One that is now 537, we're a little late getting our meeting started. So we're ready now if you would join us with the Pledge of Allegiance. I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivis will, but liberty and justice for all. Do we have anyone who would like to offer an opening prayer? If not, we'll have just a moment of silence. Thank you. Madam clerk. Mayor Green. Here. Vice Mayor Inzki. Here. Councilman Lehman. Here. Councilwoman Hanchar. I'm here. Dan Smith, finance officer. Here. John McLean, finance officer. Here. Shonda McLean, finance officer. Here. Chad Ward, public works manager. Here. G. Scagley-On. Here. Captain Bragg. Present. Ron Brown, community development supervisor. Here. Julie Denowsky, records clerk. OK. City Attorney Andrew Han. I'm here. The agenda for this meeting was posted on the city's website, City Hall Bulletin Board on Tuesday, August 27, 2024. Is there anyone in the audience who would like to address their workshop meeting at this time? Seeing no one, Manny, do we have anyone signed up? No, sir. Okay. We'll move on to board reports. Do we have any board reports? No sir, we do not. Okay. We'll move on to item number four, regular agenda, fire and police pension board of trustees appointments. I'm sorry mayor. Number three. Judy did send us a report but she was not able to be here tonight to present the report. But it is on record if anyone wants to see it or get a copy of it. Okay. Thank you. Thank you. Madam Clerk. Do you want to who wants to address for a? I will sir. All right. So we currently have a firefighter, police officer, Pinchamor to trustee's vacancy. Ron McAndree had to resign due to health reasons. And his wife, Lynn, has actually submitted an application to replace his position on the board, which would leave just one vacancy, resident position vacancy. So she has lent as far as her application, her background. She's been a city resident for 23 years. She is a former city council member. She's a registered retired nurse, a retired registered nurse in a former bookkeeper. And her application is in the backup folder. If you would like to take a look at that, actually I actually attached here. So we can put this if you're okay with this to point her to a two year or three year term, a two year term on that board at your meeting next week. Any discussion? I appreciate her standing up to volunteer. Yes, I think we're actually unanimous that we tickle the death that Lynn is willing to step up and serve on this board, Mandy. Okay. Y'all good with consent? Yes. Okay. board, Mandy. Okay, we can move on to item number five, staff agenda items, 5A Community Development Supervisor, Ron Brown, DCBA Music Festival, alcohol waiver, and Ron, we'd like to offer our congratulations to you for joining our team and Dunnellan. We're very happy you're here and we look forward to everything you bring to our community. Thank you. Having fun so far. We're glad to have you, miss, sir. You can believe that. You're probably great. All right. All right. Thank you, Mr. Mayor. I was okay. Yes, sir. Go ahead. Mr. Mayor, I'm still in my training wheels right now, so make sure I'm on top of things. The Chamber Commerce has requested permission to serve alcohol beverages on the street. There's a map that was attached, has the Council had a chance to review that map. Yes. So part of that map for the Chamber of Commerce, they want to weigh the City Coal Section 6-4 possession or consumption of public consumption on public property or on private property without permission. So it has between hours of 5 and 10 p.m. on October 12, 2024. Has the council heading discussion on that? Did you have any questions for me from what probably are to present it to you or anything I can research and talk to you on? I think this year they're kind of changing how it's going to be taking place if I'm not mistaken. No, we went through all that. It's pretty much going to be the same as it was before, mostly. That's okay. So we'll set Tim up here. I'm getting miscommunication because I heard it was one way. Now it's... It was like four ways, actually. So what have we all finally decided to do? Chief it or not? I think what we decided on is the Chambers asked to have, I think, three beer gardens. And the allowances for the beer gardens and that whatever property it's on, like exit realty, bad cock and then Ernie Mills. The alcohol is for those locations only. They cannot walk in between, down the sidewalks. So the very answer, whatever, would be just for those properties. Has there been a problem with it before? Because I mean, I've always volunteered at the bad cop beer booth. I know that shocking, right? And in all the years, I've never had an issue with, I've never, the place in there has said that there was an issue between the locations. I can understand crossing the street with a beer, but I guess between the music, I guess is my last thing. If you look at any other Location that has these any other city that has these when they have these types of events roads are shut down There's no traffic. Everything is separated from the traffic So that's what we're trying to do this year is keep it separated the best we can from traffic and keep the people and you know the pedestrian and vehicles safe from just people walking. And plus, it makes it very difficult for law enforcement to enforce anything out there when people are just walking everywhere without a call. And I guess my only thing is again, because this has always been a, from point A to point B, on both sides of each road. And that's what everybody is going to be used to. I mean, that's been the norm. This time here, it's gonna be like a beer garden type thing. In that area, it's gonna be roped off like when you go to the fairs or something. Okay, so that's how to say you can drink here, but there's gonna be ropes so that when the exit is gonna state no alcohol past this point type. Okay, so I just I just I'm just trying to make sure that we're courteous to those that have been used to not on purpose ignoring it, but you know some some grace given for like hey guys This isn't how we're gonna do it this year, you know, take it back to where you got it from. So that's that's what I guess I'm there to say is for Scorace. I guess we have a little bit of concern over just the people not wanting to comply. So the chamber has a little bit of, no, I'm taking my beer, I'm going here, I'm going there. They're a little worried for their volunteers. But they'll have our numbers, we're not out to put everybody in jail, we're just trying to keep everybody, the pedestrians, drivers. And the chainers, very happy with this resolution. Just putting it, but Judy's not here. It's always a good thing. Thank you. We had a meeting. We sat over here. So if I'm having my cup, are we going to have it looked at? If I'm walking in. It might be sample. I would be, you know, and we have little sniffer flashlights that will take the field to come to the straw. I mean, I'm just trying to, I'm trying to think about people are going to. It's right, but it's not going to be what it's going to be as it'll be. The alcohol will be served in a container that they come in. There will be no red cups, there'll be none of that kind of stuff. That's fine. So it's just like at any other time. And there's no outside alcohol. Right. There's no public walking around consumption. Okay, that's fine. I was just trying to think of things that I know people will ask me. And we've been working really close with the chamber and that's the way I want to keep it, keep the conversations going. So chief there's going to be three or four beer gardens, three. And the three of them are going to be at the exit, want to be at exit, want to be at Babcock and want to be at... Ernie Mills. Ernie Mills. Right, the same set of, we see them for us. No different. Yeah, I just wanted to... Yeah. Because there was the other band right across the street from Goldford Donuts, right? Yes. So you're going to use the one there for both of them? No, it's going to be the same setup, like what you and I set up last year. Goldford Donuts did not have a beer thing there. They have a water thing there. But the beer and wine stuff will be just a three-packed cow. Okay, so it's you, I'll probably set it. You got it. One last thing with Babcock closing, are they gonna be able to have electric power because they were using Babcock's power? No, no, no. I'm gonna get a whole Julian ask for them. I think we should check into that. Check with them. We're back here. Anything else, Chief? Nope, that's all. Thank you, Chase. Wrong. If you have anything to add on this, uh, miss that, um, the closure of Boston Street for the food trucks. And that was the only addition to that other than that, I have nothing else to add. Any other questions from council? Concerns? Are we doing a done tank? Don't make those types of suggestions. I've done my job. Actually, it was warmer? October 12th. Thank you. 5 p to 10 p. October 12th. Is the... Okay, what is October 12th? What was the special event that we were expecting? The special event that we were expecting. October 12th. Let's see. The Columbia University. Indigenous people's death. Yes. We can call it that. October 12th. Talk to young Kippur. Saturday, young Kippur. Anything else on this issue? Well, then we'll move on then on the Council agenda. Items F-E-U-A water pressure issue. Who wants to venture into this subject? I think I'll end it up with that one. Well, you can start it out, Tim. I spoke with our FDUA rep, John, last week. We thought we had from three different areas, Vot Springs, the Grenada, and Blue Cove. People have come in at separate times, concerned about their water pressure, or showing this pleasure that there might be an issue with the water pressure. So, John asked his folks to go out. The water pressure at the tower is 43 psi. The typical pressure band for this type of system is between 35 and 45 psi. So, at the water tank, at the water tower, we're at the upper end of nominal water pressure. He explained to me the highest demand times are between 5 and 7 a.m. when a lawn irrigation goes off, folks are taking showers, etc. Everything everybody does get ready for work, school, and whatever else they have going on during their getting ready for the day. The natural is second high demand times are in the evening when people are taking their showers, dishwashers, all that kind of thing. During the high demand times, the high demand times will cause a loss of pressure and flow in some areas, depending on a few factors. Where they're located, elevation lies. Naturally, the whole thing is a gravity system. So it's whatever head pressure is in the water tower. There's a form of a multiply that times the side of the pipe. It goes down and then it goes into the lower pipe. So there's formulas for all that happy stuff. And if you live in an area that's a higher elevation and the water has to climb back uphill, naturally you're going to lose some. If you live in an area where there is more demand, more houses, more whatever in that area during the peak periods, you're going to notice a little bit of, you're going to notice a little bit of, you know, some lack lower pressure and all that. Bottom line to all that gibber and this, the system is operating as designed. And again, this is a, it's operating just as a gravity type system is designed and they know issues with it. It's just, you know, it's not a perfect system. There's pros and cons. It's a cheap system to run. The other type systems where you run high pressure pumps and all that, naturally they get expensive, you get maintenance, you got pumps, you got electricity, you got all that kind of stuff. That's why you see in most areas the water towers and the gravity type systems. So they don't find, they went checking a few places and they can't find anything wrong. So the people who were in here complaining a couple weeks ago, are they on the east side of town? They were all over. That's why I explained to John, it's not like one area come in, know could be located because the the one set of folks were from the Granada the other people about springs and the other peak the other man was from Bluecove. Yeah because the farther you get away from your source you got more friction loss than the pike. Absolutely right and there's there are probably only like four to six inches probably four inch pike. And they choke down depending on where they go and the dogs depends on you know see you got the yeah You got the major header that header is gonna go to the little feed lines those feed lines are gonna go Individual houses and then probably gonna matter the age of The house and the piping and how much crud is a built-up in the pipe and all that kind of stuff Yeah, a lot of variables, you know that But as far as the overall system it's operating operating like it should, like they would expect. And what was our pressure at? 43 psi at the tower. At the top of the top. At the bottom of the tower. At the bottom of the tower, what it does, tower is it uses the weight of the water on the top of the pressure water. That's the entire system. So other than like Tim said, spending a lot of money and putting an high pressure pumping system. There really isn't going to be a lot that they can do unless it gets so bad out there that they decide either put a new pipe in or put an augment, something to augment the system on the other side but then that gives you problems back on this side. Just for a little bit more information, I asked him, we got the new campground that's going in west of town. So you know, there are going to be a couple hundred more people there on the water system. These are that's all been engineered in and everything. The water system should be able to handle it. Yeah, that's going to be about 225 people. Right. How much you, but you know, as Tim has explained it, as you branch out into the neighborhoods, there's several ways that it's naturally constrained. Yes. And then there's more usage in the neighborhoods that are heavily used, but the new facility that's being built on 40 is located right across almost just across the street from the water power. Plus we're not going to do water pressure in a normal house. Yeah, and plus and plus you've got your water pressure as we said, 47 pounds there. So it's not a great deal. It's not going to affect the rest of the system to serve that facility because it's going to be right there at the source of the pressure to start with. So I think that's probably would be one reason to be causing additional issues in the city. Hopefully they're all retired and they'll get up till nine o'clock so they won't be on the bus. No, see, that's the thing is the bottom line too is that you've got whatever main you've got coming out of the water tower. And when you take that total area, then you take the total area inside of each house of every faucet. It's like it's about an eighth of an inch isn't what they use. But when you've got 1,000 eighths of an inch open, there may be so much water coming out that there's not enough water coming down so it slows down. Anyway, so I guess that there really, there are a lot that we can do, there are a lot that we can do because they feel the system is working as designed. Correct. Well, and several years ago before we got some grants to make improvements within the city on Park Avenue and Walnut and some of the other streets, when we went in there, the whole project was based on restoring the water pipelines because at that time we were losing 40% of the water from the well-head at the water tower to the consumers in the system. We are now down to 20% loss. So that's still not exactly, it's still not what we would hope for, but when you've got a system that's over 100 years old and you have been able to modernize it to the point that you have reduced by half the lost water. Imagine where we'd be if we hadn't have done that. We'd still have a lot of water leaking that would never reach the consumer, so there have been improvements made, and those grants were very important and accomplishing that goal. So they mean a lot to our community and every time we can improve the efficiency of our water system and our sewer system that is joined between the city of Dunnell and Rainbow Springs. That equates into savings for the entire community. There are three and the three in the three main people that depend on it. Our businesses, and our citizens, and everybody else that uses it. So the efficiencies of that system mean a great deal to us. If we had to make up the difference without those grants, our water rates would be extremely higher than they are now. I would even venture to say how much it was offset by $5 million worth of grants. Those were very, very important. And we're going to be looking at things in the future too This is an issue that will be coming up and as soon as we get some more valuations done to what we could use Here in our community to enhance our water and sewer system I will be playing close attention to what we can do Just as I did in the past because it it because it affects us all and it helps the vitality of our businesses and everyone involved if we can keep these water and sewer rates down and the only way to do it is through additional efficiency in the system and that's what that's the key so that was the whole premise years ago that I want to continue on as we move forward. I know it's not the perfect system, it's as Tim Demonstrated with his presentation. We're always going to have a problem because it's time for people to need the water. You don't have to buy it until you turn that faucet on and you don't have much pressure. And then it strikes your mind But we are all members of this council. I know we're very much interested in it operating efficiently No doubt about that I just want to say Todd and his wife because we're both the same neighborhood You I know I'll be doing it this year when it cools off, but go on and see if you can see what kind of pipe you've got from your meter into your house. And if you've got an old galvanized pipe, you may want to look at getting that prepared because those are all usually full of crud. And I know I'm going to do it in a my house to find out what it is. So that would be the best suggestion. So. Well, is there any other comments on this? Do you have anything else? No, sir. You want to bring up on the phone? No, I'm good. All right. So we asked that they have any comments or topics? You could if you would. If you would like to. You don't have it. Would you like to say anything? No, you covered it well. I'm sure you're right. I'm sure you're right. I'm sure you're right. I'm sure you're right. I'm sure you're right. I'm sure you're right. I'm sure you're right. I'm sure you're right. I'm sure you're right. I'm sure you're right. I'm sure you're right. I'm sure you're right. I'm sure you're right. I'm sure you're right. Okay, special events. What really drove this one here was all the different iterations. We were going to get council input on the Twin River music festivals. What we were able to work all the issues out. So that's history. But we wanted to, now what we want to just use this particular bullet for is the Christmas Parades coming up. And what we did last year was work with the chamber because the Christmas parade is unlike many of the other events where it's truly a local community event. So we split the costs, we gather up all the costs, put everything together so we knew what the costs were and then we split the costs with the chamber. So this is just kind of a heads up that we still have to get the information, get everything together, all the numbers together for the Christmas parade, and then at the October workshop we'll present the plan and the finances and get council approval for splitting or whatever guidance the council wants to give financially for what we do with the chamber on the Christmas parade. House Minions, can I ask you something since you are the liaison for the chamber? Since we do block the streets off at three o'clock in the afternoon on the Saturday of the parade, would the chamber, because I've been talking with Bandy about it, and according to her, you all can do it, is it offering bending sites where the streets are blocked off. Like, the one closest to my house would be crazy chicks in Grumbles House. There's a barricade put up there. So in places like that, where there's no ready food, could we look at issuing permits to food trucks so that they could dispense food in between the three to seven hours and maybe make a little extra money to offset some of these costs? Certainly. And what I had explained to Councilman Lehmann is that could be done as part of their special event permit, is when they apply for their permit permit if that's part of what they want to do for that event. It has to be within that special permit and there isn't allowance for that in the mobile vending ordinance because currently the food trucks are not allowed on the Easter West Penn only if they're under a special event permit. They wouldn't need to get a separate permit, but it would need to be. They would? They would not need a separate permit. That vendor would not need to get a separate permit. They would fall under the permit of the DCBA if the DCBA wants to include food trucks as part of that event. I was thinking if they wanted to offer it to DCBA members first as an incentive to get people into DCBA because my, what I was trying to find out was if there was a way that the DCBA could do it so that our staff wouldn't have to do say 15 or 20 permits so that they would be able to handle the whole thing. Oh, they would have to go to DCBA. I would have to go underneath the one thing. Oh, it would have to go through DCM. Yeah, it would have to go underneath the one thing. Yes, but that would be right. But everything has changed off as far as we can do MOTs and all that. So we have a lot of different stuff that we got to work out this year. MOT plans are not the same as they were last year. No, I understand. And all that. I understand that probably cost money. I've got it. I'm going to raise some money into allow people to allow. Absolutely. And maybe make it more popular. Mr. Mayor. Got it. Mayor, Councillor Aandrum, did you have a comment on that? Your face says you're dead. I'm just wondering how that would work with the permitting and so forth. That's something I can discuss with Manning to make sure that's not issue. Since I don't know the details of who it sounds like it still kind of works. So surely who trucks me a part of special events permit but some of the details support I just need to discuss with that. Thank you. Any other questions on what? Jim you had one more. So that if the meeting takes place. The median on 45-41. No. I think you can go out there with the public works, guys, once. And see what they're up against when they maintain those islands. It's like Russian roulette when these guys are out there trying to take care of the trees, the bushes, the grass and went through the agreement that we have with F dot on this. And back when there was an agreement, it looks like there was even some grant funds to put in the landscape and all that on those islands. We're also required to maintain them for F dot standards. And I'll give you one like the trees. The trees are now at the point where they need trimmed back and all that because they're not allowed to hang low but the roadway they gotta be 14 feet, lowest branch above everything, et cetera, et cetera. And we just recently received a notice from FDOT that we're not in compliance with all this. So what we would like to counsel to entertain is we notify F. That the city does not want to maintain these islands anymore as per agreement 204-03. the committee. Let me go to the PDF and tell you what this means. Okay. So, notice thereafter, local government should have a period of 30 days within to correct the cited deficiencies. If said deficiencies are not corrected within this time period, the department may terminate the agreement. We've gotten these deficiencies a few times as I've gone back through the records. So if said deficiencies are not corrected within this time period, the department may terminate agreement. In which case, the local government shall add its own expense and within 60 calendar days after written notice by the department which is FDOT remove all of the landscaping that the department directs to be removed and return the right away to its original condition. So we would like to work kind of recommending that we to the council to issue a letter to F dot something along those lines that we would like to have those those islands returned back to the original condition. So we can get out of the maintenance business and the risk of our workers out there. And we go ahead. Well, the original condition is what they are now. They were never not rast and such. They were always like that. Right. Until we hear back from F.Dott, they'll explain to us what it is. The other thing I'm looking at is getting ready to do the road project out there on 41. I'm not sure if F.Dott's doing anything with the islands. I believe it's just a grind and repave. I gotta go back and look at the nose as long as I look at it. I mean, maybe we can do it as a part of that. But would like to at least start communications with FDOT to get us out of the maintenance world and see what they have, what they come back with and tell us what we can, what we can't do, what they want, a type thing. I think it's important to put the ball back in their field, they're the ones that made the objection, and we need further information about exactly what they're objecting to. Well we understand what they're objecting to. Chad do you have any, I don't remember what the details were to you? Yeah, just come back to the tree training and stuff like that can be 14 high and they're starting to grow up and get so big we have to keep them cut so they're not intruding into traffic. And when it wasn't bad before the trees are getting to be hyped now, they're getting limited on means we don't have bucket trucks, we don't have the list So we're using theiders and stuff like that out there. I'm highly aware. Have you had a chance to have a conversation with them about this and the situation our city's in with the lack of equipment to maintain these? No, we didn't. They got a one last time about a tree's mean in front of back and stuff like that. And you can take guys name it. Just told you we're about to end your what we're going to be able to do with the poll saw traffic and everything else. And you don't have the trucks here on the foot down the road. We just show them working ahead and the car's on the lights and close off stuff. We're just staying out there on the edge of that. But before we went any further with F dot we wanted to get council approval council guidance and not just run off on our own When this was set up just let everybody know when I go back through the Through when these islands were put in in the agreements it looked like there was a I remember right a $42,000 grant Okay to put all this in to pay for plants and install the plants and all that. So that's where the city got the grant money to do all of that, did all of that. And that's where the requirement to get that grant money was the city will maintain that per F dot standards. Now back in 2004 when this agreement was made, you know traffic has increased incredibly distracted driving has gone absolutely nuts and I got the opportunity to go out there and check meter numbers, water meter numbers with public works a year ago and it's crazy. That's the thing that we're putting our people out there. We'd whack it and doing all this other stuff. When the state goes out there, it's like Chad just said, they've got markers way ahead. They've got men working signs. They've got people posted. And we just don't have those resources. And at the same time, they're doing both signs that row with the mediums and right-of-ways. I mean, both pages are row. I would think that I would think as a member of the council that I would want some common sense inserted in this and the common sense would be that we are as you said, just like you should have said, we are maxed out as far as equipment we have in order to maintain this to their standards. And we need assistance as to what they require. And we also are very much interested in the safety of the operation of US 41. We're not advocating that either. We want it to be safe. And if they see items that need to be improved To increase the safety of 41 We're in favor of that what we are limited as far as our ability to comply with what they're suggesting and See if you can't get some common sense Remedy out of this because this is a common sense issue I mean it we can only do so much and and I'm sure they have other small cities that they have to deal with too that have this same type problem. And as we're growing expeditiously like we're doing, we're going to be facing more and more of these issues. So Chad, as far as I'm concerned is a member of the council, I would suggest a common sense approach to this and then come back to the council and explain to us what you feel as our public works director we need to do. Is that is that sound reasonable? Yeah, I just want to ask Chad. So what you're saying is right now we are responsible for the median which I understand. But on the swales on the two, the states coming down and maintaining the. Come on, let's do the same on both sides of the road. When you're pricing on aging, we back in the criminal due as we were just maintaining the middle. So would the council, if the state came back and said that they would be willing to do it for a price, would we be willing to pay? No, we don't have to do that. All right, it's their median. They own it. OK, we just went into the agreement that we would do this. There are, we are allowed to get out of the agreement to get out of the agreement, OK? But it's like she said, excuse me, she said it's well, bow or something. She's on I am he I am she There was no it said it would return to the to the the initial state But there was no initial state, right? It's all the communication we would talk to F dot we would open up to communication say hey This is what we got okay basically was you know, what can we do talking? You know, we just talk about each side come up with okay you do this or we'll do that or and then Right right right and then when that comes back if it's on the city that makes sense the city go out rip out the trees and do that Right it was city initiated yeah right right anything we don't know and then at some point we would have to send a letter out changing this agreement that the city is no longer responsible for the islands is back to F dot yeah because that was 20 years ago. So yes, I was on city. I'm trying to remember 20 years ago I was pregnant on the city council. No, that was even longer. But anyway, I was on city council. I'm pretty sure I was back then. And yes, we didn't, that was the main focus is the beautification because we didn't want it just to be a median down along the stretch of road. We wanted, you know, we wanted that charm of a city, and that's why, because we didn't want the median to begin with. Back, I don't know if you remember. Back, I made the move that people could get in and out of the text code school. What was that time text code station? FDOT told me I was was wrong and they went out and measured and they said, oh darn, she was right. So keeping something there that's appealing to the eye and not just the seamen's lab straight down the middle, you know, I don't want that for sure. So hopefully they'll be able to, And again, if they've got the trucks or they've got the equipment already, I'm sure they can go and do themselves. That's what I would hope. Like the Mayor said, common sense. So Council's okay with staff reaching out to FDOT, working this out, bringing back what do you have? Yes, so definitely Chad, just reach out to them and see what we can come up with. Great. We're good. Yep, I think so, that's a good idea. You got anything else to you? No, sir. Definitely got more traffic from 20 years, so 2004. We have, we probably more than double. The record probably would indicate that. And we're going to see even more we're not going to see less seven eight ordinance or our D2024-08 school speed zone enforcement Ron did you want to speak to that? Yes, Ken's obviously happy to speak to the ordinance. I know Captain Bray has spoken to you a number of times about contracts and an ordinance that City needs in order to implement this program. So this is the first step in that, I would study, of course, and other than the period that will follow once the program is implemented where tickets are not issued or no sub violations rather, since these are not uniform traffic citations per se. But essentially this is the ordinance that will create the program. It runs up. When the legislature created the legislation to allow governments to enact this, it's a little bit different than the, some of the other camera legislation that that was enacted. All of the rules and so forth within the state code is they're all parts of different, well one bill but all parts of different sections of statutes and so forth. So essentially what this ordinance does is take those requirements, consolidate them and put them in your code or in the city's code rather to get the program started. Some of the administrative procedures and so forth can be adopted by resolution once the city knows how much it wants to set the fines that accompany the notice of violations. There's a limit and there's a certain range. Again, it's very similar to the red light program, as I've mentioned before. And I sent this to the clerk's office right before I depart for the long weekend. So you'll see a highlighted area. The ordinance is done except for there will need to be a description added into 6695 that highlighted area for any areas where this ordinance will be in effect as of right now just that one school zone area. So if this all looks good to you, I can work with the police department and the city clerk to make sure that's adequately identified within 6695 for it to come back to you first reading. If you have any questions, I'm happy to speak with you. The schools, and I know I drive it every single day multiple times, but I know we have the public schools, but does that include past the Baptist? It will include it. It'll all be one continuous schools. Okay, but it's not right now. I'm sorry? I'm sorry? It's not right now. Yes, it is. It's still the same. I drive it every day multiple times, but do I know? Okay, I just was trying to visualize. It seems like it closed, it stops at power. Yeah, but you'll see where it goes up to the Christian, the Dinole Christian Academy, where there's a sign designating as the school's. Okay, so I'm not. This is just, no. Your kit, sir. This is just for the schools. It doesn't apply to any day carriers like Little Gem. No, sir. Only to the designated schools. Designated actual schools. Yes, sir. Is there going to be one out? Is Dunnell in high school in Dunnell? No, there's another one. No, it's about 80 feet past. OK. And the last question, too, is I saw that you can, you can't, it's my understanding that if you will not, they will not be able to look at the tapes for anything other than the time between the schools on so they can't be used for ongoing surveillance. Correct. We would not, you cannot, by statute, you cannot do any other traffic enforcement with that. Now, if a murderer drove through our town and those cameras picked that up, the current interpretation and Andrew, if you want to provide some guidance, you know, if we picked that up, we could note that, but we would not be doing it for surveillance. Okay. And could case law change that later? Okay. Maybe so. Is that a good analogy or? I think so. And Councilman Betts directly addressed in section 696, 9697 of the ordinance that provides some details on what can be and what cannot be used. I just want to make sure. It does have to be destroyed actually I want to say it I mean the video Were there any other Tim have anything no sir. Okay, very good. Thank you. Thank you counsel We go on to 7b or that's ourD2024 that show 9CRE plan amendments. Thank you Mayor. I think the next two will be mine as well. This is just the ordinance that implements the CRA plan amendments that council wanted to see. And I left the CRA plan alone as much as I could so a lot of the historic information because a lot of it is of course very old I didn't want to make too many changes but you'll see that the community center language is fully taken out and the project list has been updated to account for the new projects and old projects have been removed. Any questions on this one, I'm happy to answer them as well. Valerie? No, sorry. Good, thank you. I'm good, thank you. That's good. You want to do the next one, Andrew? Sure, I'd be happy to. And we're ready for first reading on this, correct? Yes. Are we? Council? Oh, I'm fine. Yes sir. Yeah, we'll move ahead, man. You're right. You're on the record. OK, the next one is ordinance 202410. This is the update to the noise ordinance that complies with some of the recent case law, when I say recent within the last few years, regarding plainly audible and provides more stringent and defensible methods for gathering evidence and ensuring compliance utilizing maximum sound levels and sound meters. So this is just for Council's information at this point. I do anticipate that this ordinance will change. In addition, of course, to any changes that you all want to see, I know that staff wants to make some changes as far as how the procedure would be for any license or ability to exceed the general parameters for special events and that sort of a thing and procedure wise. Reason being is this is basically flag- Beaches noise ordinance and the city manager became the city clerk in the ordinance. I took out a few parts of the ordinance that were inappropriate but I think the collective determination of staff is that some of that responsibility at least among staff needs to be shared between the police department and City Hall. So I will be working with staff to make those adjustments as need be and of course any changes that Council wants to see. Once the ordinance is acceptable to Council, it does include a component that removes some language in the land development regulations which is out of place. There was just a small section on noise that really wasn't in sync with what we had in the code itself. So because that does require a change to the LDRs, this will have to go to the planning commission as well. But that is just for a consistency, comprehensive plan, consistency review, unless you want them to look at anything else or provide them directions to do so. So this is, like I said, more of an FYI, and just for you all to take a look at and see if you have any preferences, questions, comments, or direction for the next stages of bringing this ordinance forward. But it definitely will provide a much better tool for law enforcement to address river noise and any other type of noise issues the city may face in the future. I actually have some. Yeah, I have a question. On Andrew, on 42-28. Heredrap 2, number C. And this is which line? It is line 245. 245. Okay. It says that special permit will be given over for four hours and 124 hour or day. However, I'm looking at the roster for the two rivers, the two rivers is five hours. Would we need to make a change for that? This ordinance will not be in place by the time. When is the... October 12th. It's October 12th. This ordinance will likely not be in place. But I mean in the future, could we address that? There's a whole lot of things that this thing is going to get to eat That being more normal. Okay. I just want to bring that focus. Yeah It depends on how you want to see it This is for exceeding the maximum and the level noise level So this is a special event that is going to be in excess of that and you want to allow for more than a four-hour period Then that is completely up to you. Again, this is another community's ordinance, so I fully expected to make some tweaks to the fitted, exactly to the Nellings needs. Obviously, Flag of Beach is not the Mellon and the city has its own unique needs and direct-sing noise, plot problems and new services. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. I have had a community development run is going to get have to get involved in that too because they've managed the special that permit process. Once we think we have all the kinks worked out, then we'll bring it back to you and on paper for another. And any comments we might have we can just email to that will be perfect. Okay, I guess we'll move on then. Item number 8, 8, resolution RAS 2024-23, establishing road rehabilitation reserve. That'll be Mr. Mayor. Thank you. Council as promised, before you there is a draft resolution establishing a road rehabilitation reserve based on the discussion from our last budget workshop and formulating this reserve regardless of what surplus there may be that's indicated in our next budget. There we would not be transferring any funds into this reserve until after the year has been audited to ensure that there truly is a surplus that could be transferred. So you are a stat, you would establish this, say now, but it will be after May of 20 25, 26. 25. Well, the budget is for 24, 25. So the audit would be May of 26. So because it's after the year is ended. OK, I'm OK. So if this ends in September of 2025, then the audit is not technically completed until May of the following year. So where do these funds stay during this whole year? They stay in general fund unrestricted. Now we can move them temporarily and then true it up based on the financial report. But to transfer it sooner when you don't know, you truly have a surplus because those funds could be spent. So, and what I want to let you know is the budget has changed substantially from the last workshop. Due to several things, state revenues have decreased by $37,600 from what I presented previously. Expenses overall have increased by about $50,000. That's attributed to the council contingency that you asked that I put in a 35,000 based on this current fiscal year. Some other highlights, the council, the police directives, policy directives that they asked for in the amount of 16,000 has a new quote came in. It's now 25,852 for that. So there was a $9,800 increase for that expense. I did move $60,000 out of reserve to fund the comp plan, but that's a net zero impact to the budget. We also, BSNA has had to push back our implementation for the financial system due to some concern risks with the data that they need to review. Primarily, it has to do with code enforcement and community development module. So they wanted to push it back with implementation to be in February. So we increased the current support expense for a municipal financial system for another quarter by about $11,000 and $12,000. However, the SNA has offered to cover half of that expense due to them needing to push back the project. So we received some concession on that. But with this reserve, that's why in this reserve, I have an amount not to exceed what we would transfer to the reserve upon the audit. The same way we transfer money into the General Fund Capital Reserve based on the audit, the same way we transfer money into the general fund capital reserve based on the audit report based on depreciation expense. So that's a surplus that we have at the end of the year that money is transferred to a capital reserve and it would only be used for capital. Now this road reserve would only be used for road items, whether that be repair maintenance or infrastructure improvement. I added a section 2 to this reserve shortly before the meeting and I will read it to you. It says for budget adoption, use of these funds must be specified for rehabilitation, repair, and maintenance of existing improved roads. If council desires to use these funds outside of budget adoption, a public hearing and regularly scheduled council meeting should be scheduled to receive citizen input. A supermajority vote of council is required to draw down these reserves. That's designed to, so that these funds can't be used, basically, willing to, that you have a supermajority vote. That's forward to you. If it's in the budget, that's what it's to be used for, for roads. And that would be something that Chad would identify at budget time. But now, we could transfer it now. The surplus that I've ended up with based on those decreases in revenues and expenses amounts to $54,019 as of right now. So it's not even $60,000. 100,000 was eaten up with these added expenses and decreases in revenues. So are we going to end up with a large surplus at the end of the year? We've been fortunate. We have in the past ended up with a substantial reserve that has just sat in unrestricted. This way you're designating in addition to some other designations that already take place that you transfer this for the purpose that this resolution intends. And by establishing a not-to-excitement, you set a camp on what would be transferred into a road reserve. Now, for the purposes of this, you could say, okay, right now I'm not to exceed $54,000. Period. Regardless of what surplus there may be at the end of the year. Either way, it stays in the bank, but if you want to establish a road reserve, this is the way to do it. I personally don't think you should really transfer money until it's audited. Because too many things happen during the year. For example, we're using council contingency for the police air conditioning repair this year. We've done multiple budget amendments, which we may still end up with another amendment prior to November 30th. Once we get our year in numbers in and we do some analysis, we may need more money from reserves. At this point, we really don't know. So it's entirely up to the net if you want to continue with this. Again, it's 54,000. It's not 100. It's not 60. So I leave it your hand. Again, it's 54,000. It's not 160. So I leave it here. Jim, why were you referring to the audit in May of 2026? This, wouldn't it be May of 2025? No, because May of 2025 will be the current fiscal year of the time. Did this budget establishes. They'll be doing in 2025, they'll be doing 23, 24 audits. Correct? Yes. Right. And this is the current fiscal year. We're saying that we have a risk. We have no. No, no, no. OK. So you're saying for the fiscal year 24, 25 is what this would be applicable to. Yes. And so we wouldn't know until May of 26 what the actual surplus is exactly. You could establish it for this year based on the audit. What surplus you may or may not have, and then we could transfer that to establish the reserve in for this current fiscal year. But again, you really would want to establish a cap. That way you keep all your other funds free for anything else you need. And this can be changed. You know, if Shawna will be here, she can present, well, the auditor will present what surplus you have for an assigned flood balance, meaning just is just sitting there with no specific purpose. And based on this cap, you can decide how much you would want to train this for this year. So this could be established this year. It doesn't have to wait a whole year and a half. And then the surplus that right now we've identified in the budget is just kind of a placeholder for the surplus that really would take place for 24 or 25 a year and a half. At this point in time, Jan, do you feel comfortable that we are sitting on that 54,000 right now? Right now. I'm comfortable, but until the money starts coming in and your expenses, you know, through the year, I'm anticipating you have a larger surplus. So you think this 54,000 is more of a base figure? Yes. For this next budget year, yes. And that may be all you want to transfer to. You may not want to transfer any more than that. And this resolution would only establish a cap. And after the audit is presented, then you could have the discussion on how much do you really want to transfer. You could base it even on a percentage of the surplus. That may be a little more difficult to manage if you just want to do it a percentage, but it could be done. That's what we do with others. Like currently, after this next audit, I'll be transferring 10% of depreciation expense. De depreciation expense is pretty much a known number from year to year. It doesn't fluctuate that much. So it can be assumed that right now, approximately $15,000, $16,000 would go into this general fund capital reserve that has been established forever. But this reserve, this road reserve surplus is a little more, it's quite a bit more of an unknown amount. So that's why I suggested a cap at this cap. And again, the resolution can always be changed to a percentage or you could increase the cap or decrease it. You could look at it from year to year if you wanted to change it. But if you're wanting to establish a reserve, I think you should set a cap. And starting it this year is not a bad idea. We'll have the audit in May. I know that's eight months from now, but that's just eight months from now. And you could actually have money deposited into this reserve that Chad could use next year if he needed to with Council's approval. Again, it would take a supermajority vote to touch it, but you could do it. Mr. Mayor. Yes, ma'am. Mr. Jim's still thinking. That's these little wheels turning. So I just wanna make sure, because I was trying to keep up with all the numbers and all everything you were to say. So when we're asking for the audit reporting amount, not to exceed and forgive me, are we saying that so if we know one mile equals a million dollars to do a mile of work, by the way, I'm not suggesting putting that much money into it even though we'd like to. So, are we saying, are you saying we should put a million dollar max woman there and then only put 50,000 in it? I mean, I just want to see, are you saying 100,000 and only put 50,000 in a fish here? My first thought is a cap of 100,000 because typically our surpluses have been, I'd have to go back 20 years, but I think our surpluses have at a minimum averaged a couple of hundred thousand dollars. And that can be due to additional revenue coming in, like if we get the one-cent sale tax money, if that gets approved next year, we're going to have gonna have a huge surplus at the end of the year but that's all capital money restricted for the one-cent sales tax what's gonna have what's what what you would need to look at is there's a line item in the auto report this is unassigned fund balance from that you decide how much you want to take. If you say $100,000, Shawna would need to do an analysis to make sure that $100,000 is truly available to be transferred. She could come back to council and say council based on the analysis. We could transfer up to $100,000. And then you all could make a decision how much you really want to put in the reserve at that time. And I'm sorry. I missed red. And I missed red something up there. And last year, our surplus was $733,000. I want to sign fund balance that just sat in an unrestricted reserve that could be used for anything. So I'm saying that $100,000 cap is reasonable that it could be increased as years go on or decreased. But I think you need to do an analysis each year. Keep it all separate and make a decision as a council. How much do you really want to set aside for that? And so if we all set up here tonight and said, okay, Jan and Shana, let's go ahead and start this this year What are you telling me that number is? I don't know at this point how much you have available, but if you establish a cap, can't transfer anything more than that if we only have a $20,000 surplus. Well, Councillor, we only have $20,000 surplus this year. Do you want to transfer 10? Or do you not want to transfer any? Maybe nothing gets transferred. But we could still this 2325 budget tell you to put, and I hate 54, I would rather do 50, or I just like even numbers, sorry guys, 5055. I don't like it being left in the general fund. I would want you to put it somewhere, line item. It's for that, the, any other council member that sat up here, that wouldn't maybe be us, because we send it. Goes and general fund, it's not protected. Well, that's my problem. Right, no, I don't like that. And I don't like that. It's recurrently, it's in the budget that you'll see attached to the agenda for next week. In council, I believe it's the very last budget line in council's budget. It begins with a 9,000 series object code. It says transfer to. It's a transfer out. And I have a description that it's to fund the road rehabilitation reserve. So that's identified in the budget. It's only a place holder at this point because this resolution really tells you what kind of surplus do you have? Is it going to be 54? Is it going to be more? We can't do it more than $100,000. Okay. So I have identified it in the budget that it's going to be a transfer out. Council, you have your contingency of $35,972,000, which is the same as this current year. And then you have $54,000000. So technically if you didn't use any of your contingency and you have this 54,000, you roughly have $90,000 to put in a reserve if the money comes in as anticipated. A lot of things can happen. You may have more expenses than you've anticipated. We did this year with all the budget amendments we've done. So, you know, and I believe the plan next year is we've gotten a lot of things out of the way, so hopefully we'll have a very few budget amendments. We'll need to take place next year. I'm sure that's probably what you're kind of leaning towards. So, but it may or may not be true. So, a budget is a live and breathing document and it's only a budget. These are our best estimates of expenses as well as revenues. Even the state revenues, but the state revenues typically do come in this plant. That's why I was really surprised when they decreased as much as they did. That was unusual, but they really took them down a lot. Valor, do you have anything else? I wrapped my mind. Can I let Rex go in and let you think about it? Rex, do you have anything that you want to question or concern? Tim? Yes, sir. Come back to me. Oh, no, no, no, no. I have sneezed at all that. I was in it. Okay. All right. Okay. If I remember right, we have $8.1 million in all of our bank accounts. Is that correct? Something around there? That's about right. Okay. Let me explain how IC surplus work in that the end of the year. And what we've been doing to the taxpayers and to the abelorium. Pick on Chad. So this year here, I'm going to do a project for Chad at his business. I charge $60,000. All right, stuff came up. Wouldn't able to do the project this year. But pay me the $60,000 upfront because that's the terms of the agreement We didn't do the project So next year he wants the project done. Okay Chad. You want the project done? I'm gonna charge a $60,000 again. That's exactly what's been going on. And then we call that $60,000 surplus, it is surplus, okay, by the definition of surplus. So we charged the tax payers multiple times for the same project multiple years. And when you ask the question, what, how many times have we done that? What's the magnitude and all that? We're really not able to figure out the answer. But I don't know how any of that is right. What I will tell you is in a regulated utility business, all right. You're not allowed to do that. When you have to give all your examples up to the commissions and in regulated states, you can't do that. What I will tell you in the next few days, okay, what's the president of the state who can get fired for doing that? I just don't understand how that can be an ethical accounting practice. To keep charging the taxpayers for the same thing year after year, however many times we do it, call that surplus, we built up $8 million. That's part of the reason we built up $8 million. So I'm wondering what, one of my questions is, how much of this $8 million that we've taken from the taxpayers in all these years can we move into a resolution and it can only be used for the roads with most of the verbiage that we see in front of us with this resolution. So again, most of our surplus is because we simply didn't do the project. The, I understand we're down to 54K now, but the 35K for contingency, that was not a hard number. That was a grasp and number out of the air because we had, we were talking, if I remember right, we were talking $90,000. So if we're going to have that $90,000, let's make 35K contingency. That's all fine. What I can't believe anybody would do is take this money, put it in general fund. OK, after the years, we have watched councils up here be like a revolving door. All right, I sat there and I watched people make themselves mayors, all right, so that they can get a project done. And then when they don't get a project done they throw a fit and quit. I watched that twice now. We watched council members come up here come and go and when they didn't get their little pet project they throw a little fit up here and they go and they quit. Or we get great things happen like green light to us that we're still paying $175,000 per year until 2032. So we're not going to talk about where our race saddle detects pairs with that kind of debt and they have nothing to show for it's zero. I think we have the money to do our roads. I think we need to take a look at how much we've already taken from the tax payer. I do not understand why it is so taboo to if we can lower the millage rate because that's all we need to take. I don't care if it's 50 cents per taxpayer or property owner. It's their 50 cents. They got up, they work with it. It doesn't belong in a government bank account. It belongs in the person that got up, went to work, sacrificed. It belongs in their bank account. If it's 50 cents, it's their 50 cents. You know, we nickel and dime. You know, you speak at work the same way. You know, all is only this, only this. You know, left it, but it was time at that time. Only take five minutes of your time. Well, you got 20 people wanting five minutes of your time. Your day is gone. You know, if you're not really disciplined with your time and you enforce discipline with the others that work around you. I think we have the money for roads and if we put this money in general, I don't care if it goes in there for a month. That money is at risk with what we have seen go on up here and no council members sitting up here, am I talking about so I just want to get that off the table now. But we have all seen time after time, this money get wasted, people's pet projects, and if it goes in general fund, that money is absolutely not protected. And I don't think that we understand enough about what we need for future monies and projects to determine anything right now with an amount. I think we need to get right now we have we know what we're spending this year we know what we're going to spend 24 25 on roads and we know what we're going to you know they're all estimates naturally and we know what we're going to spend 25 26. So I think we need to get our act together a little bit more out to the five year mark. See what we have in there. Are we have enough years right now, well, I guess we'll be back up. The other problem with past expenditures is when you go look and you say, because I find this out when I go in, I take a look at all the quarterly reports to make sure we're on track. Compare that to the past, I think it's three years or four years that come in with the reports. But you can't compare it to three years ago and say, well, we only spent this or we spent all of that because as this project runs over, oh, well, we got money okay. And please understand, I am not dising staff. I am not dissing Jan. OK, I think it comes from a previous administration that ran this city. And that's the way this person did business. So if this project runs over, that's fine. Go to the Magic Finance person, OK, because they know there's a little bit of money that didn't get spent over here and we'll bring it over here. So when you go back and look at historical records, unless it's a zero, my opinion is, they're not worth the computer cells that are little O's and ones that make up the computer language. But I just, I think there's too much risk in going down here. We'd have taken a time to put forth the figure out what we're going to spend in the next five years. We built up $8 million. Can we put some of that in some kind of in a resolution like that like this? I'm just I guess I'm done. Well, do you have anything now at this point? Did you wish to speak on this issue? I got a lot of stuff and I haven't put it all into it. Okay. Well, I would say this, a form. I appreciate very much the Mayor's position. I understand that he's concerned for the finances of the city and he's concerned for the taxpayers in our city that they be treated fairly. There was a period of time and he had addressed some decisions that didn't work out very well. There was a point in time that I went on to counsel and those decisions were revealed So subsequent problems that they created and through Jan Smith's efforts to withstand some obligation that she might have had it otherwise, she provided the information I needed. And when I presented to our city council that we were spending over $1,000 a day above our income. The next subject it was discussed without discussion of what I presented was coloring books. So I understand the frustration of trying to keep our city in the bounds of reasonable financial decisions. The only issue I have is that when I think about what obligations we have to the citizens to provide to services that they cannot provide for themselves, and that being streets, police department, and of course they contribute to our fire department and our emergency response. All of these items are public safety items and public service items and our city is responsible for providing those services. I want to provide what is needed to the professionals that we have in our public works department to get as much accomplished as possible. That's my goal. to get as much accomplished as possible. That's my goal. Now, let me move forward. The approach that I hope to be able to take is what I've taken in the past. It's the approach every option I can for grants. And sometimes you have to have matching funds to put grants together. You can't just go up there and expect 100%. They're different levels that they may be willing to come grants together. You can't just go up there and expect 100%. They're different levels that they may be willing to come up with. So the happy ability to do that is always paramount to me because I want us to be able to present our case to the state and the federal government wherever we can. We have been very successful in doing so. So that's why investments mean a lot to me. And I think it's a wise choice and I do understand exactly where you're coming from. And she won't just thing to be conservative and we need to spend the money that we've got and we need to use it. That's what it's there for. It's not there. It's not piled up just so we can brag about how much money is in the bank account. That's not our purpose. Our purpose is public service. But that was the reason and why I still think that everything we can do to give you the tools. If you have cost over runs and you have problems and then we're going to have those, it's going to cost you more money than you're anticipating. There's no doubt about that I want to give you the tools to do that and I know Tim does too because we want to get these projects done And we're not gonna get them done if we just if we don't adequately fund so I'm torn between the two I want to be I am as conservative as there as I could ever be I don't want to spend one time More than what we have to to provide what we need for the city. But then on the other hand, I want to give you the tools to do your job. So that's the bottom line. That's how I feel about it. I can appreciate every bit of that, and agree with every bit of that. But I think before we go, and we don't have much time, I think we need to take a look at how much money we have, see what we do have, what can be spent on roads and see if it would make more sense to, you know, if we want a road reserve, take some of the money to sit in there now that is at risk for whoever wants to come up here and move money wherever they want and see if we can't take that money and put some of that money and put it into a reserve and make it safe, make it protected so it can only be used on roads. My point is I believe we have the money to do all of this. I believe we can do a few things. I believe we have the money to take care of the rows. We just need to look at what we have and come up with a strategy to use it. I think we can, you know, again, nobody's going to get rid off of a tenth of a mill west, but if it's their money, it's their money. We can soften up some of the stigma about taxes and government and all that, by we're only taking what we need to take from you, and we can explain all that to anybody. And get our roads done, which is what everybody's asking for. So I think we can do all three things with what we have right now. Am I against a resolution? I am not against a resolution. Okay, I just think that we already have the money to fund it without calling the $60,000 that we discovered that we took from the taxpayers in the year that we're in now for the rewriting the comp plan, okay? And now let's not take, we already took it from the taxpayers, so we ought to at least have a $60,000 surplus from that line item. Now if we have overreaches, pick on the police or use that, because we knew coming into this year, there were gonna be unknowns with the police department when we walked into. But that's what the reserves are for in my mind. We used those and if there's other areas that we didn't have to spend as much as that we thought and that will soften those blows. The other thing is, we really need to understand our budget as far as This surplus stuff we all do the happy dance and we got all this surplus money But many times you can take a look at it you subtract the 60,000 you subtract this project We didn't do where that project we didn't do you know more than likely not going to show What I call a true surplus we're going to show a deficit because we had to spend so much on this, so much on this. So we spent more than we actually budgeted it, but we know why we did it. You know, and that's not a bad thing. You know, going over, nobody wants to go over, but it's not a bad thing to go over if we understand why we went over and if we need to adjust the following year we adjust the following year you know move stuff up. If it's a one off you know it's a one off and we eat it. If we look like our reserves are getting too low and we got to bump up you know the millage rate a half a mill or something because it looks like we're getting in trouble we do that and we can explain it to people. But I just don't know how we explain to people, the analogy I used with, you know, we took 60,000 from you. This time from your ad valourium taxes and we're gonna charge you $60,000 again this year for the exact same thing. And I know it's been going on for a long time. And it's time to me to put an end to that. I'd like to see a resolution that doesn't allow us to do that anymore, that we cannot charge at Valorium twice for the same project year after year, you know, and then same thing. There's nothing wrong with that. If we have to raise a mille's rate to accomplish what the budgetary Requirements are then that's what we do But the biggest thing is we need to explain it and I'm here to tell you can't explain half this stuff that goes on and when you do get in there Take a look at it Some of it and then again this is not Jan. This is Dr. Staff Some of it just doesn't look ethical to me and we've been doing it for year after year after year, so it's just become commonplace. But it is not stuff that would happen out there in the, no business would operate, cannot operate like this, you can't stay solid. But I'm off for a resolution, but I don't think that we should be, I still think we should give the $60,000 back that we discovered we're charging them twice for. And take a look at our 8 million that we have. And if we want a resolution so that we can protect some of that money for roads, move that money into this resolution, and protect that money for future roads. If the 1% sales tax does not come back, we can look at this again next year. It's going to be an uglier picture. And if we need to do something at that point, then we raise two-tenths, we raise a half a mill, so we can build up road projects. That's fine. But I guess I'm done again, sir. No, no, no, I'm glad. I want to hear what you have to say. And I am listening. And so, so is everyone else. We are all listening. Now, who has a, Jay and you want to say something? I'm not trying to be argumentative or get on anybody's bad side. I just need to bring something forward. I know you speak about advalorant taxes. Advalorant taxes make up only about 25% of the monies we collect. So you could look at 90% of Ad Law and Taxes fund the police department. The rest of the Ad Law and Taxes are kind of spread out amongst all the other departments, including finance, clerk. So you have your other revenues not only from our existing residents, but sales tax within the county. That's collected, that we get a piece of. Yes, it's based on our population, not property owners. So, I know you talk about giving money back to the property owner, but they're not the only ones footing our bills. Right. Now, I'm not talking about giving it back. I'm talking about not taking it from them. Okay, but isn't it? The city has always been reactive. In my 20 years here, nothing but react, react, react. Because we didn't have reserves to address, which over time we could have lowered taxes even more. Now, to me, we're still in a predominantly reactionary mode, because right now, and I understand about taking a look at everything, I totally agree with that. But I think that if you don't start to take the opportunity to continue to build reserves so that in the future, maybe you can quit. They can be at rollback for multiple years if you have enough reserves to carry. But even just the roads, OK, you may have two years covered. What about the amount where you keep that little bit of money that our residents don't even notice that you've given them back. back because in last year, I'm curious, did anybody come up and say, thank you? I don't know. I didn't hear of anything. All they notice is their tax bill went on because of other taxes that have increased. So those pennies that you talk about, right now it's a $54,000 positive impact to reserves. If you give it back, you know, the quarter, the 50 cents, that's just reserves that don't get funded. So I just, I, and I'm sorry to disagree, you know, I guess we agreed to disagree and I, I understand where you're coming from. But to me, it's such a small amount, and I understand I'm on a fixed income. So I get it, and every time there's a pricing increase, it hurts my bottom line too. But how many people waste $5 a week just giving us soda or a slushy? And they don't even notice until the bills come to that the 50 cents or a dollar venture giving back to the property owners. When it could help to stay in the city's reserves. If we could lock them up like you suggesting, maybe make tapping into reserves more restrictive than it takes a supermajority or a unanimous vote, that would make it a little more difficult. You're never going to, I don't think unless Andrew has a different thought, you're never going to be able to keep them protected 150%. I don't know of a way to do that unless it's statutory or by like county ordinance where the 1 cent sales tax was only for public safety, which included, excuse me, fire police and roads. That was their ordinance, that's the only thing we can use it on. So maybe you do ordinances For some of your reserves where they could still be undone by another ordinance But that makes a little hard. It's kind of like getting married versus To kind of say goodbye At least that was my thought 40 years ago. Correct. I agree with that. So I'm in total agreement if you can protect reserves and even looking at the monies we've got now and seeing what can be segregated. But I do just agree with this giving money back right now when it's such a small amount that it's that to me the impact I don't know if you pulled your your constituents what would they say? That's all I'm not trying to make enemies. No you're entitled to European and your experience without a doubt Jan and it's appreciated with her. And also, just with respect to your analogy with the electric industry, they were allowed to keep a certain amount of profit for their shareholders. So you could say that your constituents are your shareholders. So you keep that little bit of a profit, yes, it's coming out of their pocket just like a customer of the electric company who own stock in that electric company. Okay, they've contributed to that stock that they now have in their pocket. That's all I'm trying to say is, you know, whichever way you all want to go, we will absolutely make it happen. I just need to know what your direction is that you would like me to do. And right now, I've got a budget for the first public hearing. It's not quite too late to change it a little bit. If that's what you want, I do need to get one posted very soon. So I kind of have tomorrow to make any changes for the first public hearing but again it's just your first public hearing you got until the end of September to make changes. And just to your point real quick and then we'll be able to get back to this and not the budget somewhat is that if I'm saving 50 cents this year but in a year or two I have to raise the military and now I'm saving $0.50 this year, but in a year or two, I have to raise the military, and now I'm making myself pay $5, because I didn't put away that $0.50 or $0.50 today is a savings, I'm gonna spend it like said, trust me. And with $0.50 when I have to pay it in two years from now, you're going to be hearing me screaming. I mean, respectfully, of course. That's my thought as far as that goes as well. The problem with that is we don't have a plan. That's what fight, what, I'm sorry. again if we start with that little amount of reserve that we can save. And I know you and I kind of disagree on the double-dip and thing, but anyway, you're all of it. But yeah, 100% five year plan for all of our departments. What are the needs, how many computers you're going to need three years from now? You know, kind of those kind of things that we can truly plan out and say, why are we getting this computer? Four of them? Why? So yeah, I'm all bored with that. So, okay. I would add, you know, I fully agree with this five, but I think we need to be looking at five, ten, and fifteen years. This is what I hear from my constituencies. I want you to plan for the future. I want you to pay attention to not so much that went on 10 years ago and what decisions were made then. Where are we going? What kind of pressures are we going to have on our community due to this enormous growth we're having. One little short example this morning when I showed up at Dunnell High School as I knew every morning, I'm at the counter at the administration building. There are four sets of parents with four students enrolling in our high school this morning. We are now as of today at 1,500 and 77 students. We have 20 portables. We are under enormous stress in are done at my high school. Our teachers, our students, our administration are struggling to do the very best they can for our children. So I come from seeing that into my city hall with my council and we are trying to make decisions best for this community. Yes we have different opinions and yes we express them but we're all on the same team. We want what's best for this community and there is no doubt about that. As I want to go back to as as I said, to start with, the whole purpose is to give staff the tools they need to move forward with our projects. If we get into a situation, as we just talked about for five-year plan, I would like for us to have a workshop and we sit down and we work on where we think we're going to be and give our staff time to prepare and Sit down and have their suggestions of what we're going to need in five years and ten years and 15 years and Then the public can see us facing that issue and Discussing it just like we're doing now And it's wonderful that we have reserves now. I've seen it when we didn't have them. In fact, when we were in desperate situations. So I've seen both sides. I've just getting my feet on the ground now, and I'm going to do four more years of this. And I'm going to continue the same pattern I have in the past. I'm going to work hard with my counsel to do everything we can to get every dime worth of benefit out of every dime we collect. But this issue about this moving this money into a road reserve, I think is a great idea. I think it's a starting point. I don't see a fault in it. I think there's a little, from my viewpoint listening to my fellow council members, there's a difference in exactly how we balance this. How do we think we're approaching this the best for the taxpayer? I think that's what I see. But I think we're all on the same page as far as doing the best we can. And whatever decision do our fellow council members want to make on this, it'll be solely up to them. But I really, I don't have a problem with starting this dedicated fund and moving forward, with moving money into it when we can and when it's appropriate. And locking it up is best we can so that we can, when we talked our citizens, we want to be able to tell them that we're going to get in the program, we're going to maintain your roads. We're not going to do one year's worth of roads. We're going to do two years. We're going to do three years. And in five years we're thinking we're going to need to do this so that our public understands it. We are trying to grapple with the future. Not just deal with the day to day. I'm going to make sure I wrap my head. I'm not going to talk about them. I know they're the same. If we say tonight that we're thinking about the 100,000 maximum, not to exceed 100,000 correct, it does not mean that we have to put any money in it if we don't have the reserves. That's correct. That I'm fine with. Yeah. So it would be presented the way I'm looking at it is at audit time maybe sometime in May when your audit report is presented and the auditors have determined what unassigned fund balance is available then you can talk to how much do you want to set aside. If any. At that time. So, so just looking at that thing, could we, would anybody object to $100,000 in there? If any of them? Did you have something to say about it? Sam, did you, I'm, did you have anything? I guess I don't understand where the hundred, where any of it its coming from. Okay, like we had a $700,000 unassigned bond balance. So you could take $100,000 from that and move it into a reserve. After this resolution is complete. Yes. Okay. And the hundredth it would just be a cap. In other words, okay, you've got 700,000 on the sign. No more than 100,000 are we going to move into a reserve. You could put 500,000 here if you wanted to. You could put a million. It's just a cap. Okay. That's discussed at odd at time as far as how much would be transferred. Let me ask. If I want to. Yes, yes. Let me ask this. With this resolution, can we take some of that $8 million? And that's not obligated. I know we have so much obligated. We have so much invested. You know, I did go back and I'll remember what we have actually on hand. It's almost all invested. One way or another. Okay. So. But that's okay. I mean, that investment reserves are separate. You have your bank accounts, which are your investments, and out of those monies in those various accounts and CDs that's what makes up your reserves. So we can still stay invested. Yes. But protect some of that money by putting it into this resolution. You absolutely could. Okay. In mind You've got your ARCA project starting. Right. Okay. That's a million dollars right there. Right. So, and we haven't gotten any ad volume tax money at this point. I think we need a little bit of time to really... Oh, I'm not looking and jumping at anything right now. Okay. Just asking for it, especially since we're so close to hearing. Right. But absolutely, we could come back to you at a later date to say, we think we're okay in moving this money into reserve. I would want to be very conservative since this is the first year we're really doing this without, with unaudited numbers. So I would want to be conservative for this year. So it may not be 100,000, it might be less. Right. And then you could come back in a later date and say, OK, let's move some more into it. So your hands aren't tied for a one time only distribution. OK. What I would ask though with this resolution is it mentions in here existing, I'm sorry, existing improved roads. Okay. What I would like to add to this resolution like we do in ordinance as a stuff is a definition of existing improved roads and what my feeling at the definition needs to be. The definition would be existing and paved existing and paved as of the date of this resolution. Existing. And like you, I am not trying to irritate anybody out there, okay? But this is not to take care of, we've already budgeted $20,000. More than we do any other place in the city to take care of Don Ellen Heights roads. But don't want somebody coming in here and saying, okay, we're going to take this money and that's what we're going to pay those roads without there. You know, this is to do existing pay roads in my opinion. That's on one out of four up here right now. Okay. Council. Over there. Right now it says existing improved roads which could indicate a limerot road because technically it's improved with limerot. Right. You know we found all that out when we worked with Andrew as far as we have to what we had to do with that new road out there with that builder put a road in or the builder put a house in. But basically what you're saying is that We're talking to him right here in Section 1 at the last point. The last portion of the paragraph, Section 1. Paid and proved roads. You're just asking to add that one word there. I think he's asking for us to put down what an existing definition of what an existing paved improved road is. Yeah, I mean, I'm good with you adding the word that you added in there, Mandy. Let me get back to the build. I mean this does speak to strictly paid roads without. Oh. Put the word paid in there. Oh, okay. Right, you just added the word paper? I just put it in there. Oh, OK. Right. You just added the word paper. I got you. Got you. I have the idea. I have the idea. I have the idea. Right. That's what that is. Well, that's the thing. Take that in proof. This is really matter. Yes, because. It would just be paper-roads. paid room. Well, it proves Kerry's legal description. Well, and you're not talking new roads. Okay. Yeah, I don't know if you're annexed an area and it needs a road. Yeah, a new road. Say it's vacant property, you know, and you want to do something to improve it to a lot of buildings. Well, the only... Really, but my paper here. The only concern I've had, I don't want to tie Chad's hands if he needs money out there. It's done at the heights. I don't want it to be said. Well, we can always fund it. That's not a problem, Council can make a decision to fund what you need. But it won't allow you up too bad on what you think needs to be done out there, as far as maintenance, if you get in a situation where you want to do it three times a year, that's your current practice that's existing, it's two times. I want to give the staff, I want to give our department, you know, the option to make a judgment call of what needs to be done out there. I don't want to tie public's works hands. You see what I'm saying? Tim? Right. When we sit down every year and we figure out what that is. You see where I'm coming from? Right. But it won't. The process we have right now. He determines what that's going to be every single year. All right. With our contractor. Well, you understand where I'm coming from. I want him to feel like, you know, if I need something, we can come to the council to be able to talk to him. Right. Absolutely. All right. That was the only concern I had. Yeah. Just me or budget item. Right. All right. Well, you know where I'm coming from. And that's where you have your contingency fund to I mean it's 35,000 right now doesn't mean you can't do a budget amendment for more if Chad would need it for Line Rock or whatever I understand that that was my only concern I just want to be sure that we're not locking in I don't have a problem with it with the paid roads We've got to maintain them if we don't maintain them, we're going to have to rebuild them. And as we went through with the cemetery, if we ended down the work we did at the cemetery, when we did, we would have been rebuilding roads and it would cost us a great deal more money. So we did exercise the right thought and we did get those roads paid in salvage those roads. We want to be careful that we don't get in a situation with these paved roads. We don't have to have a rebuilt. That's what, that's one of the things it concerns me and that would be in the same thought with the 5, 10, and 15 year idea. And if we decide to add dirt roads and we can always add dirt roads. Yeah. And we can always amend it. As long as it takes a super majority. Yeah, yeah, no, I'm right. Right. Right. Yeah, no, I'm right. Right, here's what happens. I mean, you got the landowner, it owns the huge parcel. They section it up. You got the contractors that come in and speculate. OK, they come in, they buy the property, they build spec homes. They don't put any improvements in the roads, storm water, any of that. So then they build a home on that property. Somebody comes in, generally from the north. Okay, I want to live in Florida. This is all great. Who knows that they're told that one day the city's gonna pave your road or not? You know, when I go out and talk to Don Delan Heights, you get a whole mix of everything out there. You know, Chad gets to cause, hey, I pay $3,000 in taxes out here when you guys gonna pay my road, you know. Well they don't realize 2000 of that three goes to the county. The other thousand we can sit down and they can tell them every penny where that money goes okay including the 20,000 that goes into their roads every year that we don't spend anywhere else. So the person that sold the property and broke broke it all up makes a ton of cash. The speculator the speculating home builders do the same thing. They put it in the rows and some of them don't want them paid so that they can do different government programs and stuff. And then you get enough people, and then you get the people out there that are OK with living on a rock road for a while that's never lived on a rock road. And then they figure out, oh boy, this was not the greatest choice in the world of living on a rock road. Now I want all you people that bought on paved roads okay because you live in the city and pay taxes. I want you to pay to pay my road. You know, I messed the only thing I'm looking to avoid. Yeah, hey, we do not have dental notes. That's all I have. And what we can add is Jesus. What we can add to the resolution, and this was a suggestion by Andrew. I'm going to take credit. I would like to. After the word paved, put paved with asphalt or hard surface. Cool. Awesome. That's great. Do you hear that? I'm going to do paved with asphalt or hard surface. Can you make those words appear? If it is, but if it is. Whatever your cursor is. What did you say? With asphalt or hard service. I was from the industry. Okay, so I do have one question now. So we do this resolution. This is just for this year. No, no, it's for going forward. Okay, so this is a resolution saying that we are establishing this at a certain dollar amount, but it doesn't obligate us to any future. No. Okay, that's very good obligate us to any future. No. Okay. That's great. We want to really talk about how much do you want to put in a reserve. Okay. So we're just setting up a reserve. What you have, yes. The second question is, the way this is set up and with what Kim said, this pretty much negates four people out there fighting a way to get on the council coming in and saying hey I'm going to look at the road reserve I want my road pay for you to get eight million dollars. This isn't here So we can take this money out right they can't with our super majority they can't take this money And that eight million is wide open right and that's why I'd like to see some of that 8 million rather than taxing the fee for more. I'd rather see some of that 8 million made safe and be protected by putting it in some of that. I think we are because that's one thing that I've got. As you guys have said, it's happened before. You get four people up here. That's the right agenda. We've got our money. We've got our road done. The Bible's here. I will see you. So, but yeah, I think it's a good start, but I just want to be clear that that's what we were doing today. Okay. And right now, please don't hold me to this, but there's only a couple million that's really unassigned. The rest is all committed. We've got that ARPA project. I'm just concerned if that goes over. So you don't really want to commit. That's why I'm going to be very conservative coming back initially. And then once everything's audited because chances are your ARPA project will probably be complete by May. That's kind of what we're hearing. So you'll have a better idea of how much of whatever the balance is, say, Aignolian, could you really set aside? Right. And you can make that call at that point. Just, you know, Shauna will present that to you and she can make that transfer. So that's not a huge undertaking by any means. So what's the magic number we want to put in those? Yes, that's the only thing is if you want to establish a cap. Now, if you don't, and you don't want and you don't want a cap. That's what I was going to ask, why do we have to establish a cap? Well, I put this in here because based on the surplus that we have for next year. Right. No, you don't have to establish a cap. Because if we establish a cap for 100K, but then we take a look at five years out, 100K is not gonna do a whole lot with roads. We're gonna have to come back here and change this resolution and increase the cap. So why don't I take the cap out unless Andrew sees an issue. Let me work on some wording and get Andrews okay on it and we'll bring it back for maybe next week For your first public hearing because unless I miss something we don't have a cash Whatever goes in this is probably the safest money that we have in the city the most protected money put it that away Other than Well the state statute the state statutes is gonna are to control a lot of the access to these funds and state statutes. Right. It's, you have one other reserve that takes us to the majority of the country, the largest reserve of 1.8 million. Gotcha. That's restricted. So you don't have to. So there's two of the eight. Yeah, you don't have to. Eight million. I'm with you. Gotcha. There's two of the eight. Yeah, you don't have eight million. I'm with you, contact. Okay. So, because almost, I want to say 800,000 is already in a gas tax reserve. So I'm thinking you maybe have a couple of million that you can, excuse how to get this plane with. Thank you. For this reserve. But let me go back, let me do a little bit of analysis. I'll take out the cap and I'll put something in that, something to the effect that Council will direct the amount at the time of the annual audit or something like that, how much to of unassigned fund balance to deposit into this reserve. So it can be presented at that same meeting or the very next meeting, but I think based on your audit results would be the most comfortable for you to transfer the money. And knowing maybe what projects you have for the new fiscal year, like an ARPA project. Or if you get a grant grants are really, they're really going leading towards a 50% match. The 25%, the 15%, those days are going to really going away. Now legislative appropriations may be different, those are fewer, I don't know if the fewer far between, but grants are requiring more commitment. So just to keep that in mind, you have a road reserve established, you could commit that as your man. Right. If it's, especially if it's a road reserve established, you could commit that as your man. Right. If it's a road grant. Well, it adds, the whole point of this, it puts more tools in the toolbox. Absolutely. Well, I'm making a presentation. And I'm in Tallahassee, and I'm trying to do something with the legislature like we've done before to match the federal grants when we worked on war and sewer and we got the state money to go in with it too. Is it what we're willing to put in the game? We're not coming up there expecting the state to finance our city. We have money that we've set aside in this account. This is what we can do. What can you do to help us complete these projects so that we can have a better system for our city? And that's the point that I've made in the past and it has been good. So that's one of the reasons that this putting this plan together to have this reserve designated reserve is important. Because it gives me tools in the toolbox and I'm going to need a lot of tools. And that's one of them. And I hope that Council will do this reserve and I like the idea of it not being kept. Tim, there's no point. There's no point in keeping it. We can make decisions. We're going to Council that's going to be here. We're going to have one more with us. Hopefully, if all our else holds up, we stay in office. We're going to be the ones doing this. And it all ties in with my thought of this five, 10, and 15 years idea. Something that this council is gonna be able to work together on and come up with some concrete plans and talk to our constituents and see where they want us to be in five, and 10, and 15 years. That's what I really want us to concentrate on that. But I think not putting a cap in it falls right in line. Right. Otherwise, we've just got more administrative duties later on for staff to change it. One of the things Jan did say made a question bubble up. So after the audit period, we would determine what surplus is and how much we want to put in there. Does that take a supermajority vote? No, that- Only to use the funds takes a super-it. Does not take a- does not take a- only takes a typical- if we got a full council, three to two, to determine how much goes in, takes a supermajority to take out. I mean unless you think it should take more than three votes. Oh no. No. No. I don't I don't myself. I just want to say for our action. Easy and. So I think it reflects on our future and our confidence in our decision that we have a forward to come out and a three to go in. I think that reflects well and I think it'll fall in line with our count. This council's thoughts. And keep in mind super majority like right now would be three. Not four because you have to make it safe. So that would change and we'll check. But it's thinking about how many C's are there. Because if you have third one, which is a quarter, a super majority could be two of those. Three parts. So I do. Oi, be. I hate be. What do we, are we kind of, are we kind of, are we kind of, are we kind of, are we kind of, are we kind of, are we kind of, are we kind of, are we kind of, are we kind of, are we kind of, back to you at your first public area. You don't have to adopt this at your first public area. It could be your second public area. But let me see what I can come back with. Then you all agree with the work. OK, we're pretty clear now on this one. All right, let's go on to AP then. RES202424, Sir24 Circle Police Department vehicle. Chief, do you have a comment on this? Here it is. Okay. Did I hear you correctly? I think there was a comment may get rid of it. Yes sir. Was that show on the record that get rid of it was our chief's response? Oh. What, I'm, Brandon do you want to talk about this? record that get rid of it was our chief's response. Oh. Oh. What? And if you want to talk about this. It's an old car. This get rid has been over at the PD. It was donated to us by the Williston Police Department back in 2018, I think. And it's just been sitting in there. I don't think it's been being used. So we're saying get rid of it and send it to weeks and try to get a little bit of money for it. Can we put it on the consent agenda? No, because it's a resolution. All right. Is that okay with that? I don't know. Yes, sir. Get rid of it. But, hey, and I want the motion to read. I like it. Give it up. Give it up. All right. We'll go on in. Well, I do have a request. Kind of lines up with this. What I'd like to know is how many PDV vehicles, I know we've done the inventory already. So we know we've got these PDV vehicles, we know the number and all that kind of stuff that we've done that a couple times now. I'd like a list of we have this vehicle, whatever make model, and this vehicle is assigned not to a name, but is assigned to this position in the PD. I'm trying to get a handle on how many vehicles we have compared to people, take home policy and all that kind of stuff. And it's just spurred that thought. Sorry. I'll tell you that. Pretty quick. Yeah, no, I know you're busy. You got stuff going on just. That's the right answer. That's your earliest convenience. You have the 14, 4 and 5 a.m. That's the record show that the chief did respond positive to the positive to vice mayor's request. Anything else or lower on vehicles? That's sir. All right. Department reports who wants to start. You'll be quick. Thank you mayor. We have my commission terms expired. For Brenda Diargo and Kathy Dunn who have agreed to serve each another two year term on the board or is a first alternate on the board and she's willing to move into the Full member position to replace same Martian and I'm sorry We didn't get this out with the agenda last week. We didn't realize it until after it was been published But if you don't mind I would like to place these appointments on your consent agenda for next week When finally is that okay? Yes, sir. That's that's a program that's fine Andy do you have anything else why you're got the floor yes we received a request for a letter of support for hospice facility and we drafted the letter I believe mayor you could speak to this probably better than I can because you spoke with Ms. McLean. Yes, this is a proposal. There has been a certificate of need that has been created for Mary County for an additional hospice facility for our county. And this is the proposal for that. And I was asked by just Miss Jessica McClain to sponsor it if our council of course agrees and assign a letter of recommendation. She did tell me that it's a possibility that it could be located in our area. And as you probably know, the nearest hospital facility that we currently have is at Pine Ridge. And it's been there for several years. None of us won't have to face this, but there are many of us, including myself, who have participated in the hospice care with friends and family members. And if we can have one in our community, it would be nice for the people that would be in need of it. They wouldn't have to travel so far. And it would also be a plus for our community because these would be good jobs in our community. So that's a kind of advancement for the community and it also serves as an opportunity for good jobs for our citizens. So I think it's a win-win for our community if it's possible that we're selected. So I would like for the council if it's your approval to endorse this. Yes sir. With my letter. It's signed. Okay. Asfises of a bunch of angels. That's affirmative, Mandy. Do we need to vote on this in the council meeting or is this a? And say this is the council meeting. What would you like for? Yeah, if we don't consent. That would be fine. I'm looking at Chad. Chad, what you got? Oh, wait a minute. Don't. Well, I'm looking at you, but he's pointing. You're throwing it. You stepped in the hole there now. All right, here we go. We're ready for you. You're first president. I'm going to do it. I'm going to do it. I'm going to do it. I'm going at you, but he's pointing. You're stepping in the hole there now. All right, here we go. We're ready for you. Your first presentation to the council. I'm Austin, Mr. Mayor. I'm nothing else in there. That was easy. Well, that's a wonderful way to start. We're proud of you. There it is. You know, 24 minutes to 8, and he's offered a wonderful assessment. We appreciate that. He doesn't have anything to report. She's insated her time limit tonight. All right. Well, we're looking forward to your future reports. You and as you can see, you have full support of your councilman. He stole that one from me just by the way. All right. Okay. Well, so. Well. Oh, she never saw Ray Ron. Okay, well, so Or on just just don't be that hopeful next time Well now you can point back to Chad now let's see if the Chad has to say Chad what did you got? I don't have nothing Sean had a question. It's the way well one one thing I did talk to Chad before the council meeting to ascertain exactly when we might get started on our grading work at Dunnell and Heights and he has informed me and I'll, if you don't mind, I'll mention it, that it's up for work now and we're waiting on weather conditions to improve so they can get out there and service the every six months actions September 1st so I know and and of course after 16 and a half years of living in my home I'm fully aware of what the roads look like and I'll report on its several neighbors ask me and I said this will be a good time tonight to find out from the man it's in charge so I'm glad to hear that and I'll report on its several neighbors. Ask me and I said, yes, it'll be a good time tonight to find out from the man it's in charge. So I'm glad to hear that and I'll relay that to Michelle's listening to. She's probably happy about that also. Chad. Oh, Sean had a question. Oh, no, but can I just, can I just tell Chad, just hold, come, sorry, Sean, down there at the base of that one room that you live on. Thank you. Yeah, that grade is totally clogged over with pine needles and such. Okay, I just... I tried moving some of it today, I figured GP better out as an athlete. All right. Anyway, I just saw that. Thank you so much. Is there anybody else but Chad? Yes, sir. I'm thinking you've already rigged him over the cold. Why do you office it? Why do you office it? You're a good look, Chad. You're doing fine job. I can tell that. You've got him laughing smile and I mean that's pretty good. All right, let's get over trying to get something. Any more department reports? Chief is stepped up to the microphone. Welcome, Chris. Welcome. She's as hurt as her. I'm not taking her. Oh, wait a minute. Did I overlook you? Yes. No, I did it. You have something you want to do. Chad, would you give her the microphone please? Yeah. Yes. I just want to know on the list of vehicles, did you just want us to cover P, want PD cover? Yes, just PD. Just to do or did all of the department. No, just PD. Have a handle on Chad's. OK. You got a handle on a man. I've got a handle on the Mandi and Chad's one car. That's right. It's not one car. It's there. Is that all, Sean? Yes. Thank you. Okay, Chief. It's all yours. Just, I think I've been trying to keep everybody up to date. I want we've been doing so far. They're recovering some of the one more equipment. Still some of the missing, or working on it, we've got a few more leads that we're following up on. Jans doing her thing as far as whatever we got to do with the insurance stuff for the one more recovery. Yeah. So we have a church already. I told Chad he needs to lock that stuff up. Church is already there trying to take the mowers. So they're out there. Yeah. When take what? The same thing we know we don't need to do the different stuff. So. The insurance company is checking to see what's what with that. He hasn't got back to me. There's still stuff going on. That was my question. Do we have to get back the money we got from him? No, no, yes. Oh, we don't know yet. We'll find out what the process is. How do you think they're still looking for invoices to see if they owe us any money based on more up-to-date costs. Okay. Which I was going to submit at the same time, but I don't think that's going to work. That would be able to know what was recovered in this time. Okay. Oh, the net. Before I'm meeting next week, we should be able to put in like those numbers you guys are looking for, you know, what calls of service we're working, how many arrests and things that we're making traffic stops. We're gonna put that together so you have it just before the meeting. Okay, thank you. Appreciate it. Appreciate all y'all doing. And investigation is a work and we're getting more and more information so it's looking good. Any questions for the chief? No sir. Thank No, sir. Thank you, chief. Any other department heads? Anybody else? I'm not alone. Okay, we'll let that go. You won't allow anyone? Oh, council comments. I thought it was a good project of meeting. Thank you, everybody. Thank you everybody. Thank you, Valerie. What was that so funny about you? I would say a few things. I've been in touch. I went to the meeting of course, standing in Hollywood. It was very, very successful. The Far League of May, Far League of Cities. I obtained a lot of good information. I got a chance to talk to the Deputy Director of the DEP, which I had not met this individual before. The prior administration I had in some time with and his I told him that you know we look forward to working together to preserve, you know, our aquifer and our river and our funding for whatever's necessary to take care of it. And I told him that I would certainly look forward to the future and he said, do you have anything on the drawing board now? And I said, no, but I will. So it was a pleasure to have a chance to speak to him personally and express our appreciation for the past, for the millions of dollars that he has, that department has funneled into our community to protect our river. And we're very pleased and he was glad and very receptive to the conversation. This is one of the benefits of attending something like this when you actually get the chance after they make their presentations to get the talk to them and express your personal views to them and you was very receptive. Like I said, I met a lot of the mayors. I was, uh, did I'll be working with. I've been in contact with our mayor and fellow mayor and Bill Vue and our newly elected mayor and Ocala. He actually attended Lely High, I'm not Lely. LeCanto High School, I was thinking about Lely and Naples, but LeCanto High School and his grandmother still lives in Citrus Springs. So he is well familiar with our community, and I was glad to hear that. What's the new mayor of O'Callad in March? Oh, yeah. Yeah. So he has good connections with our community. I also have a meeting with the mayor of England who is set up for next Monday here at City Hall. And this is my first meeting with her. I look forward to that. We have also have an opportunity to meet with the mayor in Crystal River and the city manager there and that's been requested. Many and I have a nice reading with them also. So I am working and I realize that I'm going to have four years to be doing some of these things and I'm going to be working as closely as I can with our Florida League of Mayors and our Florida League of Cities and obtain every benefit we can. The new president of our Florida League of Mayors is the mayor of Daytona Beach Shores who attended our regional meeting about six weeks ago and also attended the meeting. I made it by 15 minutes due to weather conditions, delayed to get to the hotel, but anyway I was there, but I had shorts on, but she, Nancy Miller was tickled to death that I made it anyway, and I had breakfast with her, which she and her husband the next morning, which I appreciate very much also. So I'm becoming well acquainted with our new president and look forward to her support and help as we approach Tallahassee again. And I'm ready to go to Tallahassee. So we'll see how this all unfolds and I'm pleased to work with my council as we go forward and come up with our plans that they won't be to present and how we present them in Tallahassee. So I am very pleased with my first few days of knowing that I'm going to tie four more years up along with my time at Dunnell and High School. And I won't mention to you that. Does anybody have any questions about the trip? Any concerns? Did he have anything? About tripping out by a draft something? About what I've done. I mean, anything? Not yet. We'll let you know. All right. Well, that sounds like a pass. I'll let that out. You did that. I got through this meeting with him. What were you thinking? I know. What did I think? Well, I do have cover everything? Oh, we have the chief and I have a meeting next Tuesday with our fire chief, Jamie Banta is coming to Dun Allen and we're going to discuss some of the emergency communication systems for our county and he is coming over here and I appreciate very much that he's scheduled a meeting at four so I don't have to Get relief at the school to be here and also the mayor of England was very gracious and allowing another four-clock meeting So that I could get here for that also so I look forward to that. It's gonna be very informative and we want to reinforce our Position with our county every way we can Now done. All right. Can we get a copy of the next? Go around with the budget. Where we at with that? I just finished it right before the meeting. Cool. I just want to double check. Okay. Okay. But it was going to be attached to the agenda. It goes out tomorrow, but I'll give you double check. Okay. But it was going to be attached to the agenda that goes out tomorrow, but I'll give you the next absolute beginning and next goal. Thank you. And that's the line I have in detail. Okay. I don't have the summary. Okay. Completing the chat. All right. All right. That goes along at the budget here anyway. And as soon as that's available, I will be there. Thank you. Thank you. That doesn't get posted with the agenda because it's not ADA compliant with the child. Okay. Some months of supplement. Well, would you mind sending me an XL version also? Of course. Thank you. Is that enough homework, Dan? Yes, sir. Okay. Andrew. This council very quickly just have two things. I did forget to mention earlier when we were going over the speed zone ordinance, we will see an exhibit A on the tail of that ordinance that takes some things out of the city code. And apparently back in a number of years ago, the city did create some legislation for a camera program but that was not authorized by Florida statute. It shouldn't be there. That's why you do see that being taken out. As far as new information, I do understand that some development efforts may be coming to Denel and they've already been some with the PUD that was done most recently. I had mentioned before to counsel that maybe time to think a bit about impact fees to make sure that new development is charged for those costs as opposed to taxpayers' roads. Some of the things right now, to now and only has a police impact fee. So just wanted to put that on your radar. Even if you have development coming in, there's still a long, you know, entitlement process. Impact fees are charged at time of pulling the permit. So, you have some time if development is indeed improved. So, just something to think about that does require a study and does require an investment up front to get an impact fee program going. But there are a number of different categories that the City can institute impact fees on including capital facilities for new municipal buildings and so forth. Should the City need them in the future if there is growth that necessitates them. So just want to make you all aware of that something I've been discussing with Mandy. Okay. What do we look at in terms of, would you say a development? I mean, a part of the picture. I can't say that'll, that'll, I suppose, you know, that I don't know right now, I know there have been some inquiries. Yeah. For some lands that are, but I don't have the details of those to share. And certainly until an application is made, won't know those details. But I know there's an interest in development and development of vacant land. Okay. This is exactly why we need this five, 10 and 15. We really do. And this is all goes into what the planning process for for what how we want to implement These fees these impact fees and all of this is is in our plate right now And I think as soon as we get our feet on the ground with our budget that we get into our workshops and our staff and have them do their presentations and have us get a pattern set up for where we want to go and what we're going to need to do for these next few these next year challenges. Do we have something you want to do? Do we have a timeframe that I mean sounds like this is coming out as fast and furious. I mean, I'm guessing October workshops too soon. Oh, for impact fees. Sorry. But. But we can start talking about it anytime you want to talk about it but like Andrew said there are two large properties in the far east section of the city limits both of which we have received inquiries about every pass. out every past, say, the one not really as aggressive, but the one that we received in the past week. I could see sometime in the near future them filing some sort of application just based on, you know, some of the questions they have, but it's very, very, very preliminary right now, but I don't think it's ever too soon to start talking about what impact fees we can establish and how we establish those fees. Like Andrew said, there's a study, how we're going to fund that study. So I don't know. And I've asked a question. I'm still not. Many times you all have answered it. How do we not. Let another done Ellen Heights happen. You know, as far as. Developers. Okay. Okay. Okay. Whatever. Okay. Build a bigger sewer. I mean, I'm just making something. Okay. Whatever facilities. Okay. Build a bigger sewer tank. I mean, I'm just making something. Okay, gotcha. So we can set the requirements up. Okay. But then, as Andrew Mitchell grows, this first thing I think we're going back into. That depends on the underlying zoning though, whether it's by right or if it is something that allows. You can always have a development agreement, but if, for instance, if you have lands that are, and the one I'm speaking of, I believe, has a mix-use land, has a mix-use land-bounding. Future land use category. So distinguishing between zoning and it's, for all intensive purposes here, we can look at it the same way. If you have an entitlement just to build residential zoning, buy a right, in other words, that residential zoning on top of a residential land use, then you can't create exactions on top of that. And in addition, I mean, if it's infrastructure that supports that development within the development, so forth, they may have those, you have mechanisms to control that and have the developer pay their way. For roads and so forth outside of that development, it's a lot of work that's been done by that development. That would have to come through impact fees and other means to make sure you have the funds for those. I suppose to do. Mr. Mayor. Mr. Mayor. Andrew, didn't, and I'm going back to 25, 30 years ago, being on City Council. I remember us having impact fees back in the day. I thought like it was. I mean, I'm talking like Chuck was on City Council. I mean we were like a few had a three bedroom and I thought this was what it was like a three bedroom two bath house for every bathroom you had or square foot, like how much square footage or something was how much an impact fee was. Was that not in the city ever? That was probably with the county. You have to pay him back fees with county. And they've got... You may be thinking about the information. Maybe that's what I was thinking. No, utilities, yes. Maybe that's right. But I remember us, and maybe I remember talking about doing impact fees. No, we currently do have impact fees for police. Right. But I thought we had it for, if I want to build a house, it's going to cost you. It would, but it goes to town. Maybe that's fine. OK. So would it be wise to us to ask Andrew to start looking into some impact fee templates for they were applied to down that one so we could have a baseline of what to go on? Impact fee legislation is not difficult to draft. I have a number of templates and so forth and something I do on an annual basis whether it's an update or instituting a new impact fee. What is more time intensive is hiring a consultant to perform your study, because all impact fees that are implemented have to be based on a study. The study must be completed, and that has to be done by an expert. And that is where the bulk of the cost of implementing the impact fee is incurred. It's not perhaps it is difficult to put in ordinance together by scratch, but we wouldn't be putting it together by scratch. And in fact, when we did the police impact fee, the whole framework is already there. It's just a matter of adding the other impact fees that the city needs. So we would be looking at putting together an impact fee that covered more of the infrastructure things that the past we've been expected to pick up. So the sewer is handled by anything like that. But roads, potential city buildings, a city hall where it need to be expanded at some point. And it requires a bit of planning. And that's why you have to need the study for the need because usually if any fees aren't incurred or aren't, pardon me, not incurred, but are not utilized over a 10 year period, they're generally returned. And so, you know, you need that study in addition to coming up with an equitable share of what impact fees do you need? What? addition to coming up with an equitable share of what impact fees do you need what that's what I That's also something performed by the consultant. Okay, and then the last question is I know everybody was silly Does that EDA consult and simply just hired for the the comp plan, you know, is that what that was for? So would we be wise at looking at? Actually bringing somebody in for a comp plan to start looking at what we can legislate or what we want to put together in the community if they're coming in. Yes. The ADA planning consultant will be assisting us with rewriting the comp plan. Right. But they, typically what you would do when you're doing a study like this is, if it's over the threshold, if we determine it's over the $35,000, however, I do think there is some language in the purchasing policy that does allow the year to, enter into agreement for studies that are exceptions to that purchasing threshold. There is many. What is that exception? What I'm trying to ask her to change is I will not do that without reading the camera first and saying this is who I'm recommending it. This is how much it's going to cost. What I'm trying to ask her to is I don't want to be in the same position where there's three auto parts store in a row to where they just building what they build. You know the people who want to build and we have no say over what they build. Do it. Are we going to be able to have a say for it? That's not impact face. No, but well eventually it is because it's going to be residents and that's going to affect. But you understand what I'm saying it seems like right now anybody can do what they want. And I've heard Julianne talk about we need to comprehensive plans so we can bring in certain businesses to build the city. Do we have any way to once something gets started? If it's not what we want to say no or do we just have to? Generally don't have controls on that level to negate certain businesses. Now sometimes you can't so for instance I've never seen any legislation that prevents generally competition is what drives decisions as far as you know to that level dealing with auto repair shops. Now if there is a rational basis to restrict, you know, those businesses and new businesses coming in within a certain distance and so forth, sometimes you can do that but generally not. So the kind of level of planning that the Comprehensive Plan looks at is just typically setting up future land use, setting up general policies and so forth which are implemented then by the zoning controls. So yet you do have the ability to state that hey you want to have on a broad level commercial development here, residential development here. Here we want to allow for mixed use projects that require development agreements, plan, unit development and so forth. You know, I can't say that you don't sometimes have those distance restrictions, but they can be a bit tricky if there's not a good basis for them. Usually they are left to competition. But yes, you know, for instance, dispensary is medical marijuana, the spend series are one, well they used to be. Now the state is pretty much taken that over as far as preemption. So there are some controls you have, but that's not something you'd be generally looking at anyhow on the comprehensive plan level. That's more on the zoning type of level. And those are by right, usually not that level of detail. So if a certain individual business wants to come in it's either allowed by the zoning code or it's not allowed by the zoning code and a certain location but if it meets your code you don't have the basis to say no I don't like that. I just say business you can't locate here. So basically if somebody wanted to come over there build like a 600 unit apartment complex That depends on the zoning category and what's in the land use right now And you have a comprehensive plan that for all intensive purposes meets Florida requirements So it's not going to allow an intensive development, you know, unless it's already been planned for right and you know You have to look at what those categories are. Yeah. Okay. I'm just. Yeah. Mr. So kind of circling back to impact fees, could we, would it be appropriate for staff to be directed to come back to us with a plan of who would we need to call or if you can kind of give us a preliminary how much this might cost because I know y'all at staff have nothing else to do on your schedules. So but if you don't do, but if you would be able to do that for City Council, please, and thank you. And if I am able to help or make any phone calls, if the City Council doesn't have any, I am happy to assist making phone calls to help you with information. But not to discuss anything. You don't need anybody to discuss anything. Does anybody have anything else to add to this? Are we, are we wrapped it up? See you, okay. Thanks. Thank you for having us. Oh, fun. We're going to entertain the public comment. Any public comment? Seeing no one. Oh, entertain a motion to adjourn. See y'all later. Second. Second. All right. Question. All in favor say later. Second. Second. Allie. Question? Mullen, favor say aye. Aye. There is no discussion. No discussion. No discussion. I have a time. I have a meeting with the inter-