing the sun setting on the west. And I kind of pinch myself. How lucky am I, me and my family to be able to enjoy this. Not a lot of people can afford a home here, but there's a butt. I haven't increasingly concerned about the condition of properties in the city. The people not doing their roads, I clearance, their weed abatement. And I'm just gonna ask my fellow neighbors, do your weed clearance, do your road clearance. It's for your own good, and it's for the good of the community. And you know, the fire marshals shouldn't have to give you two or three notices. We all know what's required. And it's not May 1st thing. It's a year-round thing. Some people think I let my weeds grow, my tumble weeds, but as long as they're down by May 1st and it doesn't work that way. So, and if you've ever listened to the Planning Commission, I always talk about being considerate of your neighbors. I think we could solve so many problems. If we would just think, is this good for my neighbor? Am I being considerate? Am I being a good neighbor? So I'm going to ask everybody to be considerate. Do you read a statement? And it's for everybody's good. I would hate to see what happened and what's that eaten fire? What's that? Alterina? And I mean, Can you imagine if that would have happened here? I mean, it would be horrible. So anyway, thank you Mayor Prispecia for hosting this. I think this is very good, so thanks. So I know we've heard a lot of scary things tonight, and we've heard some positive things. I'm really excited about a couple I'm excited for having our new fire marshal. That's exciting. I'm also looking for some change. So, on the planning side, I really want to look at, we're fortunate. We don't have homes built on top of one another from the most part we've got one acre zoning but but I constantly see you know modifications for these setbacks and I really think that as a city we need to start thinking about our setback modifications or setback exceptions appropriate given what we've seen the the reason for the zoning, my understanding, talking to some of the older folks that have lived here and I'm now, I guess, one of them. But the folks that have lived here a lot longer than I have, the reason for that zoning really was in the early days because of fire protection. They didn't want houses built on top of one another and they wanted that buffer zone between homes to allow for fire protection. So really looking, you know, as we go forward looking at that planning process and saying should we be giving the number of exceptions that we do around setbacks. Stepping up code enforcement. making sure that we have that defensible space and I get it. Some people's definition of a kept home is different than others but when you can't walk around your property because there's so much stuff, you're just creating a hazard for your neighbor and so you know I've already talked with Chief Jorgensen about identifying these houses working with our code enforcement department to start getting, I get it, getting these houses on a plan to get rid of the clutter that's around the home and making sure that we can create the defensible spaces. Chief Jorgensen did talk about our brush clearance program. I know that past fire marshals have been very willing to work with people. I hear he's going to work with people too but we have to get aggressive with our brush clearance. We have to get the fuel out of the city. Some success stories. Brian Bergman sitting in the back, Brian and Dennis Larrity were very instrumental in getting the very first hely hydrant in LA County installed on an easement that the habitat provided for the city. We're very fortunate to have that resource. It's what's called in the, as far as chief Martin has told me, it's a force multiplier, I think I've got that right, right? It allows one helicopter instead of having to go land or having to go find a water source miles away from the city. We have a water source that's almost inexhaustible, right, at a high point within the city that allows the first helicopter to begin to aggressively fire in the city. We have another resource called Firewatch. And if you're not a member of Firewatch, why aren't you a member of Firewatch? I mean, I think there's a mark still here. No, mark left. So I think it's 35 or the dues are like $35 or $40 a year just to pay for equipment and keeping the repair running. And I think the radios, if you can't afford a radio, let me know, I'll buy one for you. I think the radios are $20 or $30 on Amazon. They're not that expensive. the mark was here, they gave a really good presentation. For those of you that, you know, we haven't had one of these in this city, but there's a thing called a public safety power shut off. And if it happens in this city, that's probably your first clue that you might want to start thinking about evacuating when you start getting those power safety public safety power shut off notices. Because that's telling you that the weather is forecasted to be fire weather and that if the utility is going to start turning off your power It's probably a time to start packing your car and getting stuff ready to go and if not leave when that happens Because the next thing that's happens is your power is going to shut get shut off and in this city We already have enough problems with your cell phones I don't know if you're like me, but at my home If the power goes off, my cell phone stops working so Firewatch is unique in that the radios have batteries the batteries last five to six hours that Repeaters have backup capabilities on them and that radio might be your only way to communicate I'm not saying that you should stay if you lose your power If my power goes off and I'm not able to communicate and we're in a PSPS event, you know, I've got to start getting my wife's 13 animals and crates and out the door. There are other tools available. So fire watch if you're not a member of fire watch. You should really think about becoming a member of fire watch. Kathy Solbal and Mark that were here can help. I know there's several, I don't know if Norm's still here. Norm was here earlier. Norm out there, okay. Yeah, Norm can, Norfolk and Halper's Thomas, there's a bunch of Firewatch members that are here. Get a radio, I keep mine on in the house, and the Firewatch members are really disciplined. There's no chatter on this thing. Every Sunday they make sure all the radios work and that's about the only time unless there's an event going on in the city. And when there's an event going on in the city, you have people telling you about the event that's going on in the city. So it works very well. Bon brought it up so I won't go into it. Volunteer. John brought it up. There's a lot of opportunities to volunteer. I hope that's an amber alert. But if you're not volunteering, consider volunteering. EPC, I think always needs help. We do the quarterly cleanups. Firewatch is a volunteer organization. There's a lot of opportunities to volunteer. And then lastly, I just want to thank everyone that came tonight and participated. Dominic, thank you so much for your time. Chiefs, thank you for being here tonight. Ray, Quann. And then you guys, I mean, I'm just really thankful that so many people care enough. I mean, in my years of doing this, I think the only time I've seen a bigger crowd here is when we had the meetings to talk about why we closed Tossi under road back in 2019. I think that was the only time I've seen more people in this room. So thank you so much. I know I'm going to stick around for a little bit. It's eight o'clock. I want to thank you all for coming tonight. This is about the time frame that I thought we would run two hours, rafferty. And I just wanted to say that as we are always looking to improve the brush cleanse program, if you have some thoughts or ideas what you see as residents receiving that information, doing the work, what might get your attention better, what might be difficult in the process of doing the clearance or hiring a contractor some of those stumbling points you might come across. Please speak with the chiefs, myself, council members, as we're in this process of adopting or starting our new brush clearance program at the April council meeting. We'll have a public hearing as one of those steps in that piece. We're always looking to improve that and especially this year make a little more changes to it. please give us your information and some of those things that in the past may have been the stumbling blocks for you guys on. can't fire and find a contractor to do it or I'm not quite sure what needs to be cleared or I can't pay for it or I went to a bait mint and some of those things are ideas you may have that we can then take back work on and then work with council to make those changes to the programs to make it better and improve and help our residents be able to complete those brush-clowns things so please chat with us take back, work on, and then work with council to make those changes to the programs to make it better and improve and help our residents be able to complete those brush-clown things. Please chat with us and share those ideas you may have. Thank you. All right. And then I want to lastly, and last but not least, thank staff. So this was a out of cycle meeting and one that was not planned, so staff did support it. We did make sure we videotaped it because I did hear there are several people that couldn't make it tonight but wanted to watch the videotape version so we did have staffer to support. So thank you so much for giving up your Monday evening. All right. thank you all.