I'm on front street any falter. Okay. I love that we approved remote participation by letty hearty second. All in favor. Hi, any any posed? Is it officially in our fish? Are you? Here we go. I care and have some slides and some. Is this going to go through the. Go through point by point. I. And I was just introduced at the last time we did this was. I think it was 2016. It was prior to. It was during the planning of the high school. I mean, we had to make adjustments because we knew that we were gonna have this, well, we hoped that we're gonna have this huge debt coming from the high school in City Hall and the library. And it was more debt than our existing financial policies that allow us to take. So Karen worked really hard with David Ford, who was our financial advisor, and they came up with this plan. And then this plan she had a day of charter and why it went to New York to get the bond institutions to review our financial policies and our financials and then they gave us a bond rating which was triple A. Triple A. Right so both organizations gave us triple A because we had sound policies and sound bank balances and then we were going out for bonding from these to projects we were able to get the most possible right. So that was the gen and I don't know how one had been changed before that but so that was 2016 so we're supposed to review them every. So we know it's 28th. 28th week? Okay. Yeah. Okay. And pretty much the policy for vids that we think of long term for initial sustainability and that we have to make ourselves desirable for issuance of debt when you go and meet rating agencies. And then we have appropriate use of funds for the one time and on one place so that we don't create a structural imbalance in my answers. So what I'll do is I'll go section by section, cover the highlights. And if you have any questions, we can go through it. It's not that long of policy, there are like 405 pages. And then we can do a couple of charts at the end. Two. I think there. So in general, the budget is adopted by, governed by the city's charter and by the city code in adopted by council and your budget it has to be a balanced budget revenues equal to expenditures. The other thing to keep in mind during those is that one-time revenues should be used for one-time expenditures and non-referring costs could pay for, like pay as you will projects, could pay for that service, but more like one-time things, equipment, and add to 500 reserves and those kinds of things. But considered as a restricted use and point time use. There is a clause on that the budget code include a contingency of preparation for council and we have done that in a couple of years in the past. When we're crafting the budget. There is not enough information on what all the priorities are going to be and we put a contingency amount or council and that can be appropriated through the year as and when it comes clear. So that has happened in the past. The utility funds I'll just cover at the end so I'm going to skip the utility piece here. I'm just going to. The financial policies say that we should have a five year and I'm going to correct about to six year in the next with a 10 year window when we do the update. And these are all supposed to be done by ordinances. The CIP has to show the color of money, how it's getting funded. The debt, cash, grants, all the funding that the Catholic projects are requiring for completion and like a full financing plan for the six year that we present annually. And we have gone through the annual budgets. The next piece is on governance. How we get these into might find out the City of all. So the City Council adopts the budgets by ordinance. I go see for I'm on CGS last of the and the. So then the amendments like the same thing have to be approved by Council adopted by an ordinance with public hearing into ratings like we do. Transfer between funds between the departments can be done using a resolution, but since we do an ordinance, we just follow that protocol and we don't separate out the resolution piece. Within a department, any movement of funds between personnel and non-personnel, or within non-personnel between accounts, has to be approved both by the finance director and the city manager. Then, transfer between capital projects comes to city council, and we bring that as part of the budget amendment. Even though it says that that as part of the budget amendment. Even though it says that the downward adjustment of project budget requires city manager and the CFO approval, I mean we pretty much work any changes that we do to CIP projects, whether it's transferred between projects or moving funding out, we do come to council or transparency and accountability reasons. And funding for retirement and post retirement benefits. So this is interesting piece of information for everybody. That when we have our in the pension system, we do have a fully funded, I think it's about 170 percent, the last semi-site, for the city side, and we make our annually contribution based on what that jury will use the methodology that they use. And those are determined and we fund ourselves appropriately. And then we do the same for the other post employment benefits, the OPEB, which is other than the retirement piece of medical, the life insurance, and all the other benefits that we have. And being in that piece that we are a 100% funding for the city, good place to be at, and then the utility will cover all utilities at the end. I asked one question about the both retirement benefits just in terms of the relationship because may you often raise like the water ones and so what was it part of the water sale like a portion of that is basically being used to fund the pension retirement benefit. So it would have been that the city would otherwise have to find some other source of funding, but that the water sale basically is a large portfolio. We pre-paid the mortgage a little bit. We put a $11,000? No. No millions. Millions. Yeah, yeah, yeah, it starts to sell in land. So we put that in in what I mean. 14, 14, 14. Yeah. 14? Yeah. You probably talked about it for 10 years. Yeah. Yeah. So when you bring it up and get from meeting a lot of the time, it's just sort of reminding people and reminding all of us that that like fund is there and it continues to pay you know support the rights. So there was a whole way as a white student coming from elsewhere. Yes okay we talked about it as white said for like two years and had to be convinced this was the right use of this nice $1 million from the sale of the waters. So it was the sale of the water system. It was time to pay school land that we got. All sorts of cities have its own waters. Yeah. Right. Right. So not so. I hope you refer to that. So when we got $20 million in addition to the land where the high school is because the water system is valued higher than that land. So then we decided to invest it. My understanding was that we're getting interest from from money. So that money isn't going like two pensioners that's going back to the city for use. Okay, right. And the reason being, the city isn't allowed to invest money in things. So this was a way to invest money in the pension so that we could pull out some of that interest. So we use like 600 and40,000 a year, our interest and we use it towards employers contribution. Oh, and we are using that money tower. Okay. For the taxpayers contribution. Yes. So if they gates that exposure to the tax, I see. How do we not have that windfall on that money? Would we have been in trouble with the pension system? No. So that 107% funded is without counting. We kind of treat that, that's correct what I just said back here, right? We treat that 9 million separate. It's like a car. That was the true innovation. Putting money in the pension fund, people do that. But carving it out so it's a perpetual return for the taxpayers was the innovation. And that's why it takes like 20 minutes to explain it. That's the body. That's why it took two years to put that into the chat. That's the way it is. No, that's correct. I've done in the past move money to the trust fund, like one time money, but partying it out was completely. And just a quick, so putting it in the pension fund means it can be invested in like a more broader range of assets rather than like what we're usually able to. I'm still in. Absolutely. Okay. Okay. And it's in perpetuity. Can we add to that? Or no? Yeah. I'm always wondering. I mean, it's a lot of it. Okay. But then just use it towards your talk to me. You should once. Yeah. Okay. But it's not like a bank account that happens a one way back. I heard you say, OK. But it's worth talking about because probably there's two big ways that cities get in trouble. Maybe three. One is they don't fund their pensions. The two is they get addicted to one time of money to pay for operating expenses and three to take on too debt, too much debt. So the third you could argue about mismetrics, we've done that with a vulnerable area, the other two quite solid. And the Carboud on the pension fund also helps, right? Because if we grow in terms of our staffing numbers, we already have like circuit grid built that cushion in for post retiring benefits. Someone. Did you say, again, I said that that kind of having a car powder when we did the upfront movement that also conceive of leachion help as we grow staffing numbers wise, right? So that as post-employment benefits like continue to grow because we have more staff moving forward we hopefully have already like more of a cushion in terms of what the retirement benefit will be as we have for example more police officers in the world right because we're 100% Yeah, but that's because of that, but not because of the 9.2 since it's completely treated as a separate account or a sub-event. Any increases in payroll have to come out of our either investment returns or what's in the cap, all right? I think it's accurate to say that a growing organization tends to have a more comfortable tension situation than an aging and maybe decrease in a moving forward size organization. I think that's a definition. Yeah, that's a way of attribution, yeah. Support, support. Yeah. And look at our report from their time report. I put my name. The one is coming out right now. Yeah, yeah. First thanks. So. That's right. She's very good. County will come. Yeah. That's. Well, she's very good. Come and be happy. That's good. Well, she's not on the line. Yeah, we have friends. Well, I think she's. That's good for January. Yeah, I think. Maybe. Oh, we saw her. We saw her. Yeah. That's so strange. Remember you. Yeah. Okay. Sorry. She came to my house. I think it's out but I think it's stockative not till Shane. Right. Yeah. Thank you. I'm kind of glad. Sure. And then we move to the meat of this, but debt management, one of the big reasons why we have a policy. Um, but there are some metrics that. Um, determine how much debt we can issue. So first one is that the total general fund debt that we issue should not exceed 5% of our assessed value. And that is that just a taxable piece. And we are within that limit. Numbers two is that our total annual debt service expenditure that we have compared to our total expenditures should be less than 12%. 2017-18 review because when we were projecting and modeling our school city hall and library debt, it was going to go over 12. So that's the time we made a tweak that it could go over 12, but no more than 15%. And what would we do to, in extra, to keep in line line ourselves but our finances so that a plan to come back down and then also the years that were over, I'll just keep going. So when just remember those two things, first it was 12% that's the standard policy. I'll call it and then 15% which is the maximum policy and will keep moving. And then when it comes to fund balanced requirements, don't explain a little bit more. No, it's just, it's going to be a link. If you want me to go point by point, I'll go every each one of them. So that issuance policy requires us that we don't issue the for the debt for the more than the useful life. So like for issuing for vehicles, the terms are going to be five years or less if we're issuing for like a high school 30 years, 20 years and did 30 on the board. Normally, the normal infrastructure we've done 20 in high school. So that and then for the arbitrage, that we don't make any more interest than the borrowing rate. And we did end up paying this year because we did make more interest than our borrowing rate. So like in the past we haven't we've been good but our interest rates were high so this year when we did our reports we ended up paying something. And here do we pay that to your The balances of that insurance are quite small. There's more right? Right. Yeah. So if this has happened, the fact that right after we issued the school, we were sitting on a lot of money, as it is waiting to be spent for the project. And I could have been, you know, a big thing we would have been talking about instead of balances very small. Do we only keep a little impact for now? I'll spend what we need and return the rest. We don't like to keep, we want to spend it now. And for some reason, the drawdown takes long, the interest that's earned, we come back to council to reoccurate and that interest income can be used on projects that are part of the issuance, like if it had a fire station or if it had parks, then we can't issue it. Use that interest income for a similar kind of point of view. And that we've seen that in some of the credence, but I think it is. then in some of the previous budget. And then the number six, which tells us how our payouts have to be. So 25% of the debt should be repaid within five years, because we're a policy sales, and it'll means 50% of the debt within 10 years. And in the past, until we shoot the big amounts, we were pretty good about that. And then with the $120 million that we issued, we did both past these thresholds, or we didn't read these thresholds or other. And so the other policy that I told about the debt service to expenditures, the 12% and then this one, these are the two that we had when we did our model, we knew that we're going to meet these policies. And then we made some adjustments to our fund balance policy based on that. Just a look, if this one is the one where the end violation of right now still, which is why we're holding higher available fund balance. So it's worth getting your mind wrapped around that a little bit. What this means is 20 year debt Okay, and because we issued the 30 year bonds for the high school And it ended up showing us while we're outside the range of these payout ratio It's a little more complicated that but insured handbites What did they go? And that was all baked in when we issued the debt that was and we got a triple a reading hand base. The, what did I think? And that was all baked in when we issued the debt that was when we got our triple a reading. Yes, yeah, we had to shared the model. But at the time, and that was our plan that we changed the policy. One of the dimensions of this that's worth keeping in mind is the tactical point is whether we issue debt with level debt service or whether we issue debt with level principal payments. One of Ira Kalen's big second, if you push forward on his tenure, was level principal. That's more expensive up front, but it's quite nice because every year your debt service goes down. As opposed to if you do level debt service for the 20-year bond it just stays dead flat. So the only kind of good thing is that normal inflation makes that feel smaller year after year. Level principal is a very strong way to issue debt. And we did that and we read up to the high school. The high school, however, we did as level front of whether that's a dead service. Because it was just too expensive to do as level. So to summarize why there are two departures from our normal financial policy when we issued $120 million. It was both level debt and 30-year bonds. That's right. That's great. Thank you. Do we have anything else that's level debt? Or just is the library or city of all? We kind of pick on the school saying that was the big thing, but in truth that was kind of bundled all together. St. Paul library. That's all that's. It's not said that right. I thought it was not. We were in the library in the school at the same time. But I thought we kept it at 20 year though. Yeah, she's right. The other was 20. So libraries at 20 year though. Yeah, she's right. The other one was 20. There were so many rooms at 20. It's 20 year, but is it level to have a level principle? I thought it was level principle. I want to say that only the school piece was leveled. Okay. Yes, that's the big selection. I want to. Yeah, I look like that. I go check that. And that's pretty much how we get modeled at two, but I want to check the papers, the bomb papers, confirm that. And we have an issued death sentence. 2019 November. So we've had five years of kind of dead issues. Yeah. Thanks. Yeah. I mean, good. Got it all before the interest rates. Right. That was a good one. The mission next. I think that's really good. So we were going to do any like, what's the later retrunches? Yeah, we were originally planned by the high slopes. Retrouches. So one to do the planning, one for partway, and then one six months later to finish the project. So we are pulling out so much debt at one time, but at the time we're ready to issue the debt, the interest rates were so low. Karen said, let's just do it all once. So do we do two trenches? We did the first trench for the planning. Yeah. And then we just combined the second, third trench and one gigantic issuance which they see us but I see this on trial of interest. We couldn't do it right now, it's interesting. But we want separate. Yeah, yeah, that's it. Oh, it's time tells us what qualifies as debt. So we've done funds for general obligation funds. We've done line of credit, the non qualified less than 10 million. We've done revenue bonds, but it's just tells what are the different tools that qualifies that. And then the next little mini section tells that the council must put to referendum when we go for general obligation bonds. And there are two requirements. I mean, it's two clarifications on that. One is every time it is more than the, the mouth needed for bonds. Should be more if it is more than 10% of the total general fund budget. And in. In the case of high school, of course, it was and we went, we kind of represent them there. And then there are some carry up to it and that's some item number two which says they're issued for public safety or sooner or medical service projects and we don't necessarily have to go. So. and we don't necessarily have to go. So we're not in service this project, Steve. Far station. And to me, I think that's what that is. As the ambulance, the ambulance, I mean, we're not gonna shoot guns for a hospital. But some jurisdictions, right? Sure, it's your funds for our federal community. I think that's really going to be ready. Thank you. But when we did see Hall of the, there was not a referendum because it was tied into the police and the court. Yeah, so there was a fun time for us that it count in this like the such of services. Right. And this was a debated point. I will help to say. Yeah, it wasn't just. There was a debated point. I will have to say. Yeah, yeah, it was. It just, there was a lot of conversation. Yeah, yeah, I know I'm yeah, but it be a better decision that we did not have a reference to your scale. One note on this. This is totally voluntary. The City Council is in post this referendum on itself. And it could repeal that, if it wish to. One of the differentiators between County and a city in Virginia is that counties have to go to referendum. Cities deny. Oh, that's something in our city charter about going to Ratio Nambac. No, it's just this is it right here. And that was done by resolution also. So it's also kind of a quirky thing that sometimes these resolutions get lost because they're not in the code of ordinances. So by having it kind of reaffirmed in the policies, cancel, kind of reminds itself that part. Yeah. self-developed farm. And so you say, you have to get enough to do the pool. Yeah, very new referendum. 1996, it was a referendum. And then with the like, with the library, the referendum was for ex amount. And by the time you built the library, it was eight years later. And we used more money to do another reference, and to put more money on the library. Because we were bonding the additional money. We found that money in our fastest head. We used to find more money. I didn't have to do this right. So it's for that amount of money to borrow for the product. Fairfax they do like a partner front and over say it's all right here because it's just built into their. They have somebody schools that they're waiting in somebody facilities. So it's always in there because they're always bonding. Oh, bigger. Yes, bigger issues. We'll go down further down past you today. So the fun balance. That's what gets tied into these are the metrics that measures how much fun wellness we should feed. And then that section we look for policies. I'm assigned fund wellness. That's the one that the city sets aside for emergencies and for needed doing economic, you know, those kind of emergencies when we have and it was used last time, I think around 2000, 80, 90. That was not during COVID. No, no, this was with a great recession. Actually, that was a fine. And so with the standard policy that we had. Of that we have of 12 we have. Of 12 debt service, expenditures of that service as a percentage of total expenditures, we are required and payout ratio 25% that within five years and 50% within 10 years, we are required to maintain 17% as a target for the other side fund balance. And 17% is roughly two months worth of operating expenses. So that's like a buffer. And it can be used for a new short pulse, although I think that was the reason it was used in 8.9 and we've seen a downfall in our revenues like you mentioned COVID but we didn't have to dip into it. We cut our expenditures at that time to stay within our revenue protections. If this year we were to have because we've been over maybe over predicting I don't know expected revenues will we dip into that fund if it turned out that we were short on what we were expecting. I would say the first exercises that we look at our expenditures, which there are any vacancies we can raise or if there are any other cuts we can make both us under schools. We do that. We reach a point that we don't have class and there are views of still unexpected. And we can also reach Texas. That's the other. Not here. Not here. Not here. Not here. But that's the other. I don't know. Okay, sure, the toolbox. There's a text, are you really needed? Yeah, but the charter says that when we end the year, we have to be within the revenue budget though, we said we can't have our expenses for 60% to finish the program. So yes, like in the case of say, I don't know if something happens in Whole Foods doesn't open until November of next year. Like that would then impact our budget and so then we would have to figure something out. So one tool would be dipping into this. Another tool might be freezing our expenses or trying to back up. So we saw, if you recall, a chart or it says the floor is 12% and then the target is 17. We've been on the conservative side and we've kept ourselves at the target, 17%. And then the policy says that if we go lower, then we have even lower than the floor, then we two years to flexed fiscal years and the year that we're in to come back to 12% and then we had additional three years, three fiscal years to come back to 17%. So overall five-year window to come back like a cure for ourself. I guess it was 2010, right? That was the year we had to get, because they were set to. And I saw you get a sticker. It was pretty large. Yeah, cool. It was 2008 and it's like, where you crashed that we were already in the 2009 budget. So it was like the phone, your budget, right? Well, just the chart that you're going to show go back to that year. Yeah. to about your own. So we so boy that had to happen was then I'd be able to hold hold money had to get put back in so yeah we'll budgetate we have to repay your that's like fine balance. So that also means things take. Are these numbers you should like I mean if you look at probably 10 or I don't know like looking at other jurisdictions um it's the 17% and 12% standard across jurisdictions? It is, it's not like standard, there are some that are even 20%, there are some that are like around the 15%, and we will have that for you and for presents, there is a with our major interrestrictions and some the key metrics how they're there. When we did these policies last time, we brought that as well and shared with council where our benchmarks are there too. And these are in a waste tender like GFO away the General Finance Office Association. Overall, in US has some best practices that every institution wants to follow. To be in and has to be starting up for us to go get a debt of even stock. What percent of, this is probably not. I'm just saying about the AAA rating. Is there like 10% of those applied for it or at AAA or like could everybody be at AAA? It's determined by how, I know it's useful. I don't know. Right, I'm just wondering like, what is the number? Like how many are to be at? It's determined by how I know it's useful. Sound your good. Right, I'm just wondering like, what is the number? Like, like how many are to be? Yeah. So, I mean, it's great for us to get out and rate. I'm like, Calonies in the US. How many of them are triple A's? That can be quite. Yeah, just, I mean, not exactly. I'm just curious. great but I just wanted some perspective on it. So it's not like if you're not a triple-tooled employee you cannot borrow. You can still borrow, I know you can borrow. You can borrow. It's like an additional device or if you borrow money and then what really you're borrowing it. I'm just curious. Okay, I'll get that. Okay. I mean don't, don't spend it just a sometimes. That's not a big question. Yeah, I'm just thinking about it. Yeah. It's definitely not a priority, but it's a curiosity. Yeah. One thing that is kind of interesting is that is have legal mechanism and the written your constitution for the city not pay its funds. We cannot not pay. We have to pay them. It's like your payment, like the sponsor support kind of thing, like the child support or another element. So like the Virginia Constitution stands for the proposition that you have to raise the taxes or you have to cut. But no matter what, you have to pay your bond. And be civil. And so in some respects, given that law, it's like, well, we're a higher credit than the United States government. Oh, my goodness. There's no pathway for us not to pay. Oh, wow. So, you know, the movie says the same thing. You're not ready to do that. But in some respects, their business model is to make that student really want to pay those fees and get that rating as a little bit cynical. But you were, movies was double-a when I came. Yeah. And the other two were triple-a. And then when we went to issue the 120, we got raised to triple-a. They were very interested. So they were pretty happy. So they were like, yeah That's the trible. That's why they were happy that we have planted well. That's satisfying. That's satisfying the right amount of resource and requirements. That's what I was referring to as a Virginia constitution. And Illinois, for instance, or Detroit Detroit gave its bond orders just as the Mexican haircut back in 2010. So it's a Virginia thing, but I think it's Virginia's not a line in that. I think there's still a lot of states where there's no pathway to bankruptcy at Virginia's stock. Oh, that's so. No, I don't have a mindset. You know, reinvesting the bankruptcy. He bankrupted it, you know, after the ice. Right. Yeah. Right. Okay, so item number three in this, find balance that talks about when we. Go past our debt service to expenditure ratio over 12. Then what do or required to do or if we're not able to meet our payout benchmarks of 25% and 50% and 10 years. Then this was the new piece that was added 2017, 18 times when we did this policy and that was that we look at our available fund balance, not just on a slide fund balance. And that includes all the spendable money that we have, which is, you know, I unrestricted, I want to say, because it's the capital reserves, reserves that we set aside, the permit reserves, reserves that we set aside, the permit reserves. And anything else that is restricted like the bond proceeds, the grants, the inventory assets, or any income rates, is those don't count into that calculation. And like Wyatt mentioned, we are now in compliance with our debt service. We are below 12% that service to expenditure, but we're still not meeting our payup ratio requirements and that we have to to 2028 to meet the point. So that's why when we looked at that chart, requirements and that we have to to 2028 to meet the point. So that's why when we looked at that chart, the bar, the stack, we had the two lines, the 20% and the 70% both that after when we are in compliance, then we go back to our other side, the 70% line. And you mean, how many years do we plan to be out? I'm sorry, six. Yeah, it was, um, some Swedish issued like 22 till 20. 21 till 28. 28 is why we. Seven. And then the next section number number four tells the description on each of those categories of green to the accounting standard that we have restricted is more like bond proceeds on grant very things that we have for specific purpose. We can't use those to count towards the unfalents, the available fund balance. Committed is what goes in calculation for the available fund balance, and that is capital reserve, the permit reserves that we have satisfied. Spendable is what we satisfied for elementary assets or any Greek expenses. Like we have insurance payment that we do. Using this year's money, we do next year's insurance payment. So those are unspecable. On ease. And then assigned is that conferences and the eos that we have outstanding. So those examples of those, that's the something. Practical investment policy, that's like what fish centers are served. So this was started by 2011. And it's it's funding set aside for capital projects or debt service to support the capital projects and the minimum balance requirement set here is either it's 5% of our total capital assets. And I mean, which is a big number, or 3.75, the end of the year is lower. So we go with 3.75, even if we take 5% off like 100%. So. And then it gives a little bit more description of what we can use it for replacement rehab of capital projects that service like. Just mention and then the governance on it again has to come to council for approval and use ordinance to read it. And the same cure that it has for general fund other monies, as it's a cure that if it goes the loan the limit since there is no floor or target here, just one number. We have three fiscal years to recover, to cut back to our clients to come back to complaints to come to the minimum requirement of 3.7 plus. And this is separate from the other sign 12 balance. Yes, yes, yes, a separate part of mine. So just not count towards that. It doesn't count towards the other sign 12 balance, but it counts towards the available. That 20%. So when we look at that bar graph, then we see sort of capital reserves. We should in our minds sort of always think that 3.75 is like the very top portion, let's say of that purple so that, you know, we're supposed to be keeping that yet. So like year six, we would wanna see at the end of the set, I think it would be, that we have a strong current capture of, or an emergency web books, thank you. That's what I'm saying. So in the purple, like technically, I don't know, in my mind, like there's a lavender in the purple, that's like 3.75. Like there should be a sunset of the purple, like technically, I don't know, in my mind, like there's a lavender in the purple. That's like 3.75. Like there should be a subset of the purple. Oh, yeah, yeah. And then it's already a be all lavender in your box. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. I think 29 is a good portion. Yeah, you're right. I like that. Yeah, I like that. We'll do that. Policy requirements. It's been right. Okay, any other questions that think this is the end of general fund? Does that reflect better like how you build up your capital reserves for specific purposes? And there's hardly one you would technically be. Oh, you might want to be above this since it's that much lower than what five percent would be given our assessed values. And I will ask you. Yeah. Okay. And maybe before we shift to utility funds, just kind of a point that I would share with Councillors. But on a sign of unbalanced is not an attack as I might expect. And it's, you know know having the chart where we share with how we used it in 2010. It was just incredibly difficult. That era was one of the great procession to the litigation on the with Fairfax County on the water fund which we've lost and the judge ordered us to discord from the general fund to the utility fund by $8.9 billion, three years worth of the transfer of profit we had taken from the utility fund to the general fund. And so that was an emergency. And sort of go in the noise of all of the difficulties that the great recession brought. We had this big payment we had today. And it is quite remarkable that the city council had the political vision to say, we're gonna get our house in order with management to put ourselves in the position to meet these big capital needs that we needed to make. And so these policies are not for outside audiences. They can be very close to home. And what they did for us in 2010 was bought us time. We needed to cut the school budget. We needed to cut the general government budget, which we did. We reduced our staffing by 15%. And kind of everything. general government budget, which we did, we reduced just staffing by 15%. And kind of everything. But it does take time. We did too layoffs, but we've mostly relied on normal people choosing to retire and things like that, which made it morale-wise much better too. That's a kind of the Visualge bus and trash and recycling was in-house. I think they can't contract. So they were some big change. So there were some layoffs that definitely was a lot of Yes. Figure many is sent to sew we tired. We did an early retirement in the senate. And there was this, I think there's a sense of the more tendered employees. Like we get it, but it's a crisis. I can retire. I will have retirement benefit for the benefit of my fellow co-workers. I'm going to choose to retire. There are many that made that decision which, um, uh, so it was, it was, these things are, yeah, can be quite real. And um, that's that. But I think too, the ripple down of that is that you cut those 14, 15 years no now, yeah, that happened. But the city's staffing, it took a hit for a long time. It took a several hours to get back to that pre- Possession. We were in the same kind of a population increased. And so I think our staff at the levels are still. So you have accelerated. We have achieved some of those. If you look at the years, you have to be very rational. But that's it. I mean, that's because I'm going to the campaign. I can. And arguably, the sort of the hockey stick that you see in a employment level is sort of getting maybe correcting some over cutting that we did that was difficult for us to sustain. It made us more delivering, you they make council community expect for us. One question before we move to the utility funds. So while we're still in the general fund, this came up in the EDA meeting. So what happens to unused money for capital projects to the parklets, namely. Could we clarify that? So what this stands, what the written policy says is that the council can then reallocate those dollars by resolution. In fact, what happens is they would naturally go into capital reserves or any rate this city manager can commit unscathed dollars to capital reserves through an administrative action. And that's where they sit until the council ratifies that with an ordinance change. Did they have to be assigned to, besides the the reserve for the capital reserves, do, does it at all dollars in the capital reserves fund have to be assigned to some projects? It could just be sitting there in a general. So it's not like, because they know what a LLC IP is. Yeah, okay. What the city manager cannot do is plus up another capital project to the administrative action. That of an expansion of the appropriation has to go to cats. Or even transfer from this project to that project. It's pretty much like sending it back and reappropriate. Since each named CI project, CIB project is the equivalent of a department in the operating budget, where only the council can move money between departments and make a council can move money between projects. And is there a certain amount of time that projects have before it has to spend the money? Is it three years, why? Yeah, the money will disappear from the project at three at year three. And just in the general capital reserve fund? Sort of naturally, it would get on a signed fund balance and then the city manager came by administrative action, put it to capital reserves. But the council has to reappropriate it. Okay, so just to be clear, so it could be in capital reserves assigned to a project right now. Nothing happens for five years. That many then gets put back into the unsigned fund balance and then you could put it back into the capital, I don't know, the count, you know, the back of the capital reserves and then you could put it back into the capital, I don't know, the capital, you know, the back of the capital reserves and then council could assign it to something. Right. I think the bottom line is, if a CIP project does not perceive them or he's not spent, the council re-approach. It doesn't get spent by staff. Yeah. Okay. So in your CIP chart, when they see the six years versus the 10 years, basically each of the yearly columns, we should think of it in terms of like that year, but it stretches an additional two years. Okay. I mean, the money isn't going to be so bad here. Yeah. Okay. I mean, the money isn't going to be so bad here. Yeah. Yeah. So even the stat chart, like, it's, yeah, appropriated, but it's not happening then. Yeah. She does give us more flexibility on the conservative side. If you run into a problem, then you when I see the icing or a quality, 2008, 10, their projects that were underway that just got delayed or halted. So then you got additional funds there that could be re-allocated if necessary. Right, so if you're looking at like fiscal year 27 on the CIP, you and your mind are like, oh, the fiscal year 2526 funds are pulling with that if they haven't been. It's not too ready. Yeah, okay. I think I'll before we start the utility fast. So I don't have the review of this. Some feedback, but the questions that came up at the VFC on the 15. Yes, and then of course coming to the 18th work session. I my full council. Instead of being there, they're going to get their presentation on some of the practices out there, how we come there, and the further things being for change. This is the same down for people. Yes. And we have the same staff. Okay. So, because the minute comes on the 25th of the resolution. All right, thank you. Pretty much. I know a lot of the things. I'm actually not sure. You're welcome. Yeah, I mean, don't really. Yeah, you can really spend a whole life of a lot of changing change. You're not interested in a lot of changing. We still see. Yeah, I think it's fun. You said it's a great job. Wonderful. Yeah, I think it's better to finish that one. We're full. Yeah, but one that I've been turned over my mind and I People look at the fine one, but I have you know the planning commission's been asking for us to Do long range planning for the affordable housing fund through the CIP? so Looking for whether this is the right vehicle for that or the affordable living policy is the right vehicle for it I kind of like it in this rather than in the affordable living policy and I think a place it could be is almost just a sentence that says Either here on paid in section B the last two Paragraphs it could go any other points. The City will prepare, update any of the six year CIP program, we can address all of that you're planning for affordable housing, bearable incentives, or except for the trust funds, the City will adopt an any budget for all other funds, including the school board and the academic health authority, and we can say, in in comma the affordable housing fund and then addressing how long an inch planning could be done. So we'll work on some language there but I want to be aware that we're thinking about that and and would like the council to weigh in on this planning commission question. I've seen Cindy and Laxida a few times. And then there's like tired of that. We don't have to worry. We write that in a query. I think it's a monitor to think about. Yeah. It's just that when things, we have a better picture. We have to, in a policy, you have to have some way of telling what the balance should be. Yeah. How are we going to distinguish it? Why? should be, yeah, how we're going to make it. Right. Yeah, so this is just going to be an introductory that we're going to do it. But once we have a living policy, the forego has a living policy, and then how we're going to manage the money, then I think we should have a piece. Because here, for the CIP, we have a capital investment, free investment, flexion. So there's going to be a little mini section which you know, it's not like an aspirational sentence. Yeah, like it was in the policies for a reason because we're supposed to be doing something. Yeah, that's right. We have. Yeah. Okay. But for now, we need just an explanation. I have to go in a few minutes. So I don't know if that breaks our world. We'll do the utility funds. We've got all the concepts. The utility funds quickly since we got all the concepts. The utility funds. The two pieces to the utility funds are the fees and the chargers that we get. And then we have the availability fees in this year. So it talks about in the section above what those can be used for availability. These can be used for capacity increase and then the fees and other fees and the regular operating or operating expenses and for that service if we have or on government insurance that we shouldn and we do have out-sane months there. So, what the fund balance requirements are on these funds is that the unrestricted section C.1 there should be greater than 25% of the total operating expenses. And we kept up with that policy both as we do the year end and then the planning for the next year's budget. And then the other one is that the capital reserve for each of the funds and for Sanitary Sour, it is 2% of the capital assets are 400,000 and I mean 400,000 the one that we aim at currently and for stormwater it's 2% of the capital assets. That's 0.3 and 0.4 and And if you recall when we did your end report, we did report out, oh, this is the budget. We reported out what the fund balance is. And we look at it again, at least the sewer one, when we go to come to before the capacity increase. If we're doing so when we talk about potentially amending or updating any policies, we haven't before done debt service in a utility fund, have we? We have these other books. So if we're doing so like numbers, we're talking about for sewer, for example, this is this policy adequately cover the debt we'd be taking on like we wouldn't need to do anything different with the 2% versus the 400,000 in terms of a capital reserve. Correct. Okay. Yeah. I mean, at least for the capacity increase with Fairfax, we're not hoping to issue any debt. When the thing based on comfort, then we may have to issue debt because that's another 10 million then the folks who have this, that's what that. So we don't need to do like a build up the way that we did a build up in catholars or sort of in a demo fund sort of side. But I think what the number say that seems to me that it may traditionally. That's correct. Do you have the model? I'm sure that the debt we're wanting to issues. Doesn't all make us go and pass our benchmarks. If it does, then we have to put some ESL headquarters around that. But the sewer fund does have a decent amount of debt. And it's generally been all to fund our share of treatment plan upgrades. Yeah, that's right. Because we have that. And then we still have the treatment plan updates that are going to happen. Like that. Yeah, that's that is mean, because we have that and then we still have the treatment plan updates that are going to happen. Yeah, they have to show up in the CIP. So like you had an unforeseen amount or something balloon because of Alexandria or your bags right from 10 or. Where were the plants are. Yeah, yeah. Okay. Yeah. That's pretty much. It's it's along the same ones. The other side. She talks about. The bond issue andances that we do, general obligation bonds, and the same set of, like, how the cost issuance and interest, it just tells us when we go into issuance, how we think of structure. To me, getting better rate for utility, like one or issuing utility to other general. I guess bonds, buyers are willing to pay a different rate for utility versus general instruction. Yeah. I mean, I'm thinking it could, I should have those, but because there's a review stream to pack it up and it should be slightly better all the obligation bonds also have reserves that need into it. And so I'm just curious. We have issued sewer debt in the past. Backed by the full faith and credit of the taxpayer of the city of Falls Church. In order to lower the debt. Service by a couple basis points. And the. Reason we've done that is there's no way we're going to recall it or so we're going to bond so it may as well, it may fully do it and get big advantage of it. So, better interest rate. Which in the way of answering your question, I think in fact the general obligation is generally viewed or favorably by the bind holders, then a revenue bond for utility. Okay. Because they view as like priorities wise, you would have shrinking revenues, you know, or whatever it would be, right, ability to pay that you'd be paying into this at a higher priority, like sooner than some of your other debt because of the essential nature of the service. That's right. But I think it's also related to the fact that what we were talking about earlier, there is no legal mechanism for the city on the issue, but there is a legal mechanism to default on the Revenue Bond. So the one default that I can think of in Virginia history is in the University of America, which was on a Revenue Bond for their municipal golf course. Oh my gosh. And the Revenue's were not sufficient to pay the bonds, so there was a fight so whether those bonds would be on or not, a similarfight really kind of can't occur with our general obligation bond because it's going to be paid. Yeah, interesting. All right, is that your Debbie, you want to keep going? Yeah, let's keep going. Thank you very much for taking the time. Thank you all. Hopefully we'll pay dividend on it. Thank you very much for taking the time. Thank you all. Hopefully we'll pay dividends on. Thank you. Thank you. Have a good day, by all. Thank you.