Meeting of the City of John's Creek Planning Commission to order. At this time, I'd like to ask everyone to please silence or turn off your cell phones. The Planning Commission is a recommending body to the mayor and the city council, and we follow guidelines and conjunction with the public hearing to assist in formulating a recommendation. Copies of the Planning Commission procedures and staff reports are available at the entrance to the chamber. The presiding officer will call cases on the agenda for public hearing. First, the presiding officer shall recognize planning staff to make a presentation of the case with recommendations and then we will open for the public hearing. The applicant will receive a time period of 10 minutes to present their case. If there is any concurrent variance, then each variance so grant the applicant an additional 10 minutes. The time is kept by the planning staff. The applicant may choose to use their entire allotment or reserve a portion of their time for any rebuttal. Any member of the hearing body upon recognition by the presiding officer may ask questions of the applicant or agent of the application. The period of questions from the planning commission is not deducted from the applicant's time period. The opposition is also granted an equal time period per the application to present their data, evidence and opinions. If a large number of people wish to speak in opposition, it is advisable to designate spokesperson to make that presentation. The city is not obligated to provide the full time period to opponents if they elect not to use their time, and the opposition is not granted a rebuttal period. Any member of the hearing body upon recognition by the presiding officer may ask questions of any person giving public comment. After completing that process, the presiding officer will indicate that the public hearing is closed. Upon closing the public hearing, the planning commission can no longer be addressed by the applicant or opposition. The planning commission may ask questions of city staff at that time. Once all questions have been asked and addressed, the presiding officer will call for a motion, and if it's properly seconded, will call for a vote on that matter. The presiding officer will then state the vote and recommendation for the record. I will ask at all present, accurately and refrain from any outbursts or comments, etc. I would like to recognize the commissioners and attendance tonight beginning on my right with Commissioner Horton, Commissioner Carnwall, Commissioner Jackson, Commissioner Anon, and Commissioner Katzen, and I'm Commissioner Holst. So with that, the first item on the agenda is approval of the August 6th, 2024 meeting minutes. Planning commissioners, have you had a chance to review the minutes? Mr. Vice Chairman, I would like to make a motion to approve the minutes as present. Any discussion? Okay, all those in favor? to approve the minutes as presented. Okay. Any discussion? Okay. All those in favor? Okay. Motion passes 6-0. Meeting minutes are. Excuse me. 5-0 with Commissioner Anand abstaining because she was not present at the August meeting. All right. The first item of business on the agenda. All right. The first item of business on the agenda. All right. Good evening, planning commissioners. My name is Ruji Agarwal, and I'll be presenting you tonight's case. Resoning case, RZ-24-002. The subject property is located at 6350 Hospital Parkway. It is 6.74 acres. The existing zoning is mixed use district and the proposed zoning is townhouse residential district's TR. The request is to allow single family attach residential subdivision with 60 town home units and a density of 8.9 units per acre. And in the map here you see the black outline that shows the subject site here. The subject property fronts on hospital parkway. It is approximately 760 feet northwest of hospital parkway and Medellin bridge road intersection. It is bounded by John's Creek Medical Pavilion to the west, terraces at John Screek Shopping Center to the north, about which about Megan is ferry road, hospitable parkway to the south, and John Screek Village Shopping Center to the east. The subject properties currently don't mix to use district conditional to 2001 zoning case, which is 2001 Z-0133. In 2002, approved rezoning applied the mixed zoning districts to the subject property around the subject property and all properties around the subject property. So, in essence, all the area that you see in pink, right here, all this is mixed use under the same zoning case. The original zoning allowed for 600,000 square feet of commercial use hotel limited to 120 rooms or 75,000 square feet, and up to 75 multi-family units above the commercial space. The site is currently undeveloped and predominantly wooded and a stream traverses parallel to the rear property line. So this is the site right again here and there is a stream that runs around this property line right here. Next we'll take a look at the site plan. The total units is 60 fee simple town home units out of which 28 are 24 foot wide front loaded units that are shown in orange color in the site plan and 32 which is 20 foot wide rear loaded units which are shown in the red colors. The minimum lot size is 2000 square feet. The minimum heated floor area for each unit is 1,900 square feet. It is serviced by private roads in alleyways for the rear loaded units, which is shown in the gray color on the side plan. And in the center is, this is the alleyway right here. There's single ingress egress proposed of a hospital parkway which would align with the intersecting road on ebics way. The stream that exists to the rear of the property and the side plan shows applicable 75 foot stream buffers. So you can see the site plan right here, the lines here, the gray in the gray are showing the stream buffers. All this is stream buffers. There are two stormwater management facilities that are proposed for the development. One is the underground facility in the front of the site and the strong water management pond towards the rear of the property that is shown in the blue in this rendered site plan. A 25 foot landscape strip would be provided along hospital parkway, 10 foot landscape strips along the east and the west property lines. The tier zoning district requires 15% of the gross acreage to be set aside for open space. The applicant has identified open spaces which are marked by these letters A, B, C, D, and E to be improved with on-site amenities such as pervious nature trails, fire pits, passive open space, bachiball code, and outdoor dining areas for residents. This is the open space plan that they have submitted and these are the graphics that they have submitted for the intended spaces that are identified here on the plan. Next we'll take a look at the elevations. The building facade would be constructed with a combination of brick-winear, bone-in-battern and cementous siding. Rendering shows varying roof lines and building offsets with both front and rear-loaded products built with rear decks and porches. So in the graphic here this is the rear loaded product which would this is the front side and this is the back which shows the garage and the decks on the top and these are the front loaded products with the entryway and then this would be the rear decks and the porches. The maximum height allowed is 40 feet and each unit shall consist of a minimum of 50% of brick or natural precast zone as exterior building materials according to the zoning ordinance. Next we'll take a look at the seven zoning impact analysis factors. The first one is suitability with nearby land uses. The subject property is surrounded by commercial and retail in medical office uses and is characterized by a mixed-use zoning district. The proposed townhome development would be considered a use that is appropriate within a transitional area. It is within close proximity to office retail uses and major workplaces in the city. The proposed development therefore would be suitable at this location with appropriate conditions. And this chart here shows in the top the proposed highlighted in yellow is the applicant, proposed development, the TR. And as you see down the list is all the commercial office, which is the John's Creek Medical Pavilion, Terraces, John's Creek Village Shopping Center, E-Bix Development, and Emery John's Creek Hospital. They're all surrounding this development. Next is Impact to Existing Uses. The subject property has remained undeveloped while adjacent properties on all sides have been developed since 2005, with a mix of commercial, retail and medical uses. The proposed development would not adversely affect existing uses, but would complement them by bringing a new, walkable community in close proximity to commercial, medical and office uses. The property appears to have a reasonable economic use as currently zoned. Next we'll take a look at the impacts on infrastructure. The proposed development is expected to generate 406 daily trips, which includes 26 trips during morning peak hour and 32 trips during evening peak hour. Based on the trip generation data for the development, staff is recommending the following conditions. To restripe the existing gore area along hospital parkway for a right-turn deceleration lane to service the development and to install stop signs to create an always-stop controlled intersection on both sides of the hospital parkway and e-bikesway. Fulton County water and sewer confirmed water and sewer capacity is available to service the proposed development. And Fulton County Schools, school board has identified a total of 12 to 46 students that would be anticipated from this development, but it would not have any impact on the school capacity as all schools currently are under capacity. Next, we'll take a look at consistency with the comprehensive plan. The subject property is located in the Tech Park community area, which is shown in this black store, is this location of the subject site, and purple is the Tech Park area. The vision for this community area is to become a live-work play destination for business owners who want to live in a premier residential community, have a short commute to their office and have an amenity rich park at their business front door. The comprehensive plans future land use map indicates commercial multi-family for this property. This land use category is defined as property containing housing units with more than four dwelling units per building, which includes town homes as an identified housing type. Therefore, the proposed development could be considered to conform with the policy and intent of the community areas land use element and with the comprehensive plans overall intended vision for housing specific to the technology park area, which is to expand housing options for employees working in the technology park, especially those in critical positions such as hospital workers. Any other considerations? The subject property and adjacent parcels were reasoned to mix use in 2002, pursuant to 2001 Z-0133, allowing for mixed use development consisting of commercial, retail, office, hotel, and up to 75 multi-family units above commercial. All uses except for housing and hotel have come to fruition as part of the overall development of the areas since 2005. Edition of a residential component would help to complete the intended mix of uses for this area. Environmental impacts. The environmental site analysis indicates that the proposed development would not disturb environmentally sensitive areas on the site. The two stone water management facilities are proposed for the development, as mentioned before. The first one is the an underground facility in the front of the site, and a stone water management pond towards the rear of the property. The applicant will be required to provide runoff reduction BMPs to comply with the city's natural resources and environmental protection ordinance prior to the issuance of a land disturbance permit. With that, staff recommends approval of land use petition RZ-24-002 with the conditions that are included in your staff report. That concludes my presentation. Thank you, Ms. Argo-Wall. All right. Would the applicant like to come forward, please? And you could do us a favor. Anybody speaking to this body, please state your name and address for the record. There we go. Good evening. My name is Din Webb, 1105 West P. Street, Atlanta, Georgia, 303 on on here on behalf of toll brothers before I begin. Let me introduce Jake Meek. Jake is the director of land acquisitions for toll brothers and is ready and willing to take your questions tonight. There's not a whole lot left for me to say. Ruchi covered a lot of ground there, but I'll try and fill in some blanks. You know, let me start by kind of reminding everybody we've been here twice before. I'm sure this all looks very familiar to you. We have shown up two times with the staff recommendation of approval, but we had a technical issue on the property. We had 80,000 cubic yards of Filder, we had to figure out what to do with. And we have resolved that as of about noon today. So we are good to go. And we are looking forward to moving forward tonight, hopefully. I talked a little bit about toll brothers. The first time I was here, I'm sure that's a name you guys know. Toll brothers is America's luxury home builder. They have been in business since 1967. Start about two brothers. They work in 24 states and they have several projects here in Georgia. They are the best of the best. I've got an image here of the property, Ruchy did a good job of explaining that. And I think the part I want to emphasize is, as she mentioned, back in 2002, this property was part of a 43 acre assemblage that was zoned for a variety of uses, right? All the which have been built except for basically one, which is 75 apartments over commercial. We are not here proposing apartments, but I think it's relevant because you talk about things like trip generation, right? You can reach you talked about the number of trips that this site will generate as a townhome development. You've got to compare it to what it would generate, I think as a multi-family development 75 unit. So it's just, it's relative in a lot of ways, including a trip generation. Let me show you my site plan. This is the proposal 60 owner occupied units. These are three stories with all with two car garages. As you heard, it's a combination of front load and rear load. I think importantly, as with all toll developments, this site will be heavily landscaped and heavily miniatized, right? That is part of their hallmark. You can see some images that toll put together to kind of give you the feel of the site. They call this a mood board because that's really what it is. These are images that represent sort of the vibe that Tolbrothers wants on this property. And you'll notice that there are a variety of open space, you know, passive active open space areas, including starting here in the front. You know, this is what we call active amenity A. They'll be in outdoor dining area, fire pit, bachiball, male kiosas, or sort of the ideas for this portion of the development. We've got here in the rear a stormwater pond, but it's actually going to be a minotise, right? There will be walking trails back there, bench seating, it's an amenity to take advantage of by the residents because of the proximity to the creek and the buffer that the creek will be on that portion of the site. We've got several passive parks here in the middle of the property in this general area. The first is passive park C that's proposed for sort of cornhole, you know, seating areas, things like that. Passive park D, which is in this general area, excuse me, line up, sorry, I started thinking of this kind of thing. So that is, you know, Whiffleball, Frisbee, it's a little bit bigger of an area there. And lastly, we've got a small pocket park, we call pocket park E in this area that we can, you know, is proposed to have a fire pit. I've got some elevations, these are the same ones. Ruchie showed you saw just a wick through these quickly. But again, this is the front load unit here. These are the rear load units that Ruchie covered in her presentation. You've heard staffs recommending approval subject to conditions that we agree to, so I'm going to abbreviate my presentation and just touch on a couple points for us to stop talking. I think number one, this makes sense given what's on the ground, right? You've got restaurants, you've got office, you've got everything that a live work play environment requires except for the live part. And again, back in 2002 when this project was originally improved, live was contemplated. And because of that, this development represents an opportunity to sort of complete the vision that was started several decades ago. And I think probably most importantly, as you heard from staff, this proposal is consistent with both the criteria in the code and the compliance. So this is consistent with what I think John's Creek envisions for this property, not just 20 years ago when Fulton County was controlling things, but also looking forward. So with that, I think I'll stop there. I'm happy to take any questions you have. I'll reserve my time and we'd ask for recommendation to approval subject to staff conditions. Thank you. Five minutes and 24 seconds will be reserved. Okay, great. So we'll come back to you with questions. But at this time, I would like to open it up to anybody in the audience who would like to speak in favor of the project. And by the way, if you didn't notice, if you have cards, there's cards in the back if you want to speak to the audience. Would anybody like to speak in favor of the project from the audience? Would anybody in the audience like to speak in opposition to the case? Okay, well that was easy. Okay, so that being said, I'm gonna close the open forum and We'll come back to that. So I think at this point we will open it up to questions From the planning commission. I'll kind of defer myself and my questions to the end. But I'd like to start on the right here with Commissioner Horton to begin it. Commissioner Horton. Yes, Dan, if you could come up please. Curious, can you tell us what you decide to do with the 80,000, whatever million, whatever it is, square feet of the- 80,000 square feet. It's still got to go. Yeah. What we were concerned about was whether, when it needed to go, do we need to get it off the ground or off the property before rezoning? Right. What can we do it later? And we worked out in arrangement with the owner, so it will be done later. Okay. We'd still like to do it quickly but it's not going to hold up the rezoning. Alright, yeah. Because there's somebody out there looking for that dirt right? We know. See that's a fundamental problem. You know, once you start moving you've got to find somebody to take it. We can say I need dirt right now, but the question is, what do you need it in a year? Right. Right. We've wrestled with that issue for a long time, and we think we have a solution. Okay, very good. I actually commend you for waiting till you had that figured out before you came in front of us, because I know there's a lot of people who think the show must go on. But if you're not ready for it to go on, you shouldn't. So thank you for doing the right thing there. I know that we have the square footage, expectation of these units. Do you, are they two bedroom, three bedroom? I'm trying to figure out, are we really targeting more families that are going there? Are we looking at maybe people who are done with their family time and they're looking to downsize. What do you think your demographic is? An age and kids that might come there trying to figure out for the schools? Yeah, typically speaking, this is not a great development for kids, right? It is generally speaking, young professionals, potentially young professional couples, or older folks who are not quite ready to move into the retirement community. So I saw that number of anticipated school kids. I've been doing this a long time. It sounds like maybe you have to. Yeah. That number is often high and I suspect it would be a little bit high here. It's high and it's also a big range, right? Right. Which I get that because you don't know. Are you going to be building these units to have higher technology because again, maybe some of the people that go there will work from home so that will also affect the daily trips at the peak hours in a positive way, meaning less? Absolutely. I mean, because of particularly the younger demographic that will be a part of this development, there are concessions made. In fact, a three or four bedroom unit is typically built now knowing that one of those bedrooms is going to become an off. That's right. So yes, it will be designed for that type of buyer. And the price point, by the way, is about $700,000. Okay, great. For now, that's all my questions. But I might come back and ask more. Thank you. The problem. Great. Thank you, Commissioner Carmel. Yes, I. So, my question is, so I pass through that hospital park where every day, a couple of times, you know, it's just, it's a narrow road with the hospital on the side and there's emergency entrance also through that road. And my question is more to staff on whether, you know, who did the traffic study or, you know, you guys thinking that that adding these town homes would block in any way, you know, the traffic that't have access to them just like it exists today. One thing that we did ask the applicant to consider as part of their traffic study and I believe it was done by Kim Lee Horn, we recommend that Kim Lee Horn to them because of the fact that the entitlements that was approved for the Emory Hospital. So we wanted to see if there was any impacts of this development in relationship to that. And so that was exhaustively looked at. And it concluded that based upon the number of units, the number of trips, it won't have a detrimental impact to the hospital. And the four-way stop will basically be sufficient, right? Four-way stop for the type of use that's being proposed. That was also reviewed by our Public Works Department. And that was the recommendation along with what Kimlee Orn mentioned and that's why we converted that into a condition. Just one more question around. So is there enough, I think there's probably study around, that there's enough space for emergency vehicles to go back in and forth, right? There should not be an issue with that. I don't see around about any of that stuff. Oh, yeah, yeah. I mean, there's no need for around about in this particular case. Roundabout is usually, as a, yeah. I'm not saying like cul-de-sac, like where they can make a U term, right? Oh, yeah. So I mean, this has to be all accounted for. And they would also be accounted for further in terms of, We're to grant them 60 units as an entitlement. If they can't meet the emergency apparatus requirement, that doesn't mean they get to build all 60. They would have to meet all requirements as part of our land development planning review. Okay. I have another question about. I'm sorry Mr. Carmel. Commissioner Carmel, I wanted to address the fire because we did actually go back to the applicant and if you see the site plan there is sort of a Hammerhead or enough radius to turn to fire truck. Yes. Yes, three point turns. So yeah, we did account for that so I have another question about There's a public participation meeting right and they came back with the one with sure plantings. So there's something, do you wanna leave the, the word area, some of that towards the back, towards the stream, how do you plan to accommodate that? So on the backside, because of the creek, we have a buffer and all those trees will be left. We had proposed, there's a landscape strip proposed, I believe for the front and the sides. We had no opposition, We just happened to show up on the community meeting on a night when there was a very active matter I think it was at Reynolds Farm matter you guys probably remember that one So nobody was there for us, but one lady did ask if we would consider putting more mature trees in the buffer areas And we said we would Yeah, that's all from my side for now Right, thank you commissioner Jackson so commissioner Horton must have been looking at her my shoulder with my nose. That's right. So you mentioned the dirt was resolved and I don't want to harp on it. But how is it resolved? Because 80,000 is a lot of dump truck trips, right? I mean, is that the resolution is hauling it out of there? I mean, because that's a lot of Yeah, we have to get rid of it anybody who wanted to come build on this property whether it's our project or another would have to get that dirt off the site So that really wasn't the issue the question was when and and how do we account for the cost frankly? Got so we've solved we've solved it it but, that dirt still has to go. Because that was one of my questions initially was, the added cost of that is it can affect the amenities or the prices of the homes. And I think you addressed that last time. It will not now. Okay. Okay. And Commissioner Horton also mentioned 1900, obviously it's the minimum. Is there a maximum or is that what each of them are? Now my understanding is the range is about 19126 hundred is that okay okay that's great I think 1900s the minimum in the TR district okay and is someone who served on the school governance councils at Audrey mill and John's Creek I got excited to see these new student numbers because we're an aging community and our schools serve we're under by a decent bit and when you budget for schools, you also budget for teachers. And so when you can add new people or new students, you can add teachers. And then you kind of said, well, maybe that's not the case. But I think there'll be some kids, but there never as many as you think. There's no way there'll be 46 kids here. I've got three boys and a dog and there's no way on Earth, we would be fighting all day long if we didn't have some yard space, it'll be more room. So a town home is a perfect product for people in different phases of their life. And so most of the people who fit the sort of the target here certainly don't have a full family. But there'll be some kids I suspect, but it's not gonna be a lot. Well, I think your timing is good, especially with Boston scientific going to open up soon bringing on 461 new jobs. I mean, you've got the potential there to get some folks to live across the street. And I do like all the staff recommendations. I think you guys did a good job of adding 13 attachments to it, to make this workable for everybody. So, thank you for coming back and buttoning them all this up for us. Happy to be back. Thank you, Commissioner Jackson. Commissioner Nuh? Yeah. I have a I have one question. So when do you plan to break ground for in this project if it goes through I'm trying to think in terms of timeline. So, I'm going to give you a brief break around about summer next year. Summer next year. Okay, great. And my other question was to staff. So, when we approved the expansion for the hospital, we had thought about three or four things in that area four. So, this will get incorporated in that, the road improvements and all that. Yeah, I mean, it will be separate. That one was a DRI trigger, so there's a lot more expansive work that they would need to do off-site as well. This is specifically pertaining to this development, but shouldn't have a negative impact on all the other stuff that they need to do. Very good suggestion to have the same traffic studies. It's the same form because it's just that one road and we are expanding it. Okay, great. That's all the questions. Thank you. Great, thank you. Mr. Ketson. Yes, I have a couple of questions for staff. To remove the excess soil on the site, will that require, can you confirm that requires a site dirt removal permit? Yeah, I mean, so this is the conversation that we've been having before coming into this in regards to the removal of the dirt. The city doesn't approve grading only permits, because we don't want sites to sit as is from years. This is different than that. I understand. Yeah, so this one, it'll be done as part of the land disturbance permit, and it'll be part of their phasing of erosion control, moving dirt and so forth, but it'll be part of a full LDP. Will you require the development team to put in their construction entrances at this phase. That's a requirement. And what about wheel wash? Because they're going to be there 80,000 yards is lines of dump trucks. Yeah, it'll be part of the construction exit requirement. Wheel washes? Yes. Great. Thank you. exit requirement. We'll wash us. Yes. Great. Thank you. One last thing. In this conversation, the term parks was used again. Yes. And you know how I feel about that? Yes, I do. A lawn is not a park. A amenity. A lawn with corn hole on it is not a park. It's an apocalyptic park. It's an amenity space. So I think it's a good follow up. It's not something that I had brought up yet, but I'd like to maybe talk about defining what a park is a little more in our code. Sure. And again, I don't want to blame the applicant. That was his choice of work. I'm not blaming you. I'm not blaming him. You don't have to blame that. No, I'm just kidding. No, I think we have a different term. Yes. Yeah. All I was trying to say is we've got lawn spread out throughout this development, including one huge one in the back with trails on it. If you actually buy that and put it in, I mean a botchy is permanent, hopefully. Cornhole could disappear, you know. And Frisbee's bring her own. Thank you. Great. I just have a thank you, Commissioner Katz. And I just have a couple of quick questions. First of all, nice job to the planning staff. As usual, very comprehensive. Mr. Webb, thank you for your presentation. We've been eagerly waiting to see this. So this is good. We have been eagerly waiting to see this. So this is good. What I think is prominent in all of our minds is for those of us that have been on the commission for a couple of years. We were here when the presentation by Emory John's Creek Hospital was done. But we also know that the timing on Emory John's Creek Hospital could be a number of years down the road. So I was happy to see and that I was gonna be one of my questions to the planning staff, is that there is a comprehensive plan to integrate all this information together, because the concern I always have in any city is are we playing connect the dots? We do not wanna make decisions isolated in one silo, and not consider all the other silos that ought to be concurrently considered. And it sounds like, you sounds like that was done. I did have a couple of questions for you, just more kind of technical things. You mentioned that the apartment that townhome sizes would be 19 to 2,600. How does that translate into bedrooms? Number of bedrooms approximately? Is that 3, 4? I don't know. 3, 3. So you could have multiple use in houses. You could conceivably have families here, right? Even though it's not necessarily your primary targeted demographics, correct? You could, but really the fourth bedroom in the townhome world now is a flex space, right? And all of that, so work at room or something like that. Right, right. And so, you know, one of the questions I had, you know, like many of us who live in the area, we drive down that street about five times a day. And of course, very familiar with the inference by e-bix on the right and across. And there's already two stop signs there. And I read that you're gonna add more stop signs. And then there's gonna be a turning lane, a transition lane, I think we call it deceleration lane, right? Okay, so if you do have school buses because even though you're saying there's not going to be a lot of kids, there are going to be some kids, right? You've got north view, high school, etc. Whatever, is there going to be provisions? Where would they actually pick up disembark with a school bus in the deceleration lane, or how's that an envision to be done? So my understanding is that that is a conversation that occurs at some point later, either during permitting or near the end of the project. And the school board basically tells you we're going to pick you up pick the kids up here. So I don't know that we have discretion over that. Okay. So a question is, is the deceleration lane long enough that if at 8 o'clock in the morning they need to be picking up for Northview High School and making U turns on that road to get back on Medlock Bridge that can be done without issue, or would they be forced to go into the development, do we know? I mean, to be honest with you, just looking at the development of how it's laid out, I don't think a school bus will go in there. Okay. Because they're not going to have multiple stops in the 60 unit development. Most likely going to be in the diesel lane, the dieseleration, the right turn lane, and essentially into the neighborhood. If it's the right turn lane, then they would have the ability to make that left turn if they need be onto Ebexway to go back. Right, right. Okay. And just to put some context on the trip. So we submitted numbers for AM and PM trips. Yeah. We're talking about a car every two to three minutes. I mean, it's not like, even in the busiest hour of the morning in the afternoon, so it's not like there's a line of cars coming in or out. So if you've got five kids in this development getting on a school bus, it's probably going to take a couple minutes, but not much. It's not going to interrupt. Yeah, I think the only thing I want to be careful of here is that there aren't unintended consequences and that the deceleration lane is long enough to allow That if people are exiting entering whatever is they're not being blocked by a school bus because there's a number of commissioners Is pointed out that road is pretty narrow and sometimes people fly down it. I don't care if there's a stop sign there or not I mean, I've had issues there Even with a stop sign where people go flying through we all know how this works. And so it's not a show stopper, but it's just something that as we're doing stop signs, et cetera, because the issue long term of that road, which I understand is going to be paid for by Emory Hospital and their presentation to us eventually down the road. Is that correct? I believe for the improvements that they have to put in the road for them. That could be 10, 15 years from now, based on their development schedule. So that's not going to be any kind of a short term solution for this. OK, well great. By the way, I do agree with Commissioner Jackson. I think that this is the type of project this city needs. I mean, more and more, we see work live play environments going on. I also think, we don't mandate your price point, but I do think at a price point like this, you'll get a lot of interest in the community and young professionals. And considering the fact that Emory Hospital is expanding over the next 15 years by about threefold, I'll bet anything you're gonna get a lot of hospital workers that park themselves in your development and then just wanna walk to work at Emory as a part of that expansion down there. So those are all the questions I have. Any other questions from any of the commissioners or are we ready to make a motion here? All right. Would somebody like to make a motion? Yeah, I'd like to make a motion to approve land use petition RZ24002 with staff conditions. Oh, second. Great, thank you. So land use position RZ, I'll, so tune we have to vote. So all those in favor, we do have to vote. That's kind of key. all those in favor? We do have to vote, that's kind of key. All those in favor say aye. Any opposed? Motion passes, six zero, concerning land use position, RZ-24 is at zero zero two. Thank you very much, Mr. Webb appreciate your time and your colleague as well. So, all right. Next order of business on the agenda is land use position rz-24-004 with a concurrent variance bc-24-003. So, Ms. Argerwal, we turn it over to you. So, I think in your packets the applicant has requested a withdrawal of this application, so that letter was included. The applicant is here to answer any questions, but if you have any questions with the staff, I think it was a pretty detailed withdrawal letter due to financial concerns and you know, the over the course of the discussions with the applicant, this is ultimately the course. Okay. Personally, I don't have any questions, I'll open it up to my colleagues. So I know you don't have a crystal ball, but what happens? What's the property? What happens in the property? Yeah, I mean, is there been other interests? I mean, was there anybody that's else approach to the city? Okay. No. Okay. So is it that's a great question Commissioner Jackson. So what's in the building now? Is it operating? No, it's vacant. All the existing senior residents, I guess they have emptied vacated building. Okay. I have a question. Does Johns Creek have three empty senior living centers. It is correct with this property, yes. The one is across John's Reeky. That is IV Falls or IV Halls assisted living. And then the Cohen Homes of Jones Bridge Road and Bice Road Intersection and then the Sunrise. Is anyone coming in to talk other than this applicant who has come in and talked but withdrew to talk about converting those? This particular property? Any of them? We have. We consistent received calls about those properties. And then the staff basically tells us what's in the comprehensive plan, what's our vision, and what's the zoning. Yes, we definitely have been receiving calls. Okay. So I do have a question for staff and you, Mr. Carnwell, Katzen brought up a good point is, so what happens if a building is sitting there and no one's in it for a long period of time? What happens? As from a city standpoint? From a city standpoint, I mean, unless the building becomes blighted over time, there's really nothing it would sit as is. It still has a property owner. It's not abandoned in any which way. Now the property owner is looking to potentially determine what other options may be available in the future. But with the withdrawal being a final option, there will be a time in which a period in time they would have to wait before they could come back for another request for rezoning on the property. Okay. Ben, can I ask that question slightly different? So does the city have requirements of property owners of what their upkeep needs to be? So that we know if they're not doing it, there's an opportunity for either finding them or taking some action. A lot of times it's not really relegated to the interior of the building. It's more the exterior and the exterior property. So yes, we do have the International Property Maintenance Code that deals with maintenance requirements, just the minimum standards that are required. Then I have a question regarding the interior of these buildings. If any of them were built with code that required R13 fire protection and whatnot, is the owner obligated to maintain that as an active system while it is not operating? Do you know? Not the off the top of my head. I mean, technically from last name point, I really don't know the answer to that. I mean, if it's being in use in any which way, they would have to follow whatever the requirements were at the time when it was constructed. But if there's no one occupying it, that's hard to say. I would think their insurance would require something in order to continue to have insurance on the property. That's my experience on that. If you want to speak, could you do me a favor and just come to the mic and state your name and address? Yes. Hello. How's it going? Good. My name is Dan Marinco. I'm with Partners Development Group. My address is 487 Bishop Lane Woodstock, Georgia. Great. I am with the ownership group for this particular building, and so we were the applicants that worked with Ruchie and Ben. And first of all, I want to say they do a fantastic job. So the whole state of Johns Creek is in good hands, especially with you guys at the home. Exciting things to come, listening to a lot of these proposals, being at a few meetings the last few months. I will say that unfortunately our plan here was to, we bought the property closed on it, we had intentions of the full time winding down the property to re-zoned basically a complete interior conversion that would require a different use. As we've seen being in the senior living industry for my whole career, Phoenix Senior Living would be the operator. They're headquartered out of Roswell, Georgia, and have a South East should hub, but HQ'd in this area. It's a very hands-on in the stand of Georgia. We've seen much like the world of the scene since COVID, a pretty crazy scenario where you saw kind of a collapse in first of all the labor market, right? Labor's still very hard and so going back to some of your guys' comments about closed buildings, part of what we were initially hoping to accomplish was you know leveling out some of these things that are becoming concerns in the senior living operating world, part of that being taking labor offline here to be able to supply it in full capacity to other communities. The same notes go with still a recovering industry as it relates to occupancy just since COVID. So there's a lot of different factors that we felt like we were helping not only our own plans but in the local market and we were excited to do that. To clarify, yes, the building is being shut down. It's not completely closed yet, but it's on the tail end of that process. And unfortunately, as we were going through the rezoning process, ran into some items when you're talking about an interior building that you're looking to convert. You can't see behind the walls, right, at first glance. And so as we dig into these things, we do have another case study, a very similar project that we're doing in Cobb County and that project was sped up. We're able to understand more about the project and the requirements from the construction side, which really took this particular project over the edge from a cost perspective. Couldn't have foreseen that at a time. Really wish as you made the statement earlier, don't go and tell you know this is something that came up and unfortunately weren't able to kind of level out the capital markets. However, I would like to kind of use just this one segment to voice just, I guess a question related to staff at staff and commission at this point in time. We do have the full intention to make best use of this property in the long term. As of now, we have to request withdrawal because any future use won't match the zoning that we were shooting for, which was apartment limited in nature. The product was going to be more age restricted senior apartments, which would lower the price point. It would still be a very similar resident profile. However, the overall cost would come down quite a bit to meet the middle market, which is an underserved piece of the senior living puzzle in today's world. We do have the opportunity to pivot to other uses. I understand that with a withdrawal going to final decision, there is a 12-month window for a new decision to be made. I've probably worn these guys out with questions and conversations surrounding, you know, any ways to chat through if there's any opportunity to work around that and find a spot to meet in the middle. We probably would be able to pursue another reason, faster if possible. However, if that's not possible, we are going to be forced to sit with an empty property on about six and a half acres of land. And that I consider prime real estate right off of Old Alabama Road directly across from Newtown Park on a very wonderful side of town. I don't know if there's any examples of that in the past. It doesn't sound like it, but if there was any possibility of discussing a short and time period that could be pursued, we would be very happy to discuss if not, we would definitely look forward to getting back on the docket months down the road to align with the new top lines. So, I think that's a good point. I think that's a good point. We would be very happy to discuss. If not, we would definitely look forward to getting back on the docket months down the road to align with the new top lines. All right. Well, thank you for that explanation. And by the way, good luck with your project. And whatever point it is in the future, we'll look forward to having you back here with something new in mind, etc. So absolutely appreciate your time. Thank you very much. So we do need to make a formal motion to, what's the term? withdraw, thank you. withdraw. I have a question if it's in the previous. Please. Please. Then given the reason for the withdrawal, being based on factors out of their control capital markets and things, is there any kind of angle that could be taken as far as having to wait 12 months and maybe because of the reason that they had the withdrawal that there's a different way to look at it? No, I mean, I totally understand the evolution of the market, different things come up. There's so many different ways you could argue a reason for which draw. We don't have a list. I mean, the intent of that was always from the standpoint from council side of what they refer to as resident fatigue, so that they didn't have multiple rezoning coming on the same site where neighbors or folks that may oppose it or have questions about have to come out multiple times. And so that's why they want to have a time in which there was a break in between a rezoning action. So that's the way it's built out in our ordinance. So that being said just to follow up with Commissioner Horton, does that mean that you could conceivably propose to the City Council to have some consideration on something. But of course the applicant would have to have something prepared earlier. Or is it just kind of more written that it has to be 12 months? I mean, it's very specific in our ordinance as to that process. We've tried to change that in the past. And you want to be consistent? We have to be consistent for the sake of being from a technical standpoint. Yes. You don't want to make up rules as you go along. That's not the way to run a government. All right. So we do need a formal motion to withdraw, with draw land use position, RZ-24 is at 004 with the concurrent variance, 24 dash 003. Can I get a motion for that? All right. current variance 2, 4, dash 0, 0, 3. Can I get a motion for that? All right. In that case, you may have made the motion. I just made the motion. Can I get a second then? Thank you. All those in favor? All right. Motion passes 6, 0. Thank you very much. All right. Next item of business on the agenda, I believe is any departmental updates? I can inform you about the next meeting, which is October 1st. It's going to be a busy meeting. We have three rezoning cases and two staff, one text amendments, and tax amendment for outdoor storage, yes. And then the comprehensive plan amendment to incorporate revitalization plan. So there will be five items on the agenda. Should we bring breakfast? Or? Sleeping bag is more like it. Can I bring my sleeping bag at night? That is on October 1st, yes. So one other note, it's actually a case that was scheduled for November. I believe it was RZ240010, which is MBFAR. MBFARMS. I'm so sorry, it's all getting over. The three cases that I said were actually for November meeting, not for, so October meeting is two rezoning cases, but again the comprehensive plan amendment, right? Yes. And the tax amendment. And the tax amendment. Okay. And so, yeah, sorry, the RZ240010, which is the MB Farm property, that was originally scheduled for November, but there are a lot of different things, issues that we need to make sure that we have enough time to work through with the applicant. So we did offer the applicant the availability of administratively withholding. And so they agreed, so that would likely go to our December planning commission here. I have a question. Have you had an opportunity to draft anything about the storage units that we could ask questions right now or should we wait? I would say less wait. I'll send you some links to the discussions we had as part of work session. This was a council initiated text amendment, zoning amendment. And so we've had three different work session meetings related to it so I'll send you links to all three of those and you could have some fun watching it over the weekend Thank you So I do have one question for you guys from a planning standpoint I know we have meetings. I believe scheduled through at least November maybe December. I don't know What about for 2025? I know we're moving into as of October 1, a new fiscal year for the city. When do you think we'll start to see proposed dates for calendar year 25? So people can get it on their calendars. I'm currently working on this schedule right now and I will have it said been in reach about the end of the week. Okay, and I understand you you got things to work around between the city council and timing and our schedules and all that kind of stuff. But just out of respect for my fellow commissioners, I think it's important to start getting that stuff out so we can get things locked on our calendar. This is an important meeting. So all right. Any other updates? Any other questions or conversation from any commissioners? All right. I'd like to make a motion to adjourn. I will second that motion. All those in favor? Aye. All right. Motion passes. All right. All right.