Chairman Mike Hyab is unavailable this evening so as co-chair I'll be filling in for him We have six of seven members an attendance this evening so we have a quorum and we can conduct business at hand The meetings being live streamed and it's being recorded. It can be viewed on the city's website at Aberdeen MD dot gov The minutes are also being taken. Thank you Stephanie Additionally, we requested everyone silence their phones. So the first item, first item on the agenda is the approval of the July 10th, 2024 meeting minutes. Has everybody had a chance to review the minutes? Does anybody have any comments or corrections to the minutes? Okay. Do I have a motion to approve the minutes? A motion to approve the minutes. Got a second. A second. All in favor? Aye. Aye. Okay, minutes have been approved. So for business items for tonight, the first item on the list is the discussion of draft amendments to the Code of City of Aberdeen Chapter 235, Development Code articles 1 and 2. Phyllis, you wanted to discuss. Sure, I'm going to discuss it. Sorry. I like Phyllis. So this was sent to you two months ago. And it was also sent to the city attorney and to our senior player, Stephanie Spector. And it is for articles 1 and two. I'm continuing to work on the rest of the amendments which you will not see until you get, I get your comments and then I'm going to incorporate all everyone's comments together so then you will come, I'll come back with a red line for you and then we'll move on to the next articles. Okay, so let's start with one and a half. I got you, yes. Okay, so there were a lot of, just really a lot of comments from the city attorney and from Stephanie about the definitions. So a lot of those definitions regarding congregate housing, housing for the early housing for the homeless group homes, those will probably change based on conversations that we're going to have after we review everybody's comments. Is that fair? Works for me. Okay. Okay. Stephanie, do you want to add anything? I don't think so. I mean, I you covered it but we're definitely looking for comments from the planning commission as well. Okay so that's our homework. Comment. Review it in the comments. Okay. And if I could just say one thing you did you received an email from Councillor President Hybe and the council has been looking at the table of use regulations. I'm going to assume for four months now. And then they just started looking at the definitions as well. So that he sent you, and I got it same time you did as well, he sent you some proposed changes to the table of uses. And we should discuss that, I mean at some point as well, whenever you're ready. We can do that at some point as well whenever you're ready. We can do that after we get your comments on this. On these two articles, we can jump right into that. Okay. Thank you. Okay. Any comments from the board or questions on the first item? Anything you want to bring out, Beth, you good? Or anything? Anything you want to bring out that you good or? Well, no, just in general, anything you want to, you know where homework is. Yes. Okay. Okay. Sam, you good? I am. I guess the thing that struck me reading this a couple of weeks ago, was it there are a lot of changes especially to the matrix without a lot of backing information and justification. Like I'll give you one example they struck out the TV station radio stations. Oh you've moved on. Can we I'm going to say can we start with that? Both of these things. So both of them. So I guess my hope was that in getting these recommendations from the council that there would be some kind of verbose justification or discussion about what their thinking was, right? I mean, some of them are obvious, right, that they're trying to control what's going on, but some of them just seem out of the blue. So I guess in the future I would request that if anything was, and for all communications that they just not drop, you know, Deus Ex Machina on us and, you know, try to provide a little bit of why they're thinking what they're thinking to help us along with our adjustments. CM, I was at the work session where this came about. So the whole point of them not giving us any explanation was they didn't want us to know who wanted or didn't want what. I mean, I really don't care. I don't either. Yeah. No, that matter who, just like. It was just supposed to be. It was supposed to be. Collectively what they all thought. OK. I mean, that, you get way It makes it very difficult to pull out the details when there's just I mean it all I mean they're just so comprehensive and the number of them That there's no rhyme or reason to any of it at that point And carry on I have some comments for Party. I don't know if I'm on. Some of the definitions in here. In the dwellings section. We have garden apartments, high raise apartments, mid rise apartments. 14. 14. 14, thank you. OK. But we don't mention condos. So should it be apartments slash condo if they're on a occupied or how do we versus a rental unit? Because I hear apartment and I think they're rental homes, not fee simple homes. And I don't know if there should be condos, apartment slash condos so that if people are owning them. And then for the use of the land, does it really matter to us whether they're under rented? I don't know. Do we do we do we want more owned homes versus a part I mean I don't know if it matters or not but I think I don't think it matters that I think we need to define it. Right. It doesn't matter what the department is. We think in terms of do we want more condos, apartments, whatever, but I think I agree that I think we need a definition of condos. Correct. And then I guess my other, because all of this kind of melds together with the House bill as well because they take a lot of time in the House bill to talk about mobile homes and modular and If you relate this to this Modular are permitted, but mobile home Park is a special exception so can you have a mobile home that isn't in a park? Well right now no but there is some state legislation that will supersede that Okay, so if you go to my memo that I wrote and sent to you guys on House Bill 538 There are definitions that we're going to have to change to be Consistent with what this House Bill is because and that's what those are some of the ones that had to be changed because they mentioned Clusters which are in an archive Triplexes and quadplexes. I'm even They're not on our code either. Or would that be a catch dwelling of more than four? Because we've only got two plaques. All right, so this is what I'll do for that specifically. Look for definition for condominium. I'll go back to House Bill 538. That's only agenda to talk about by the way. And I have listed there the definitions that need to be changed. What we've provided for it and what needs to be changed to be consistent with this House Bill 538. So we'll move past that if that's okay with you. Yes. Mark, anything? I just had some highlights on the definitions, but they made, they, they, they, on accessory dwelling units and I guess some of these we will never encounter like adult bookstores, but we need to obviously have a definition for them, just like Convin. So I think it's really accessory apartment. I think we maybe need to look at that. When you say look at it, what's your kind of your thought? I think it's going to tie into House Bill 538. And I thought of some of these and I think we got to make sure they mesh between the bill that were mandated the bill. Correct? Yes, we are correct. Okay. And our definitions that they need to jot. mandated the bill? Correct? Yes, we are correct. Okay. And our definitions that they need to jot. I agree, 100%. Yep. So, that's it. All right. So one of the comments from our city attorney, since you brought up accessory apartments and accessory dwelling units, is to make sure that they're consistent. From page 16, where we define dwelling accessory park apartment to the one where we added accessory dwelling unit. That will be something that we do. We have to go back and change that. And it also has to be consistent with that house bill. And now it's the time to do all that. Mm-hmm. Remember, if it's in a talix, it's been added. Right. So we added that definition, accessory dwelling unit Down to anything you want for your okay Okay. Down to anything you want to. Okay. You want to step any fillish you want us just to send email you our comments or you want to talk about them next month. Email would be great. Okay. The email would be great. And we can jump right into the memo. I know Sam started with this, but if you have, if you can just refer to the page number and your comment, that would be really helpful for Stephanie and I to incorporate in these changes. And the other thing is, Sam, you made a very good point about Justification for the table of uses so when I would before you start with that I'd like to get an email with your comments on the draft amendments on the development code and Then the second if you could just send me an email so they're not combined and I can forward that to Council President Hybe and the mayor with your comments on the table of uses. Two separate emails. That is a very, you don't, I agree, you don't care who made the comment, but you want to know what was the decision, why did you make this change? What's it based on? So should we hold off then on having another meeting to discuss that until we get justification? Let's leave it up to the Planning Commission. Do you want to have a special meeting? I know that Mike Cobb and met with Stephanie this morning. He suggested a special meeting to talk more about this or you just want to cover it tonight. I'm fine with whatever you decide to do. He might be better for a special meeting? Yes. That's what I thought. Okay. That's fine. I'm fine with that. Next Wednesday, this council chambers is available. Do you want to do it then? Sure. Next Wednesday. Next Wednesday. 24th. Yes. Seven o'clock. We could do earlier too. We just have to. It doesn't matter to me. Put it on great. Stephanie has to announce it. Put it on Brandon. Yes. Do does anybody is seven good? Are you want to come earlier? What do you guys want to do? Seven's good for me. Seven preferable. I miss the date. Oh, next Wednesday. I may be in Michigan, but it's seven's fine. Okay. Dayante is seven. Preferred. Okay. And Sam, if you can't attend to me, if you could just send me comments. And they can just be bullet points. I'm fine with that. Please. Thank you. And at that point, we should have the, from the council, what precipitated the changes that they wanted. By the 21st? No. No. I think that should just be too common. Got it. Okay. Okay. And then, it's what it's. I gotcha. I don't email to you. I'm supposed to post it on. I didn't get the stuff that would be good. OK. Gotcha. OK. What's it? Does that make sense? Yeah. I got one quick question. I was looking at the definitions of brew pub and brewery and things like that. I wanted to compare it against bar. I don't see bar listed anywhere. No, restaurants just one paragraph. Do I did check that? Sam, with the way liquor licenses work, it's very hard to have a bar without So they all have to have a restaurant Well, it does it it does say lounge bar so we have outdoor dining or bar on page 25 and outdoor dining area bar accessory to a restaurant or tavern located on the same property. Is there one for tavern? Let's have, like you said, has lounge and bar. Yeah, page 28 restaurant. Any building structure or portion thereof where food is sold for consumption, including but not limited to a cafe, coffee house, tea room, dining room lounge, bar and tap. Yeah, it's just the way it's okay with that. I guess based on the laws here, what I think of just as a standalone bar, we don't have this thing to be a thing. I don't think it's a category for liquor license. You have to serve some amount of food. OK. I think a percentage of your sales has to be. All right. As we do. Yes, but if you're a true bar, yes. As opposed to a brew club, which has to be the trough. And that kind of thing there. Thank you. Okay. Okay. Okay. So then the special meeting we'll talk about then the table of uses. So we'll skip over that for now. And I met with Mike this morning. He gave me some notes, so I'll scan that and provide it to everyone so you can review it. But hopefully he'll be here Wednesday. He said he could, so I'm gonna hold him to that. But he can explain his comments further. Okay. But he can explain his comments further. Okay. Okay. So then we'll go down to the third item which is discussion of House Bill 538. Skip 2, IBD height. Oh, I'm sorry. Discussion on draft to the code for Section 23518K4. Gotcha. So we had received a request from Mr. Jeremy Traywell with Marshal Richie Associates because there was some inconsistencies in 235-18K for the Integrated Business District relating to height of residential structures. And the table of uses also permit garden style apartments, mid rise apartments, and high rise apartments in the integrated business district. However, there were height limitations for those uses. So he had sent me a draft ordinance, I forward that to the city attorney. He prepared this draft for your comments, but he is also looking at this again to make sure that we did not exclude mid-rise apartments. Mid-rise apartments are defined as three and four stories, and typically a story is 10 feet I think. So I thought that that fell within that 50 foot height limit So he's looking at it and he's supposed to get back to me this week So if you want to comment on it, it's great if you want to wait until Fred provides additional comment That's fine too and just keep in mind that draft amendment when the table of uses they take out there's apartments styles anyway but when the table uses, they take out there's apartments, styles, anyway. I'm good. If you go back to your memo that Council President Hybe, that's whoever. Yeah, they totally, the only kind that they are approving of is Gordon apartments. And they have two stories. Yes. If I'm reading that correctly. If I'm reading that correctly, they have struck all of that. They have struck all of it. So then this ordinance would kind of be a moot point because yeah, kind of a head scratcher. Is it that they don't want any more rental partners? I can't answer any questions. I don't know. I wasn't involved in any discussion. I wasn't including any discussion. But you work the work session. That was at the work session. I would be a good question for the mayor and council. And. But I was at the work session and it's public information. So so yes they don't want any more rental properties. I looked at that and I look at it's no longer permitted use in an R3. You received what? How do you? It's struck. It was... It was all the way across. All the way across. Specifically R3. It's been struck. So, anyway. That... There was a couple of curious... So, are we spending... Are we spending in a circle then? It's sort of like catching our tail. Review the definitions, but the definitions, I guess you can have a definition without having a use. So you're aware I was directed to start the amendments to the development code as soon as the comprehensive rezoning was in an ordinance format from the council. So I started working on that. You have what I've gotten done so far. I continue to work on it. This is whole separate what the council's proposing. But theoretically, we could have a definition without a use. No, you wouldn't want to do that. You wouldn't want to do that. I don't think you'd want to do that. Wouldn't not a good idea. We want to define everything that's on that table of uses. That's been our problem. And nothing. And then add uses that we can add to the table of uses as well. There's a lot of new types of housing, congregate housing. You know, they've legalized marijuana. So we have to look at that. That's in there, I assume. Yeah. It's in there. Yeah, according to the mayor and the council's memo to us, they want us to fast-track this by September. September 12th? Yep. Right? Huh? If possible. Huh. And I appreciate the special meeting. We can discuss it further next Wednesday, hopefully. The chairman will be here and the council president will be here and he may be able to give us more insight. Because they took out mobile home park and it says in the bill that we're supposed to have mobile homes and modular homes. And then. But do they mean that like as a separate area of mobile homes like a park, a mobile park? As I think of it, are they me mobile homes within any other resident, you know what I'm saying? Any resident area? Well, any house felt, where is it? If you go to the house bill and go to first page. The legislative body may not prohibit the placement of newly manufactured homodural dwellings, which we do have a definition for modular and they're permitted. And then they talk about all these middle housing. And middle housing means duplexes, triplex, quadplexes, cottage clusters, or town homes. So, and a cottage cluster is like, I don't know if a cottage cluster could be four mobile homes on an acre with a common area and that's considered a cottage cluster. I don't. Stephanie, you want to give a minute over you of the meeting that you went to about housing in Maryland. Sure. That might be a little bit helpful too to give some background. So about two weeks ago the state held a housing symposium, not this well. There's a housing symposium held by MML and the Maryland Department of Housing Community Development representatives were there. And they really talked about not just the house bill, but then some other legislation about excess redwellings that hasn't been introduced yet, but will be probably in this next legislative session. So I'll give kind of just an overview about both. The ADU task force came out with some policy recommendations to change basically local zoning to allow accessory dwelling units in all residential areas that would allow single family. So again, nothing has been introduced so far, but they said probably upcoming that will be introduced. The house bill is a little bit complex, one of which is talking about manufactured homes, manufactured modular. Manufactured used to be called mobile homes, that's an outdated term now. So one of the criteria for that was that a manufactured home couldn't be on wheels, it had to be on a permanent foundation. But their rationale basically is that it's cheaper, less expensive than stick built homes. So they're really trying to help affordability of housing. That doesn't mean that we couldn't impose design guidelines as an example for the zoning district, so we could say they have to have certain design recommendations, but we would have to permit the manufactured and modular homes. And we already do permit modular. We just don't permit manufactured right now. The other component to the housing affordability is to allow an increase of density for affordable housing. So there's three different criteria. One is land that was formerly owned by the state and federal government. One is land owned by a nonprofit. And then the other is land that's within 0.75 miles of a trans station. RTOD area is a mile, and they couldn't decide if it was, sorry, half a mile. They couldn't decide if it was a mile or half mile. They decided to split the difference, and that was really their rationale. So that being said, I believe if the units are 15% affordable, they can increase their density up to 30%. So in the case of single family zoning, that would allow duplex, triplex to increase that 30% in cases of multifamily. Again, that would increase to that 30% density bonus. Stephanie, what was the number of housing units that the state is short right now? So we had heard it was 60,000 but then when they set up the symposium, they said it was closer to 95,000 units. And they really were emphasizing that Maryland was losing a lot of their population to surrounding states, specifically Pennsylvania and Delaware. And people, while they were working in Maryland, they weren't living here because it's not affordable. So really, I think the whole point to the housing bill is just to increase access to affordable housing. You can get into a lot of reasons why people don't live in Maryland. I mean, it could be taxes. You know, land is cheaper. And it also do away with the whole free market. I mean, housing costs are what the market will bear. And people are moving into Southern Pennsylvania. It's obviously there's not the employment that there is, that's why they're working in Maryland because there's employment here. So I think there's a lot of, I think there could be some questions. I think there's tax implications. That's why there's people retiring moving to Pennsylvania and Delaware. And that may change the mail and obviously that's not part of this body. The other thing and just maybe just for information purposes and I'm glad Stephanie clarified that when you say a modular home it's not a mobile home, don't have wheels. So if you think of a modular home, the one that comes to mind is an antico-home, which is very prevalent on the eastern shore, and they make beautiful homes, they truly do. If you were to see an antico-home, you would know that it is a manufactured home and built on a foundation, and it looks like a stick-built home. So that wouldn't be any problem. The other question I have is, you know, how do you define, well, I have two actually, how do you define affordable, you know, because that's the sitting here. And two, this bill really illustrates the need for a table of use page because it really doesn't define anything. So a lot of shortcomings. And I understand these are legislators and they're not planners. I get that and that's not their valley understood, it was a question about the table of use. And it would be nice to have a table of use for this house bill. Or any bill dealing with land use. That's all. So did you say more to follow on this? And Maryland's part of my plan is going to get involved. And Maryland's part of housing community development is going to come out with a white paper for lack of a better. I think they're, I left this out, but they're really focused on training. So, though they haven't come out with anything yet, they insisted that they will have a series of trainings for, you know, planners and planning commission. So there'll be a virtual webinars about the House Bill, I guess in the coming weeks hopefully, but they didn't specify timeframe. But I think their goal is to have these ongoing, really before January, well before January. So quick question. So the houses that are on like West Aztec and Incustrate, even though that's called a mobile home park, they're modular homes. They're not on wheels, they're not. They're manufactured. They're manufactured. Yeah, HUD changed the definition. They changed the definition to say manufactured home and really I'm not sure on the modular side but manufactured they have a HUD certified label which makes them a manufactured home. So when we get a permit for instance for a manufactured home and it has that HUD certified there's really not necessarily a plan review because it's already been certified that it meets the code. Thank you. And a lot of those homes they'll come in on wheels and then they check it up, take those off and put up. It's like a skirting around. Yeah, yeah, and they sell them and they just pay a lot rent. Just take the wheels away using now the house that I was raised in on Harford Street that came in two pieces and just that's modular and That was the basic back then when it now like Mark said you go to a place If you're going Delaware or wherever these these homes, you would never know. They're beautiful. They're elaborate. They are beautiful. They're beautiful homes. Now again, they're on the upper end of the price range, I'm sure of. So, you know, I know my parents didn't pay a whole lot when those two sides came in and, you know, but you can't tell that it's, you know. No, I mean, and the price itself might be cheaper depending again on the design that you get, but they're still paying the same fees, you know, connection fees, impact fees, that anyone else is paying. So there's other costs that are associated To your point I think there is a Section in here that defines affordable means that housing calls to not exceed 30% of a household income Yeah, but what would that house would income be? Yeah, well they mentioned the median income for the area. Yeah, and it's supposed to be, and that's fluid. I mean that's a short deal. Sure, yeah, yeah. Yeah, 30% of the one. Thank you for bringing that up. What's it gonna say about? The other thing about this bill is it also puts deed restrictions on these units that they stay affordable For 40 years. How do you do that? How do you do that? That's my question I was a thing that kind of I was like well, how do you control that and what's affordable? I mean we have no control over BGE rates It's PSC right public service commission. we have no control over water rates you know there's there's taxes both from the county the state and the local jurisdiction which would be the city of Aberdeen there's fees 40 years I mean it says a 20% but who decide I mean do, who decides which 20% I mean, if I buy one, am I with it? How do you put the deed on all the houses in there? And many times, I know a point I was going to make. Many times these mobile homes or manufactured homes sit on ground and ground rent is required of the length. Right, isn't really renting the ground, but it's a fee that the homeowner has to pay to whoever owns the land. Basically. I don't have the house bill in front of me, I apologize. I think they put a provision about that though. I'm not mistaken. I'm not mistaken. I'm not mistaken. I can see it in there. Because that's that both those places are we. I think it's only for mobile homes. For mobile homes. Yeah. Not for modular. For mobile homes. I mean, I think one of the requirements it had to be on a permanent foundation, and I thought they spoke about Brown-Rum. But I can remember seeing it, but I may, I'm probably wrong. Okay. I just don't remember seeing that in there. And it also mentions something about parking and bicycles, like you can't make the requirement for parking, mean that development doesn't happen if it has parking. Remember that part? May allow a reduction of the number of required parking spaces based on the availability of space for parking bicycles. I must have skipped over the bicycle word. What page is that? This is on page 7 of the house bill. I like. I'm going to get it. I would like it to be easier. How do we figure that out? Because if we require off-street parking, we also have to require parking for bicycles that we consider how many people will ride a bike. And then we can reduce the number of parking spaces if we have more I Guess it talks about if a legislative body regulates all street parking The legislative by show a car space for parking the bicycle, but we do that we do. Right. So now we got to think about bicycles. You know, this really was written for Baltimore City and Baltimore County. That's exactly my thought just now with like, Jesus does. I know it's statewide. Do they envision someone coming in with a planned community and then applying? Maybe. Like just buy a bunch of land and kind of just do it. I can't even see Baltimore City. I mean, where would you put them? I don't know, but a new development within Baltimore City unless you infill someplace where you're gonna tear down, roll, redevelopment. Well, maybe that's what they kind of were thinking that tell you down a lot of their homes. And because they mentioned if a nonprofit is doing this. Right. Building. there's homes and because they mentioned if a nonprofit is doing this right building. I'm sure this has been vetted by lots of people. Is what it is. Well, we got back. Are we, did we go back to the high restriction thing now? Yeah, yeah, as we got sidetracked. So on the high restriction, you want us, if we have comments, and we're waiting for legal to bless it. So he did, he's good with that. Oh, reviewed this. Yeah. But he is going to answer the question about the mid-rise apartments. Looking at the definition, I don't think there is an issue. There's a disagreement on whether it is an issue or not. So I'm turning it over to the city attorney and he can work it out. So there might be another version of this and I hope that I'll have it next Wednesday for you. I wish we shouldn't vote on this. I wouldn't vote on this tonight. Let's wait until next Wednesday. It'll be an open meeting. As long as you have a quorum, you can vote on it. Sound good? Yep. Can I put in my light in mind? I'm sorry? I'd lightening rounds. I mentioned we were at we were at a council meeting and I don't know if you remember there was a fire in Belair off a 22 where a condominium got struck by lightning. And and there was a big there was a fire that starts inside a structure. But if lightning strikes any of these higher buildings, whether they're commercial apartments, I wouldn't make sense to require lightning rods so that I don't know. I mean, I know it's old fashioned and maybe, but the sprinkler only work if the fire starts inside, not if it hits the roof, because the sprinklers don't go off until the fire gets inside the structure. So if a lightning hits a roof, it doesn't protect. So just, I don't know if that would make sense here or not. So are you advocating for lightning rod? Yes, I am. You don't own a business of that, do you? What? Selling out lightning rod? No, no, I don't own a business. I'm just saying. But if there were a lightning rod on that condo building, you would like to think the lightning would have gone to that lightning rod and there wouldn't have been the fire on the outside of the building. And that's not a requirement in the building code for anything. I asked. And I didn't know if being we were talking about height, it makes them more susceptible, whether they're commercial structure or dwelling structure. Would you have it at a certain height? So many. I don't know when they're where they're most effective, or if it's just the highest point in an area, that's where lightning goes. I mean, I mean, I mean, I've watched trees get struck on the ga- yeah, now. Right. Right. Right. So we're gonna get somebody in here that installs or knows lightning rods. But if we're gonna have structures this high, I think it would be- I hear you. Yeah. Oh, I got you. You know, to protect everybody. I hear you. So there's my two cents. Interesting. Okay, that's it on the agenda. Anybody have anything else that they want to discuss this evening? I have a question. Okay. The building and it's got a name on it and everything that used to be the pharmacy, the Catechorner, behind the library. What's the status of that? Right on Park Street. Oh, that's when she and I were talking about. UBT? Yeah, yes, UBT. It was John Harley, Carl and Liz, and John Lee. And a camera. And Chamber office? Yeah. What? I mean, it looks nice. It does look beautiful. And the chamber office. Yeah. What? I mean, it looks nice. It does look beautiful. Is anybody moving in there yet? We're not aware. Okay. It's a shame because it's a beautiful money. Where is the money? They did. The next part of the AMP was. There used to be the pharmacy there. They were permitted for all the work, but we don't know. They moved in office furniture and everything. I believe so. It's a nice addition. We just don't know what the status is. It's a defense contractor and they have their ease and occupancy but. Okay. I keep asking about that. And I do have one other thing. At the Monday nights council meeting they approved some of the compry zoning that you all worked on. I wasn't part of the commission at that point. But based on that zoning for areas changed, do we update our land use table when that happens? No, not at this time. Okay, all right. Because we were reducing amount of B3 in the city. I did task you guys with commenting on the implementation chapter. Well that's. So that would be helpful. And as part of that, I mean we could address that then too. Okay. So as Beth said, the council did pass ordinance 24-0-14. There were 122 properties on there. Swan Metters was removed. Art Helton's property and Westbiller Avenue was removed. Design masters was removed. Cop was removed and then put back on as an amendment. I didn't see the amendments till Monday morning when I came to the office. So you have not looked at the amendments either. But the ordinance was passed and it will be effective September 2nd. And when I get a signed copy, I will make sure that you have it all. They down-zoned some properties based on one of your meetings that were you discussed it. So it was a very interesting meeting. We had about 50, some people in the audience. I think everybody here tonight was in the audience as well. So I would encourage you to look at the... Were there a lot of comments? Were there a lot of different comments? It was like it came here, but he's aware of it. There were a lot of comments about the transit or development district and... The same thing that we talked about in the meetings we had had with people who came to that. There were a lot of angry people. So I would just say watch, watch. It was live streamed and it's available on the C's website. OK. OK, anything else? Yes, Sam? Can we talk about the mail that went out this week about the traffic study? I mean let's get a traffic light on all that. Do it now. I hear you Sam. Did I forward state highway comments to you? Yes. Yes. You have county comments from public works and from planning. So according to that letter, somebody was charged with putting the required to put paperwork forward to start that process. Am I reading that right? I'm not understanding what you're asking, Sam. Let me pull it back up. Give me just a second. So the state highway and the county reviewed the second, the revised traffic impact study. They both provided comments. Now it will be the developer slash engineers responsibility to provide a point by point response to those comments and we'll be copied on it which I will share with you. This is the city should require the developer to install the traffic. So why would a developer install? And it's not a city road. I mean, you can put a condition on the preliminary site plan. Right. But al-Dyner's step me and 22, is a county. 22 is a state highway road and county units al-Dyner's step me right. Again, I don't understand this highlighted area where it says the city should require this. Who was making this? I'm sure that's just their standard language. I see. So we're no further, but at least somebody else could be. No, at least we got comments back from those agencies. I mean, they have to address the warrant. I think the warrant study was the issue. If you read into that. I did that. Yeah. State highway had comments about clarification and why the traffic consultant, traffic concepts didn't think it was necessary to put a traffic light in. Right. And I agree with that. And the state said we want to see your warrant study about that. Great. Little steps. More to follow. More to follow on that further than Something similar happened at the specific road roof 40 intersection when the Perryman peninsula was being developed and that red light was I believe her as was The responsibility of the development. And that was on the federal highway and accounting room. And I think the same thing happened with EVIMAR. There's a light there now, but it's just flashing. They were willing to put a circle in, but now there's a light and it just flashes because it's developing. When the school goes, I guess. So that is not unusual that the state would require the developer, even though it's not contiguous to his or her property. But it impacts the traffic impacts the road. So Monday night you mentioned that you were putting together some of the, with the grant the city has received for the train station. Which part of that was that? Just more clarification. Was that for the design or? The money that we've received, $5.6 million dollars all goes toward design engineering. Geotechnical. And that's starting. It's all planning. So it's phase one and phase two. We just received a grant agreement for one of the $800,000 awards. I'm still working through issues with The U.S. Department of Transportation with the state But it's moving forward. Yes. Yes, the funding's in place. It's not going to be taken away if we have a change in the president And November that money is committed to us To my knowledge. I'll see that. And the fact that. And Amtrak's project is fully funded in its $50 million. And as long as we stay with the TOD and keep moving that, we can get more grants. Yes, it would be beneficial for us if we're applying for more grant federal grants that RT or D masterplanes updated. Because they have mentioned that in all the debriefings when we didn't get a grant that that study has to be updated. And we did that last meeting but it hasn't been gone to council to get approved. Not that I'm aware of. Okay. Do we need to push for that to happen? I certainly would. Okay. You all received an email from council president Hybe. And I would just tag on to that and say, oh, by the way, in our July meeting, this is just a suggestion. I'm not telling you what to do. We requested that you update the 2012 TOD master plan. I think you offered $100,000. Right, I think that's what we have. Well, and when the vote was taken on Monday night, they wanted to hold everything off until we had this study. Just not what. But they didn't vote to get a study. So I didn't understand that either. Is that that was kind of correct? They wanted to hold off on everything. Yes, that comment was made multiple times. Yes. It could be from you collectively, or it could be individually, but I would suggest that you do that. Because it could be individually but I would suggest that you do that. Because it could be a budget amendment. And they passed several budget amendments Monday night. So there's no reason why it couldn't be. Okay, anything else for anybody? Or would anybody seen the progress on the rudders? Kind of passed it like Let bring some good good question. I hope they're gonna cut those Trings the trees The rudders from Ralph 40 oh no, okay. Yeah. It's pretty fast. And then I saw that what is it? Phil's eye grand has started the I think the town home portion. Yes. And then I haven't drove down there yet. But I see that the development right there off a long drive is is coming along pretty nice to they're selling very quickly. Oh yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Oh, the every never. Yes. So we took a little tour. That was since their last meeting one. Yeah. So we took a little tour. Very nice. Very nice development. Yeah. the al dino stepney for a lot of that construction and repaved that the roads actually better that side than it's ever bid. But of course when you get down to the swamp that's still going to be problematic the next time that washes it. Well in the county's budget they put in $1.3 million to resurface around al dino and Gilbert but that was in the budget that was not only the top end, the whole thing, they ran the whole thing from Gilbert and all Dino, they had put, I don't know if that's enough money, they want to take it from Tarn chip to asphalt. I only looked at it because, you know, have you seen with the the research that they did the last two weeks? I haven't been I always go the other way Because I don't know if that's part of what you're talking about if it's separate. I'm sure it's part of the overlook No, I'm saying if it's part of what they were gonna go. I don't think so Yeah, cool. Okay. Great. Anybody? Um, nothing else than we can adjourn. Do a motion. Oh, Phil, so you have your agenda items for next month? Yes, yes. Yes. So, just wanted to make sure you had those. I will not be here next month. I'm going on my first cruise. Oh, you. I'm not right. You missed a guy's name plate. One time. I know. All right. Now he's going to be here next time. Don't put a rush on the names tag. He's not gonna be here next month. He left too much. Yeah. You can slow roll that. Yeah. So move. I'm gonna hold it grudge. Got a second. Can you join me? A second. Okay. We are adjourned.