Okay, now I've done everything correct. Go away. Go away. Right. Today would be May 6, 7, 6, 6. Thank you for the last environmental advisory board meeting. Looks like present. We have Jamie Darrell Andrew Rebecca. Tom Prissina joining us. And Joseph Goodman. Send would be organ Chashi. Mike Steiner. Mike has go. Mike hasn't excused. That's. That's. Oh, I had a question. You're going to have to wait after the conversation was with him. So. Is anyone have any questions about the approval of last month's meetings minutes for April? We basically finalize the letter and got it approved to be submitted to town council which it was a couple weeks thereafter. We have a motion to approve those minutes. Rebecca makes a motion to approve. All right. All in favor of approving the minutes please raise your hand. Second. Second. Oh thank you. second. Oh, thank you. Who can second here, Joseph? Joseph, can you second please? Thank you, sir. All in favor, please raise their hand. Right, those minutes are approved from April 2025. That kind of a light meeting this week. First point of topic though could be in a bay which is coming up May 16th so that will be next Friday. Correct. Do you have any information regarding concrete enough that you should know that we might not already or you have all the details. This just came from a suggestion last month about what does the board want to do with it? It's an opportunity to speak to people, have materials available, just be in the community. You want me to prepare something like it. printed out flyers, you know, some irony of having paper printed out to hand out a trash pick up. Um, I'll put it in. So. prepare something like it was printed out flyers, you know, it's a Miami having paper printed out to hand out a trash pick up. Um, So, you know, like text cop like they do with the mountains down instead of a, yeah, or you know, we just are burning trash or something, but really, whatever y'all want to do, um, but I can help make it happen. I will make happen. On, it's nothing that's fine as long as they still doing giveaways or a posture, there was no prizes. No, we haven't done giveaways since I've been here. So I'm not familiar with how that work. Haven't done that long, what two years, three strengths. So your fourth already? Holy cow. So you haven't been done at least four years. So I'm not sure. I just don't take it down to the, I don't know. There's a lot of it lot of tendleds going on. Yeah, I think I don't know why we don't do it, but I firmly kept on it the past. I would see this more as an educational opportunity. Information out to the public. There's some programs like it. Next to agenda items if we want to have a, or instead of the table, even. Well, I would have suggest, please, as well as I know, it's a great opportunity if you guys put together a long picture, both points of what individuals can do. Based upon the membl of use to counsel well received. But what can be done about protecting your home fire right what can you do about you know use a variation one. But you know just simple things to put out there from the environmental advisory board. You, we all need to act together, make us better plays. But, bye bye. And these are things you can do with both points. And then referring maybe to your website or something, or something. But I did it. It'd be really useful for people. I'd be willing to help crafting something. is pretty easy for some of the things that relate to water, fire. It's all in your memo. It is. Extrapolate from that to a one-pager with bullet points. And it needs a bullet point to pull out. A lot of this is already drafted. So if you read the newsletter this month, there's a ton of wildfire information and emergency preparedness. We don't have anything from the district, so if you want to create something water-wise, that'd be great. Sure. Core I know you've got stuff. We've got collateral. Yeah, for me personally, I know I'm out of town on the 16th, but all good of things. I've got with our staff to see who's available. Okay, if that makes sense, follow up. Okay. And we're at a town as well, unfortunately, but that doesn't mean we can't help crafting the message. Yes. and if that makes sense, follow up. Okay. And we're at a town as well, unfortunately, but that doesn't mean we can't help crafting the message. Yes, you want to do some water-dogs? I'll pay me, I'll have a presence as well. We may have some environmental and water bottle stuff to give away as well. I can check. Oh, sure. Hey. So the table is what you need. And are you asking for some of us to be there at the table? To I can man any table. But if, or I don't know, is Brittany still work? Yeah, Brittany is there or yeah, there's a couple people that, whether it's Brittany with development or Jamie with communications, they're both snowmass residents. And then, and then yeah, we've got other staff that we can talk about the scene. Yeah, if we can, if we can post, I can fire them. So then when people pick out trash bags, yeah, I are code so they could get buzzed in on just local environmental aspects. So we're doing that for housing information. So we can just have the same thing set up for this type of information too. If you're in like a little table time with housing information, sandwich cord. I really don't know. I didn't know what you're talking about that. Yeah. That's a good one. We have both a pamphlet for those who insist on paper and a QR code for those who want to avoid, but that'd be the idea. And they'd be printed here, would you be able to do that? Okay. I'm signing up. I'm also absent. I started. Super starting. I mean, he's got, I need to plan this a year in advance so the EAB can craft our vacations around. Well, some years has been in very first week of June and some years it's always the third Friday. Is it? No, when we were going to waste out there was some June days. Okay, so then it's always the third Friday, right? Okay, I'm going to do this for the fans. Let's talk about this in Talk to you. Talk to you. Talk to you. Talk to you. Talk to you. Talk to you. Talk to you. Talk to you. Talk to you. Talk to you. Talk to you. Talk to you. Talk to you. Talk to you. Talk to you. Talk to you. Talk to you. Talk to you. Talk to you. Yeah, We can all appreciate that stellar quote that I had. Oh, no. No, for the trash. Stay for the lunch. I think it's great. That's one of my better quotes. It's it's such a good community. You don't even think that many people are still left in town that show up to clean it. I guess so what are the bare minimums we would need to get together to fill this solid idea. I've heard water, fire, or if water gets me some information, we'll take care of the rest. We've already got fire sorted out by all have all the assets, one on the table, one like corn, that would be nice, good little level of the housing section, the environmental section, and then uh, four on one, it's on cable, you've got your, your, your, your, your, efficient building, efficiency, doing both. You're a partner, but you're also part of it, but, Yeah, it's composing so available at the town site. And it is. And that would be important to I could be included. Yeah. That's what I think everything in the letter. Everything on one page is maybe some simple little stuff. Well, these assets are in real. These assets are already created. We have these already. So it's a matter all together on one page. We're various. Various pages, but it's easy to put. I mean, you're asking for a lot of information to be on one page. I just want to say, you might want to. I just want to, because I think that's what's going to be most powerful for people. Think you have other stuff that can pick up a once-some rate. What can you do? Yeah, what can you do to help? I got it. I was just going to suggest that we cycle that when it comes to, and one suggestion which I was able to find was a map. Wasn't in the announcement that I saw, but I was able to find the map of where they're all stations are. Yep. So we cycle that forward? Yeah. We have not, you're going to all be shocked, But I have not gotten to putting the math on the website yet. Okay, so it'll be up there. Yeah, that would be great. I think we're trying to be working one to two the ones that work tonight compile for you. Yeah, I've got all the information I need. All right. Get it printed. Please. Why don't you get the gesture? Um, is anyone you're going to be here, Tom? I will probably be around, but with my physical limits. I'm not sure I can pick up for us in here, but I'll be there. I was has a very track. So you have have a lot of work? No, I've been around for four years. The Greg has a boot. If you love to play. We were right along four years later. That was your... Yeah, I see. I'll see. I'll see. What's your name, man? It's the alitating that I'm right. It's a good man. He also had a beard. Oh, I got more hair. How are you getting that a brass tie? I saw Travis having a lot of hair, but it's been tough with gunmen. They're in parachute,, eh? Oh yeah. Yeah. He's now the time manager in parachutes. All right. Well, thank you for that tall idea and thanks for offering them. Included. Better done. Appreciate you guys. Well, I mean a bulk of our topics today were exploring the cost electrification and core and Holy Cross alignment. Thank you. We're going to be the. I've got to be here because I've got some some things I can share for you guys just. Well, see, while he's pulling that up, let's take advantage of sign or not being here and volunteer him for a lot. Oh, there we go. Yes. That's how he's worked best. Yeah. So Morgan Shaji should actually be putting together your talent battle stage before. Damn cycle paper. He'll do that. Okay, so the cost of electrification, I've got a couple things to show you guys just to kind of get you an idea of the challenge that we are seeing and working to try to overcome with core, but then also kind of the monumental scale of what the the capital investment is if you look at like really like decarving the built environment, you know, to electrify the built environment. So first thing I will go over here. And so what I did is I, the easiest way for me to look at this is how we track our, is everything through the emissions and emissions inventory is kind of the easiest way where I was able to wrap my little brain around how to kind of present this information. So what I did is, and this is on our website on AspenCore.org, the greenhouse gas emissions inventory for each of the different communities. So I pulled up the built environment. Oops, sorry. Or I could move to. That's great. So this is the inventory based off of the latest data that we have 2013 or 2023. Like I said, it's on the core website. And as we've talked about before, also that is like that you'll see on the website is also like, you know, snowmasses portion of like the aviation and landfill and, you know, other other emissions. And so looking at like this here, and I don't know why I have fugitive emissions in here as well but like I lost it yeah yeah yeah Yeah, but it's a Christmas reading connecting. So what else the joints for anything would have a chance to week. Oh, I see. Really. So, so, Pick and County, they have a very large fugitive gas emissions because of coal basin and the old mines over there, which is a whole other story. But so, if you look into the snowmobile, the assortment is just our share of this. It gets spread across the jurisdictions. So it's a baseline study that we were part of recently. Yeah, for capital. Yeah, okay, for capital. It's not that we got leaky buibs here. Not that we're aware of. Yeah, okay. Let's sell it and blow it up. Yeah. So there's a couple different ways, different places to look at this. So electricity that's, you know, the electricity that the buildings are using, these currently have, you know, emissions associated with them because the grid isn't 100% renewable. It's not 100% green. So not all the electricity that you get is, you know, net zero. So to speak. However, when I looked at these, I kind of like, hey, took these away and took these off the table because holy cross-cenergy is your utility provider throughout all town of Stomach Village. They are making great strides to making their grid 100% green and they're close to 90% and they're trying to move towards 100% by 2030. And they're continuing to work on that. So just by the fact that Holy Cross is a very progressive and proactive utility, these gas emissions are gonna go down over time. Also, these are areas where just being more efficient with your building using less also like does help as well, but that also helps elsewhere. So, where we really focus our energy, where you go on, I mean, I really find it interesting that residential commercial about equal and I'm surprised I would love to be able to do that. I think if you look at square footage, I can't remember who told me this, there's a square footage calculation and it's about even It's interesting when it goes into the utilization rate. Yeah, it's that right. That's some right sounds right But yeah, I don't I didn't have dig too much into like the specific Build it like a building inventory and kind of slice and dice it that way for Because we're so there's so little commercial here, but it's interesting. Well, it's commercial, use a lot more electricity than coal. Correct. And think about like a conference center, a hallways and a line light, those, you know, have to be added to the same small line line, right? You know, electricity. Occupied space. Yeah. So. Yeah. Yeah, so yeah. Yeah, so then if we go and so really where we're looking at like of how can we have an impact? It's really again going towards electrifying the built environment, right? Obviously energy efficiency plays an important role in that as well for a bunch of different reasons. But this is the area that we really kind of focus at when we look at like where we can have an impact to invest in to be able to reduce the greenhouse gas emissions. So I kind of took these down here and just pulled them out, same numbers as up here. And I think like first thing to go is kind of like talk about assumptions because this is just all big broad stroke math and you know things are dynamic and you can make this analysis as complicated as you want. It's a very complicated subject and I took the approach of like let's just get this down to good talking points like you know. So you know one thing that we did is just you know so just some basic assumptions here to kind of talk about and go through is just that we looked at the like the average carbon reduction and so when we when core invests in projects when when we're measuring it based off of, and issuing grants and rebates. If you're a community priority participant, you get double three-bait amount. So our investment for a community priority participant, which is income qualified or like first responders, teachers, those types of people, like really kind of, it's a pretty broad net. Again, the definition is on the website of like, but these are really kind of like the people that make up the core of our community. We assumed that looking at historical data, the amount of projects that we issue and do that. And when we allocate those resources, that it's a pretty even split in resources between community priority participants and non-community priority participants, because we still gotta work with all the non-community priority participants, because I'm agnostic about it, we gotta reduce energy use, so we gotta talk to all the people. Like the line that light needs to reduce their energy use You know Joe Schmoe like we want to help them reduce their energy use I felt like you're picking on the Joe's Yeah, I think you're doing pretty good from from my understanding actually, but the other Joe's I guess the shanes out there. So this will be important to kind of when I like when we look at like the number of investment and how we just calculated that. So another thing to just point out is that like as whole across makes their grid more green, your group the amount of greenhouse gas emissions we get from just adding insulation to a project will not be as much as because the grid gets greener so the energy you're doing, you're going to get less energy savings over time just because the grid is getting greener. So what that does is also though, that means that electrification as the grid gets greener, if you're removing gas and electricity, you're gonna be getting more greenhouse gas savings over time. Well, that gets to become really complex math. That's called calculus that we need to get into there. And so we just said, you know, we're assuming that those are just going to kind of cancel each other out, you know, calling it what are you going to cancel each other out? The increase in greenhouse gas savings through electrification and the decrease in greenhouse gas savings. Do projects like adding insulation as the grid gets more green. So we're just saying we're not going to worry about that when we're doing our looking at our man here. Can I interrupt for one? Yes. This is asked to me by somebody I was in conversation with. I did not announce that this is what I was going to ask Mike. I feel like I heard something about this, but I bet you would know. If, if, of course, sorry, if, if, um, Holy Cross is 90% renewable. Does that mean 90% of the literal electricity coming through the socket is from a renewable source or have they paid elsewhere to trade for something that they generate non-renewable here? I'm mix above. Yes. So there is some that is there's more of the 10% that's left. There's more than 10% that's actually made from non-renewable sources, but they just paid someone else to build it in another place because you have proximity issues and things like that. Would that be a... To think of the 90% has renewable. 50 offset, so when they wheel electrons, those offsets are an operational decision, and so they're paying a premium. They get the electrons closer to the generation point that may not be generated throughout the point. But on paper, water's done the same way. On paper, 90% of total electrons are sort of the customers, are from a renewable source. Sometimes they will get what's called that. We know where I'm to credit that is a commodity, so they buy and sell with that. So they'll buy into a project in California and they've been tied into our system but those people in that grid might be buying the assets from our side and certainly. The money that we're paying is 90% renewable but the actual photons that might hit your house is cold coming through these lights right now. Okay. And more than just 10%. Yeah. Okay. Thank you. Yeah. A whole across there. And this would, this is definitely a mic Steiner and, and, and Holy Cross Energy kind of conversation. But they have a really interesting challenge because they're unlike most utilities, their highest, their peak load, peak season load is midwinter, whereas almost every other utility in the United States, their peak load isn't a song. very condition. Okay. Okay. Because I do some. Yeah, in the assumption around two, I think, like the trade off between electrification and efficiency. I think we should be intentional about intentional about making a decision about, you know, to what degree we want to incentivize and inform people about resilience. Right? And I highlight that as a simple example of something like, you know, we could take old buildings and that are leaky and not well insulated and put heat pumps on them and have them be 90% renewable and say they've got basically like negligible carbon impact. We can also put a lot of insulation and retrofits in them to make them more efficient. And a byproduct of that that we may or may not care about, but we should be intentional about it is that If the grid goes out because of a fire or whatever else, that home will be comfortable and occupiable and have less water damage for a longer period of time than a home that's just running on a heat pump. And so is that a problem that we want to, you know, is resiliency a problem that we want to invest in or educate people about? Oh, man, Joe, you, you just hit something that we at CORE just keep talking about all the time. It's very important because it is a challenge that like, you know, we, you do see less greenhouse gas. reductions per dollar invested in a energy efficiency project compared to installing an ePump. But those are absolutely important. And then when you talk about resilience in that sense or just comfort indoor air quality, there's a whole bunch of things that go into well sealed, well insulated homes that there are a lot of co-benefits beyond just GHG reductions. Because while I'm framing this conversation around GHGs, research has shown that no one knows what that is. That's my job is literally to remove those from the built environment. And I don't know how to describe what a metric ton to CO2 is, you know. So, but it's just good for math sense here. But yeah, that's very important to think of when we are structuring our rebates and actually in 2025, we did go back to looking at more energy efficiency projects in some of those resiliency, framing it around some of those resiliency pieces as well, because those do really resonate with building owners and homeowners more so then like reducing your greenhouse gas emissions, even though that's very important to us. So yeah, like I mentioned before, 2023 is the year we're using, and then the last assumption here is we are assuming, or there was another one in here that I must have deleted. We're assuming that we're not, you know, bait, this is a static number and that we're not adding any greenhouse gas emissions in the built environment through new building or construction, which obviously is not true, but it just makes them math easier. And then another thing that we looked at, that'll come into play here later is just that. When we looked at our grants and rebates, you know, it really looked like that course, grants and rebates typically fund around half of that project cost. and our grants are structured usually up to a cat a half the project cost or up to a cat. And so we looked at that and just generally speaking about half of the project cost core is you know with the rebates that we're doing for funds about half the project. So when we do when we translate this into dollars here you'll seeing a few seconds. Before you do, let's go to number four. Just I like that a little bit or Here some information Brought we pretty much are built out here in smoothness on the commercial second might see some You know rebuilding and you know scrape the rebuild orodel, which always increase efficiency. But there is going to be significant increase in growth as employee housing. Maybe 200 units of Azure Redx in 10, 15 years. 100%. And the good news with that as well is between what town of Snowmass is a part of. The energy very good. And then the count of snow mass is part of the regional code alignment to be able to push towards aligned codes across the jurisdictions in the region here that new construction, renovations additions, the energy codes are pushing towards very good, very good efficiencies. So that will be helpful. Those poor fish among 200 units is a little. They'll still add a load for sure. It's a substantial amount. And Tom, if you want to brag on staff for a little bit, you can tell this group back. All of town housing is energy neutral. So All of town houses is energy neutral. I believe all of town's facilities are, but I know all of town. I don't think that was it. I believe that was happy. People are pedaling in the basement or how does that when we do updates to our facilities. So Mountain View is the most recent housing project to have had a renovation. That building envelope is what we tackle. So we're in the term build it right, build it tight ventilated right. That's what we're fixing if it wasn't already there. Then most buildings are all electric and if they're not, we're partnering with our thousand cord and make sure that they become all electric, do some fuel switching. And then participate in Holy Cross's pure program. So we are fine. See, that's really valuable energy there because the draw site is going to be a challenge. It doesn't creep the overall load, but it gets by that formula. Great. I have an issue though with us like green washing or not accounting for embodied carbon and construction phase emissions because I think we're ignoring that. Yeah and like we and I mean that the partly I bring that up and have it really sure with us ignoring that because you know frankly like frankly, like the, I mean, you know, we have a long discussion about what degree like the global emissions matter or don't matter from, you know, our 100,000 metric tons, like the emissions tied to moving, you know, dirt in and out and and excavation work also come with particulate and socks, knocks emissions and noise emissions that impact wildlife in the local populations. It's very tangible negatively impacting emissions and it goes right up against like the council's mandate to do things like improve the established nature as a dominant feature of the landscape. I will just say that a long effort in many reiterations occurred design for the draw side and I encourage you all to come to May 19th Council, May Newark's, it will be public session is as efficient and as effective as it can be. It's gone from three buildings to buildings, one building, which is most official way. The underground parking has been minimized and rationalized and there's outdoor parking, outside parking. I mean, it's as good as gonna get, you're gonna build 65 units of housing, which we desperately need to operate our time. That's the reality, we need that, was it? So, but, I don't know if you looked at the current design it purged you to, it's as good as it can be. We've minimized the excubation as much as possible and minimized the impact on the landscape. It's gonna be. Joe, to your point, you'd like to see that inventory as part of our emissions? Yeah, we should. I think construction phase emissions, if we are doing greenhouse gas inventories, that is something that should not be ignored. There's a number that And the other thing that I think I would encourage us to track and manage more actively is just kind of the the use phase of you know of our built environment, which includes things like landscaping and you know maintenance and you know all these trucks running around to service homes that are empty. We don't take like ideological chances. We don't decide that we've got to cut them, but we should truck them, we should measure them. Do I think those emissions are captured in other parts of the county's case line? We might not be talking about it explicitly and what Jamie's prepared for us, but I know that that's captured elsewhere. On-road, diesel and transit. That's the one, yeah. Yeah, it's kind of smeared in no with a bunch of other stuff. And I think we're making like decisions about the built environment. We should see that picture comprehensively. I'm getting out of operation. Yeah. Operational carbon. Yeah. And so they're measured differently. So it's not like we're ignoring it. It's just for looking at built environment, we're looking at it. Once it's built, it's now the start of the event. Not necessarily. It's the physical layer. But think about you've got your house. What it takes to operate that house, electricity, gas, and then all of the construction and ongoing costs. The trucks you drive up here to come to this meeting, those are captured in different gadgets. So it's not like we're saying the truck that helps build your unit, isn't being captured. It's just not in the actual physical place. And yeah, and the same thing, like if you were to renovate your house or scrape your house and rebuild your house, those emissions are landing in your solid waste numbers. But yeah, Joe, your point's right. I mean, valid though, just that like those are real emissions that like, you know, when you're talking about codes or permitting reviews or how you build your house, what materials you use matter. Like cement concrete is 10% of global emissions. So absolutely let those numbers matter as well. So yeah, if I definitely encourage you to go on to askincord.org and look at the emissions inventory, it's super fascinating for both here and all the other municipalities. So Jamie, can I just jump in for a second? This is just an aside because you're right, it's not something that we're considering. It's not something that we incentivize right now through core talking about embodied carbon and building materials, but it's a conversation that we're having on several different fronts and apologize if anyone I just jumped in. But I'm Tara and the Chief of staff at Core. I can't see everyone in the room, but nice to see y'all. And yeah, it's a conversation that we're having on several different fronts about what is our role, what do we want our role to be in advocating for, encouraging, or otherwise incentivizing low carbon building materials and considering that embodied carbon piece of the built environment. So more to come, but I think it's a good discussion. Probably full of derailed jambies. No, we're super close. So all this lead up, when we analyzed our incentive programs, our grants rebays when we level those out, level those out across community priority participants and regular grants, we're investing about $1288 per metric ton of carbon to through our rebate program for reduction because we're tracking the money that goes out, We're investing about $1288 per metric ton of carbon to, you know, through our rebate program for reduction because we're tracking the money that goes out We're tracking the carbon that we're saving. This is what the investment cost is. So again, keeping a good number. I mean, I have no base to understand the number. Well, I think that this compared to if you were to compare it to, you know, what, you know, I would say like a lot of times, like carbon credits or like, there's been a lot of kind of like what Joe was talking about with greenwashing of like what an actual is, you know, of like, you invest $40 per metric ton to like save rainforest in the Amazon that gets torn down, you know, the next year. Did it really, is that really like valuable? But like this is, I like, you know, so I would say based off of the cost of living here, the cost of construction, the cost of gas, all like when you look at like what goes into an energy efficiency project, this is higher than the national average, but you know, the cost of living and and picking county is 125% of the national average. So I think that this is kind of like one of those things that just like recognizing this is kind of the cost to do business here. That's your that's your cost share. The full cost is another 50%. Well yes, okay. So that's the other half of some of the full cost per metric ton is twice that. Yeah yeah, so what I did here then is I just took, across the one that gas use, because remember, electricity is going to kind of take care of itself with the grid. We looked at gas use then. Here's just your same emissions. And then I took at times the in our investment in metric ton of carbon. And then if you do your total list. So this is what, if you're saying, if you're still asking core, if you're saying to like, if we're gonna 100% electrify town of snowmass, generally speaking, if you were going to do that through incentives where you paid for half of the project the electrification project and ask the building owner or homeowner to pay half of it. Still the investment is $62 million. Only from core core and the remainder comes from the residents. So is 125 million total. Yeah. Only on the. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, Um, You know, yes, you know, yes, it was Chinko, Dimeo, right? But according to the front administration was the fifth of May. Anyway, Anyway, I'm afraid to work that one in the right way. Anyway, this in a much more simplified way, be very useful to guys present to talk about. But to me, I mean, the big message, a big pull point, big bullet point is only really meaningful way to save carbon and snowmess village is to electrify, right? And the cost to do so is $125 million. That's a good takeaway. I mean, that's really that simple. That's the current crisis. So first time we had a real number. Yeah, yeah. And there's another number which caused today monthly, what's your annual, what's your monthly cost, right? But it's very important for my colleagues and counsel is lay people to understand. If you really will serious about meeting the goals we've said for 2030, it's going to be $125 million, $126 million. Well, it's full application. Yes, to do everything, right? Which is pretty much the goal. I mean, you get to the goal of the 2030 goal. I don't know how that relates to this, but I assume we basically have to electrify everything, right? Yeah, I haven't like maybe 75. Yeah, it's it to feel better on the goals like no one in the entire world is on top of their GHG goals, but because it's a big problem for her in terms of how to help frame the issue. Yep, right? And you want to spend money on a round of money and you want to spend money to save carbon. It's your choice people. We got so much money, how do you spend it? Because there's no way that CORE is going to come up 60 to the pretty money down just for snowmass. Unless we give it to CORE. Oh right. That's a big deal. That's a big deal. That's a big deal. Unfortunately, in today's world, I mean, there's federal and state funding. It doesn't exist. Really challenging. But that's really, you know, it doesn't need to be nearly as detailed as what you went through with us. But just to say, you know, if you were to electrify all the homes, all the businesses, Thomas, it's going to cost 100. Yeah. We're six million. Yeah. I think it's simply enough is like, this is the number you got to reduce. This is the cost per number. And that makes it this dollar and this dollar total. You know, it's what important. The stuff we're at, we're past the point where the stuff is inexpensive. It's not the hard stuff. Exactly. What is the total annual grant total of the Accords doing in the Valley? Right, this year we have our pass through funding. so what we like you know have been given as a grant through whether that's Town of Snowmass, Pickin County, City of Aspen, Eagle County, Bissalt, our London and then yeah we have Atlantic Aviation is a new one that we got but like through our government funders we have just short of $1.5 million in grants and rebates that we are, that we've been granted to pass the road to buildings for electrification and energy efficiency projects. Full value life. Yep, including Eagle County as well, including some stuff on the Eagle River Valley. Yeah, there was an early meeting outside a couple years ago where and it's not a number of what would take to electrify the entire river. It's like a billion dollars. It's like a number that you could never ever come up. Yeah. And that's the dilemma, right? And so and then like part of course funding. So So we do pass through a lot of our funding to through grants and rebates that we administer for projects. But then obviously there's our staff time that we do advising to just advise people whether they proceed with the project or not. And then also there is communications that we're doing to be able to do outreach to communities. That's something that actually Greg and I have been talking, emailing back and forth about of just like, how can we do more initiatives to get more uptake in town or snow mass. And then also there is a development arm where Tom just mentioned Atlantic aviation, if you've been paying attention to the newspapers and the news, they announced $300,000 match grants to be able to further projects as well. So we have a development arm that we pursue grants, and then also fundraising and philanthropy to be able to further our mission beyond what we get through our partner organizations with the other government. So we're hoping to continue to increase that impact over time, but like Tom mentioned, federal government, state government, the funding is very challenging. And just for perspective, what does the town give to court this year? 200,000? 300, 200, past the realist rebates, grants and assessments. 100,000 for I don't have anything. 63 million. Or go home right now. You know, get up and get up and get up and get up and get up and get up and get up Exactly. So, what do we, we call it dilemma, but we're empowered with knowledge. What do we do with this knowledgeable dilemma? We take advantage of the opportunities before us. That's going to get quick wins, easy wins, when we're able to make a bet. And then I just had a couple of case studies to kind of show you here of real projects that we've priced out here in the last few months and these were really interesting just because we were able to get. I hit the addresses to, you know, protect the innocent here, but so this one here is a commercial building, a small commercial building in just outside of downtown haspen. That they need to replace their heating and ventilation systems. The gas to do a gas like for like replacement system with actually a little bit of upgraded energy recovery ventilators to help improve the ventilation and get some recovery some energy from their exhaust and things like that is, or this is, oh, this is the electrification one. So to electrify it, to do it fully electric is a half million dollars. And then if you do, I think this is like eight or nine thousand square feet. And then to it's like through basement plus two levels. And then those rooms is not big. No. And then if you look at just the HVAC replacement, it still has like, you know, an energy recovery ventilator. So this would be replaced with gas. So this is replacing it with gas is basically 250. So I think I've said before that like weather and I'll show you this as well in another example, but like for really good conversation speak, you can say whether if it's a gas replacement and if you look at electrification, for just conversation sake, it's electrification's going to use the cost you double. So that's, you know, and this tracks, honestly, like I've, this is very comparable to before coming to core. I worked as a nurse rep on buildings and construction and asked them home. And these numbers are very familiar. Sorry, actually one comment there. I was agreeing with the numbers but this kind of rule of thumb of double. If you do like a gas for gas replacement of a furnace, you might pay 10 to 25 K or whatever more, right? But if you install, I think you're quoting like heat pumps here, you're getting air conditioning. That's true. There are definitely co-benefits there. Wait, I mean, like this is like we're harder than ever here. I wouldn't even call that as a co-benefit. Like that could be the dominant driver. Right. And we know that people are increasingly adding air conditioning to their homes. And when doing that, you know, it's not double. It might actually be cheaper. And so let's make sure that we're doing apples to apples comparison, especially if we are communicating anything to the town or to the public. No, that's fair. Yeah, that gas furnace definitely does not provide heat, but heat pumps do work in the summer and the winter. And I would say that like that, that is a very frequent thing that we see when people are inquiring to core about our grants and rebates programs. And heat pumps is because, you know, yeah, sometimes it's because we need to replace our heating system, but a lot of times it's like, I'm thinking about getting air conditioning. How do these heat pump things work? Because I hear they do both eating and cooling. So it's a very, very real point, Joe. Appreciate that. In this case study, would, I know you can't speak on the behalf, but is your assumption that the Holy Cross program would finance this? Holy crosses reb Holy Crosses rebates and even coers. Uh, future, all future program to, to pay the cost upfront in order to make switches. Oh, yeah, they're non-financing program there. They're on bill repayment. Um, probably not, um, commercial because the investments are so high and the Just resident and resident and residential is like and that's one thing that we can talk about even though Mike's not here about how core works with Holy Cross like that's one of the things that we are working with them is their on bill payment reprogram. It's just an interest free loan right basically. Yeah, it's like a 0% loan that's not like for 10 years on your. Why is it so much higher for a commercial building in a residential town? Do you have the same size? The, um, just the heating. I don't know. There aren't that snowmess. There aren't that many homes. There are 9,000 sort of fee. All right. And snowmess 5,000. Aspen that's a small house. It's a thing in divide and two creeks, something I don't think they're top-edred. It's 9,000. Come here. Good chunk. A greater than nine, I know the fear that we're between 5 and 8. Yeah. 5,000 average is a big home on snowmails. Yeah, it's where you get to get there. I mean, you're all that much different, but you know, what's that? Your home is much larger. Yeah, of course. So actually, I think it's like an elephant, by the way. Hey, it actually looks like grass. It's four. 100. So what are the concrete. So Tom's question though about Part B of this, this is installation. You have any sense of projected operational cost under each scenario? I mean, generally speaking, well, that's the installation cost. We haven't like, honestly, we haven't gotten too much into, and there are a lot of kind of factors that can make that go. Well, like, generally speaking, if you're looking at things from a unit of energy cost, gas is cheaper than electric. And so that is something that we're at being able to be able to talk about, to have an honest conversation, whether it is with a commercial building or with the resident to be able to say your gas bills or your, if you fully electrify your energy bill or your monthly utility bills are going to go up by X dollars or down the list. That's a symbol for all, okay? Because again, I'm a really good gas firm, it's probably 95% efficiency, right? So if it needs X amount of BTU, you see heat it, right? At 95% that's a number. And if you use a heat pump, and I don't know the math for a heat pump efficiency, but there must be a metric where you could determine the BTU's command of the heat pump free, right? Yeah. And you compare you, right? Cost of BTU. Cost of BT to you. I mean isn't it that simple? It is that simple and I can tell you the number of countless Plummers and folks who maintain Gas boilers who came through our home and said these boys are really efficient and these heat pumps. They just can't compete, they're just not efficient. And I said, you know, help me understand what this COP means and people have no idea, right? And what is a COP means is you pay for one unit of energy, like one kilowatt hour of electricity and you get three kilowatt hours of heat delivered into your home. So it's an efficiency of 300 percent compared to like 95 percent. It crushes is boilers on efficiency. And you have to do a conversion. No, no, it's not. And so it is. It crushes, you know, resistance, electric resistance heating, that's a 300%. It's not 300%, compared to 95%. It's those are different metrics. It is. It's three, if you're talking about efficiency, 95% is the efficiency. And that's the name plate efficiency before you de-rate them for altitude. But they don't actually 95% at our altitude. And you know, he puns operate with a coefficient of performance. That is their measure of efficiency. It is above one and all what base what base what base for 80 or what I mean so it's not a comparison. It's a simple energy in it's not a comparison. It's a simple energy in energy out metric coefficient of of performance. And it describes how many units of energy are you paying for at your meter and how many energy units of energy are you getting delivered to heat your home. And when you use baseboard heat, the COP is one that operates with 100 efficiency. When you use a furnace, it's maybe 95% and a heat pump is 300% or COP of three or maybe it's like two to the four depending on the temperature. Because as it gets colder, the heating performance goes down. So if you got that then I mean I'd equal bear the cost of electricity versus gas, right? Oh, yeah, I'm at 95% a little bit less and ones that thread 300% in a little bit less So I mean, but yeah, but what's the relative cost of a B2U per energy source? I would say back in with me in one to two months, and we can do a little case study and presentation on that as well. I think that's important because it's a 192 to install under 92 million, and that's just to get it in. Now you press play. What does it do to your, what does it do? And that's a second. I mean, you're living with it hopefully for 20 to 50 years. I don't know. Hopefully, that's certainly part of the map. So I mean, there's this saving the planet, saving my pocketbook, right? I mean, there's, that's, you know, and there's some very wealthy people who always try to save the planet, But not everybody is, 100%. So I mean, if you were, I mean, you say electricity electrification with a heat pump is more than gas, would you say from operations, is it? 10% more, 50% more, 200% more, and what's your gut? I'm not going to hold you to it. I just want to sit and say, I'm trapped. Yeah, that does sound like a trap. I wish I were a better politician to come up with and non-answer. I can assure you. I don't remember. I can assure you, Tom, that you will feel it. You will feel it when you write a check. So it's sweet. Yeah. And like, and that's where like, you know, when we talk about co benefits, or Joe was talking earlier about like, not forgetting about like, how energy efficiency projects are important. I think like that's a big thing of just like, you know, not only to like help reduce the cost cost of your heat pump. If you can insulate your house better, seal it better. You will require less heat to do that. You can buy a smaller heat pump like your calculations for what your heat load are going to be or less that reduces your capital expense and then obviously it will reduce your operating expense. So, you know, whether and so we've been talking a lot about that and reminding people if they acquired about a heat pump to be like, well, tell me a little more about your home. Like, you know, as a cold in the winter, like even when the heat's running, is it drafty? Like, you know, maybe you should get a home energy assessment that core will do for free or at a great discount. And maybe you need to have like, you know, get your door sealed or add insulation. And those are things that like, you know, can help bring down your, you know, the pain you feel when you write your check at the end of the month. But as a politician, represent the community, seriously. Before I can really recommend and urge people to electrify, I need Bill to tell him what it's going to mean. And while core and other, all across, others could maybe help with the upfront cost. I'm just going to help with the operating cost. We need to understand that. 100%. Yeah. We are having those conversations. I just cannot give you a number for you today, Tom. Yeah. I think you might also want to know where ROI is best spent. Yeah. Which is another question we didn't ask you to deliver ROI. We asked the cost electrification, but if ROI is better spent on the insulation first, before you electrify, that's also a valid strategy question. It's giving out a little bit. That's exactly why we have core product in the community because they will come to your home and tell them what to do. And what to do? Divide the first, yep, for their first things first. I already have people in my home telling me what to do. But in the second instance, different people tell me to different things. It sounds like on the flyer at the cleanup, the first thing is to have a core energy audit. That was a solid home. He makes that. He's got a friend. He's got a friend. He's got a friend. He's got a friend. He's got a friend. He's got a friend. He's got a friend. We've entered children's lives. That. Face the, I'll be mentioning, tons of trash. I'll be mentioning, I'll be mentioning, I'll be mentioning. Now we're talking. So, and then just one more case study here. This is a multi-family residential unit. These are small apartments. The heat pump upgrade. It was 12 apartments that are a little less than 1,000 square feet each, you know, $160,,000 total about $13,000 a unit for the heat pump which is we thought was a really good deal looking at this and then the like for like replacement $80,000 $6600 per unit to replace this be a unit for a apartment it is that's how that's how these work. So, when you do the eight pumps, do they use a air handler or these, the units are just upon the wall and... It depends on the, on every home, every apartment is unique. Some are the many splits, like the things you see up on the walls, some of them have dispersed, you know, kinda condensers, others have, you know, outside units and others can have. I mean, repulsed furnace in a ducted home can it be a ducted system with a air adder? Some of these is the cost for all 12 units or per unit? Yeah, this total here is the sum for all 12 units, and then that's the sum for all 12 units. I'll give you guys a good reference. I had to read both my furnaces, which were only nine years old wrapped out for me in January. The heating strangers were rotted out to which condensation as they were designed poorly. And it was when we were having that sub-zero weather, who I know a choice even talk talk about e-bump. I had to get something in. So I had two new furnaces put in, $28,000 for two furnaces. Yeah, sounds right. So it was a four four thousand for four thousand, right? I wish I couldn't have an e-bump because the perfect time by the dynamic time to plan. Well, there are people, you know, people that I manage that are smarter than me that if you want to retrofit in, a heat pump as like a stage one heating and cooling, and then you can have your furnaces set point in as like a backup heat. If you want to do that down the road, and then when you get, when you talk to like, where Joe talks about like when the coefficient of performance gets low enough, the heat pump shuts off and then you're back up, you know, heat fires and you say a lot of energy. So retrofit you can do in the future. Not lost. So, so I have a very condition which I'm gonna be used but put it in. So you would run refrigerant through the air conditioning coils. So what you would do? It would be the heat pump. You could probably. The heat pump. Yeah, I mean, from the heat pump. And so that would sit like kind of upstream or I guess, I't know downstream from you know your furnace and that does its thing and then you know you provide a lot of cost analysis that we haven't even had a touch at all on getting grassbond. Yeah and let's pause there a little bit too because we've talked about two kind of separate concepts in this meeting. There's a resiliency piece and there's the sustainability piece, which you would suggest commsiles can't touch the bond both. 100% in someone help bring you up speed and why that's resilient. Don't you still need electricity to run the heat pump? So if you had a fired electric grid goes out, you're still out. Yeah, but where's I'm missing out what they're being. I'm not having what they're being. Now we're good. So there's a concept called thermal inertia. And it's basically summarizes the fact that if you flip your switch, and it's 30 degrees out and 70 degrees inside, it doesn't go to the 30 degrees immediately. In fact, the speed at which your interior conditions change is dependent on your envelope. It's not dependent on the efficiency of your your boy or, or your heat pump. So if you've got a really well sealed envelope and good windows, you might coast down to 60, 50 degrees over days. And if you don't, you might get to 30 degrees really quickly. All right, and that may be the difference between like people showing up, but like the town center or wherever, like looking to stay warm, and versus the difference of people like sheltering in place, not being like a burden to the infrastructure. Building like this is a really good example where most operating days, some Monday through Friday, the system heating turns off around 5.5.30 and you can feel it turn off. But it's not until 7.38 o'clock when you start looking or I should zip up a little bit. Well, this building has mass because it's a concrete building. A home doesn't have mass. Now, mass is great because it has a time lag to it. But an insulation will help some degree. I can tell you, my first is prepped out, it was sub-zero. You got cold and really quick. I had, and eaters gone. I mean, that's powerful for friends. My energy is abilities. Crazy. Anyway. But I mean, Joe's point is right. The more you insulate, the better you are. And again, one more most likely of a power failure here is in the summer when there might be a fire. Winters, because our power lines are on the your ground with snowmess village. The chance of us losing power in the winter is less likely. And I get that now on the insulation side, but it's the heat pump part of the equation that slows the decline. No, no, heat pump is separate. If your electricity goes out, your e-bombs do nothing for you. So if you had solar power, you were off-grid, that's another question. Yeah, tired. Okay. The other variable, which CORE can come out and measure for you, is your air changes per hour, or how leaky your building is. And so doing a blow-door test to kind of the point you're making, like that actually makes a bigger impact. Yeah, they write your installation. Yeah, absolutely. Did we set a date? I'm going to ask one time, Council. You council. Yeah. And I just want to mention on that. Maybe next Monday, I don't know if we're able to send it up. There was a request to get. Tell me in for fire department and. And from the police department to come in and talk about Fire risk evacuation as well as clearing of you know, then what is that? Yes, I can speak to some of that. I've been speaking with John melee and He's going to try to come to the June 2nd meeting number one number two. He's been talking to the collective and he thought the date, he is set of date to show the elemental movie at the collective and he said it was Tuesday, June 17th. That's the latest date. Okay. So the 18th and 19th were preferred but that's the first rodeo and the first concert. So we're looking to not be with that. So yeah, so a panel will be there. They'll be showing the movie and then afterwards, they'll be a panel of exactly what I am saying. If any of you want to show up or connect electronically, hopefully we will be able to reach it for next Monday or not. It's working on it. John, yeah. That's right. A discussion that you might be interested in about fire and risk and prevention at a community level. So we're trying to arrange it for Monday. My question is how can we distill and utilize information that Jamie is providing when we get into the energy conversation on June 2nd? Well, like I said, I think just a quick, I mean, you don't need to go through all of it, but just to say, you know, you don't need to go through our calculations. need to show the calculations. But if we were to elect, I think that first thing which shows the uses and where I point out the commercial resentful, the same, I think that was pretty interesting. We're using creating carbon. And then to say, the only way to make significant gains now going forward is to electrify and understand the magnitude of the issue if we were to electrify everything to snowmass ability is a hundred and twenty six million dollars. All right, I mean, people need to understand that, right? It's a good, yeah, place to start to get higher on a point of reference. Yeah, but I think it's important to stress that am I correct to say that's really the only place we're going to make significant that then greenhouse mission gains. Right. Yeah, it's in there. Our small residential building. Are you able to be there on the second if there are questions? I probably will not. I have a doctor's appointment on the front range, but Tara. We've been speaking and she has made herself available. Can you be I'm not able to remotely? potentially I would need to look back at what my appointment is but I mean we probably get to this program for three that was another one of my questions is because I know the session last night went to 7 p.m. what should we hate you that's the way they're recording cutoff it's okay that's so how do we plan for is there a way we could just plan for this and also that you tell us how much you want us to take so that we can we've got a lot to cover? Well, why don't we have a session together? I don't know if you guys can meet on another meeting but all we do just a zoom together and talk and I can help coach you as much. How to slot and I kind of have have it word in sense by priority. But all of it is relevant. I would say a 15, 20 minute presentation. And then 30 minutes of Q&A at least. So then as we slaughter. Yeah, you can go brief. I think the values and the discussion conversation. So then I think as each of us, because we kind of each had specialties within it, we would should try to tailor ourselves so that we leave space for each other. And be glad once you guys are sort of roughed it out. If you want to have a zoom together, we can talk. I can set that up. Okay. And it might be a PowerPoint that we rough out. Yes, then. Okay, you should have a PowerPoint. So that sounds like a work item between now and because our next meeting will be after that. Right. Right. So we should figure this out by email. Yeah. And we've got a double all these vacation calendars, too. This is okay. Well, the information is provided into, that will go into a town council packet. The letter itself. Yeah, yeah. So I think whatever was said to be a vitality on the packet, but you also should prepare a PowerPoint real summary, right? You know, not too much detail on, but bullet points on the PowerPoint at the main point, right? Right. And then open a discussion. It was a great memo, was well received. Thank you. A lot of stuff. And your input is really helpful. Yeah. I didn't mean that. Take us off course, but let's. No, no, no, make sure we do that in the meetings. I mean, I think it just needs to align with what we presented to the town council. I'm going to have a slider to her comment. And we try to hold ourselves to a schedule so the person who's presenting item six doesn't get shafted. Right. Well, we don't cut you off. We just get bored. I can just turn you out. I was a sum of look. I mean, it's a tough case. The nature. If you have too much, it just gets, of course, good boy. We're not going to say you have stopped 20 minutes. But I have a limit. I just say 20 minutes or less. Yeah, keep it to 15 is a 15 big group. You better in the month discussion. And you need that by the, um, probably the Thursday of the Friday before the second when, when do they have to submit it for the package? We are publishing on the 29th. So the day the package will be great. But the 28th of May. So and if you guys want to get together a couple days before that, great. Just tell me. So I zoom get together maybe a couple days before. Let's just review it. Okay. So that means we prepare the slides earlier and we get together and zoom get together to discuss just. And it is necessary. And there's more. There's. Yeah, right. That all. Okay. Quick question. Just if one of the reasons I'm here is also if if Jamie's not able to attend, are you thinking Jamie that you would have been part of this presentation group and preparing this? Is that something that I need to join in for? Well, you should be there anyway. Yeah, should be there. The more the barrier, the both should be there again. No, you don't need to help in the preparation. I think questions when it comes down to energy and all things related to core. Okay, sounds good. Well, I'm planning to be there either way. And if if I could just stay looped into the preparation and presentation just so I can know what contents going going into it. Thank you. Jamie, maybe in terms of preparation, if you were able to summarize everything you said in that perspective version. Oh yeah, like a pie chart or whatever it comes to mind. Sure. One big number, 120. Flashing right. If you're you're calling now, stinky green. You know, grey will be by Bitcoin. We're starting to buy it. All right. Well, you've been tracking it right. I'm sorry. I'm saying my Bitcoin story when we're done here. Okay. Okay. Okay. Well, that's not necessarily an upcoming agenda item because we're going to get that done before, but I have one upcoming agenda item. Please. And also spoke does not hear. Do is. He said he had another appointment. But he had brought up sent an email about the Boulder mushroom, the Boulder Company and Boulder that Fights fires with fungi and he said he had never heard of it. He's gonna look into it But he would really very much be interested in learning more So I think the idea maybe happy and seeing reaching out and see if they want to present sounds like a good idea. Let me just sort of tell you where councils at. I know this place, very concerned about fire. Very concerned about fire. What can we be doing? What should your residents be doing? it's a big issue. So, I don't know, it's playing mushrooms. There's also a company, maybe it's the same undervalueder that has the system where they spray our hosts with foam when there's a fire. How quick can they respond? I'm not. It depends on which you have. Yeah, I want to get the hell out of it. Yeah, but I'll look at it. What can we do to try to reduce the risk to the community for far, and I think a big piece of it, because as you all know, I mean, it's that question if it's when and What you want to do is prevent homes from the night And so comes down to individual home Make protective space around their home and we need to get that message out now There's other larger things that we could can do about clearing dead wood and stuff and there's the thing going on down valley, you know all the statistics. So if there's a fire in Carbondale, it'll be here within 12 hours, someone crazy and they're trying to create a fire break. But all these things, but I mean, it's a real danger. People are very concerned. We feel as a council, we need to be helping as much as we can because that is a catastrophic danger. And what I heard in the discussion yesterday, it quickly goes into, oh people want to realize what we're doing in the public spaces. And my response is, it's phenomenal what's been doing in the public spaces. That's not the question. The question is, what isn't being done in the private spaces? And what is the role, the public sphere, to influence the private spaces? And that is where what you guys speak on to. That is where you can really help give some guys. This is what you guys need to be doing. You need to get the community to be doing x, y, z. So here's another thing. And just in you and the public speaking of operational cost. If you were to fire mitigate your house in the way that they're presenting, some of these homes would be removing 20 plus large pine trees for sure at the cost of tens of thousands of dollars. Yes. Not all but also I mean there's also all things you could do just in the first five feet. They're hugely important. You know not everybody's got pine trees right next to their house and not all those are good. There's a lot. Now we're in Utah last week doing the parks and stuff and one park. We're in Bryce There's a whole area where they thinned out the pine forest Really interesting and you can see these piles They put all the branches inside the pile and they put all the heavy timber on the outside. They're all spacer up, but they're spacing out the trees for all the reasons we understand. People are doing stuff and people need to understand. So if they had to do it, they're 20 pine trees. But we spruce trees. But yeah. So for the second, just because I'm seeing here, remember that you're not a member of the board and so speak to what the Water District can be doing in conjunction much like John will be giving insights from the fire districts standpoint. I Can be very helpful. I can address that but I actually will have to lead off my remarks by basically saying I don't speak for water district. Now, I can say what some capacities are and what they aren't for. So that is clear and I think that's a general knowledge kind of thing, but I will just be cautious to say, I don't represent the board. They're not authorizing me to present the stance as a citizen. This is what I see. Right. number of this as a matter of this board, this is what we're talking about. That's my point. You're not a member of that. And I should, I can say that too. I'm clear because I don't want to have any mix up of derailles, EV or SWSD. Well, he's a participant. I'm a participant, but I'm not an official member. So I can say that and you also don't represent the water district. That's very important. But yours are informed and interested since you're new, been in all these meetings, right? Nobody's going to problem with that, but just do your disclaimer. Yeah. You just want to answer. And no drinking a ton of all right. Only in town hall. So I came up. I'll forward you to soda. Sound. I just come. Just 12 already, but no, it's in that yellow cast. The surf. Right. Our next actual meeting is the day after June 3rd. I guess with our last few minutes, is there any closing remarks that you want to have regarding the useful information you've presented to us today? No, I think it was a great conversation. So yeah, like I said before, we're working on being able to normalize what that looks like to be able to have good conversations around the utility impact the pain you feel at the end of the month. I've been asked that question of course for two years. Well, I gave you $126 answer today, today. Like come on. It's a brilliant. Thank you. And thank you also for joining us. You know, it's the same be prepared for you. Glad to help. I know what you guys are doing is so great. So important. So appreciated. I mean, it's really smart stuff. And it's on really important stuff. And you know, That's all I can say. It's really good. Mixer, you're helping a whining. How we can best be used. That's why I'm trying to help is how to align it so it could be most effective. Yeah, I appreciate that. Other than that, I think we're set to adjourn. Thank you, ladies. Chachi. Hope you're doing well. Where are you? I'm in Boston. Are you in a chat? A touch a? I'm in a touching note. I'm in Boston. Are you in a tattoo? A tattoo? I'm in a tattooing. No, I'm in the lobby of my building. Okay. Okay. So we're still here, even though we're $9 billion short. We're still here. What's going to say? Are they going to be able to give you a degree or is that been cut off? I think it's within the cut off, so I'm fine, but maybe it's not paper. Maybe it's just an email. Okay. How many of this is sustainable? Terri, keep your lips in for June 2nd too. Yeah, we'll see. Thank you. Thank you. Okay, thanks everyone for your time today. Thank you. Bye. Any adjourned. Thank you. Bye. See you in the afternoon. Thank you. Welcome. you you