Thank you, Mayor Rua Recording. I'd like to call this main to order at 501 PM March 24th. Thank you. Would you leave the pledge? Sure. I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America to the Republic for which it stands one nation under God in business alone. On the New Zealand Justice strong. Next time. Mayor Schermarcks. I'm going to go on in business alone. I'm going to do the reason for the justice for all of you. Next item. Mayor's remarks. No, thank you. Thank you, Mayor. The first item on the agenda would be optional additional early voting locations. And this is my item. So as you know, Fulton County has offered to split the cost of voting with us this year. It's an election year. Currently they're proposing one early voting location. As of last week, they've moved that from Spurla Oaks to OC library. They have given us the option to add a second location and an additional cost to the city, and they've asked that we make that decision by April 7th. So I've included the packet that they gave with the finances and the list of early voting locations that's proposed. They haven't updated it to reflect the OC from Spural Oaks, but I did confirm that with the elections office this week. Okay, thank you. All right, questions? Do they want to leave you on a liaison? Thank you, Alison. No. Second location. All right, questions? Dolly Piona, we as on. Thank you, Alison. The second location would definitely help. So in case if we go back and commit for the second location and things change, like maybe the county might come back and offer it or maybe the other cities are willing to speak with us? Does that change any of those commitments? I mean, I would think that if another city offered to split the cost with us, that that would change our commitment. I don't think it would change things from Fulton's in. In there and they would still have to do the election, they have to start securing the space and the personnel and the equipment and stuff. So that's where the cost comes in. Okay. Again, the second location is going to be more on the border of the other city, so it would definitely help. Okay. So I would say just we should definitely look at the second location. Okay. So probably something in that on, on the older La Mama, that area, so that would be different. So, if we were to add another location back in, it would be Spurl. Okay. So, we don't have an option in that one, then it has to be Spurl. It's my understanding, yes. I mean, I can always ask, but Spur ask East Reserval Library. The Roswell Library is currently on the proposed list. The East? No, I don't believe it's the East location. It's the location off of Norcross Street. Yeah, that's not the East one. So I just turned back from the Roswell City Administrator. You Let me know that, like, literally just moments ago, that they have a committee meeting tomorrow night, and that their council is considering. Staff is recommending council has not voted, but they're considering adding a second advanced location at the East Roswell Library. But they have not made a decision yet. It goes to committee, and then we'll need to go to a council meeting. So staff's recommendation is to add a second location of the East Razzle Library. But this is hearing back within the hour very recently. But again, I'm definitely in support of adding the second location, but I'll leave it up to the staff to decide how to work with the county and the city. So are you saying that you would consider either option, either the entire potentially $60,000 if we were to pay for it on our own, but you would prefer to partner? You said $41,080, $41. Well, that's for the, in case you ever run off, you would, I would, for budgeting purposes, it would be an additional $16,087. So you could get away with 40, but we really don't know until election day. Again, but if there's enough, there's another big ticket item than just additional locations. Yes. There's a very reason to wait and hear what they're going to decide. Yeah. But again, but if we missed April 7, the deadline, we would completely. Yeah, I was. Yeah, I was. Yeah, I was. Yeah, but I don't know how hard that I mean they put it black and white, but I don't know if that's negotiable. The deadline. Are you all hearing Jason in the background speaking overhead? Yeah, maybe just let him know. All right, well. So, a couple of things. I would like... Okay, maybe just let him know. All right, well. So a couple of things, I would like a second location. For a couple of reasons, I think just having the OC location on the north side, it's forcing a lot of people to drive. And with all the construction traffic going on in the city, it's a challenge in itself, just getting through the city. However, if, if, if, if, if, if, if, if, if, if use East Roswell Library along with OC. That makes sense to me. That would be the ideal situation. We save money and we get, we're covering both sides of the city, but if we can't get confirmation of that East library, then I would say let's go for a second location. And I don't know if we can push this decision off. Is it possible to push it off a day? To get this information. Now, how much are they really going to refuse us if we come back April 14th and say? I don't think so. I mean, they're gearing up for the July elections. So I would think that they would extend the deadline, but I can't speak for their behalf. I would think we've got a little more. Even if we look at the other way around, if we come in and then we have, if we have to backtrack, then it goes both ways. Right, so it's. So I guess the fault is two, and ideal for me is to wait until potentially revisit this at the next council meeting, well, or if we have to schedule something to revisit what Roswell's doing, I guess. The thing that for me is just that really seemed like something that Fulton County should be providing anyway. I mean, they have provided so few locations in the northeast part of the county, really the north part of the county in general. But, you know, so I kind of hate to reward the bad behavior after lack of better term, but anyway. Yeah. If that's the case, if we can ask up to April 15th, we can have another discussion in the next consummate. Could we not just set a if-then plan? We could. Like if they go with the east razzle we execute redo you know and if they don't we execute be would you want to make it sweeten the pot for a razzle a little bit I'm not saying hazzees but incentivize them to to do that the only thing is I don't know how many people, maybe just along the barnwall corridor, that would use these for all as well. It's not in our city. And I do think that, I'm sorry, what are you doing? I do think we've set a standard that we've had two locations right for. So in 23, there was only one. Yeah. In 2019, we used just one location. We used part place at Newtown. 2021, we had two locations. In 2023, we had just OC. So it's kind of happened now. I thought it was the whole time. I think that's when OC Library was in a renovation. It was closed correctly. Because I remember I worked at volunteering for campaign and I stood outside the library directing traffic. Because the library was closed. But people were going there to vote anyway. So. I would have loved to have seen though. Well then, I would support then maybe us, yeah, helping out with Rosswell. I was hoping that we would look at, so part place is not under consideration, but it's just sprulled then. I would defer to East Rosswellwell and us a few dollars. But I think we told them that we didn't want to do that. Which I'm not sure that I understand particularly why but I love the park place you could go take a walk and then go vote. I would I would agree with that park place would the parking? No. Don't we displace some of the seniors that use it or do we not? It's a part of place. Yes, if you use park place for early voting, all of the uses during that period are impacted. But could we use the community clubhouse or offer that to the county? It was not large enough to meet their needs. Oh the technology what's not there? So there's no other options that you all can think of around old Alabama not spruels just a little far Yeah, I mean spruels a good location, but it is a little bit far for the Right yeah Maltesca for perhaps I don't know if they'd want for three weeks to be set up there. I think we could propose that to the Fulton County Board of Elections, but I think they like to stick with the locations they know. They have a pretty extensive vetting process to come out and look at a location. So I'm not sure if they'd be open to that. I can certainly suggest that our ask. And because it's part of this, I'd absolutely agree with this. Our scene is in bed. Yes, they have used the senior center before. So. Two. We're talking more about Mt. Piscott. Something that's outside our control. I know that they're voting location on election day, but one day in convenience is different than three weeks. Well, so I thought this was going to be easy peasy. I'm sorry that now I'm not singing so easy peasy. So I would support just then one location and maybe talking to Roswell about us contributing. Can we do that? Contribute a little bit towards the east Roswell location. Like 40 bucks. So there's a real concern that if you have city specific elections and voting is happening outside of the city that presents potentially a problem. If it were only Fulton County or County wide elections, it wouldn't be an issue. But since we have city specific. Even early elections, early voting voting? Yeah. Because the city specific. Well, except that the Public Service Commission is on it. And so that's the thing is I really do believe we need to push the commissioners more because that's a statewide election. That's not just a municipal election. And they're giving three locations on the West side of 400, only one on the East side. It's just not very fair. Yeah, I mean that would be my preference. I really think we need to do that. Rather than us caving so quickly that we say and said, hey, no, you need to. Second location. Yeah, it's the, I mean, it's a statewide election. So. They need to run this way. They run any other election this statewide. And I mean, I'm guilty of not having this in clarity either, but it sounds like it's really a matter of either we. at a second location at Spruel or nothing. Because practically speaking, it doesn't sound like any of these other locations are really going to pan out. So, what that means is what are your thoughts? What do you want to do? I think we need to reach out to the commissioners and we all have different relationships with different commissioners and encourage them to support another location, at least one other location, which would probably be Easter as well. And then I guess we could consider at that point whether to add spruels a second location. Yeah. Yeah. Good station. I just have another question. Are there any road projects that you can think of off the top of your head that will impede access to O.C. In November or October and November? Well, it is in devolved. Yeah, it's just the last two weeks, October. I mean, I guess you could argue that the intersection at Jones and Sargent is potentially something. I don't know when that's supposed to wrap up. You could argue that when the 20, but that's pretty far away. So there is construction throughout the city. So advanced voting theoretically can draw residents from anywhere in Johns Creek. So. But it turns bridge be done by then or sergeant. So we have a couple of projects that maybe wrapped up by that point. But in terms of new construction on the books, I think the Bicer of Bridge is probably the first one that comes to mind of a new project that may start between now and then. With instruction faced? Yeah, with so many going on, I mean, I almost think we would have to have a second location, because I just can't see. Having forbidden something that happened with Jones Bridge people, I wouldn't sit in that traffic. I don't think for early voting. I turn around. So yeah, I guess it's within budget if we go with the second option, unless there's a runoff, right? It's not currently within budget. Oh, okay. Well, I definitely will put pressure on the commissioner or I'm sorry, as the commissioners hope East Rao as well is available. Okay. Well, I definitely will put pressure on the commissioner or I'm sorry, as the commissioners hope East Raazwell is available and I'm still okay if the body is with that expral. And in terms of budget, I just want to remind everyone that we could potentially also be allowable for the runoff if the Public Service Commission does not have a runoff and we do. They're estimating that cost to be approximately $165,000. So this advance voting would be on top of that. That's the bigger piece. I mean, we off-idead, the Canada's Republic Service Commission. I don't know. I just wonder how many there are. I don't think so because their election is not told July, so. Yeah. All right, well, what are your thoughts? Thoughts, I believe we do need a second location. And I think the county is choosing true library because they have more leverage with their state properties. The county guys control the libraries. And the attorney says that it'll be better for us to go with being within the city. I think our hands are pretty much tied. But, ultimately, if we have a choice, I would definitely like to explore East Russell. East, yeah, East Russell. The library there. Okay, all right. So we are a little bit, a little bit of everything everywhere, all at the same time. So I'm not for doing any additional at this time. I think that's where you are. I'm not sure where you landed. I came in. Absolutely. But now I'm based on, I thought the precedence we always had to. And if that was not our precedenceence then I'm okay with one but I like Aaron's suggestion of hey you need to get this roswell online. It's a statewide election. They only have OC to cover whatever 45 square miles, 50 square miles of full and counties unacceptable. It is unacceptable. The population numbers are higher I think on the east side of 400 than they are on the west side. Yeah. All right. I would do the same thing. They'll just wait for the county and then. Are we good to kind of whole? Well, that would be. Table it until the next next meeting Y'all get it but give us an update when you hear When we hear back on rosswell. Yeah. Yeah. Is that Is everyone good with that? Yeah, should Alison give a response to Fulton Kenny since they're expecting something by April 7th? Or is she just going to ghost them? If you want, I think it'd be more inappropriate for you to say that the body talked about it and really felt like that they needed to step up and provide another location. I can certainly say that. Thank you, Alison. Is that good direction for us to give her? Just have the message be that we're still considering and we'll get back to them. Right. Okay. No problem. All right. Next topic. Okay. The next item is the strategic economic development plan. Director Launces here for presentation. Looking sharp as always. Thank you, Mayor. Good evening, Mayor and Council. Kim, my one second on the development director. It is my privilege to present the 2025 Economic Development Strategic Plan update. This evening for consideration, this plan builds up on the strong foundation established by previous efforts. It provides a roadmap for economic development initiatives over the next five years, while aligning how efforts with the city's long term vision. The five goals rather are outlined in the memo that you have. Basically basically with this strategic plan update, we're looking to continue to build on the success of the town center, Vision and Blend. We are also looking to strengthen our position as a hub for health wellness and innovation. Go number three, we are going to continue to support our existing businesses through our John's Creek Business First Program, which is our business retention and expansion effort. We're also looking out ways to continue to support our entrepreneurs and small businesses through targeted initiatives, resources, and partnerships with our regional and state partners. And finally, with goal number five, we're looking at building quality places throughout the city. I will be more than happy to go over each goal, and I'm also happy to take any questions. Well, thank you, Director Kim. So, do you get feedback from our businesses about our processes, our code, our permitting as being an impediment to doing business in John's Creek compared to our neighboring cities? As part of our business outreach efforts early on, we did a small business survey to ask a few questions about needs of our small businesses. And those needs were identified in the report. And basically a lot of the questions or a lot of the needs were around assistance, assistance assistance, a lot of the businesses, had issues with marketing visibility. So we are working with Mercer University and our friend at Greater North Island Chamber and the local Chamber to put together a program for businesses. All right, but so as far as our processes permits, regulations. Those were, those did not come up as main challenges that our current businesses are facing. It was more so marketing visibility from a signage standpoint. Those were the main challenges. Do you see anything in that realm that you see as an impediment or something that we could smooth or make a little bit faster? So throughout the different meetings that we've had, our business first meetings so far, we have not heard anything as far as our regulatory processes. Obviously, there's always an opportunity to improve. And if it's something that the mayor and council would like to explore, we can definitely take a look at the current processes and see where we might be able to improve. Okay. All right. Anybody else? Doli? Thank you, Dr. Hans. All my questions pretty much. You answered in our meeting. So good report, like a lot of information, something to build on. So thank you for your time on the meeting. Thank you, appreciate it. Nice document here. Love it. I do have some questions on the SWAT analysis that you have here. When I go through it, your strengths, weaknesses, opportunities, and threats here. A lot of what I'm seeing within each one of these, because this is a high level strategic plan. The tactical maneuvers within the plan itself, are you comfortable that you have the resources to execute on these goals within each one of the SWAT categories? Part of what we are looking to do and as stated in the strategic plan, there is a toolbox, right? We currently have a number of tools and I think that there is an opportunity to add more tools when you think about a redevelopment because as we think about the future of the city and where we're going based on current market conditions based on our commercial office market and what we would like to see I think there's always an opportunity to have more tools in that toolbox and I know that we are going to talk about that toolbox and some of the tools. On top of my head, I mean there are a few things that we can consider but I'll be more than happy to have that conversation at a later time. Thank you. I, you know, like number 10 here in the plan, you know, adding more people. I'm hoping we can not have to do that. I'm hoping that we can bring in some tools that we can leverage, because leverage what I'm seeing here. When I read this, I see a lot of why. These are the branding, these are the things we have to do, and these are the why's we're doing them. But to put a finer point on this, I'm not seeing the how. How are we going to achieve these goals? And that's in the weeds, I know, and that's not for this conversation. But I wanted to put it out there because there are some, I've got a whole, I've got a lot of red here. And so, I love to sit down with you, maybe at another time, to do this offline because it would take quite a bit of time, I think. But I love what, I love where you're going. And so let's keep going on this. Thank you, I appreciate it. Thank you. First. I think there's, for Council Member D. Biasi, under the goals of the strategic, I think there's strategic elements of the house. There is. There is. From my perspective. Yep. But I did have just one issue with one of the house. So that's goal five, strategy seven, development authorities. So I support this plan as is, but I wouldn't ask that we try to leverage the other strategies listed here before we go down that path. I thought it was excellent document. I do think one of the things we need to continue to pursue, I think you had a health care and life sciences in elastic industries, not necessarily recession proof, but can handle those downturns a lot better as industries. I do think we need to emphasize, I think we had it listed here affluent demographics, but I'd say, I'd almost, where was it? It was in the SWOT strength. Yeah, the educated and diverse population, I think we need to leverage that to keep more talent at home if possible because I do think quite a few industry folks understanding the high education of our population in diverse industries could be one of the biggest assets in your portfolio going forward. So I'm glad that's list there and I would continue to hammer that home. Just to respond what you had said. So I agree with you. Some of the house are in here. But some correct. Some of them are just big like redevelopment areas and things like that. You know what I'd like to do is make sure that if that's a strategic goal that we all agree on, you have the tool kits to go out and actually be able to execute on some of that. And if you need some third party help, not consultants, but some potentially economic development from Atlanta, from see those things, I want to make sure that you have the tools to be successful to execute on these because some of these are big rocks So that's wrong I have no questions. I think you prepare any this report. Thank you Some of she have to look at our demographics, it's mostly white color. And currently most of them are working from home. I understand these strategic goals. But what are we doing to provide some better infrastructure? I would like to think about the residential fiber availability. And also, you know, real estate is very integral to the business. At the top of your head, do you know what is the vacancy rate right now? Commercial? I know we are in the 20s. I would say about 21 percent. Oh, you're talking about, sorry, commercial or residential? commercial commercial commercial commercial commercial commercial commercial commercial commercial commercial commercial commercial commercial commercial commercial commercial commercial commercial commercial commercial commercial the region as a whole, obviously it's still a high number and we can definitely do a little bit more to attract. I'm looking at is, are we thinking in terms of retooling these empty buildings to make it attractive to certain specific industries? Because one of the things we're looking at is health wellness initiative. I we making it appropriate for them? So, the conversation about the strategic planning and the house, I think the goal is to establish the strategy rather, and based on feedback from the mayor and council, and when this plan does get approved, the goal now is to work the plan and that's where the how comes in. It's about that might be an opportunity to say, hey, as a property owner, as a commercial broker, how can the city help? Because that's part of our strategy, that's the vision that made the mayor and council has. What does that mean for you and how can we help? And if what we're hearing is hey, we need additional resources to be able to convert these spaces into places where HWI companies can come into. And if there is a number, then the conversation is going to be, how can we help? So part of what we're trying to establish is the way, the where, where we want to go, and the how is the work plan. I do agree. The report itself is good, but since it adds up to the infrastructure, the long term infrastructure part, I guess I hope you can think along these lines. So tell me if I'm wrong, but so we were the first to be bio-ready certified and at gold level. Is that something that you are able to continue to leverage in conversations with potential? Absolutely, yep. Recruits. So I mean, it seems like that saying that we have got the infrastructure and the zoning appropriate for those type of businesses to come in. I don't know where the city would begin to actually start doing something physically, but it sounds like we're doing I think about what we need to be doing. But if you have any recommendations in that, I'd be very interested in hearing that also. Okay, just a quick question. In your research, because of the vacancy rate that's out there on the commercial side, have you had any conversations talking about incubation, the technology side of the medical side, where we're landing on, has anyone talked to you about setting up incubation centers, incubation like Georgia Tech has, things like that to foster small businesses here? Part of one of the strategies identified in the plan specifically for goal number two, which deals with HWI. I do think there is an opportunity for us to expend on the I of HWI and looking at places like portal innovations, colabtech at Georgia State. We may be able to attract innovative companies as they are getting out of incubator programs at Georgia State. Yes, there would be a conversation about what can we bring here to the city to kind of serve as a launching pad for those innovative businesses. And the next question would be, what can we partner with to make that happen? I have been meeting with different institutions, and I've also visited a few places, including colabtech. And next month, I am going to portal innovations, so take a look at how they are doing. They are private, but I think there is some synergy when you look at what's happening at the regional level with the growth of the life sciences in the region and also the amount of money that is being poured into the region in terms of venture capital. I think there is an opportunity to do more and explore more in terms of innovation. But again, you know, it would have to be a, we can partner with and where does it physically make sense to have a center. But it is something that we are more than happy to explore if it is the wish of the mayor and council. Thank you. Thank you. I always done with questions, but then this elicited another one. So would that, if we're focused some on heavier on the eye at times, would the prevalence of class B, office space actually be an advantage for the eye given the the cheaper cost usually uh... from my perspective i happens in class whatever the lowest is class the in in a garage sometimes or the maker space that i think we're i think warehouse open space to would be ideal because then we can make it whatever we want And, want. And there's obviously not a lot of that kind of structure here in John's Creek. I mean, if you look at Boston or Elkond, and you go to their vendors, their ten genital vendors horizontally, who supplies them? Do they want to get closer to those organizations to have a strategic advantage than the secondary tiers competitor? So things like that would be ideal. And possibly they have some extra space that could foster an incubation within their organization. I don't know, I'm just reaching, but that kind of thought, you know, and push, I think would be great to explore. All right. I do. Sorry. One quick five questions. Well, I was waiting very patiently. When you said the 21% vacancy rate to my colleagues, is that all commercial, including office, retail, and restaurant? Or is that all just officer? That's office. That's mainly office. Our retail is pretty is relatively stable we are at I would say low six percent seven percent okay can our office vacancy if I remember one of your previous reports or emails is that that's a little bit better than say Atlanta or North perimeter So right now we are doing better than Sunday Springs and Alfa Rida. Roswell is doing a lot better in terms of vacancy rate. So yeah. OK. All right. All right. Well, I am going. No, no, no, no. Holy, wait. Oh, man. Last question. Dr. Lons, say again, thank you. What was the vacancy rate pre-COVID? Do you happen to know off the top of your head? I'm just. Pre-COVID? Yes. so it's 21 to 21 But you ran we you ran in it Yeah, but that was after covid All right, anyway All right, maybe that's a number maybe that number could be. And are there any other, Chris, are we free to? I always criticize in people who drag these out. But it's kind of killing me inside. All right, anyway, Dr. Lons, thank you. Awesome. Thank you. So that I have clear direction for this plan to take the place of the plan you adopted in 2016, it to go to a council meeting for formal actions. It's a safety issue and this can go to the yeah, thanks So consent agenda next meeting Yes, senator. Okay. Thank you. Okay. Let's you want to present it again Thank you so much Chris want you to Thank you so much appreciate it. Thank you All right, and then we had an item that got added. Brace road. We wanted to take bicerode off a non-discussion. Do I need to? I think, do we have somebody that you've talked to about? Or are you going to lead us off or what? Yeah, the bicerode construction contract. We are happy to answer questions. I'm going to ask Assistant C. Manjur, how you're going to join us. Our public work structure is not with us this evening, but Chris can probably answer some of the questions Councilman Skinner mentioned to me this afternoon. Thank you. Thank you, Chris. So my concern is us closing another road before one of these other four projects are completed. So my fears that Jones Bridge will not finish by summer when you've got to close the bridge on Bice Road. And I think all of us don't, or maybe just me, don't realize when we approve these, the impact it'll have on the residents as far as the timing goes. Now that Kimberly and I talked about the capital projects, dashboard, will help with that because then we could see what's currently in the works and what's required. So it's been on my mind because I've been reading comments and hearing from the residents and it's terrible getting around our city. So to close another one is it's hard to justify before one of these are completed. And primarily Jones Bridge. Okay. I'm not sure the question, but I'll talk about it. Well, I guess the question is, can you assure us that before vice road closes, that Jones will be complete? I cannot assure with any definitiveness, but yes, Jones Ridge is slated to be done by the end of the summer by mid-summer. This bridge is not slated to close till summer, till school's out. So, this summer. Bice roads? Yeah. This bridge is 2026. Oh, it begins. The finish is 2026. The finish is 20ishing 2026. Sorry. So I understand your challenges on Jones Bridge, but the traffic lanes are the same lanes that have been there. There have always been a two lane road. I said. So there was a traffic signal they had to replace last week. And so that I don't know if that's when you may have gotten caught, my wife got caught. They had to turn, clay, close the road for a limited time to flip the switch around. But in general, it is two lanes flowing. Well, it's the stop sign, the person pulling the stop sign, letting only one lane go through it. Right, there's temporary lane closures throughout the day. Well, I mean, but it should be paid by summer. I went and walked it last night. And I was gone for a week and I was pleasantly surprised at how much it had gotten done. And I don't think anyone gets more derision online than I do about the fact that there are so many construction projects out there, but Yeah, it seems like that that project on Jones is very much on track Yeah, but I mean I mean Yeah, I would just encourage our council to just think in terms of, okay, if a project is worth doing, if it's worth doing, then why is it, why does it make sense to stall the project? It's the timing. That's the only thing I'm concerned with timing. Okay, well, thank you. So you're expecting Jones to be completed by summer. I feel like these two will be okay, time wise. Like Jones will be wrapping up almost on, but our bias will be starting. The bigger challenge with this one specifically is the federal funding that's tied to it and the timing it takes. The fiscal year for the federal money is June 30. So we have to approve it now to get the funds that are part tied to the project. So the construction can start and we can receive the grant funds that we have for this project. And I understand that I'm just wondering, can you put a contingency in the contract that they have to wait until you give them a start date? When Jones is done. When you have a start date. If I change the timeline like that, there's potential financial consequences. The contractor has some rights to talk to us. So it's not as easy as it sounds. Am I remembering correctly that there was a purpose, a purposeful decision to delay this bridge until the summer so that it would have the lease and unimpact on schools? That's correct. You just go into that a little bit more VW. Yeah, obviously it's going to the project is going to go beyond the summer correct so What is that window like and what's it stay? Yeah, the goal was to make sure that we maximize the summer cycle the two months off or 10 weeks. So when we close the road, it'll be closed for those 10 weeks and they'll be able to get a lot done. But it's going to go past that, like you said. But then try to get it done before the end of the year. Get the road reopened before the end of the calendar year. So then when we start next year, you have a bridge, a new bridge. So I mean, I live right there in Chrysler's right there. And you're on the other side of the bridge. Yeah. So as I recall, for me, the fact that that bridge might be closed and give it to anyone. But so, you know, like we would just simply have to take a right out or go double gay, correct, to get places. My friends at double gay, forgive me, but yeah, we go through there sometimes. And then like on Chris' side, they would do what? Go back to Sprule. Go back to Sprule. Correct. So, I mean, you're not able to go your normal way, but you're really able to go wherever you were going before. Just a little bit different route. It's a little different route. That's correct. And that's where the traffic signal is sprule and all that. Alabama helps make that that left safer. There's some other projects we've done in the past to help make this closure of the road not so impactful to the community to have safe ways to get around. So if I recall, we also saved a million dollars. We could have went with nine months to 12 months, right? One lane, correct. And then this, so when you say calendar year, is that a conservative estimate? Because I thought it was like a four month versus nine months. Right, it's conservative. I don't want to make too many promises. My public work structure's not here. So I'm stepping in. I mean, I just, you know, again, kind of is a very local resident right there and talking with the residents along that area, I think people are very hopeful and excited because we've done the project, you know, from say the bridge to Old Alamamo, we've done the projects from Jones to the bridge. And now it's just that bridge is the gap to complete the entire corridor. Yeah, I think we'd have to have a really compelling reason to not move forward. But I agree that it's a very worthwhile thing to think about. I will go back to Jones. So I know that there have been issues on other projects in the past where there has been a bottleneck due to a utility not being relocated. You and I have talked about individual companies. Are they primed and ready to go? And they're going to do what they got to do to make sure that we're not. We've given them notice. So they should be starting to ramp up. And give them notice that, we'd love to have them come here to explain if they can, keep us on schedule. I would love to have them do that. Yeah. But there's rules. Right, they're working within their rules, and we're trying to leverage the best we can to get them moving fast. So yes, we have notified them, the projects can mean awarded for construction soon. They need to get their contracts in place so they can move their lines. Some of them will be on the new bridge, and some of them will be off under the creek. So it just depends on which utility it is, but they are ready to go. But I'm talking about Jones. On Jones, yes those are those we're down to I think one utility has to move and I don't believe they're impacting the paving at this point they're really impacting one drainage section. Okay. But we're getting very close. Are the big rocks, I mean again and you know, layman out walking, not what you want to hear, but, you know, it seemed like the big parts of that project. There's not a lot of bare earth. Correct. You know, it's more like we're about to lay down concrete for sidewalks. We've got underlayment there for the road. It's just a matter of putting in the islands, finishing the sidewalk gaps, few drains, and- The top layer of asphalt stripes. That's really the, when you see it feel finished, but that that should happen in the next couple months. Or those more smooth elements to navigate in terms of the issues that Stacy is talking about. Yes. And once they're done, it'll ride very well. And the lane closures will be much more minimized. And hopefully in the next two months, the last report I had, I should be getting that done, which is before they would close. Vice-were. And I'm sorry. And then in the next two months, what? They should be doing some of most of that in the next two months. What I just talked about? Yes. And so the stuff that would be left would be getting the grass in and some of that kind of stuff along the sides of the new sidewalk you just described. Some of the markings and signs and things of that nature that are. OK. So you're done. Yeah, OK. you know, I love bridges. So just set the foundation, the reason I'm asking this question is because I live on Parsons Road. And a couple years ago, well maybe five years ago, the Parsons Road Bridge was reconstructed. And it was one vendor out there who had a huge problem and we had to go back out to another vendor and literally the road was closed for over a year and we had to go around the block. And it was an event for a lot of people in that area but people got used to it and went on. The challenge I wanna make sure, and I guess I don't recall the drawings of this bridge. The Parsons Road Bridge has, you know, you come down a hill and you're making a sweeping turn and there's a sidewalk that is not a pathway. It's a normal size sidewalk in essence, but the cars are going past you at 45 miles an hour minimum and it is quite honestly dangerous to walk across the bridge and I don't want to see that even those are straight There's not a curve. I don't want to see because there's sidewalks here I'd like to make sure that the sidewalks are of the right size So you're not literally up against the street when the cars are going by and next question is Is there going to be one guardrail or two guardrails one guardrail for the pedestrians and second guardrail on the other side or where is the guardrail I guess on this project You and I sat I sat and you come out. To the first first answer I don't have top of my head. I know there is a trail on one side and a sidewalk on the other. I can't tell you how wide they are exactly but it is a straight road versus the curve. There is no plan to have a guardrail between the cars and the people. It is a vehicle going off the road, type protection, at the end of the bridge, abutment. So the guardrail will be on the, so the pedestrians will be right next to the road. Correct. That's correct. How do we make sure that the sidewalk is a pathway and or and not I mean, the sidewalk, I mean, it's, in my opinion, I think it's a horrible job we did on the bridge in Parsons Run. I mean, if I would have known what it is today, you know I would have complained wholeheartedly and so with the community because people run across the bridge because it's so scary. Even with the mitigations that we tried to do, it is still bad. And I walk that just about every other day. And it's scary. So how could we make sure before we go forward that the sidewalk is a proper size? I mean, is the sidewalk in trail not going to match what's on the other existing sides? It will. So the way that design works in general, and I haven't looked at this one before this meeting, but bridges are very expensive. Yes. And so every foot you give to the width is a much higher cost than any other part of the projects. And that's why bridge projects are so expensive. And so typically a trail will come down towards the bridge and then kind of come up all across the bridge and then kind of go back. And so that's probably the way this one is. That grass strip kind of goes away as you go over the bridge because that two or three feet that's normally for utilities ends up going underneath the bridge. They used to attach to the bottom of the bridge and you don't need it for utilities. But that then makes people get closer to the road. But to his point, and I know that I've raised this point in the past, you know, we need to be given options to decide if we want to make something cheaper because a lot of times we may really want to maintain the look and feel and the quality of life, safety, whatever different aspects there are. Right. You know, and I feel very strongly about that option not being taken away from us. So I don't know how the rest of the council feels. Can I ask Larry one question because I've been on that bridge with my car. Are you saying the pedestrian's have to walk? The pedestrian bridge. So there's only one sidewalk. There's two sidewalks and both sides of the bridge. One's a pathway, one's a regular size sidewalk. And the cars are coming around to turn and the apex of the turn is right where the sidewalk starts. So I kid you not one little miss and whoever's on that bridge is dead. It's literally that simple. So I don't want to see that situation occur here, even though there's not a curve, you know, I want to make sure that there's enough room so someone could ride a bike and they don't feel like they have to hurry across the bridge because it feels dangerous. Right. And I, I'm sorry. Is it the bridge or the dot here? Yes, yes. I mean, if you ever want to just stop at Parsons Run, at the bridge and just, just stand there and you'll know exactly what I'm referring to. And I just want to make sure to your point that if we're saying yes to the project, which I agree, yes to the project, let's just make sure that we don't create another problem here, another situation that, even if it costs a dollar more, we don't want that situation to go. Is it going to look the same to your knowledge? No. Is that what's there now or at Parsons? I don't know if I'm up in my head where that design landed on the width. It should be wider. It will be wider, but I can't tell you exactly how wide that sidewalk is. What about the other, sorry, the last few we've done, the one on Barnwell and then the one on Nezbit ferry from below, they all have like that like design, it's a little bit separate like pedestrian bridge attached to it. It seems to have been the style we've been using more frequently, a colleague creek, not a colleague creek, but a bell road going towards the high ground. It goes. like pedestrian bridge attached to it. As you see, it was a head in the style we've been using more frequently, a colleague creek, not colleague creek, but a bell road going towards the like. Those pedestrian bridges are, we're only for pedestrian bridges. They were not, we did not touch the actual road bridge in those projects. That's a good point. Because those road bridges were in good shape. So there was no reason to spend that money. So what we did is we built the pedestrian bridge to get the connectivity and maintain the old bridge. So this one's replacing the old bridge and we used federal dollars and therefore they wanted to put it all in one bridge versus having a separate pedestrian bridge because it cost twice but a lot more to do two bridges. To the mayor's point I think my concern is we don't get these details. Right. Before we approve something and like Haynes Bridge Road, that sidewalk sits below the road. I would never have approved that, but I'm sure the council, the time wasn't aware that's what it was gonna look like. So how can we better get picture in details about what things are gonna look like? So for this one though, I do think we saw this because it was a trail and then we did discuss the width of the bridge. Like as long as it was enough width, thought five feet, like we'd have the 10 foot trail and then it would come down on the south side of the bridge for a pedestrian. But you can just go. I think it might even been before. Yeah, the challenge is 21 is when we presented all this to the public when we had the bridge concepts drawn. We showed where it crawled. All the details you were talking about. We shared in 2021 or that ballpark. And that's when the council made the decision to close the road because of the financial everything Chris is talking about that happened in that time prime is taking us four years to get to this day where we can do construction and unfortunately we've changed some of you over that time frame. Can we just get an idea how wide that sidewalk is? Yeah I can definitely report back I can definitely report back on that. Yeah, problem. Well, and I think that we need kind of that side view because it sounds like what it's gonna do is it's going to pinch in. Yeah. And you're gonna take away that grass, the beauty strip or whatever. So it is going to get, you are going to get closer as a pedestrian to the traffic crossing the bridge. Is that accurate? I don't know. That's typical. To be fair, I did not ask Chris to review the plans and pull the project together for the meeting. No, I didn't realize we were headed that direction in this conversation. So in the future, I will find out. I will find out. I will find out. I didn't know either. I'm not going to put the other one. raise and I did not. I appreciate you bringing this forward because I didn't have it on my radar. I have mentioned this to Kimberly. I mean, for Bice Road, it's kind of one of those roads like Barnwell or Bell, this kind of be colleague. And we're going to take away the current bridge and because it's going to be raised up, the road and everything is going to be so much higher that they're talking about 250 feet, I think, on each side of guard rail. So that is a boatload of guard rail. Hopefully, maybe it'll have a matte finish and not a super high gloss finish. But so it is a difference. It is a huge difference. And it seems like this has come up before where I think the council feels like we are kind of handed, if I've never, unfortunately I've probably had to before, but growing up, my neighbors, the mom on her refrigerator had this thing that said, this is not birching, you either get it my way or you don't get the thing at all. And sometimes it feels a little bit like that for us, when we're getting these project plans, if we get them at all and we are at a disadvantage, because we can't always read some of the technical aspects as well as we would maybe like to. So, you know, if there's a way that we can maybe make this process a little bit more user-friendly for us to have an impact, I think that would be positive. Can we get another council or work session on this before we approve it? So the longer you wait to approve it, you're not going to make the closure date that we were intending to maximize the summer. That's the, we pushed really hard to get it to today. We were trying to get it to the last meeting, but we got it to today so that we could meet these construction timeline. That's it. That's it. How hard would it be for you between now and it coming perhaps to the council meeting for there to be an option where maybe the sidewalk and trail continues? I don't even know if that's not what's happening, right? Did I find that out? Right, well, and so that's I think the conversation we're having is what can you do between now and April 14th to see what maybe the options there are because it sounds like there are concerns. Correct. Does that sound like a plan? Yeah. I've been odd in a time crunch with this, ground sonalded. We getting started the deadline there to get the grants awarded. But that will meet that date, but we're the next two meetings. It's more the construction gets delayed every time we come to a meeting and wait two to three more weeks to come back to a meeting. And they got to do a lot of prep work before they close the road. At first I had to interject. How about we will pull all of the information we can bring it to your April 14th council meeting. Have it as a new business item. If you're comfortable with what information you've received, if we've answered your questions, you can take action that night. If not, we'll also include what are the critical path issues, whether it's grant funding or notice to g. Because there's g.money involved, so there's another step in the process after you say yes, so that you can understand that and know whether or not you need to take action that night or you can take another meeting to make that consideration. But so that's almost best case scenario and worst case scenario is that there's a desire depending on what plan is. To re-engineer the project. To not. Is it re-engineering if it's adding the beauty strip back in or something akin to that? That would be a complete re-engineer. Because you make the bridge wider. It's a revision. It's a revision. Correct. Sorry, but I'm ready to require engineering. If the answer, when you get out of here and you go and you look at the plans, or is that it's the pinch program, which it probably is, how difficult would it be to get us the non-pinch version in preparation for April 14th? I would find out. Okay. Okay. Does that sound good? Great. Thank you. Okay. Two minutes since you got some time. The next point, I just want to set up the context. Recently, Georgia Supreme Court ruled that individual commissioners of neighboring county could be sued. The ruling has just come. They will be this is a case law. So I presume it's going to be either deliberate negligence or malice must be what comes to my mind why this they're ruling. Regarding this topic. 6B. Acceptance of legal death makes. Okay. We're not taking that out. We're not taking that out. We have executive session and I got no notice from you. Since we got this some time, I just was thinking because this is going to give me two minutes and I'm not against it. I just want clarity. Okay. We have a process and so it's not just me, it's all of our colleagues. I'm asking what is the process so that we don't get into trouble, that's all. So what I want to know is since mayor is the point person for all these legal notices which are coming to the city, whether anybody is proceeding against us or the mayor or the city, Is there a timeline? I didn't find the timeline when it will reach the exact person who's being served. So the policy does not cover individual, individuals that are being sued. There's a portion of the policy that talks about it. There's an individual employee we can certainly add if it's an individual council member. The mayor is only the point person to be served on behalf of the city, not by mayor and council. So if you're being sued individually or you're named individually, this process would not apply. Okay. All right. All right. All right. I think those are all of our items. We actually do have a lot for executive session. If anyone wants to make a motion. Hey, I move that we adjourn to executive session, discuss land legal and or personnel matters. Mayor. Very, very elegantly stated. Second. Second. All right. All those any discussion? All those in favor? All right. I would like to adjourn out of executive session. I second that. Okay, is there a discussion? Seeing none, all is in favor. And we handled three land and one personnel issue. Thank you, Mayor. No further items on the agenda and everybody else we're gonna take a little small break and we'll start the regular council meeting here in about three or four