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I'm going to go to the next room. I'm sorry. Good evening. It's now 6.30 p.m. local time. May the clerk confirm that the public recording has started, please. Today is Thursday, March 20th, 2025. This is the third meeting of the Planning Commission for 2025 and is hereby called to order. the record show the following members of the commission are present here in Chamber. Commissioner and Council representative Bertot. Commissioner Davis. Commissioner Faber. Vice Chair Green. Commissioner Hanbok. Myself, Ronald Reyes. We have Commissioner Brown attending remote. And I'd like to read this for his ability to participate remotely. Persuant to code of Virginia 2.2-3708.3, and town of Perseville Resolution 21-06-06. Mr. Brown has requested to participate in this meeting by electronic communication from a remote location that is not open to the public. Due to a personal matter, Mr. Brown will be participating in this meeting Remember, remember, remember, remember, remember, remember, remember, remember, in the council chambers. And town staff have arranged for the voice of Mr. Brown to be heard by all persons in the council chambers. Mr. Brown made the request within the timeframe required by policy and the town attorney has determined that his request meets the requirements for remote participation. The planning commission will record in its minutes the reason for Mr. Brown's remote participation and the location from which he participated. Let the record also show that the quorum is met with six commissioners present. And also the following town support staff are present. Ms. Wineske, clerk and planning coordinator, Mr. Andrews, planner and staff lays on to the commission and director Wilkes, community planning and zoning administrator. Commissioner Favour, would you please lead us in our pleasure, allegiance? Everyone please stand. I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands one nation under God and is visible with liberty and justice for all. Please be seated. Thank you. Item three on the agenda is agenda amendments and approval. Before we proceed with approving or amending the agenda, I'd like to clarify an important point about our process to ensure alignment among commissioners and planning staff. While the draft agenda is finalized in coordination with the chair, vice chair, and planning staff. The version distributed to commissioners and the public remains a proposed agenda until it is formally adopted by a majority vote of this body. Until that vote takes place, the agenda is not yet final and the commissioners have the opportunity to suggest modification. With these clarifications in mind, I now open the floor to the commission members for any proposed amendments before we move to adopt tonight's agenda. Are there any amendments from the commission? Anyone? Hearing none from the commissioners, the agenda is committee as distributed. Item four. Commissioner Disclosures. I will start with Commissioner and Representative Bertot. I have no disclosures this evening chair. Thank you. Commissioner Brown. No disclos evening, Chair. Thank you. Commissioner Brown. No disclosures, Chair. Thank you. Commissioner Davis. No disclosures. Commissioner Fabre. I have no disclosures. Vice Chairman Green. Chair, no disclosures this evening, thank you. Commissioner Hombot. Chair, I and no disclosures this evening. Thank you. Commissioner Hamba. Chair I have no disclosures. Chair rise I do. On March the 16th I met with council members Carol Luke and Sue Colliel and Mr. Nedham Oldman to review items of interest on the zoning update and corresponding zoning map. We met at my home located at 401 Rockburn Court from approximately 1 p.m. to 4 p.m. We reviewed the use tables, overlay districts, and proposed zoning map found on the town's website. That is all the disclosures that I have. Thank you. We'll move on to item five. Election of officers. Good evening commissioners, staff and members of the public. We have reached item five on our agenda, the election of planning commission officers. As chair, I will preside over this process in accordance with Robert Rules of Order and Article 3 of the Planning Commission by-laws. procedure will will be formal, it will be transparent, and conducted entirely in open session. All nomination votes and results will be recorded in the minutes as required by law. I want to clarify that only Planning Commission members may participate in the nomination and voting process. While we welcome public attendance, the election of officers is an internal matter of this commission. Members of the public and staff may not make nomination or vote in this process. Thank you for your understanding and courtesy during this election process. We will elect two officers this evening, Chair and Vice Chair, each serving for one year term in accordance with Virginia code 15.2-2217 and our bylaws paragraph three dash three and commencing immediately through the last schedule meeting in March of 2026. For each office I will open the floor for nominations. Any commissioner may nominate any eligible member, including themselves. A second is not required for nominations. After each nomination, I will repeat the nominee's name for clarity and ask if there are any further nominations. Once no further nominations appear forthcoming, I will call a final time for any additional nominations. If none are offered, I will declare the nominations close for that office. Once closed, we will proceed to voting. If there is only one nominee, the commission may elect by acclamation unanimous consent. And if there is no objections, otherwise a row call vote will be taken. If there are multiple nominees, we will conduct a row call vote by the clerk until majority is met for at least one of the nominees. In each case, each commissioner will publicly state their vote by nominee when called on by the clerk. If no candidate receives majority, for example, tie multiple nominees, splitting vote, etc. Assuming some number of candidates are nominated, will continue balancing until a majority is reached for one of the nominees. In a tie between two candidates occur, we will continue to conduct votes between them. If it persists, the commission may discuss or take a brief recess before the next ballot. However, voting continues until the decision is made. If a new chair is elected, I will pass the gavel to the newly elected chair so they may preside over the remaining remainder of the meeting. Otherwise, I will continue. Any questions? Nominations are now open for the Office of Chair of the Planning Commission. I nominate Ronald Rises Chair of the Planning Commission. I second that nomination. Second's not necessary, but is there any other nominations? Anyone? Okay. Since we have a single candidate, and there are any objections to electing Ronald rise as chair by unanimous consent. Any objections? Hearing no objections, Ronald Ryes is hereby elect is as chair by unanimous consent. Congratulations to me. Congratulations sir. All right. Our next order of business to elect a vice chair and we'll follow the same procedure. Nominations are now open for office of vice chair. I nominate Bill Humbock as vice chair of the Planning Commission. Are there any other nominations for vice chair for the Planning Commission? Hearing none, nominations for vice chair are now closed. Are there any objections for Bill Hombock becoming vice chair? Hearing no objections, Bill Hombock is here by elected as vice chair. Congratulations, Mel. Thank you, Bill. Congratulations, Brian. Thank you. Thank you. Welcome. This concludes our elections. On behalf of the commission, I extend our appreciation to our outgoing vice chair, Brian Green. Thank you. And again, congratulations to Commissioner Hombot. I look forward to working with you. Thank you, thanks all of you for participating. Thank you, Chair. Thank you. Welcome. This puts us on to item 6 which is approval of minutes. Item 6A Planning Commission meeting minutes January 23rd of 2025. Because the minutes were previously distributed to the commission, I propose we dispense with the reading of the minutes by the clerk, unless any member objects. Are there any objections to the reading of the minutes? May I have a motion then to approve the January 23rd minute? Oh, wait a minute, I miss one, sorry. My bad. Are there any corrections to the January 23rd minutes? Anyone? I hear none. So may I have a motion to approve the January 23rd meeting minutes as previously presented to the commission by electronic means I move that we approve the January 11th 23rd Do I have a second Second for the acclimation, all in favor say yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Are any opposed? The motion to approve the January 23rd, 2025 meeting minutes passes 7-0. Item 6-B, Planning Commission meeting minutes February 6th, 2025. Again, because the minutes were previously distributed to the commission, I propose we dispense with the reading of the minutes by the clerk, unless any member objects, are there any objections? Hearing no objections to the reading of the February 6 minutes by the clerk, are there any corrections to the February 6 minutes by the clerk? Are there any corrections to the February 6 minutes? 2025. Hearing none, may I have a motion to approve the February 6 meeting minutes as previously presented what the next step is. I can't wait to see what the next step is. I can't wait to see what the next step is. I can't wait to see what the next step is. I can't? Motion to approve the February 6, 2025 meeting minutes past 7-0. That concludes item 6 minute meanings. So we'll go on to item seven, citizen and business comments. May the clerk provide the commission requests from the floor to address either citizen or business comments tonight. The clerk advises that there are no comments for this evening. Are there any electronics? No requests. So item 7 is complete. We'll go to item eight now, which is planning Commissioner comments. Let's start with Commissioner Representative Bertot. No comments from me this evening, Chair. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Commissioner Brown. A good evening. I wanted to say thanks for letting me join virtually. I'm currently in Richmond at the 116th. Virginia certified planning commission program closing session. It's pretty fitting today. We talked about a lot of things we're going to discuss tonight in our agenda. We talked about roles of the chair, comp plan, review, and updates, bylaws and ethics. So I highly recommend that the commissioners that have been gone to join this program. And it's been definitely a learning opportunity for myself. So that's all I have. Thank you. Commissioner Brown, thank you for that update. I hope you're having a good time down there and Richmond too. I love Richmond. There's no doubt about it. So enjoy. Look forward to having you back. Commissioner Davis. Commissioner Faeber. Congratulations to our next one year chair and vice chair. And Troy, I wish I could have been there in Richmond but but work impeded me. So I'm now scheduled for July. I do look forward to partaking in this training. I've heard very good things. That's all. Thank you. Commissioner Greene. Again, congratulations to run Chair and Bill. Looking forward to your committed leadership and guidance to the Planning Commission, which are goals to continue to support the citizens of this town. So congratulations and best of luck, you're all gonna do very well. Thank you. Commissioner Hava? Yeah, I want to congratulate the chair for remaining chair. And I look forward to the new duties of the vice chair. And I hope I do it justice. I'm looking forward to it. And just let me know when you need something wrong. I got another item too. I did attend the Virginia Main Street meeting and I thought it was an interesting initiative, a lot of energy there and I think it's important for us to capture the public opinions and this is an avenue to do that so I support that initiative. I elected not to me on a steering committee for such but I still want to participate in it and see what the public has to say vis-à-vis what we're going to do with this five-year update and things we have online right now. Can you hear me? I did hear you. Okay. Oh, that was Act One. Okay. And that was act one. Okay. So that's all. Great. So thanks to everyone for your support, to continue as chair of this very important commission and board. As I've always said, it is the only commission that is listed in the state laws. You won't find any others listed in there. It's important for this commission to act and do and study independently and to give and listen to our citizens to our town businesses and to everyone here. So hopefully the next year will go good. Congratulations I'm really glad to have you on and you shouldn't have said that. I will be giving you a lot to do. Thank you. Thanks. It was ledley obliged. Yeah, right. All right. Item 9, Council Representative Report. Thank you, Chair. And my congratulations to our new chair and vice chair. This is a tough job and appreciate that you're willing to step up and help to further the import work of the planning commission. Also I'd like to report to the planning commission that after many, many months of effort by this and previous planning commissions as well as the planning staff. We finally had a public hearing on the draft zoning ordinance passed by the planning commission on July 31st of last year. That public hearing was held on March 11th, 2025. And it will also be a discussion item on the agenda for next Tuesday's town council meeting. So I'm pleased to see this long standing effort moving forward. Thank you, Commissioner Rathau. Does anybody else have any questions? Comments? None? All right. Will those try? Is it too late that? Well, if he comes back. Oh, hey Troy, you got a question? I do not. is it too late that? Well, if he comes back. Oh, okay. Oh, hey Troy, you got a question? I do not. I'm online. I just had my camera off for a second. Oh, okay, so you were there. All right. All right. I just, I was wondering. Go ahead. Yeah, I was wondering, you have what the status of the zoning ordinance approval? Well process once it leaves the planning commission's hands that is once it's been through public hearing at the planning commission and then voted to recommend to the town council, then it goes before the town council, there has to be at least one public hearing for the town council at which they will collect public comments, similar to what happened back in July with this planning commission. And then from there, the town council will discuss and consider, and if they are in favor of passing it, they will vote on it if they think that it needs to be recommended back to the Planning Commission for major revisions then they would make that recommendation as well. And that's in process. That is in process. Okay. That's all there. Yeah, I'll definitely be there. Anyone else? No. All right. I think we're ready to move on to item 10. Planning staff report. And 10A is the update on FEMA training. I believe that Mr. Andrews, you're going to be taking the floor. Yeah, just to and it's page 16 through 19 in our packet. And and there's a short description in our background on page 16 and then the attachments are just just general depictions of the the floodplain areas in town. So yes, early February the 3rd through the 6th had the opportunity to attend a FEMA put on training actually at the FEMA National Training Center. It's actually about an hour north of here in Emmett's Bird Maryland. It's a beautiful campus, so FEMA puts on courses for all sorts of things there, including the National Fire Academy. And the course is free. It was free free me to attend once I got accepted. And they even, they have books from all over the country come. And they have dorms. The property was a former Catholic University, St. Joseph College, built in 1809, and FEMA bought it in the 70s when that college consolidated with Mount St. Mary's, which is right there in MSB as well. So really a great opportunity to go over FEMA, a FEMA-led floodplain management course. I think floodplain can be a very technical and sometimes overwhelming concept. And certainly it was for me early on in my exposure. So FEMA went through and leaves the course. The participants are many folks from local meet disparities like myself, as well as state organizations, our state organization that actually accept me to go to the courses, the Department of Conservation Recreation. And they manage a lot of the municipalities' regulations, make sure that we're adhering to FEMA. There are also other FEMA staff who are there who are, you know, local, local FEMA officials who are reviewing and auditing different jurisdictions. So really a wide breadth of folks there. I think it was really good to see, especially in light of some of the floodplain ordinance that we've gone through in the revisions, as well as recent discussions as they related to the interchange and things like that, and kind of put that together with a big kind of mix of folks from around the country to see what they're working on in flood plains and really get the information right from the horses mouth, so to speak, from FEMA. So a lot of good information there. I'm happy to chat with folks about it. And actually, additionally, this Tuesday, I attended it and the chair actually was able to log on to for a virtual presentation and meeting, put on by the Virginia Department of Conservation and Recreation. They're looking to start, I guess, the easiest way to describe it is DCR is looking to start their version of a floodplain comp plan. They're looking to kind of reach out to the communities and see what help they can offer, and what services they offer now, what they can improve. And in light of that too, I think they described in a responsive question, you know, FEMA's involvement at the state level and even directly to the municipal level is a changing landscape. So I think it'll be even more important to make sure that we're involved with the state processes and able to get that support as well from the state and any FEMA services. Like the training that I was able to attend. So that's sort of the brief summary. I'm happy to follow up with any questions now or even after the meeting or separately. Do any of the commissioners have a question? I pass that to you, Ron. Well, I was hoping that, well, I can do. I do. Yeah, once you start. Yeah, now I just wanna, I mean, Jordan, given the time you were there, I see some of these diagrams here updates, but I mean from a step back perspective, what would you think the top three things that you took away from as it applies to what we're doing here in person? What would be? I think as I mentioned before, it was interesting and the conversations I had in a lot of the workshops that we had with different members from across the country. really just the where our floodplain ordinance stands in relation to somebody's love as we currently really have very few structures in our floodplain. We have a floodplain, an AE zone that is more documented than some other areas in the South, obviously in some areas in Virginia. They have, they don't have really good data or any data at all in their flood plains. So seeing that spectrum, I would say for our community, one of the things I think I took away from it was just recognizing to a lot of the resources. was able to show us, including the excerpt set you have on the agenda packet. So I've known about the FEMA's online GIS layer system, which is where I've gone, but a lot of other tools, insurance tools, things like that. Information as far as post flood events, things that we, in really action plans that we don't, as far as I know, have readily available. And part of that is, partially because these other communities readily see that sort of response. Right now, the primary structures that are closest to our floodplain, our town utilities, and some close by Catoctometos. And we have a benefit of a large portion of our floodplain being in open space either town or privately on open space so I think what I learned is we have a good floodplain now but we should be prepared we need to be you know we don't want to wait till we need these these structures set up to start implementing them so some takeaways there. Are we in line with how others think about floodplain and management of that? Yes so the our floodplain ordinance actually is regulated so FEMA sets the the national standards to be a participant in their national flood insurance program. And those are the minimum standards. Our ordinance, as it stands in the current zoning ordinance, is directly based on a template of a flood plain ordinance that our Virginia Department of Conservation Recreation produced. And more or less it's a fill in the blank as a minimum. Communities like Percival then have the ability to go above the minimum and require, for example, more free board or other standards. And you can do that. But VMA just requires that you are adhering to the minimum standards and you can exceed that. So as far as are we adhering to the floodplain standards, yes, so everyone in the National Flood Insurance Program has to meet the minimums. Now there are communities that are in floodplains that are coastal floodplains. And not riverine like ours where they have the e-zones where the flooding and the regulations have to do with the velocity of storm procedures and things like that so you'll see much more regulations and precautions in those districts so we don't have anything like that there and it's not necessary and that's a balance I think all across the country is balancing you know the regulation with you know property rights you want to make sure that you're providing good guidance and regulation to protect life and property, but also not doing too much where you're getting to potentially the realm of a taking or something that's infeasible or impractical or too cautious. So certainly balance and it's good to kind of see that across the board too. Cool. Thank you. You want to. So I'd like to start by one thanking you for getting involved with this. Is this your first time dealing with floodplain administration? With the talent, yes. And this is certainly the first official training. I, you know, working with the engineering team, including the past director of engineering and planning tail Lenin, who has, who had a certification in floodplain management. Kind of apprentice a lot of that. And certainly through some of the floodplain alterations with 690 was sort of, getting that education cumulatively. So it was a good opportunity. And certainly a lot of resources here. And again, FEMA being a great, great piece there. One of the reasons actually I was able to take advantage of the FEMA course, DCR puts on trainings like this as well, but they're regionally, they move around. And they, when I inquired about, of course, were very much focused on the southwestern part of Virginia who had gone through all the flooding and trying to make sure those folks were getting the training and the ordinances online they needed. And they had pointed out that FEMA, for us as local, I was actually able to commute each day, whereas most folks were staying on campus, but it's a great resource there. So, yes, in a long answer, it's my first official training, but I had some exposure here. Is the intent that you'll become our certified flood plain, Edmund? I'm pretty pleased to say.. So that's good. We did have an interesting meeting. I thought we had like 43 people. I think they were on that call. And most were pretty quiet. Elizabeth spoke up quite a bit. I was very interested in the things she had to say. But also the pain that came out of our southern area, Virginia areas, but they went through with Alina and are still suffering with issues with their dams that need to be hardened up and where that money is going to come from. Now you gave us three of these and I don't want to put you on a spot or anything. Did you want to go through these with them to talk about this because I'm not sure they. You know I understand these you know very very clearly what they are and where they where they are right now in terms of of low marves etc. But I thought maybe you might want to explain to them what they're looking at. You know, maybe starting with 17, 18, 19. And if you don't, that's okay. I'll go through it sort of quickly. One of the things that I sort of got off track when I met you earlier, but so FEMA has a national flood insurer, or national flood hazard GIS layer. If you were to Google FEMA interactive map flooding, you could find it pretty quickly. And you can go in that. Those are the same GIS layers that we import when we're checking our GIS mapping. FEMA is the keeper of the maps. That's one of their duties as a federal agency here. So what's on their map is what's official. When the map is changing, the localities can submit requests for change and I won't go through all those processes, but it's extensive, but ultimately it's FEMA who's accepting those changes and typically among their map. Those maps, you know, in the past, years ago were large maps, those flood insurance rate maps. And even in the course, we practice doing the old school sort of scale and extrapolation and checking the old maps. But most often, the folks are using the FEMA maps. And you'll see the title of these. And I actually exported these from their layers, because you could take a screenshot of a map. But what FEMA allows you to do through a program is to export what's called a firm format, which is exactly what it sounds like. It's a little version of a firm. So our firm panels for the town, there's really just four large firm panels that cover the whole extent of the town. All of our 1% flood area, the actual regulatory floodplain is in the northern part along the South Work, Conduct, and Creek quarter, which is what I've extracted here. So I've pulled out firmets of our only regulatory floodplain. And I say regulatory floodplain because, and there's a key here, and again, I won't go through everything exhaustive. I know that it can be a dive, but I'm happy to chat in probably four-year years off. You'll see around some of the kind of teal green, which is the... What sheet are you on? On any of the sheets. So when we're looking at the mapping, you know that teal color that's labeled zone AE, that's our regulatory floodway. So that's the 1% flood hazard area. It's also been known as 100-year flood. You'll also see areas that are that light orange or bronze shading. That's a flood plane but it's considered a shaded zone X. So that's a .2% flood plane. So those areas are not held, yeah the 500 deer flood. So those areas are not held to our flood plane ordinance regulations. Some communities do have regulations for those. We don't. There are different reasons that areas could be a shade of X. And not all flood areas that FEMA maps are just strictly rivering. They have ponding areas of flooding that they can map. They have shallow flooding. So again, these excerpts, these formats show the floodplain as it moves through the, along with the Southbrook-Caductan Creek. And I'll note too, you'll see the FEMA's floodplain goes through our jurisdictional boundaries. Our floodplain from the Southbrook-okadak and Creek ties in and must tie into the creek outside of the town, which is regulated by the county. So, and it's even more interesting because the creek sort of horseshoes through the town, it moves in from the northwest, comes through the town, underhearths, and exits to the northeast, and moves north all the way up along Berlin, Terranpeg, and eventually makes it out to the Patelman. So really interesting creek and certainly something that I think, and we have some projects, cyclans long-hurst, and those are, you know, they have to adhere strictly to the floodplain here as they look around where they can build, and it's not that you can't build in the floodplain, but you have regulations that you have to adhere to if you propose to. So I'm going to expand this a little bit on them if I could. Just a little bit to help out. And I don't want to get too technical. But on the East side of town where this is page 19, and you'll see a little bit on page 18 was our latest Clomar or firm maps are shown there. And those were presented to us as early as 2012 and as recently as we actually got one I think. at a Clone Mars 2012 and then we had a Lomar presented to us in July of 2020 which completed that condition to an actual format of flow rates in that area, we're surprisingly high, at least when I found out 8,000 cubic feet per second of flow rate. Just to give you guys an idea of what that means, that's about 200, 250 tons of water passing through that area every second. That's a little bit more than a modern locomotive, which is 210 to 216 tons. So you can imagine the force that goes along with that. And also if you look on page 19 and on page 18, you'll see that the water actually will overtop. And this is one more data about the old data. This is based on the new model requirements, but over top's hatcher, as well as the main lines around seven and herst. And then recently, again, Gordon mentioned the 690 project. The 690 project was just a catalyst to learn more about what was going on upstream from Hatcher. And so there is a number of flip plane alleration studies. There's been five iterations of that so far to complete out. If you look at page 1819, you can look east of Hatcher. You'll see a lot of these numbers in feet. Those are water surface elevation numbers and they represent feet above sea level. Those are sea level, of course. Okay. And so, they drop as you go east. It's downhill, that's why you're all right. When you go upstreet from Hatcher, there are not as many of those dental, dental, anyations across there. There are a lot of called stations. And those stations were under the old FEMA model numbers. But there's a lot more data now that's available. And I know there's letters of certificates of elevation, they're being taken care of. And I think those are going to go to FEMA for valuations along with this data. Yes. Because when we talk about structures, the town has structures involved, and then there's homes involved as well. So those are the kind of things that they're working on right now. Right. And that's exactly right. You know, some of the recent, and this was at the council a few, a month ago You know some of those floodplain alterations later iterations were modeling the inclusion of a additional three-box Goldberg to reduce Redirect any flood water so we'll see that and that'll be presented again the county A floodplain alterations a county Application but that ultimately will be what is submitted to FEMA in this case in a LOMAR. And this was actually discussed again at the council meeting this last week, so that blue perimeter that denotes recent LOMAR to the north, you know, what you see on page 19. That was associated with an earlier project. A Lomar done, I think that started outside of the town. I think it's part of the TJT project in some of those industrial areas outside of town. Yes, it bridge filled. You're talking about them. And so, and that's why you see much more, because there's more more recently modeled. You know, when the county does their Lomar,'re going to similarly do elevations through much more of this creek. There'll be a much shorter gap between that low mar to the east and what the county will do. However, one of the things that was raised by our engineering team, in relation to our floodplain ordinance, both existing and drafted, is because of these projects, first this one to the north east and then 690, the town has accepted and practically makes sense, has accepted the flow rates for Kataknikreek that the county utilizes. The county models the flow rates as they come down the creek that watershed, as it enters the town, and then they're using their same modeling for the creek when it leaves the town. And those were the rates that were used for this earlier Lomar and were used for 690. What engineering was presenting, and I agree, the county's flow rates, and at the time our private consultants to note that the county's flow rates are very, very conservative. They're anticipating higher flows than the one we had utilized. Now in turn, our flood-thing ordinance now and the drafted one include additional free board requirements, which on top of the conservative flows of the county may make it pretty hard for homeowners and for the talent to meet some of these regulations. Obviously, we're not talking about reducing regulations to jeopardize any life or property, to jeopardize any life or property. But again, as I mentioned before, be careful with that. That. to jeopardize any life or property. But again, as I mentioned before, be careful with that balance. The county's ordinance then, which has conserved to flow rates, has less free board requirements, but it also has the same stipulations that we've proposed to add, which is the no rise factor. Free board is basically the height that you have to elevate your building or water proof it above the floodplain elevation. No rise refers to the permissibility of a project to do a project or construction and alter the floodplain. So right now we have one foot of allowance in our ordinance. The county has none. It's not to say that the floodplain can never change, but in order to permit that change, you would have to go through FEMA to get a conditional letter of map provision. So that's sort of a summary of what engineering has been reviewing and discussing with us as far as a little bit of the difficulty in the two jurisdictions utilizing different floodplain ordinances while using the same data. So I think that will be discussed a little bit more in the ongoing discussions with the coordinates. But yes, it's a very busy mapping and, you know, jurisdictional boundary, things like that. And, ultimately, want to make sure we protect everyone's property and their life, and that we're getting good information out. And again, I was able to identify a lot of resources through the FEMA course to do that. I think it's important that the commission, the playing commissioners understand that this look like jurisdiction within the town boundary where it comes in from the from the northwest and leaves in the northeast. The jurisdiction and responsibility is of the town, not the county. Correct. Right. And so, you know, that's a lot on us for this little town. You know, we were in a spit distance from Helena. The distance between where that event happened in southern Virginia and us in terms of the universe is a pinpoint. So we dodged a big blow with those type of flood waters coming into the town. The fact that this three box culverts going in, it's good news. I've reviewed the data very carefully. I believe that the three box culvert, although it helps a little bit, I think it's mostly there to ensure that the North 21st Street doesn't collapse during this event. It gives a relief where we were overtopping by quite a bit. It's still overtops, by the way, with the tree box culvert, but not as bad. This is important because you don't want that kind of material breaking loose and going downstream, tearing up hatchery, morseling, and all these gets, as well as getting across hertz and then getting into the Route 7 mainlines. And so all of these, they call them hydrologic structures, are a factor. And it's also a factor of people put swing sets or put sheds in the flood plain. All know, all these kind of things during a flood can break free and you've seen them in TV where this stuff comes through and tears everything up. So there's a lot of work going on. I really do appreciate you're taking this on. I got a ton of information in history going back that you're always welcome to and I look forward to talking to you some more about it because this is a serious. It is a serious thing. People will talk it's only 1% chance a year for a hundred year flood. But if you take out a 30 year mortgage and do the math, it means at 20 per 6, 26% of the time that you have that 30 year mortgage 20 per 6 and do the math, it means at 26% of the time that you have that 30-year mortgage, 26% of the opportunity over the life of that mortgage, you'll get flooded. Yeah, and that was, you know, and did tag it out, I don't need to do that too much, but the reason FEMA, actually, some of the officials said they started using 1% is because when they were using the terms like 100-year and 500-year people I think didn't appreciate the potential as much as they thought, like, oh, every 100 years, but it's not necessarily that that's going to happen once every 100 years. You can have 100-year flood twice and five years. It's hard to predict that. And just the last piece I recall as you mentioned it as far as history, I'll have to share it with you all. It's at some point in reviewing some of the photo archives digitally that we have at the town. I think I was looking for some B-A-R background, but I found a picture that was labeled the Hatcher Ford. And Hatcher street and it's I think early 1900s and the creek, you know, was it Ford over that crossing and that's how it started. So certainly, you know, we've been working around and with the creek for a long time and it's going to be a evolving piece forever. Really? Yeah, I got interested in how much water would go across Tatcher, so I went down and did a measurement, elevation measurement. and it's over 4.5 feet during this event. So it is a lot of water to deal with for sure. So anyway, a lot of work to do, a lot more things to talk about. Don't want to deal with for sure. So anyway, a lot of work to do, a lot more things to talk about. I don't want to take much more time. I look forward to working with you more on this. Okay. Anybody else? Just a quick question. The the low mar, the T alignment referring to on page 19. What's the implications that that covers over the top of some of the residents there? So I think one of the important pieces to note is, FEMA's flood plain is not, no one could ever be a definitive limit of any flood. You know, their mapping, FEMA's purpose for mapping is to reduce, you know, and to harden against a flood and provide regulations to make in, I think a easy way to think about is in this case, FEMA is the insurance provider and this is the policy. You have to meet the policy. And it's important to that folks aware of the risk, but there's not really any capacity for FEMA to alert or, I guess, the homes are close to the floodplain. There's a risk anywhere in town to get flooding, whether it's ponding or flooding or some sort of backup. One of the things I did get clarification on on the training was that anyone, because our town is participating in the National Flood Insurance Burger, anyone, whether they're in the floodplain or out of it or close, we can get national flood insurance through FEMA because we are participating in municipality. So, but you're not required to have it. If you are in the floodplain, you're required to have that insurance. And again, the Val FEMA for a lot of reasons wants to make sure that you don't have debris or things like that going down in a flooding event for safety. Specifically, the floodplain ordinance and the NFIP program are focused on the insurance side, providing federally backed insurance. And maybe that doesn't answer your question fully, but if there was a flood that exceeded the projected floodplain, obviously we'd want to respond as best we could as a town directly. But also identifying, I'm hopeful, that through this work with the DCR and their sort of conflain, if you will, that we can identify some of these resources. Because I think in a post-blood event, if something were to exceed these limits and get into these more residential areas that are not forecast or projected here, we as in the Saudi would need a lot of help from. Just as other communities do, from federal and state and even county agencies to recover from something like that. I'm glad you brought that up because you know the emergency response plan is really important because if you look at these maps and you consider the new FPAL that shows North 21st Street in the overtop. The fire department is kind of cut off from using Route 7, Hurst, and also Azure. So a good emergency response plan for when this happens is a pre-stage or some other thing. And I don't know of that emergency response plan or if he's been written, but it's probably a good time to start weaving that end of all these things we're talking about before we get on the red dot of the next hurricane coming through here for sure. The other thing too is the importance and I think you touched on this a little bit is the town's utilities and their locations in and around the floodplain. Also there's power running through some very power lines running through the floodplain over along the north of the first street. And it's really important to understand this to protect those utilities so people are getting the power and the water service and their water doesn't get and our sewage system doesn't get any deep. It gives us a point I brought up a few months ago as you know along Susan in the Susan came park a lot of the sewer stevels are very short and they're probably shorter than they should be and they may not be strong enough to handle this. So that maybe something should be considered of what we're going to do about that because if we if we clip one of those off or a couple of them off we're going to inundate the sewage system. We don't have that much water holding capability over the over the water treatment plan. So I think they might be vulnerable, but it's something that ought to be considered. And we'll talk some more about that. I'll probably let this go too far. It's one of my favorite subjects. I like anything that flows, man. All right, hey, thank you very much Anybody else All right. That's next. That's next. That's next. Oh. Yeah, we're playing update. Uh-huh. Yeah, so this is Jordan on that one too. Give you a quick rundown here. Tensions are highlighting red and really those are just kind of updates of tracking of what's been happening. So we talked a little bit about the zoning ordinance already so long. Speak to that too much. One of the things that is worth highlighting is a part of the work plan. I don't know if it's a good idea to say that. I don't know if it's a good idea to say that. I don't know if it's a good idea to say that. I don't know if it's a good idea to say that. I don't know if it's a good idea to say that. I don't know if it's a good idea to say that. I don't know if it's would encourage everyone to look in. association this work plan to evaluate on their on our next meeting so the third so as we look at this a little bit here I would encourage everyone to to look in and then I I would believe that we would have a discussion to review that that draft for the report and any work plan proposed modifications that you all might see fit or to request of the council. Yeah, it looks like I just something to do. I can't give that to my new life chair. I see you have the traffic study released. So I was going to hold off talking about the traffic study for the REC Center later in the evening. So because I think that comes up again in the last discussion item. So I will shut my trap on that for right now. Anybody have any questions? Are you done presenting this? I didn't mean to cut your off. I was just trying to be, to highlight some pieces. But yeah, if anyone has questions, happy to go and more detail with the participation too, that we would likely have a more in-depth conversation on the work plan at the next meeting as part of that quarterly report review. Yeah, since here, it's due due now March, right? All four three. Okay. All right. That means it needs to be done now. Four three is going to be here like now. Yeah, and if you'd like to, we believe at least. It should be pretty simple. You know, SAP have been drafting it, and then forwarding that base draft, but we're happy to do that. Yeah, let's wrap that up. Because, you know, like I said, this is just our third time getting together. And we'll take you some big deal. I think we do have to look at what we want to do the rest of the year. It goes in that report. Okay. All right. I think we do have to look at what we want to do the rest of the year. It goes in that report. Okay. All right. Anybody? Nope. So 10 C zoning ordinance adoption process and website overview. Is that next? Director Wilk? Yes. Please. Thank you. Hi, Chair. Has part of the, uh, oh, excuse me. Can you hear me? Is that better? During the Planning Commission public hearing process last year, the Planning Staff got several dozen inquiries from citizens regarding how the proposed zoning would affect their property. We started to discuss a way to provide information online to make it easier for the citizens to access and to see the difference between the current zoning ordinance and the proposed zoning ordinance. Then last fall, the town hired a senior GIS specialist, Reza Gazzveni. And we began to work with him on producing an interactive zoning map. I don't know if you've had a chance to see it online. But I'd like to take you on a bit of a tour, actually, Kendall's going to do this, just so you can, know how to work at yourself and then if you if anyone asks you questions you can show them how to use it also. I do want to recognize Kendall who worked with Resa on this map and Kendall did quite a lot of work on this and so that's off to her for the work. Okay, I just saw you change that. So I went from, I think went from the current to the proposed. What did you click on? Yep, so this kind of shows both the current and proposed zoning. Oh, no, here, I don't know if you can read it. I tried to toggle it. Pretty small. But basically, yes. Yeah, there you go. This is the current. And so with the current, they actually have different information in these maps. So if you look up, you can search your address. So we're here and you can click it. And it'll tell you your current zoning information. It'll take you to the zoning ordinance in Munichode, and you can see your regulations and stuff. And that's the current. So then you can check the proposed, so again, we're here at Town Hall, and when you click it, it's different information. So it's not an overlay, it's not a subarea, same zoning, but this, like, the change affected properties can see more of the information on the new zoning ordinance. Okay. So that's kind of how this worked. And then this was put on the letter sent out to all the properties that are being affected so they were all referred to the page of the website into this map so they can see what how their properties being affected. So you're making those changes underneath the map legend on the left hand side to go from the current to the proposed. Uh-huh, you can turn them on and off. And then if you have them all on, you can use this as a pretty cool, this swipe feature and you can actually see difference here. But you have to have them both on at the same time for you to be able to do that. Yeah, you're pretty cool. Yeah, that's pretty cool. Yeah, you can just search your address and click it. You can see your current zoning regulations, and then the proposed zoning regulations. And this is a tool too. So Kendall and Resa have worked on the zoning map together a lot, but Resa has also put together a lot of GIS resources for the town and many of them are online on the website now too. Things like the snow-plowing, trash, lots of things that we get questions on a lot. So it's really seen as a good, efficient tool that we can communicate a lot of things. Even putting up parade routes on the GIS map so that those can be readily accessible for anyone who's curious. That's all under the, it's called the My Neighborhood. Yeah. So this doesn't replace the official zoning map, the legal thing, right? So we still would adopt a name. I mean, is there a way to make this the legal document in electronic form? See where I'm going? Because I go to this map and it says, don't remove it from the building unless my order of a judge. I don't. That will still exist. You know, I know it does. I just wonder if this one. This wouldn't be an official map, but it would be as close to we could. And the reason for that is even, even county has a GIS map, and it can depict zoning and all those things, and lots of resources, but there's a disclaimer. And there is on ours as well that it's not a legal instrument. It's even the parcel lines that are showing our approximations. So our zoning map is exported from the GIS. So in any case, any graphical or even our official zoning map is not the most official version. If you're going to decide your parcel line and your boundaries that might be affected, you'd have to look at your deed and our zoning. Yes. I also add that once the zoning ordinance is adopted, then obviously the proposed becomes the current. So that proposed layer will go away and just become the current map. Yeah, for some reason I didn't click on that right. The correct box the other day. And I just got frustrated. Oh. That's a me problem, not y'all problem. Well, we wanted to, that's why we did this tonight did this tonight. But you also answer my other question is the basis of this layout is coming off the county's GISI. Of the parcel layout? Of the parcels, yeah. Okay. Do you have the same type of access? You know, when I go to the county's GIS, I can pop on a lot. I see the PIN number, I can pop on it, and it takes me over to all the information on what owner, where they pay taxes, et cetera, et cetera. Does this, to do, this will not do that. And I'm not suggesting you should, it was just a question. We would have similar details, but we wouldn't do, I'm just talking with Resa, Like because we're linking through the county's data set, I think we could, I don't know that it is but certainly for our zoning, yes. This is not connected to webloges yet but it can be. Actually the resident answered that question for me today. I guess it goes back to the purpose. Why was this developed? Okay, and for whom? Citizens, whatever. Which would kind of take us to how deep this would go. So I think the important piece didn't, didn't notice. We have our own GIS systems and data set, not just for zoning or for interfaces like this. Resa is a GIS specialist and for him to do the mapping is really just a side piece of his primary responsibilities which are largely based in our utilities. So the reason we need to have our own GIS is because we have our own utilities that are a matter of security that we wouldn't regulate that to the county to produce or to secure. On our GIS, the non-public side of this, which is all part of the same system, it's just a matter of permissions and what's put public. We have our water lines, our utilities, all of our easements that are linked and cited to our access easements and things like that. So when our utility team is out there to repair something, our GIS is interlinked with the deeds and the easements. So we know where we can be, where we can be repaired, what property rights we have as a town. So there's a lot of very technical and important reasons that we have our own GIS system. This is an extra that we're able to produce as part of that system, but not an independently driven resource, if that makes sense. It does. Again, I'm just curious. Okay. And I have looked at his utility, at least from the standpoint of the lane out of the horizon lines that are going around. And it's also in the utility section, it's something that our zoning team uses very often too. If we're searching, if someone comes in with a permit for a deck or an addition or something rather than us doing a full title search and going down the court records we can quickly verify on our GIS system if the structure is encroaching on an easement or utility line or something of that nature. Whether that's a site plan or a larger piece or even just a homeowner wants to do an addition and maybe there's a, because there are, there are sanitary lines that go between property lines where fences are and helps us to quickly be more efficient with that permitting to have a system, the GIS system showing all that. But you won't have all those records. You've got a general, it's a gross measurement, not an exact measurement. Oh sure. I'm sure in these. Yeah. Yeah. It's more of a confirmation. So if there was, if there was an easement or lying close, then we would request the, you know, we would get the official plaque and make sure that we verified that, that it was, you know, surveyed and sticked out where that line was, but a very efficient tool otherwise. Okay. I'll go full with this more. I got the secret code. I'm sorry. No, they're there were questions. We can go to the next item. Are we done? Are you ready to move on with this? Yes. I'll go it. Yes. OK, anybody else? No, good. All right, so I think our next item is a discussion item now for 11a. Am I on the right track? Oh. So that's on pages 24 to 38. If you guys want to just jump to 25. I'm 25. Because I've learned that I'm a study of nothing. I can't communicate, it's in PowerPoint for some reason. You can destroy it. Yeah. So I tried to do that. So let's just skip to 26. Just a little quick background. I thought this was interesting. Current state of the bylaws. A real. Let's just skip to 26. Just a little quick background. I thought this was interesting. Current state of the bylaws originally written in 1959-ish. No, exactly when that happened, but then some time back. They were amended. So they were done in 59. They weren't amended again in 2007 in then August of 14 and then 18 and then twice last year which I find, you know, if you look at this from an engineering standpoint is this is strange. So there's a couple of reasons. I should have put it else on here. I think we need to look for conflicts, emissions, and ambiguities that still exist in this, between town code, state code, and town policies. But I think this is a good opportunity for the commissioners to learn more about state code, to get more involved in the bylaws and how things work, town policies, etc. So I think this will be a leveraging effort for learning is one of the things I see coming out of this so let's go on to the next slide and kind of talk about this a little bit everybody likes these right. So we want to try and get fully aligned and compliant with interbi-laws right and that's that little we're looking thing in the middle so we've got state codes, state-only rules, town policies that can influence, and vice versa, can influence both directions to town policy. State can do the same thing, can influence town policies on this. because we are creatures of the state. We buy by the laws of the state and specifically this commission is important. And so my hope is to be able and get that done. I don't think they're terribly bad. I do believe that there's some things that we've got to work on. So does this make any sense? I'm not sure I'm in here. Okay, well that's sad. It makes sense to hear that. I've seen too many of these. I think this is good. All right, and then I just put the articles themselves. You know, on my mind, we take these and we decompose these, wanted a time and really look at it. Again, you look at Jack Bay's, look at what the state code says, look at what our town code says, and are these things coming together and meshing members, officers, and their selection. You heard some of that tonight. Again, part of this too is to look down range for future commissions to have the information they need moving forward when I'm and some of us are gone. Okay. on want to provide the best road map and guard rails we possibly can through all of this. So there might be some new potential articles that we don't even see yet. So, any questions there? Straight forward. Purpose and effort. Restore the appointment dates in terms of sort of changes offered in the 2024 version Under article two membership just to make sure they're they're aligning properly. Check each article for alignment with state code. I said that earlier alignment with town code. Comparie article with similar articles and other jurisdictions. It's always good to go off and do that. But I'm always cautious to jump in the bathtub with places where I don't wanna live, like Fairfax County or Leastin' Lowne, that kind of place. More into into. So again, you know, this is our town, our bylaws, as long as we're compliant with state and doing those kind of right things, we want to make sure we do that. So when we get that done, we identify some of the missions, conflicts, all those type of things, any inconsistencies, and then recommend changes. We'd review them, Delivery that we'd have those reviewed by the town attorney, you know, I'd like to probably do this in in in the steps for each article and then once we get to something this coherent As a full system level then we send it on to the attorney or we could decide possibly to, you know, defeat it a little bit at a time. My concern about doing that is as we go through that, we find something and we turn around and have it redo it. So I'd rather do it from a system level approach, okay? You know, do it, do it from a component, and then get down it, do it, do it, do it, do it, do it, do it, do it, do it, do it, do it, do it, do it, do it, do it, do it, do it, do it, do it, do it, do it, do it, do it, do it, do it, do meet at our convenience. And I had a rough timeline. Did you get a chance to look at this? Did? OK. Any complaints? No complaints, no. OK. Great. Any questions on this? Okay, this is not a high. So the subcommittee will generate a report and then the commission will deliberate on that. Yes, yes. So we'll bring it into, we'll feed it. Okay. We won't feed it to you too big. At least when it comes to the commission, I think I'm breaking it down in smaller chunks. We'll only eat the elephant all at one time. All right. the sausage making, then we'll put it on the shelf. Then we'll do the next, then put it on the shelf. Then once we have the system built, we'll see if there's any additional sausage making and easy to get done before it goes to the attorney. Once that's done, we come back, we deliberate. It's a final, final I'll go from there Does that sound okay? I don't know if I have to make a formal motion to get that but it sounded like we all agreed this is just a discussion. I don't see anybody complaining Okay, so it's on it's on a Troy myself to get this done and start feeding it to you. Okay All right. The rest of this was just the bylaws in K-Shall lost yours. No. off to get this done and start feeding it to you. Okay. All right. The rest of this was just the bylaws in case y'all lost yours. No. I'm not going to go through those. Any other questions? the motion law first. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. With that said, what time is it? Does anybody need a break? A few minutes. You want to keep rocking? Okay. All right. That said, we'll go on to 11b, five year comprehensive plan proposed amendment review status. All right. So kind of like what you just did, Chair, I'm going to set the stage a little bit on what we're looking at here. Obviously we have a resolution that's come through directing us to determine any changes needed to the comprehensive plan. So what I want to do briefly is frame this update, walk through what we're working through. And I think that the story so far is really we have a set of possible, so like a direct everybody to look at page 40. We have a possible comprehensive plan amendments working paper. This has really been kind of our starting point. This has come from those who came before and is really a key input into this process. Is really what we're looking at right now. Bill has done most of the work. I'm really just helping on process and project management at this point. But I think the piece that I'm really driving is really on the process versus Bill focused more on the technical side. And so what I want to do is talk a little bit about this which is phase one versus phase two. So why phase one versus phase two is why we're breaking it out that way. Phase one is essentially what we see here is the input, the comprehensive plan amendments. Phase two, well, look, some of these conversations that are going to happen from some of these items, specifically the ones that Bill is going to talk about today, we're pulling on a thread a little bit. And I think that it's good. We want to evaluate from several lenses, you know, do we need to look at something further? And Bill's got like a very, what is it? I think three out of these items and kind of a deep dive we're going to do here. So phase one on page 40, really the next steps they're going to unfold over the next few weeks. We're working with Jordan and IT to get a compliant tech solution set up that enables the sharing of documents, centralized editing, so everybody's on the same page. We really want to make sure we're tracking changes to be precise across the commission. And then once we have that kind of like how you're approaching it run for the bylaws, we want to focus on chunks, bringing that back, incorporating these, synthesizing it and then bringing it back for kind of discussion piece by piece. And what I'm talking about is not just this amendments paper, but the comprehensive plan with the embedded changes in it where we can see discussion points. So we're working with IT to get that all set up. We need to have an environment where we can capture updates, we can capture things that a lot of people are providing to the conversation and then bring that back for liberation here. So that's phase one one. So can I ask a question? Of course. OK, so the software is going to be used. I'm assuming is a word. We're currently looking at Office 365 or 365 teams. There's a wide range of things we're looking at. Either the rest of us require, I mean, I run 365, but I'm not sure everybody does. Yeah. So I mean, that's a good thing. We can create a Microsoft account. I mean, I'm going to look at multiple ways you guys will figure that out. All right, I'll leave the list. I've got some more technical background. So I'm going to try to make sure we've got something in the next few weeks. Yeah, thank you. Yeah, and I think in support of that, to there's a lot of learning that the, some of the new commissioners can do. And so what I'd like to do as well is have some hands on the documents that are based around facts, evidence, your previous decisions, problem statements all the way to, you know, propose options. all the things that we need to have in front of us to discuss this in the right way. So I will be setting that up as well, incorporate what I've talked about as design thinking to some extent here, but really learn from those who have come before and bring all that kind of to bear in this discussion. So like I said to recap, setting up a tool set that enables collaboration for all of us as we go through this first attachment here and pretty much have that ready to go. I don't have a timeline yet for when all that's going to take place like you do or a deck, but that will be probably coming by the next time. Let me discuss this. I like your on collaboration. I think we'll have a do that with this by-law thing. Yeah. We'll go down to that similar path, you know. Yeah. We're both going through something relatively similar. We need multiple inputs, multiple perspectives, centralized document management. Yeah. My one question for you since you know a lot of all the state code. I think we've talked about this. Is it a quorum if there are asynchronous discussions happening within a document? That's a good question. That's the first thing I thought of. We all go into jail. We all go to jail. We all go to jail. Yeah, because we're not going to be working at the same time, but we will be able to see what we're saying and, you know, so and so said this, that, that, that, that's a cool, you know. If it's in the, if it's in the, that's got to be a question. Yeah, we need to think through that a little bit, Because that really limits the scope of who can work on this? No, it works session. It's just him and I. I think it depends. And I kind of raised that question to the director of IT and Shannon Bowen said came at some point I think to the previous commission and spoke about the process of office 365. So eventually the plan is that all staff will in our server things will be migrated 365 and then CCB certainly at least council and Thank you mission will have that access as well I tease in the process of rolling that out. I'm trying to you know get Commissioner Feber and and humbock kind of ahead of the queue a little bit to get them a little earlier access to that But you all all will have it. So using it for the bylaws, it might be a little like should be available. I'm not sure the time on that. I did raise a question as far as synchronous communication. And Shannon's I think opinion was probably not, certainly with just two commissioners, it wouldn't be running that issue so if it was the subcommittee You know two two folks two commissioners could meet regardless Yeah, that's what I wanted to raise So you could but I think depending on And it would be subject to I think probably the ultimate being of the talent turning but his opinion was it wouldn't it Couldn't it wouldn't necessarily be violation of that, but if to have more than two making a comment on it. But the other thing that we, that it would also serve for us is if it was in a, um, in a town owned server that this was happening, it could still be foiled. So it's not that it's, if there are questions, it's still a public document and it's still available or it could be posted. So I think you're maybe alleviating some of it by accomplishing that. Okay. I just wanted to be one more. I'm more full of that. Yeah, director. Yeah. Just one thing to add. So our IT director has also said that we should be operational with the Microsoft teams in about a month. So it's not too far off in terms of time, right? Okay. I think one thing for us to think about though is this asynchronous piece, it's not a chapter. We're not both, three of us are not talking at the same time. So that's, we need to think about that as differently. We're just etching something on a piece of stone and then walking away. Somebody else might come and see that. As long as we have somebody legal looking at that. I think that's how I'll put an operational document together to find all those things. Happy to. Yeah, you know, I'm going, right? It's like a requirements document. It's an operational doc that says, these are the things that happen to find it. that's looked at by the attorney's stamp off and that's how well that's our SOP at that point because we have yeah, yeah, because this is gonna be in my mind should be used for Not even just this commission but for others too. Yeah, yeah, so Okay, I'll take care of that Anyway So yeah toolset Track changes and centralized centralized information. So I think by the time we meet next, what we'll do is we'll assign kind of out all these things here and have deeper discussions. I have a little bit more meat ready to go, but for now that's the process. But for me, I'll introduce what he's going to walk through. Okay. We're even addressing page 50. Go ahead. Okay. Well page 50 is kind of a continuation of the same discussion with the conference plan edits and use them track changes. We already talked about that. But I also included on page 51 an example where we could use exhibits to present a case study that's a little bit more complex than just a word change in the document. And so you would put the page number, the item number, you know, like the items. So the third item is actually the table that I'll be talking about. The land use comparison table is the second item. And so the page number, the item number, what the item is, what the subject, who's assigned to and what the date would be. And then there's a bunch of merge cells here. This is an Excel, is what I use. And you can put that in there and just have comments and so on. So that you can then include more pages to show the parcels that might be involved or a photo so you can send the comprehensive document for that topic and get some feedback. And other people could add more parcels, such as when I talked to Ron, and I updated that. First example to include the more parcels that go all the way to the church. So that's an example of how that can be used. So it serves its purpose by showing what you had in mind, what you thought was addressing the issue and then more people can attend to that topic and make their comments as well. So it's more than just a edit in a word document, we're actually editing the comprehensive plan as a whole. Okay, so that's it on the edits. The next section is the new Future Land Use map. And when I first showed this to Ron, he said, ah, this ought to be fun. I'm not quite sure what he meant, but I'm having fun with it. And I think it's important. I think it's important. When I was going to ask my lucky haul, two people along the conversation. Well, when I went back to the last slide, you said, now and there is an example of where the planning map and the zoning map were not in compliance. And so there are a number of those that I pulled together when we were going to do this meeting a month ago. And then I realized this map has a lot of issues this planning map does. And so I said, well, let's just start from scratch, re-address the planning map as it applies to our effort here. And that's what this is. And so let me just go through and to be clear when you say planning. Yes I'm going to the copper hints to be clear on the next slide. Okay so the presentation. Next slide. So this is this is the introduction I'm I'm going to update the future land use plan map to align with the official proposed 2025 official zoning map. Let me look up on the screen. So that's what I'm going to align the zoning map to the planning map or the planning map to the zoning map, how you ever want to look at that. So the idea is to develop a method. I think it'll make things simpler. Let me just continue. So develop a land use to do this. We need to develop a land use category comparison table, which I'll show you pretty soon. And then build a new map showing the land use categories as they apply throughout the town. And then I want to reassess the application of these categories to the focus areas or overlay districts. And then I want to reassess the application of these categories to the focus areas or overlay districts and Then define the this you know the the the only thing that we really have going on are taking place in the overlay districts or the focus areas If you're talking about the planning map and everything else is residential primarily and is spoken for so I want to redefine how we look at residential and I'm going to spend the next few slides talking about the residential and then talk about the focus areas. So with respect to the residential, we define I'm going to define the suburban single-family dwellings as those areas that are governed by an HOA. And then I'm going to define the traditional as dwellings that are not governed by the HOA. It's that simple. And then show historical parcels and buildable they can land. Buildable has defined by the zoning ordinance that it falls under. Next slide. Okay, so the table is next, the next slide, but in your deck, but I moved this ahead of it just so I could talk to the comprehensive, the 23 comprehensive plan existing categories are on the left. And then I use the categories in the proposed 25 official zoning map on the right hand side. And then I divided the current mixed-use neighborhood scale item for for on the table and I split it or divided it so that one addresses town and the other addresses downtown. So the only thing that I've done different than what's currently in the zoning ordinance or in the plan is I split that mixed use neighborhood scale to address downtown and to address town and I'll show you why I did that when we get there. And then I compared the existing applicable zoning districts to the proposed zoning map districts. Okay, so next table, next page. So this is where this table is what I call a high bid chart. There's a lot going on there. But primarily just think of the right hand column is what is being proposed. The left hand column is what you would see in the plan currently. And we have the parks and wrecks up at the top. No change has the same. And then the agricultural tourist, that's no change there either. It's the layer of the map. We'll just add those to the new map. Think of the new map as just the blank, first of all, map with a bunch of parcelsels and this is the layers of the map as they get colored in as we proceed. So far we got all the green at the top. Then for the new way of addressing the residents, I have single family detached traditional. the most complex, if you will, in that for each parcel I want to look at the age of the property. If it's traditional it generally is going to be an older house. There's a regulation for historical properties. If they're going to be contributing historical properties they should be 50 years or older so because we do this annually we update this plan we can we can maintain this to be just that so for this year 1975 and older would be in tan anything new than that would be in light yellow or you can see the color there. And then if it's historic it would not be that exactly like that but it would show you a highlight for those properties that are not only older than 75 but are actually historical contributing properties and they'll have a different designation So every parcel will be identified how old it is and whether it's actually contributing and I think we can do away with the historical properties overlay district that way and Actually identify each parcel as it is and then the next one is a single family attached or suburban. And again, that's with the HOA, using HOA as the driver. And it'll be bright yellow HOA. And then single family attached. The color there, as you see, for the zoning documents, kind of a darker brown tan single family attached. And those also fall into HOAs, the single family attached. And you'll notice off to the, on left of those you can see the R8 applies in both cases. The single family traditional had the R3A that doesn't show up anymore. It's just the R2 and R3. So I'm keeping track of the applicable zoning districts as we go. But that's just for the residential. And then finally, the multifamily orange is pretty much the same on both sides. But it shows the R15 to include, it might be included at townhouse style. We could talk about that later. I'm bringing these things up for discussion. And then the next one is the new item. It's the downtown mixed use neighborhood scale. And the reason I'm saying that when this new is because it's really only addressing C4. And what we used to have from mixed use neighborhood scale, which is number seven, shows that we had R3, R3, R8, MCE, C1, C4. So I say we keep that for areas other than the downtown application. And even in downtown, there's some neighborhood scale town versions like Longhatch. We'll talk about that. Then after that is the commercial neighborhood scale and pretty much no changes on that and then also the on number nine, that's actually should say medium, it's commercial medium scale. And you can see the color change, but pretty much everything is the same there. And then the professional office and industrial business and that includes both the light industrial and the service. And then finally there's the government institutional. So that's the high bid chart there. But it's important to understand the color scheme of the map and our approach to filling in the map as we go. So next one, next slide. Is anybody on the commission column one? Second? All right. No. Did everybody learn? Okay. Are you? I am sure. Very late. I am pretty. Yeah, that's why I figured this. Okay, so the plan, I'm seeing this as a scatter map. Right? In that condition. Right? That's what I'm seeing is this, these colors are going to mean these things on that map. Yes. Okay. Are you in the process already doing that? And but there'll be the planning map version. I understand it's a planning map. Yes. I understand. Yes. I'm hoping it's like 10 times bigger than that so that we can actually do it. And I think it'll be easy to read. I think it'll be easier to read. There's less overlays. We'll leave that. Okay, sorry. I just want to make sure that was clear to everyone. Why must be slow? Because I think everybody else knows. All right. Okay. All right. So we're past the hard part really. The high bit chart. So now we're just going to talk about the map. How soon we have this? We're going to talk about. Oh, okay. Sorry. I'm reading ahead in the book. I'm on the way. As a lot. Sorry. I'll shut up. Pull it on this. Go ahead. But so defining the map design. And that's the first thing I want to do is to make things easier, I want to actually change the design of the planning map. I want to use a grid system. Back in the old days when you have a map of Montana, you get the letters across the top and the numbers down the side and then you've got a key view over there to see if you want to be in buildings or a hell of another harbor or where you want to be. And so I want to do the same thing. So if you have an HOA you can see where on the map it is and you can see the name of the HOA, the index number and and so there's a lot of yellow bright yellow which is our suburban which represents a lot of our town and and each of those will be labeled accordingly. So that's the map design I want to do. And then also have some street names on there, but not all the streets because I guess way too crowded. So I'm thinking, I don't know, I'm open for ideas, but I was just thinking the emergency snow route might be a few of the main streets streets that you want to put on the map just for orientation sake. And then for the map content, so we'll use the, all of these have the same subheading which is update the future land use map to align with the proposed 25, 2025 official map. So we're gonna start off by stealing the layers from different places. The first layer is gonna be the parks and open and open space Map layer just like it is on the planning map now and it's the green. It's the green layer for all the parks. Okay and so we're just going to copy and paste that. We being fortunately Kendall's eager to help on this and she's already starting and then the zoning map for all the layers will provide the rest of the layers, but that's going to be the first layer. The next layer will be for the single family detached suburban, and then we already explained using the HOA for that, and then each single family attached. traditional is the next one. This one is single family detached and attached. So attached is like a townhouse, and then multi-family, which is apartments. So those are the colors, and that's what we'll be on there. Next slide. So this side shows the traditional. And it, as we've discussed before, shows housing districts. So not only are they older houses, but some of them, like Dylan's, Dylan district subdivision and Hoops and Twin Oaks farm. There's a few of them around and those can be outlined as well. There can be a index for that, the little box and a number and you can go over on the key and see where the Dillon district is and you can see this street there and the tan houses and the pale yellow if there's any that are newer than 50 years. And hopefully a lot of the stars, which are the historical properties, which would be white, would be a white parcel with a gold star right in the center of it. So that would be the gold star parcel. And then so this highlighting this highlighting would would so each year you update this. So the tan will promulgate as the years go on. And then so when we're done with this, this will replace the requirement for a historical property overlay, because everything is counted for. And the properties not included in the subdivision will be highlighted, but they won't be indexed. It's just too busy. So there are some parcels like my own that might not be in a district, but it'll be on the map. Hopefully with the old stuff. Next one. All right, and then this is the real meat of this. It's nice to get the residential stuff out of the way and taking care of, but the real focus is on the focus areas, which are also exactly the same as the overlay districts in the zoning map. And so what I want to do is color the focus areas with the same heavy thick hashmark colored line as the overlay districts. They should be the same. And then also have the same sub areas using an outline that's medium thickness just like in the sub areas on the zoning map. And that the map for the planning map under the focus area should match the sub areas for the overlay districts in the zoning map. Does everybody follow me on that idea? And then without color right now so far this is without color because I want to go we'll talk about that in the next slide. But the historical corridor overlay district, what I'm thinking about there for the planning man, this is where I'm departing from the zoning man. And I want to show a pattern for those parcels along Main Street that are in the overlay, historical overlay district. Because I think that that's really the subject matter we want to address. And those houses between the gun shop and the print shop along Main Street are in a transition area on both sides of that street, Main Street. And we may want to in that overlay district at a different land use category. And then finally, don't show the historical corridor overlay in any of the other areas of town like the Berlin Turnpike or 32nd Street or Carso on just And I really just want to focus on the main street. Next slide. So then finally, for vacant land, I want to show in white, because we've used all the colors in the rainbow. So we'll make white those lots that are vacant and seems appropriate. A blank lot, if you will. And then that is also buildable according to the zone for which it belongs. So the size of the lot, the street frontage width and the setbacks all have to comply in order for that to be considered a buildable lot. And then show the properties in black for the non-residential lots. That's what I'm saying. So white for residential vacant lots, which I think there's about three of them out there and then black for the non-residential lots and then the zoning map layers will remain the same for the institutional and government that like blue will show up everywhere and then architectural tourism commercial that layer will be taken to suck it is and the floodplain that overlay will be in there just like it is as well. And then for the to answer your question, the schedule will be provided at the next meeting because we need to discuss this some more amongst staff and ourselves. But what I really want to do is be able to direct staff to help and they've already started like I said to do this and they have a guy working just on the historical properties and these identified list of those that are contributing. So we have a little gold stars that we can apply and so on. So we're already, I think, capable of doing this map, but I kind of want an idea how I'm going to take. But the real deliberation is going to be in the focus areas where we take and reassess exactly what we want in those focus areas. The idea is, and let me just give a little background here, where I'm coming from, as I was on the original Tourette since 2006 was the first one, and continuing on. And I'm actually in the plan document and a couple of shots, pictures. But, and I got the supporting documents. There's 500 pages of supporting documents where the community went through and said, little stickers, I want this to be mixed to use neighbor whether they want this being on and so on. And I even found one of my comments that I own a page one said her 277. I just wanted my comments had to do with R38, by the way. But so, the idea of what we had in so the idea of what we had in mind for the planning map back then was that the planning map was up here and the zoning map is down here and the planning map explains the kinds of things you can have there and the zoning map tells you exactly, those zoning districts are available. So if you're under the envelope of a zoning map land use category that includes your zoning district and another zoning district that you'd rather be, but they're both under the same land use category. Changing or requesting rezoning from one to the other shouldn't be an act of Congress. Like it is if you're to go outside of that envelope. There should be some, and that's part of the reason I joined the commission is I had to rezone my own property and it took about two years of my time to learn how to do all the software and do all the research and build everything and present it and go through everything. And it actually took me two tries and I thought this could be simplified. But we need to take advantage of the map. The planning map has a purpose And I think it should satisfy that purpose and people should be able to see what they're buying when they buy property in person. And know what that means. And if they have, if the plan for that property falls underneath the planned use category, and it's not what they have now, they can see, well, I could rezone to this and it should be acceptable because that's what we mean by that that overlaid, you know, that focus area or that land use category, that this is what we're looking for is that kind of thing. So it's almost everything under need, the planning land use category should be by right. There shouldn't be any SEPs that you need an SEP to exist under that land use category. So I would like to see, I would like to see us make that happen. It's kind of where I'm going. So that's why I'm taking this initiative. And you have another slide. All right, so I got comments back from Ed, you know, prior commissioner or prior chair, Vice Chair Ed D. Him. And thank you, Madam Diode. So, when we were watching, I do appreciate his comments. And so, I wanted to address each of them. Now that you've been through this, you'll understand what he's saying and what my responses for each of those. And I want to read through these it won't take too long I promise Yeah, we're starting to get that we all turn to pumpkins at 8 and 8 30 and we haven't got to the annual review and it's It's a whole lot of pages in five minutes. Well, I'm wondering if we should consider pushing this to our next meeting, 11b, a table until next time. And just get this finished. I want to hear. I want to hear. This, the, I think staff would be fine with that. We, we had proposed this on the, because it was discussed, the annual review had already been conducted. So this, this trapped in here was already presented and approved by the Planning Commission and sent to the Tont Council. It was in cool, and it might be appropriate actually that this is part of the next agenda because the purpose that it was a discussion on here was to re-by-way essentially the work plan, which we said earlier would, we would recommend be part of the next meeting as well to set your priorities. The Conplan Annual Review is really a status report of where we are as town, a get held against what the Complan has set out. So, and not all of those are planning commission items, but so this was I think in our mind a bit of information, here's material that we'll need to work with, which again we anticipate will also be a subject of an item at the next meeting, which would be the work plan updates. Yeah, I do want to see 11 be again. Okay. And the reason I do is because I pushed off my comments on the traffic study that came out from Western London Rec Center. Because I spent some time on that and I have some concerns. Okay, so I don't want this to go away and I'll just hold on to this until we bring this up at our next meeting. So if you could just continue. Okay. I'm afraid we're not going to have too much time to give you some feedback. So I'll do a readers' ideas first. Okay. Okay. If you read the first bullet, it talks about leading off with the zoning map, you can read that bullet and I'll just leave reading yourself. And my response is he says, you and he found an error in it. And I'm saying if there are errors, we should fix all social housing about that. And the next bullet, the future map should result should, for the second bullet, I'm saying this new map should be developed with the planning commission work sessions and public comment and in communication with the VMS or other planning commission work plans. So we want to make this public and amongst ourselves, I don't want to update this map, this build this new map and the hacking so that the plan actually does lead us in the concur with the zoning map. And then the final comment about the suburban style. I'm saying any subdivisions, he was thinking that some of the HOAs may have graduated or they're not HOAs anymore. And I'm saying, well, if that's the case, like maybe the country club might be one of those that will do it on a case-by-case basis to turn. There is still a subdivision. The subdivision will still say country club. It just isn't governed by an HOA anymore. And in a case by case basis, we would determine whether that's traditional and goes into the tan and historical intruding area or remains suburban. We'll do that in a case by case, as those fall out of a HWA category. But most of them, that's the only one that I think Jordan could think of anyway, that falls outside of an HWA that used to be an HWA. Okay, the next one, next page. I'm not reading his comments, I'm just reading my responses. But for the first bullet, I agree with that. And for the next bullet, it says qualified structures. What, this is in terms of historical, what does a qualified parcel include? And then I agree with that as well. And we have on staff somebody that's identifying not only what's qualifying, but what's contributing for our historical. and then, separately colored parcels for 50 years, that might be confusing. I think I disagree with that. I think the colors will blend nicely and you'll see things progress as we group them and discuss them. So next slide. Sorry Ed, if I'm not doing this justice, I should probably read each bullet, but we're in a time crunch, so I'm doing it this way. So, the next... So, this is where I address only the historical corridor on Main Street and so that's why I'm not including the Berlin Turnpike, etc. Because it's liable to only require our attention in the long Main Street. and then the last bullet is all this map is in review for the focus areas. The focus areas. The focus areas aren't gonna be colored in initially because we wanna talk about what the overlay, what the colors will be for the land use category. So it'll all be white at first. So if there's some vacant lots in there that are commercial, it would be good to know as we're making our considerations. And if they were white, you wouldn't be able to see them during that process. So it's kind of a timing thing. That's why I want the commercial properties that are vacant to be in black. I can take more time to go through this, but I just just put this quick for your suggestive code. Like I said, is that what you want? So I'm done. Well, currently I'm kind of feeling like this is outside the scope of what we talked about. So I need to study this a little bit more. One thing I don't like is to see my name and vein when I don't remember what date the hell that was, that comment was made because I talked to Ed from time to time. I asked Ed if he'd want me to use that. Again, I need to study this a lot more. How much work is the staff put into this so far? None. Okay, good. Do you have a clear idea of what's being asked is here? Somewhat. Again, this is Mr. Hombox. Mr. Hombox proposal. We've met with him a few times just to talk about through ideas and give some feedback, but we haven't really put any research analysis work into this. Okay. Yeah. If I could picture this at least from the standpoint of a sample, some small sampling of a a focus area, for example, or a combined HOA and a traditional small area that could be somehow translated using that interactive map that you showed where you can blow it up and see things a little closer. Again, just as a sampling to get some understanding, a clear understanding of what Mr. Humbach's trying to get to. But again, I can't assign you to go do anything about getting approval of that to do it. But there's so much here. I think we're trying to eat a really big elephant all of a sudden. I'm concerned about that. So I really need to look at this a little bit more. Because I'm not hearing that you snap and have this, what's being asked. You know, I see a little bit of confused about what this is and how this would look. Go ahead. I mean, I don't know that what's being proposed is that we would do this. My understanding of what's been presented is that these are some of the considerations that the subcommittee is looking at and that the commission would look at. If there are text boys that we can assist, like the mapping, that wouldn't necessarily be a piece, but it would depend on our involvement or how much time we would depend on how much you're willing to receive. OK, all right, great. So what I'd like to have done for the subcommittee is if you two could get together and just take a snippet of a map and do some coloring on it. And use that as one of these examples that you just presented. I don't care if it's an overlay, I don't care which one you pick. Okay. And show us what we have compared to what your vision is. So we can get up inside your head and understand it. Does that make sense when I I'm asking you? You put a lot of stuff on us here with these you know with these sheets and all And it's going a lot further than I think I expected I'm not saying it's wrong I'm just saying it's in your head. I'd like to get it out of your head and a piece that we can consume well and and champion you in this process I hear you you. Okay. Because I can't right now. Okay. The advent of today's electronics, however, allows us to do these maps and layers. Some of that will be done throughout the town easier than to break it up into a little piece. And so we could put the layers in there where they apply and then do the examples where we have to identify individual parcels for historical, for instance. So we could zero in on a map, but a good portion of that will be done in one fell swoop across the town, that's all I'm saying. So I can produce some app and then have the focus on a couple of areas that show exactly what I'm talking about. Yeah, I'm looking for a mockup. Yeah, that's what I'm looking for. That's why I'm just saying, okay, that's the approach I would tell you. Okay. So it'll be done quickly. And and that's why I was going to say next next time meet, I'll have that and then we can talk about this. Okay. Okay. Forgetting this stuff. Okay. Okay. I knew this was gonna be a lot to swallow. Okay. That's all right. That's good. I hope I didn't. No, no, that was fine. That was fine. I'm trying to help you help us. I don't have a question and I might have a comment. You're good to follow up. I think my understanding is the town council, they want us to do a five year update. But there's nothing that I'm aware of that defines what the scope of that five-year update is supposed to look like. Is that correct? And it's up to us to basically determine what that, that was the request room the council was to determine what the scope was. I guess my follow-up on it would be maybe because I agree, like this is a lot to digest with. Would it be worth spending a couple minutes talking about what the scope of just very high level what a five-year update should potentially look like and maybe comparison to other jurisdictions like the understanding just from loud and using that as an example. You know they're 10-year update they're looking at the entire county holistically. And the the five year update, they're looking at just very specific corridors of where there's been either further discussions or there's been changes that maybe have precipitated in the in within those five years that weren't further analysis. So to me I guess when I hear five year update, my thought would be that that's a very small scope that is not a holistic review of the entire comp plan which seems to be I guess in some ways what this is and I think there's there's some good ideas here but I don't know maybe it'd be worth before we kind of set off a subcommittee talking as a commission what we think that the overall approach and how deep this should go to provide direction to the subcommittee. Is that kind of where you're going a little bit, Mr. Reyes? Yeah, I think so. When I go back, when I go back and look at the town councils, yeah, resolution. Okay, it says, directs the town of Perval Plain Commission to deliberate and determine any changes needed in towns, companies and plan and to recommend all resulting amendments to the town council. Now, that being said, what the amendments I knew that we hadn't hand were, was about 18 of these these in here. Okay. Were the amendments that we would consider to look at. Now I think what's happening is one or some of these are maybe sprouting into a much larger scope based on what Mr. Humbuck's talking about. And on which one it is, and that's why I like to always work. And this is number one, this is number two, this is number three, number four, and what he's suggesting is number four along with five, six, or seven. This is going to solve, we're put those five amendments or those one amendments into into some sort of condition of being considered and given to the town council Okay, but Right now what he presented it appears much larger than Again, I'm just asking for some kind of mockup and to see where they fit into these. That's all. All right. The table was the table. And then the map on the next two is there. Yeah. So we can do a mockup and then tie those together. Then I think we'd be better off. And then that would take us to the next step and then we need to chuck it out to finish it off. I think we'll go through the way that I talked about this in the first. The same about it as the baby one in case two. Phase one is right here. Right. We're pulling on some threads with a couple of these pieces here. This is exactly what I'm looking at. Not a technical side yet, but... I think we're going to add these up. Yes, when I look at that, right? And then I look at these 20 or 30 slides, that blossomed in the next two. I think it turned a page and looked at it. Okay, that's okay. So anyway, what I'm doing is I'm gonna get all of this in a centralized place. And there's gonna be kind of ancillary at times that our group, I'm saying that a rally one, there might be looking at other things that may, what's the answer back to that? So let's do that. So I don't think we're ready to ask for any work out there. Can I try that? OK. I don't see it. Well, is another words, Candle's going to stop? Is that going to help? Build this example. I'm sorry, I didn't hear that. Well right now Kendall is helping build this exam. Okay. And so you are saying that. What's the little of urgency and distance? Too much. Yeah, well, the data, like I met with PJ, the guy he just updated our historic survey. He just evaluated all the contributing properties. So we just got that data used. Yes, too many. So I just have to put that in our GIS. Besides that, we should have everything else I think. Yeah, so it's like- To me, it's not a priority though, with the other priorities you got to go on on. You know, it's got to be careful. What Kendall is describing is we have that, we just, what Mr. Hamill was describing with the historic properties, the intern that has been working with us, PJ, has completed that. So we have that layer. So putting those layers together as commissioner Halmock mentioned is not very savantensive Someone who knows how to work the jio system this matter just Selecting the layers and and depicting it and we have the other layers So it would be as much work to do a portion of the map is the entire map. That's what I'm saying. Director. Sure. Just to be clear, I'm hearing two very separate conversations, maybe about this. One is in response to the work of the committee as it stands to produce the map. And so on. The other was what, Mr. and Davis is talking about to sort of step back and talk about a scope of work. So I have a lot of thoughts, which I will not share. I know. But I would suggest maybe the committee meet with staff and like we met last week and talk about these two very separate things and scope it out. Because the The Council resolution was simply restatement of the code of Virginia language and you needed the side as Commissioner Davis of the scope of work in general and make an intentional statement. These 20 amendments are going to be phase one, right, or, or, et cetera. I think you know we're going with that. So we can, I think a task of the committee should be to look at the scoop work. So I think that's a great idea. So I want the committee, you two, to meet with the director at her convenience. Okay. And yours. Yeah, and Kendall. Okay. To get this lined out. Our next meeting is supposed to be on the 3rd of April. I think that's way too soon from the standpoint of getting this, getting the answer to this. We're supposed to have an initial agenda by Monday. So with us all here and I've got work to do too and let, and I don't see this as, you know, critical business for the commission right now. So we need to get this work done. So I'm going to suggest that we don't need a meeting on the third and the next time we meet is once our next one April, appointment director unless that unless the town has something that's coming before us that we need that we need to hear. Just two considerations. One is I did want PJ or intern to give you a presentation on his work regarding this work survey. So that could happen anytime in April. I think he's going to intern with us through the summer. So I'm just saying it might be better to have that information sooner rather than later. The other is that April 17 is during Holy Week spring break. So I was just going to put that on your radar to see if you'd want to change that meeting regarding vacation times or Holy Week or that kind of. It's the Holy Thursday, if that would matter to us. Oh yeah, away from the third. Monty Thursday, so you know, just wanted to alert you. Yeah, what do we have on the day right now? Yeah, it was the 17th and that's why I was saying, let's remove the 7th. Our next meeting will be on the 17th. Unless I can look with anyone's holy schedule. All that's good. Chair? Chair? Yes. I also suggest that as a sort of a guiding objective in going through these amendments that the subcommittee and then later the planning commission go through them and package them up with a view toward having similar issues put together and that way when they go before the town council, town council is looking at a collection of related issues. It's all about it. Okay. Perfect. The coalition of that, what is the general theme? You guys are gonna get together, right? Okay. Next meeting says April 3rd. I'm saying we don't need that meeting and I I think that April 17th ought to move. Would you say the 24th? Yeah, the 24th. And I think if we can do that, we might be able to get our act together and include and get a little more downrange on the bylaws too and have a good meeting for that. Now, the commission's always available if something comes up. If we've got a development application, something for a citizen, let us know, and we'll get together, okay? They always come first. Okay so so item 12 we're in agreement I don't need to have a motion do I think we there's anybody opposed to this sitting up here anybody. Okay so under agreement our next meeting is going to be April the 24th. Okay, 2025. Okay, I'm getting nods from the audience. Just to confirm so, so then we're calling to cancel the regular schedule meetings of April 3rd and 17th. Yes. But the 24th will still be a regular meeting. Does it have to be a special meeting? It'll be like the agenda title will say special meeting just because it wasn't on the Annual calendar, but okay, we'll all right post it the same way, okay, all right But we'll go through our same steps for our agenda process Development based on that date. Okay, we're all good. All right. If that's it, anybody else? Okay. Can I get a motion to adjourn? I move to adjourn this meeting of the Percival Planning Commission. Can I get a second? Second. All in favor. Aye. Greetings, adjourn. Thank you. Thank you.