Board of Directors of the 30th, today's Wednesday 19th and we are calling this meeting to order at 6.32. We have a little call to the staff. Director Silby, here's Director Wilson. Here Director Raxton. Here? Director Madez. Here? Director Vande, Director Ejel. And our next item of business is our Pledge of Allegiance. We have our board to provide for the year more to the new state of honor. Please stand, obedient. I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands, one nation, under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. For all. Thank you. I'm going to start my business as the adoption of the agenda. Before we adopt that, I'd like to bring everyone's attention to our new format that we have on our agenda. And that is to make it easier for the district to conduct business, make what we're doing easier to understand, bring more more clarity and information upfront to everyone in our community. You'll notice that we have ruled the items called from the consent agenda down to general business, to the bottom of general business, as done by other agencies, and general business is now called action items. We've also ruled committee updates forward so that we're not redundant and speaking about the committee actions that come forward to the board. And this is all to reduce our redundancy, increase efficiency for our agenda. And staff, any comments on our agenda? Yes, I'd like to point out in 5A, there is a typo. The second item is May 17, not April 17. It's May 22. Oh, yes, I'm sorry. Yes, please. Yes. OK. Any other comments on agenda motion? I'm going to adopt agenda. Oh, correct. What's the minor correction on item 5, a, on the thing of the second item? And I'll second them. All in favor say aye. Aye. No, abstain? Okay, 5-0. Denda has been passed. Moving on to item 3, recognition of the appointment and presentation. We do have the honor of one of our boarded supervisors who here joining us. Thank you for being here, but we're really happy to make it. This is Lauren Parlin. She represents part of our district with the council. Moving on to open forum, we have expanded some of the information under public forum. I will encourage instructions. I will leave that to you to read that we want here from all of you. We encourage input to help us in our community. And if you would like to speak to the board on items that are not on today's agenda, we would love to hear from you. Anyone would like to speak? We'll start right here in the front. Frederick Bowling-Kiamert-Part, I have three points I'd like to discuss. Bring forward. Putting the agenda, pack it out. After 48 hours, I believe, is a violation of the Brown Act. It makes it very difficult for us, the public, to absorb, read, and prepare for public meetings. I would like the board to assure the public that this will not happen again. There's really no reason that it should happen. Second thing is, in regards to the bond, the board consistently tells us that they have to meet certain requirements of the bond, certain programs, certain activities, etc. But I finally got my hands on the bond and I read it. And there's what I would say is a very important element of the bond that's not being followed and it's the citizens oversight committee. I had never ever heard of the citizens oversight committee that the board has spoke about, has nominated or has even put into place. I think that needs to happen and that should happen immediately. On March 29, I submitted a public register request. I have a copy of it here, but I haven't heard any confirmation that you received it. I haven't heard any confirmation of the status of it. I received an email from Mr. Gardner asking me to call him. I responded asking what it was regards to because he didn't say anything and I would like to find out what this is the second time I have submitted a public records request with no feedback from the board so thank you. Thank you. Next person in the back please. Okay. My name is Jay Archie Torn. I'm a former employee of the Carroll Park CSK and a 20-year resident here in Carroll Park. So I want to start off by saying thank you very much for putting on the summer spectacular. I know it's a hard thing to do. I know you guys are in a lot of pressure, a lot of stress. I'm here today to talk about the price. I reached out to staff and Kudos here to staff got back and he right away when they had addressed kind of all my concerns. And I honestly believe it's a $20 value to get in. I'm just my fear is it's going to price out some young families. If you have three kids, it's $100 to get into the game. But again, thank you for putting it on because I know you didn't have to do that. I would like to kind of formally request to be on some sort of committee for next year summer spectacular I hope that this is the best summer spectacular that there's ever been and two decades from now You guys are showing up wondering why it's not the same as it was in 2024 Last one was a little pricey and I don't think it was as good as it could have been again I hope this one's phenomenal, but if not I would really really really like to offer my services kind of a volunteer Capacity I put on a firework show with my district that I work with right now. It's free to the public. There's alternatives to revenue, I think, that might have been this. And again, I think they might have been this because you guys are so busy with a lot of things. And I think your staff does a phenomenal job. Very appreciative and happy to be a camp park resident. So if there is not the huge summer spectacle ever, I would really appreciate someone to reach out to me and be a part of next year's summer spectacular. And planning, I think, is evolving going on. I think there's smartorship opportunities. I'm going to open in once every week's out to Eldrata Hill CSQ. And maybe doing a combined show. I know that Eldrata Hill CSQ district border is a half mile from Farr Park Lake. They've got their open open up houses 0.75 miles. I think Laurel Oaks Park is 1.4 miles, Bastley Park is 1.5 miles. All those residents are going in terms of attack. It's awesome that they do. But I think the CSC for Elf-Roy Hills doesn't put on their own show. So team it up together might be a good thing. I know currently with the district on right right now we we team up with another park district, and that's how we do offer the show for free. So I just think there's more alternatives besides pricing residents out of the show, because it's a phenomenal show. I think it's a staple of this community I've been going to for years. And again, thank you for putting it on and know what's not easy to do. So appreciate all your effort and hopefully I can reach out to you too and that's where I stand. Thank you for your time. Great, thank you very much. Yes, the clerk, Barbara Rogers, Cameron Card. I sent an email to all the members of the board on the 17th of June. I'm truly grateful for all of you who have the opportunity to read the information as well as listen to the voice message left by Ellen Gardner for Supervisor Laurie Parlin. You can imagine how I felt when I received this information on June 14th from Supervisor Parlin's office. For the record, I did not do what Mr. Gardner said. There is no way, visit, either her or Supervisor Turnbue and said the report cost $40,000. I did, however, make a remark which I have had removed on the Mountain Democrat, on the article. I said that we paid $45,000 for Mr. Ashton's participation. I understand that he saw that, and I just put his own spin on it. As I said, I called the Mountain Democrat. I asked Noel the editor to remove my comments. With that said, I am baffled why he would contact not one, but two seated supervisors, the other being George Turnbue. And I forwarded that voice message onto you all this afternoon. I'm surprised and disappointed that Mr. Garden had the time to call our local representative and complain about my communications, any communications that I might have had with them. I am a member of the public that he is supposed to serve. If he disagrees with my perspective, which is based on the decades of local experience, especially in the field of fire services, he can inform the same representatives of the facts that he thinks they need to know without making it personal against me. Our representatives are more than capable of forming their own opinions on our local matters. For Mr. Gardner to insult my integrity and knowledge is unprofessional and unacceptable. I want to put it into the record, my transcriptions of Mr. Gardner's voice messages to both supervisors and Lori's email response to him. In all the years I've been coming here, I have never in my life been so upset to be disparaged like this. And I expect you as a board to do something. And as one person on this board said, he said I was a broken the bear. What the heck is that? I'm not poking anybody. Thank you, Kirch. Yes, please. Thank you, Jacob's Camman Park. Much like Brad, I was reading the supporters of their lengthy attachments to the agenda for tonight. We're not released to the public in the Monday afternoon. This might not give sufficient time for most to read and digest materials, especially given that they are so lengthy and complex and particularly including their proposed budget, which has been reformatted, which I think is a good thing. I really don't care what the Brown Act requires as a minimum. That, to me, the Brown Act is a minimum. We should be doing better than that, to be able to get the information out in the public. How about a week? So they have a chance to actually move in use the suggested. I actually feel sorry for all of you for me because as I understand it, you've got to probably about the same time we did and you guys have otherwise too. I just think that we can do better than this. Encouraging public involvement in this organization should be a priority. The agenda tonight demonstrates to me that this organization is going in the wrong direction by attempting to limit opportunities for public input. I'm very concerned about this. To not have the budget subcommittee meeting before this budget is approved similarly, that has to be approved, I guess, by the end of the June is unacceptable. Even if the budget can be amended, that doesn't excuse this delay release. To me, this demonstrates that the staff in the district is spending taking time on more, taking on more assignments and duties that may have been accomplished in the time of the matter. If they're having to work seemingly superhuman hours in order to get things done, as according to our general manager reports, something is wrong that their priorities of this organization out of black. Another priority of this district should be to write size itself. Remember what Julia is to say about right sizing this district so that they can provide the most essential, sensual, legally required services that this district is obligated to provide. Once that is assured, then other services can be at as funding and staffing is available. We do not serve the public well by providing all the bells and whistles while we simply are understaffed and underfunded to do so. As Don Hashton stated on page 16 of his report, the second full paragraph from the bottom, the residents of this district have come to expect an extraordinary of RAND services from this relatively small organization. This is all the while we cannot afford to pay for any of the options for the fire services according to Mr. Actions report. We have only managed to get this far and will have some time as it was discussed at this last meeting to make a decision about where we are going with fire services because of the conservative budgeting by Calviber. Their efforts are greatly appreciated, as otherwise we could be in on panic right now. It changes our not-made to our overall expenses, and the voters do not approve of an increase in their taxes or assessments that it seems you're going to be going for. You only be in a worse position as your expenses naturally increase over time. I can't help but think that we are kicking the can down the curb. The sooner we establish priorities and explain to the community, truly what sort of financial condition we are in, the better we will be on the long run. Thank you. Thank you. More input from the public. We'd love to hear from you. more input from the public. We'd love to hear from you. Okay, thank you all for speaking and really speaking. Next item on our agenda is our consent agenda. And that is to confirm the agenda of staff. Any comments on those? Yes, on 5A. On the March 20th, conformed agenda on the third page. The last sentence is incorrect. The motion to approve resolutions with painting, assembly hall did not include refurbishing of the implore and was removed and that goes over to the next page as well. So I was stated in directly motion as it went forward with solely APC assembly Thank you, Assembly Hall. Then on May 22nd meeting on page 405 Just to make clear item nine Item nine page four Item 9, page 4, the Board gave the DM an insert direction to move forward extending the current contract to Cal Fire for the next few years. Simply for clarification. We have first and second. I'll favor say aye. All right. Opposed? Staying? All right. Five zero. Our performance is good. Has been approved with those questions. Item six, informational items. And staff. We're all in. You want to kick us off on that? Would you like to read? Sorry? Would you like me to read it? No. I guess I'm asking you to address items A, C, D, and E. Oh, okay. The items that we not have before were from the ladies of the didn't be structurally, we're going to have going forward all of the numbers and everything for things. But the ones which actually occur will be needed and it would have been better to mention that by this first time through. So we will do better on that next time. So for item 6 we only have under there the general management report. There's other reports. Jim, they're not. Right. All right. Any comments from the board regarding the general manager's report? Questions? This is a question for clarification on informational items. Is it the intent in the future? So for instance, the finance office report is arch-reported and recommend that you send it to the department. It's not committees. Is it the you send these to departments, not committees. So the intent for there to be reports from the board. We intend the department heads moving forward to make reports they have an individual in the past. Part of what I want to see is the report. Depending on what it is, I may or may not include it in my event. But for this time, because of the amount of work that I did, I did that, moving forward, I intend carbon heads to have a month before. Is that going to depend on, it's another agenda item, so I guess we'll wait until we talk about the next. So I don't want to be careful on setting that up. The cream churro. Until we make decision. Is that move? There were comments on the general managers report then. Not. Don, he's a ten. A couple comments. First on the committee report outs. Parks is not met since January and I'll be heard clear and requesting and meeting this month. A couple other questions thunder in the park. I know it here will be in charge for parking right on because gate is an in-yet and given some history I'm not doing cash away from the office here. Okay. Can you really question, Stan? And the park gate, what do we have a permit in? That is taken more time than I would like, and I had asked for help in speeding it up. But we understand at this point that we have only one sentence to add before it goes back, and we hope that it will be issued. Okay. But we have been tracking that and asking closely. We don't control it. Ellen, could you also try to speak up a bit too? Oh, sorry. Thank you. Sit. Any comments, questions? Yeah, actually on the gate I did contact a surprise apartment and a surprise return bowl, and they both were helpful. And so a lot of their business is dealing with permits. So I would like to hear an idea to appreciate. Yeah, so we do appreciate it. Any interventions on your part? And explain that we are a community of 20,000 is losing revenue in where dire straights and it's not like a pool is going in or a patio. But nothing this happens fast. I would like to hear your response to the price of $20, $20 admission for both children and adults. What is the thinking on that for their summer spectacular? We, you know, this is the first summer spectacular under the new team and without the prior staff that did put it on. We did a call around and checked on the pricing on other similar events in the county and Sacramento County. What we found was that there was a charge for parking. We're not charging for parking. And that there was a charge for person to get in. And then once you were in, there were charges for the events. So what we did that's different this year is, yes, there's a $20 charge. What do you get for that? year is yes there's a $20 chart. But we get for that. Well your child will not be charged anything more for a highly upgraded children's fun zone. We have three major pull-up wet things for them to play in and we got a dunk tank. Director Israel is volunteered just by the hour in it, and otherwise, you all wind up, you know. But it's no extra. No extra. And nowhere should anything get here. We can option that one. Hey, my target, not enough. But we have lifeguards that are volunteer to be in there for the other time. That's an amenity that would have cost you 20, 30 bucks and more in any of the other sites that we've seen. We have upgraded food trucks and because of the issue with alcohol last year, we're not allowing outside drinks to come in because this is a family-friendly event. We're going to keep it that way. We do have an alcohol garden generator is coming in, but when you come in the gate and enter the park you will have a blue wristband for an entrance and you will have a red wristband if you're 21 and above and no one without a red. There's going to be tightly controlled. We have added a little bit to the fireworks show, but one of the things we're particularly proud to be able to present, we've got three World War II warbirds owned by members of the community who live in the airport and the two of them are national champions and they're going to put on an air show and no charge for which I'm deeply grateful. And that's a value that you're not going to find it the others and it's going to be performed at a thousand feet with the FAA's permission and there there's going to be smoke, and one of them is going to have three colored smoke. We've paired that with the two bands. We have two very good bands. No charge for any of that. Over above your entrance fee. And the band's music will be coordinated with the hair show. We have a presentation for veterans. We have a, they do a coin exchange. I don't know if any of you are familiar with the challenge coins, but close to the bin in in particular units to get a coin if you're not carrying it, then you've got to pay for round of drinks. But we're having revetrons that come up. We have something special for them. There will be a couple of demonstrations. Well, I think the thing has a lot of it to them. I have one more question. You're talking to the MC. I have one more question. You're talking to the lake. Is a fishing license required? No. For adults. Well, wait, wait, wait, wait. I mean, we're going to be correct then. One of the things we have done is we have restocked the lake. Now, we have very big bass in that lake, unfortunately. Son of them. And no joke are this long. They unfortunately are large mouth bass, and they sip the signals, which are baby-y, as fawons, and other ducts. And I'm sorely tempted to remove them because of that. But it's catch and release, and somebody gets something like that on their line, and has a because of that. But it's catch and release. And somebody gets something like that on their line and has a lot of fun. But we've stopped Luke Hill and Sunfish because small map vass were not available. And we plan on holding at least one till Roons fishing derby. Still barbless hooks and we will have some adults that are doing it to help the kids get them off to measure them and so they will have some prizes and no charge to participate in something like that. But sometime this summer when we think that the fish had had enough time to acclimate and everything, we're gonna like that. But sometime this summer when we think that the tradition had enough time to acclimate and everything, we're going to do that. So that's any further questions from the board on the general interest? You can't fish during the tabular interest you choose. But adults require a fishing, a state fishing license, a fishing game. Thank you. Any other questions regarding the general managers' report from the board? Yes, I have a couple of them. First, coming back. One question. One question, I remember I was pickable. It's clear we're moving toward looking to see what could happen in the actual black, the existing land. I have requested in a previous meeting for there somebody to explore the property next door, which is owned by, we left by a new, was by his church as a possibility to include in the potential plan. Parking is an issue and we're adding an amenity who placed it without any extra parking that could be a problem. So I requested to look at that property and perhaps explore that as a piece of this too. I didn't know if that had gotten anywhere. That hasn't yet because I need to know whether the property is appropriate for the courts. And if it's going to cost too much to amend the property for that. I don't think so, but I need to know that, they're sure. And what we're trying to do is obtain from the county all of the ground studies and everything else that we're done when this gate park went in, because we don't have those documents. And that will save us 50, 200 grand studies. I don't want it to have to do that because that may mean we put in less courts. So I want to know that. Once we know that, then we'll talk about the other part, but it kind of put in the cart before the horse. But I just want to be sure that it's included in all of the considerations. Yeah. That allows us a better expansion. Yeah, provides more for our country. That's what I mean. This question on number 12 with the lagoon. I know where the last stop any major comment on the way that the state indicated that they will tell us what we can do with the site. Any communication memory time one is the one we're going to know that? I've had a couple of very communications. Of course, they were opposite each other. One was supportive of filling it in and making it a expanded picnic site. We have, we would use graphs because we have a well-right next to it. We have one issue that we have a natural spring in. And so we have to deal with that and it requires getting all the flatbed stuff. And there were enough ground studies done on that but I don't think we're going to have to do anymore but both engineers and I had a look at it one at one that stuff. We haven't got it yet to give it to them. So that I will make monthly reports on as it progresses. I have the last piece on number one one, the bottom of the transparency piece of the reference to our project for technology, the BART-AV system. What's the update on that coming in at installation? The first part of it is we installed in July. The second part of it will now be installed in August. And Mike, who I think is here, back back in the corner did a really nice job with for us and 80% of it's being paid for by grant. Remember that, very important. And so once we have that, we will have not only a refurbished plan, we'll have one of the best conference centers in the county. And I expect to be able to market that to the benefit of the district. Thank you. All right, no further questions from the board. We'll take it out to the public. All right, anyone like to address the, or have any questions, comments on the general manager's support? Keeping in mind we can't necessarily answer your questions this time But we would love to hear it so we can get back to you any input from the community regarding the general manager's Hey, seeing none bringing back support Religious information item any other discussion comments Hey moving on. Item seven, committees. So in this case, this would be our agenda. It would be our report out from two committees, as to mention many of them in this council. The budget admin was one that was canceled. You do have a disappointed resident, but probably one than one. And I have three CCNRs and that would be 10 and a sit. So did you care to give her a photo? It was your typical CCNR meeting that reviewed several pre-legal requests from staff and the group goes. And there, it was a quick meeting. And the neighborhood campaign, which is on the educational preventative level, have been suspended because there's a very busy time of year with boats and RVs out there and people doing building projects and putting stuff out of their backyard. So that is temporarily suspended. It's kind of a cyclical thing. It's a very busy time of year for that. Thank you. Fire and parks for both canceled and fire and excitement and hospitality. I think we have some action on that. All right. So, I think, so, the meeting last week, with the committee report, we'll be discussing the discussion of the committee. And that is just the night of the first step. I will say at some point, discussing, we'll be discussing the general manager, what to do with this current ad hoc committee because they are, so I have a limited life. And usually there's a record out in the final closing of that ad hoc before any other steps. So General Manager, I'd like to talk with you at some point about how we handle that and when to do that. The other piece in that becomes we have received a record. And now we're asking staff to take next steps and give us some guidance on how to receive input from the public. We have three options put before us in the report and really depends on what our public wants. How we want to move forward with the support and what they would prefer. So we don't have an in-scene on the agenda here tonight but we are asking for some steps that we can put out to get serving in the community, the input, even ask simple questions, would you prefer to go with a B or C? Would you be willing to support this or that to do either of their any of those options? In the meantime, would encourage the community, please continue to give a feedback. If you have not gotten to read the report yet, please do. And I'm the chair for the ad hoc committee. Director Skoby is with me on that. We really appreciate emails from the cost-friendly, with any feedback to do that. We have some difficult decisions ahead. I am confident we will make a decision in the report and we will come to the future in this. But we need it, but we will come to the future on this. But we need to hear from the community on this. So that's what we have at this point. Anything to add to that, Dr. Schultz? No. All right, moving on. President Schultz? Yes, please. I would simply like to comment and say that we will have the opportunity for further public comment at a July board meeting on this. And that there will be some further discussion from staff. And lastly, given the institutional knowledge that you do develop on the ad hoc, I think it would be a shame if you chose to not to continue moving forward with this. Because it's kind of hard for people to pick up everything you've learned in meeting people who are going to be talking with and everything else. So I think the district will be well served as you both continue. We're going to get in our part of topic. It's just a few committee report out. That's all right. We can talk about that. Is the public comment on this? Yes, actually. So we'll take it out to the public. Item 7 has A, B, C, D, and E. Bringing it out to the public. We can comment on this committee report out. A, B, C, D, and E. Bringing it up to the public. Any comments? Any comments for the board? Apparently there's any CCR and the fire. Part of the board should see that out. So I really would like to see you call it through with the intention of entering into a contract for a feasibility study, even though we didn't go in the direction where they'd be triton, we'd have Mr. Ashman, the start-tasked dollars you're talking about, you guys are going to have to make up your mind. You're going to have to make up your mind, you want to sit down, who you want to sit down, and you go sheet with. And that's what I would like to see out of this committee is that you're going to have to go sheet one way or another because it's a pretty good thing to do after spending all this money. Even though I might add, we really don't know how much money was paid to be trident and we don't know how much money was paid to. And this will serve us as group from day one from the time Dawn came on. And, you know, Mr. Bartender, there's no way I'm putting any of this on you. You were not here when these agreements were drawn up. Thank you. And at best, it was confusing to some of us exactly what the role of the municipal services group was through the process. So I just would like to see you guys follow through with the intention of what was set in place in July of 2023. So I just think that that's the right thing to do. It would justify the money somewhere. I put out on the committee. You do the committee report. Yeah, all happening to you. Well, I'm Tom Rosent. I've got two questions. UnBCC and RRs. I've contacted the officer that's in charge of it. And I've noticed a tremendous amount of RVs that are parked in their driveways and boats that are parked in their driveways. And these are not just seasonal ones where they're just coming and going for the summer. These are ones that I've seen since 2020 and I've talked to them about that and I've shown the CCRs and saying that you have 72 hours as you can put in your RV in your driveway. And I've seen these RVs in there for years, and I've been contacting an officer that's in charge of this. And they were going to go out and I got a nasty grand letter at my house saying that if you have a RV you have to do this, I have my part legally behind my date. So I'm in compliance, but I've just noticed that. And I talked to him about it and he goes, well, it's just more of just telling me we're trying to clean it up. But there's no teeth in it. I guess that's what I'm saying. We have the CCRs and there's no teeth. People are not continuing doing this. So I'm saying, we have the CCRs and the NOTE, people are not continuing doing this. So I'm just bringing that up. It's concerned, it's really unsightly. I really love Chemical Park. I'm kind of picking up here. And also the second question would be the fire annexation. Is that on the website or the relief reports? is that on the website or the relief reports? Any other comment on these committee reports? In regards to the Fire at Hock Community Report, I can certainly understand that you want the public's input and you want A, B, C. But when I read the budget, and you guys are dropping the fire percentage from 62 to 58, how are we supposed to trust that you guys are not spending the money correctly? This drip from, I'm going to go clear back to when this district was formed. 75% clear down to 62 and now 58%. I find that very disheartening that you guys just are spending the money and dropping the service. So you can ask for all sorts of money. You ain't going to get it unless you start spending the money correctly in wisely. That's all I got to say. Thank you. So we can put on the committee report outs. Any other one? Any more else by the way? Okay. Moving on to item 8, which are our election items. A.A. is an update committee calendar and approve the cancellation of current committee calendar. Staff, you want to pick that off? Yes. In the bylaws, in bylaw 6.13, It talks about committees. And we are required to have a standing committee's covenants, conditions and restrictions of CCNRs. Architectural review, parks and recreation, fire and emergency services and budget administration. They meet in accordance with the Brown Act. There is the president appoints without confirmation by the rest of the board. And they serve for a year. And the CCNR committee has two board members. I'm three community members. Now, there is nothing in the bylaws that requires the committees to meet every month. That has been the practice here. Here's the problem. Number one, it takes our staff six to eight days a month to deal with this. And we don't get to do the stuff you need done if we're doing this. A lot of the committee work is bankrupt. There are times when to need committees. This is my fifth government. And in the other governments, we didn't need every month on committees. We met as was needed. Budget in admin was met every time and regularly when we were developing budgets. The others met when something came up that was pertinent to that. So here, we've been, it was a request for parks. We've met parks regularly for a long time. Parks now has a master plan. That was approved by the board. It has, I believe, it was the sixth project that had been approved to move forward. They have to come back to the final approval, of course. And we're working on those. And each one takes time. We don't really need until we're farther along but we get a problem with that committee. With fire, of course we need fire. But it is my view that at this point all five board members should be involved in fire issues, not two. And that it's important to do it in a public meeting so that you all have the opportunity to do it. Of course, committees are public, but it's not the same. And I think the issues are important enough. And I just don't consider it good practice under the circumstances to do it with two instead of five. So any fire issue I want to hear, not in the committee. With budget and admin, we don't need that every, and when we do need it, the last four. The other thing is, in addition to staff time and potential overtime, which we try not to have. We will save over the course of the year. Fair amount of money is stipends because we pay a board member each time they go to a meeting. And we will save that money and use it for something else. So, I'm asking to try it for the rest of the year. Fire will be here every month. And next month you will see more detailed stuff on fire. The report from the fire would come up as a report and be presented for information toward me. You'll still get the report every month. But where we don't have something active, take that time when we could be doing something else, makes it very difficult. I mean, we're trying to completely change your budget procedure and how you counter-slip. We're trying to take everything down to a cost basis so that you know what everything costs. And you can see where we get the money and whether we're able to do it or not. So later on when we get to the full budget, we have had the time to fully do it. We expect to have a more detailed for the final in August. But we've been allocating the overhead, the fixed cost, down to where they belong. And with respect to fire, that reflects the fact that emergency and fire ambulance left. And that's what that's about. We still get this same amount of the budget. And we can answer that more directly. So help me help you. It literally is invasive and disruptive at this point to try and do, but to many meetings so much. It means that it's much harder to get stuff out that has to be out. I mean we have a very limited staff and those of us doing this are having very late nights regularly on the weekend and on holidays. And it shouldn't have to be like that. But with the amount of work following our responsibility to get it out, this would help us because it would save us for eight days a month and let us do the other stuff, which you need. So I know it's unusual. It's a more common practice elsewhere. It hasn't been here. But I'm asking you to try it for the balance of the year. And we will call committee meetings for things that we need. CC&R and ARP have to meet because they make decisions every single one. So they have to meet. There'll be no change. But for the others, on demand has needed. So that's what I'm requesting. Thank you. The store on that end said, what do you think? I think there's a cost benefit to consider here. I can tell you as was having a mid-Abor member three years. I've rotated through every committee and I've learned a lot from every single committee. And I've got to know staff really quite well. And it also has the opportunity for our public with it, particularly issue whether it's parks or fire, CCNR, to be there in a small setting and ask those questions. So there's an opportunity for board members to hear very directly from committee, from members of our public. There's an opportunity for us to learn and build relationships with staff. And part of the way that a board works is we rotate through committees. So over the course of your to for your term, you should be on all committees. You should be knowledgeable about all aspects of our district. That's the benefit. It is pretty significant. I would be really saddened to see us lose that. Now do we need to meet every month? That probably someone depends on the committee and the work gets out there. But I believe that the committees have function well and have served a purpose for our community and bring a level of informality that is more inviting to public input. I don't know that people are comfortable in a large setting and it isn't going to be the same without the committee. So I'm sorry that you feel it's an extra burden but a lot of that overlaps with the preparation for the board meetings. So I respectfully disagree. Tens, what do you think? Questions, so you have no alternate proposed schedule. What I've suggested is, as we need an on-demand, the president is certainly called, you guys, the individual committee member of the other directors, can ask me to sit down and talk about what the need is. But with the timing, with the need to flex the staff, we're not managers to attend and take them away from other work during the course of the week so that we don't have to pay overtime. Yeah, I don't have one. I'm saying that we will be asking for committee meetings, but as things come up and with proper notice so that, you know, they're using the two ways. I don't disagree that Board Member learned something in committees. They do. But that's about 17 grand a year, I think, in board fees. How would I ask if there was an alternative skill? I don't have a schedule at this point. All right. Thank you. Fire is, for my fire is always here, from now on until fire is resolved. Thank you. I don't have any other result. Thank you. I don't have any other questions. Thank you. Done any questions? Any thoughts, comments on the question to cancel it? Committee? Yeah. I mean, I've never been a huge fan of committees to begin with. I guess that's because I want to know everything about everything. And I don't, you know, know about the committees I'm not on unless I listen to the recording and even then I kind of lose the back and forth. You don't get to ask your own questions. I personally would rather have two board meetings a month. However that said, this is typically related to the fire meeting. I don't want to waste people's time necessarily in a meeting where there's no decisions and there's just reports. On the other hand, I don't want our fire personnel to feel disrespected if we're not going to have their meeting. So, honestly, I kind of like to hear from them on this. Fire staff, we have some here. Did the board want to hear from their contractors? Yeah, about right? I'd love to hear your. Yeah, what are you talking about? I'm on your side. Yeah, so it's fine. She's going to have a martinard here tonight, but I think there's benefit from having that communication every month. Can we keep you surprised what's going on? Or I'd love to get that information out. Kind of brainstorm from ideas off each other for things that are coming up. And there's a lot more intimate conversations that happen in that setting. So that's able to happen in four meetings and it just monthly does help. So possibly we could incorporate their reports of the agenda that you. Yes, I did mention I think that we reemphasize that fire report would be included as part of the agenda, a part of the report, a written report. And we could have the back and forth at that point. Yes, you could. Okay. So you know, that's not lost. It's just that the time the longer day, the cost of having that meeting, I personally think it should be at this level, but you can have the back and forth, you do get to make your report. And if you want it, you could take a few minutes and make an oral presentation before the meeting and ask questions then. The fire is going to be around for a long time now at this level. Thank you. Is that all? Yes. All right. What do you think here? But fire is going to be around for a long time now at this level. Thank you. Is that all? Yes. All right. What do you think here? Well, I'll save my comments until I figure from the public. But there's some questions. Just to clarify, you made this day a couple of times. You say we don't need it. Can you define who we is? Staff doesn't need the direction and the time that it takes with committees when we could be actually on substantive projects that have been approved or directed to be done. It makes, given the detail that we have to deal with now, not only with the regular stuff, but the fact that we now have five projects surrounding us that are going to put demands on this district without giving us impact fees or revenue. You know, there are a lot of issues facing the design. There is a potential. And we need the time to do that. There's two few of us. But those of us that exist need to be able to do those other things that protect and benefit the district. And it makes it much harder. My understanding the purpose of committees is not simply the direction staff but oversight from the board. So is your changing the agenda to have all the departments report in every board meeting the effort to cover that versus having it done in committee? That's why every department head is going to be required to report. And if it needs to be expanded or fleshed out, two of us will assist in that so that there's as much go. As EKL, as we can reason we provide it, yes. And those are subject to questions. And how is that different than those same staff people coming to a committee meeting once more? Because the committee meeting are in the evening. We have to flex the staff. It's one thing to have them come here. But we lose some time during the day for them. We didn't want to pay them overtime, because we can't really afford overtime. Unless it's absolutely necessary. That's no different than a board meeting. But that's one. And with oversight on the department head reports, we get more condensed. It's more condensed. It could save time. Do you think there's the possibility of, that not saving time, partly reasoned functionally, the committees have been helpful is it is two board members, it's a smaller meeting, and so the two board members are become the experts in that everybody gets exposed to those departments when those items come to a general board meeting. Now you've got five directors asking questions and getting into the details and you've got a larger general public on that. My experience would be that would actually then potentially expand those board meetings and take more time than the committee would. Well, as I've indicated, when we have something important coming up, we would request a committee meeting and for that purpose to expand and discuss, but to meet every single month for every committee. Only CC&R and ARC are absolutely required to do that because they make judgments. We don't make judgments every month and the others. There are times when they're necessary. I've always, for example, had budget and admin when it's time to do an annual budget or budget correction and I've actually had more meetings with budget committees than you have here, depending on what was going on, you know, because once a month I've had where I've had every week or every other week for a while because of some of the issues with the budget coming up. But not all, I never had all of it with me, everyone. And this is five governments. Did you discuss this proposal with the Department of Hits to get their feedback and support or hesitation for anything? Everybody's concerned about the amount of time it takes. And with CCNR and ARC, briefly because we simply agree, it's no choice. It has to meet every month because it makes a decision. with fire and with park and with I'm afraid to do the administration. Thank you. You know, I'm effectively the department that except for park and I know what it takes to do these things. So with Parks, you know, we talked about that. I talked about that with our superintendent. And we have a charge in Parks right now to get done. We have things that have to be done. I'm just going to pause. My simple question is, did you discuss this? Yes. Yes. And are they supportive of them? I'm ex-okis. That was all I had for now. Thank you. All right. I have no questions. I have some thoughts, but I'd like to hear from the public first. I have a little water milite here for you. And let's go ahead and start right here. Comments on the changing of our current committee calendar. Vicki Jacob's coming. Alan, you're throwing the baby out with the bathwater. I think that if you want to occasionally cancel a meeting, because there's truly not something that is worthy of discussion, I think everybody would agree that that would be appropriate. But if the board wants to have less input into the management control and policies of this district, you may go ahead and support what he's asking for. And if the board wants the public to have less input into what is happening in this district, and unless oversighted into what's going on and less suggestions for policies and directions, then go ahead and support this idea. I started coming here a year ago. I think I attended every board meeting and I've been a couple months in and I realized the action was in the committees. That's where I did so. I really got to learn and interact with people and learn what's going on around here. I've really great deal. Without those committee meetings, I wouldn't be in the same position to feel confident that I can talk about issues that are presenting this district. If I just attend your once-cognitive board meeting, where you can't run a five to six hour board meeting, trying to get through every play. There is a value in going through these items closely and individually with two of the board members and then trying to distill things down and get it to the board in a kind of work of heath of an understandable manner. I have a really hard time understanding how other than the fact that you have to double schedules that it really costs an enormous amount of time to run these committees. The same amount of work and study and information that is required to be seen in the committee is going to be necessary if you're going to present this in front of the board. Yeah, there's some inconvenience, I understand in a juggling step, but that's what you do as a general manager. And I think it's really important in the priority of this district that we continue public interaction and frankly to have more increased and consistent board included to all of the issues that are presented before this district. So as I mentioned before, this board needs to decide what the priorities are for this district. It includes public and even board involvement in the policies and practices here. And I really hope that you don't readily give up your leadership opportunities. One last comment of the budget committee. I would like to see that budget committee meet every month because there needs to be greater oversight of that budget as money is spent and as income changes. We should have a revised budget every quarter, in my opinion, at the very minimum, revised budget, updated budget on a six month basis. You need to keep track of your money. Thank you. Other comments regarding changing our committees? Yes. comments regarding changing our committees. A public. Yes, please. Paul Gilchrist, citizen, camera bar. I think another approach might be looking how you might take some best practices from other districts and how they run their committees. I have witnessed where board members prepare the agenda to the minutes and notes that go out. They open the staff of it. They let the staff provide, for instance, a budget report provide, for instance, a budget report that says how are you performing from your budget to your actuals and what's the variance? That's something staffed. But I've seen where in many boards, the various directors take on that responsibility and get engaged and do the minutes and structure the agenda. I think that would relieve some load from the staff if you were to look at that or ask other districts how they could get other input as that's practices. Additionally, as I understand the Brown Act, Board members are entitled to $100 a meeting up to no more than six meetings a month if I recall correctly in the brown act. The board members don't have to take that money. They don't have to take it. You can say, you know what? I don't need it. I don't want it. I'm here to serve a higher goal or a higher purpose. You can give the money back. Or don't even take it. You don't have to. So I think there's some ways there to get efficiency and effectiveness. That would put your board in a good position to communicate with the budget and build on trust. And I think that's a key thing this board needs to focus on as a public trust. Thank you, my colleagues. Thank you. Other comments from the public? Yes, please. I'm Sam. Basically what I'm hearing and I agree with her priorities need to be set and it sounds to me like a management issue more than anything because that is the job of the general manager to be able to handle the staff figure out what needs to happen. That's your job. The board sets the direction. So I don't know how you, I appreciate the fact that you're trying to say some money. But that's something you got to figure out. And that's something that needs to happen here. I think the board and the staff need to figure out what's the priority, like you said, and you go from there. Because you don't always have to meet every single time, but you do have to meet so that the public knows what's going on. Thank you. Yes. My perspective really quick. I think, I agree on it for some, I think we need every month. But I think the board requests when those meetings need to happen. And I think the more it's priority, it's an issue, the more frequently you'll have those meetings. But to think that you need to have a committee meeting every single month for everything, single division, I think it's excessive. And I would say just from the perspective of working in other districts, we don't have committees every single month. But we do have committee meetings when the board requests something and we have committee meetings when staff wants to bring something to the attention of the board. And I think that the committee meetings are phenomenal because it gives you a chance to act more like a workshop than a board meeting. Whereas a board meeting here almost brought an action item and then you can ask them clarify questions. But there's really no back and forth. There's not much of a discussion at that level where you have the two board members that also add some credibility when you bring the committee back to the board Because you have two board members that are in the group and signed up Whatever discussion I have. So I agree I think it's excessive to have every single committee every single month But I do think that as board you should be requesting when you want things brought to the committees and a staff. I think you should be Bringing committees to the board. you have something to put in. This is my perspective. Thank you. Someone else, yes please. Harbor Watchers, I've never been a fan of committees and years ago they did away with committees and they brought a big way of two board meetings a month, Jay only, the head and the ground of that was going on. Because I always felt on the committees that the two board members were making the decision for the entire board of us, so we had a feeling. But I do believe you should have board meetings when there are things that need to be brought out, especially the budget. Because we used to see the Czech Register in the Board of Gender, and then it stopped coming in the agenda, and it's only in your budget, and add in portion. And as you know, I just want to get to all the meetings, because my work schedule now is impossible for me to make it to all the meetings and read it online. So I think you should have meetings when you need to have them. If there's nothing new to talk about, it's kind of redundant to keep just to make to meet. But like I said, you've never done a fan with a committee so ever. So thank you. Any other input from the public? Yes, please. A graphic moment. So I'm a little confused because most of the committee meetings that I've ever attended were far from workshops. The management of those committee meetings were done exactly the same way that the board meeting was done. You can say three minutes worth of stuff and that's it. There is no back and forth whatsoever. So maybe if there's the potential to have workshop back and forth, I would support that. But so far my experience after your plus coming to committee meetings is far from workshops. So. Thank you. Other input from our public regarding our committee meeting schedule. Great. Okay. So again, we'll bring it back to board. I want to start. We'll start with sit. I think that we've had a good representation of the points of view. I think there is a learning curve as a board member and as a public member, I think Vicky did a nice job of alluding to that. You learned a lot, but I learned a lot to myself in committee meetings. And I'm sorry your experience was that it was a lot as informed with, but it's been my experience. I'm sorry your experience was that it was a lot as informed was been my experience, but we do tend to have a much more informal conversation in the committee meetings. There is much more give and take, there is much more detail. And when we go as a committee member to the board, we are much more knowledgeable. We can present information to the rest of the board. And I think there's a confidence level in the board that two members have looked in depth in the issues in those committees. I have to agree, I think that budget administration probably should be meeting every month. It's that critical we can't do our oversight if we're not. Because that someone has to be looking at what we're doing with the expenditures and revenues every month. So I think it's been well spoken by our board members and by the public. But I think we need to continue, continue, committee meetings. They might be restructured. I think that's a great idea, it's a nightmare. How they might be more efficient and maybe more informal. So that's my feeling. Okay. more informal. So that's my feeling. Yeah, without a regularly scheduled committee meetings, I'm not going to support this. I think it's important not only that we have committee meetings, but that they're scheduled on a regular schedule so people know when to come and it's not a surprise. Oh, it's a special meeting for this committee. Here's your agenda and it's tomorrow. And so I'd be supportive of a lower frequency of meetings, seasonal seasonality. You know, we'll look at the schedule to cut down on the number. But as presented, I'm not supporting this. Done. Once the director is real's comment, I do think that if we cancel committee meetings and we know that there's gonna be a special meeting, we should put it right on that canceled meetings. Agenda says that the public knows there's gonna be a special meeting, we should put it right on that canceled meetings. Agenda says that the public knows there's going to be a special meeting next week or whatever. But other than that, and I think we ought to have them occasionally. But if there isn't a discussion item other than a department head report, I don't think we should have them monthly maybe quarterly. Here. Thank you. This has been an issue for us for a while. I'm sorry, I just referenced that. There's been different structures in the past, so this isn't written since the beginning of time. We've had discussions before about committees and the idea that maybe we don't need it quite as frequently. I can support the idea of less frequency. I'm hesitant to do a whole sale dropping of it. There's oversight piece there as some of the public mentioned that I think we could out that we don't gain at the board level partly because it would board level on a large meeting. There isn't the same amount of time to have those discussions. And I would concur with my fellow directors on many of the points. One piece I would say, I think there is value in having a regular schedule meeting, even if the agenda doesn't have some action item or some piece that needs to be done. For the simple fact the board checks in on staff and departments. Can't do that at the board full board meeting at the same level. Some board members need to know what's going on in these departments and those discussions can only happen in greater detail that it's committing. I would ask that for fire having been on that part of the reason I like those committee meetings is I want to know how our fire staff is doing. Now we could potentially do that at the full board meeting and okay. I would want to separate because the statement made in the report is fire issues are now at the board level and I would like to separate two pieces. One is the larger picture of the annexation discussion and contracts. Those are board decision levels. The everyday, every month function of our fire department is a different piece. Now we want to combine those and let the board decide that, but I don't see those as the fire things all out of the board level. There's still a relationship we want to have with our partners that I think is accomplished in the committee. And I would like to see us talk with them about what would be good frequency. I recognize in the summer, maybe not quite as much, because they're busy. And there's a lot happening, and I want to respect, I don't want them preparing for a simple report that they would just give us on paper when they need to be out on the field. Likewise, I also want to be checking in with them and making sure they're okay. We did that particularly during COVID, it was very helpful to understand the impact on them. What's going on is we can make adjustments so we can support them. And I would say that for all of our departments. And I think there's a value in having a regular discussion meeting for the public's sake so that they know when it is, they can rely on it. As some of you mentioneduling is a piece and if it's not regular, if they can't depend on it, people aren't going to move their lives around it in the sudden injuries of the evening. So I think having some regularity, some reliability, some to the public as well so they know it's coming, they can schedule for it, they can plan for it. They know there's a place that they can bring it besides the general board meeting. I really don't want to set us up for five hour or so. That's a concern I have when we can find all those things in one place. The other piece I have bringing in talking about this with agenda, I don't know if there's any for every department to report to the full board everyone. And that goes back to I think General Andrew's concern is we talked about having a quarterly report from the department just so that the full board has that and then the more detailed discussion happens in committee and if those board members feel that needs to be something be brought to the full board it's done. So I'd like to see something in the middle. I'm not prepared to just drop committee oversight completely but I can respect the fact that it does take time for staff to do this. I wonder if we're on that. That's been a problem for years. Staff takes a lot of time. It takes a lot of time to prepare for these committees to prepare the reports, to make sure that all the details are in, to do the coordination, for getting things out on time, as best they can. And if things come up in their job, that they don't expect, you just make them hard. So I'd like to see something in the middle. I concur with Director Israel. I would like to see the Parks and Recreation Committee meeting next month, as we have not met in a few. And perhaps then the committees themselves can determine based on what the frequency can be. I would request that at least be every other month for the rest of the year, let's cut the meetings in half. And perhaps the President and the Vice President and the General Manager can look at how it's actually appropriate to break some of this full board level without taking the whole way to the committees and putting in it. So I'd like to see something in the middle, it's probably the opportunity, but does help staff with some of the strain that you've done. That's what I've got. Thanks. Well, my input on committees has been I flip-flop between, oh yes, we need committees, and oh my gosh, maybe we don't need committees. So I've served for about six years, I don't know, Eric knows how long I've been here, seven years, and I'm now coming down on the side that meeting as needed is the responsible thing to do for the board, the staff, the board of district, for many reasons already decided. One reason that is not cited is that we as a board, our job is to set policy. We're supposed to set the word, you hear direction, you hear policy. That is our role here. You also hear these things getting out in the lead. That is not our role. We are really not supposed to be getting down into the detail, into depth, which is what these committees are doing. And it has too many cooks in the kitchen. We hire GM to implement our policy. And if we end up getting into the GM's job and fiddling around in there and causing a churn, it does not help us as a district. We need to stay in our role. And our role is policy. We say, we want a healthy robust program in our parks. Bring us a plan. They bring us a plan. This is what we're going to do. We go back to plan. We want, no, we want you to change this and off you go and you do it. We don't have to babysit every single step of the way, which is what these committees are doing. They're causing turn. They're causing the ways. They're not. I don't believe they're serving on our best interests. Now, we do need to meet. I don't think we should, you know, I'm not, we're not proposing to get rid of the standing committees. What we're proposing from my understanding, it's one of my main staff, is we are not going to adhere to the existing calendar. We're going to call and need it. And after hearing from input, we should call as needed on these dates that are already on the calendar because that's what we in the public are used to. So I imagine that's something that we would that's assumed would happen, but that needs to be stated. And so for my current time serving, I'm now on the side of the committees are necessary, but not necessary every month. So what I would like to see is that we keep the calendar, I can see a couple of ways of movement forward. Keep the existing calendar and just keep them saying cancel, cancel, cancel, or we have a some sort of time slot. This is where we would have the committee and then then we say, yes, we're having it, or no, we're not having it. Some type of communication, because we do need them, but we don't need them at all. So those are my inputs. So any other comment from staff? I thought there were some interesting and good suggestions. On the way, I do appreciate J. Harris comment on this. I don't have a problem keeping the schedule that we have if we can simply put out a notice of cancellation when we don't have something to really do. I mean, Dr. Ezio has requested a parks meeting, you know, two people who requested it. Under that circumstance, I don't have a problem having one. But in terms of what we're currently doing, do we need direction or discussion, we're in the process of implementing all of the things that have been authorized for parks. And they're not easy. And they're a little very time consuming. So we're doing that. But if they want a meeting, fine. But with budget, we needed, anytime we want to change something, we needed if questions are coming up. And so I would say that ART would tend to be necessary more. With fire, you know, the report that they make every month can be brought forward and put here. It's not really discussed. If they want to make the three five minute presentation, that doesn't take so much of your time. But the issues of annexation and the new contract with Cal Fire belong here. They belong here, not in the committee, in my opinion. And the rest of the stuff, if they bring something up that needs to be discussed first, and they come to me and they ask about it, I will call the committee meeting and request it. On the schedule that you have in place now, I really don't want, basically a frivolous committee. And having attended these committees for six months now, for most part it's the same people to show up. And they're good questions, they get absent and they're challenging and they're fair. Including your student or... But I have the most open office of any GMI note, and I'm more than happy to have any member of the community talk about stuff at length. Some people do. Some don't. So if there's something that they want to talk about or they want to do, I had one time where I sat for an hour or 45 minutes and listed as somebody talk. But I gave the time and I will. So I would like to see the other three meet as needed or as requested for the balance of the year on the same schedule that we have posted down because those days are posted. And we will put out in advance if we want to cancel it. I mean, a couple of times, like with DNA this month, it was literally impossible to get the budget out and take the time to meet for that committee. And this budget is required to be initially approved by the 30th. Well, it's an incredible amount of work to completely change how a district does its accounting and switch it to a cost-based fully distributed system. So that you really know what everything comes. That's hard. And I'm gonna interrupt. Okay. So what we want to do is make a possible action on the agenda of approving cancellation and current Canadian challenges. What I'm hearing and what I would suggest is that we do not do that, but we give authority to the GM to cancel the meetings. So public will be surprised if there is no meeting, have a parks and rec meetings, call for by two board members. And that's what I'm hearing. So what are you guys saying? Do we have a motion? Do we need to make a motion if we're not taking any action? The piece that I still hear missing in this discussion is me. I recognize staff's need, but there's a board need in this too. I don't think that the board members should have to take the initiative every time. I just think that at this point you still need some regularity. I like to pose an idea which is simply, if the committee's meet next month, and on the committee's, one of the agenda items will simply be chart out the rest of the year. What are the projects, what are the items? And the committee can, at that point, perhaps decide what would be the frequency for the rest of you. Because I recognize part of what we're trying to do is to alleviate some of that. That would give the people in those departments a chance to come ready to talk about it. And if we say, hey, we don't need to meet better every three months, then board members can hear from the departments at that point. Because right, I'll agree. I have very little time to process this, and even less time to talk to anybody else. I want to hear from the departments. I want to hear from the staff as well. So what I would suggest is let's plan to have our committee meetings next month. And in those committees discuss the schedule for the rest of the year. I don't like to be able to link it safe for every committee because as you said, each committee is a little different what it means. So perhaps the board members of those committees can make those decisions with public and get lit at that level. With the idea of it, yeah, let's make it worse, let's space these out every other month, every third month. But with specific purposes of those committees. So I'd like to request that we plan the next month and then agenda for each of those committees is that discussion. With the intention of backing off on the frequency as needed. I can't support just cancel it all until it has needed because that ignores the need of the toward to be to just hear reports and ignores the need of public because the public can't call committees and the public needs to be able to get in for a little more regularity. Anyone want to comment on Eric's comment? Go ahead. I support that idea. There's both the public and the idea and a board need for oversight. And I think it's presumptuous that we could just make one blanket plan for all the committees. So I like the idea each committee is making its own decision together with staff. So I think it's a very prudent approach. And the programs, those can, sorry, that. Go ahead. Tim, can you come in on that? Nope. Done. I think that's fair. I mean, what I didn't say earlier was I also looked at the idea of making it more like a workshop and a more back and forth. I don't think we should have all committees make a schedule for their schedule for the year. I think that's redundant and necessary. I think we have a general manager that can bring things forward to us as needed. We as a board, we hear from the public, when we hear from the public. We ask for the committee, plus we're going to be getting reports at the board meeting regarding these projects. You know, I see that GMS is doing a good job bringing each project forward and giving us a status. So I don't agree, but the action is to approve the cancellation. If there's no motion to approve the cancellation, I would say you move on off this topic on doing their side. Any motion? I'd like to hear what the consensus of the board is. What are we deciding? We're deciding to do nothing. Is that the consensus? That're deciding to do nothing. Is that the consensus? That's what I'm hearing. Okay, very good, thank you. We're not taking action on this. Okay, moving on, item 8B. Review and discuss the LLAU preliminary engineering report. And go ahead, just launch that with staff. Let's do that one. That's mine. Okay, so on the Agendants and I tonight is resolution 2024-10. It's to look at and approve the preliminary landscape and lighting district budget or the engineers report. I know this is on the budget or the agenda for last month, but I got old because there was overwhelming amount of questions. From the board that we didn't get the answer in time, I wanted to thank Christina because she did a lot of work with that CI while I was away on vacation. So I had her chance to kind of review the report a little bit, review the agenda, I'm transmittled but Christina did a lot of work on it. So you can see on the second page of the report is being recommended amount to let each of the LLADs, the only one this year that we're recommending it not hold, not collecting a tax assessment from is number 47, which is Camerowicz 8. They have an overwhelming fund balance and a very little expensive stock rate that LLAD. So that one probably stays zeroed out for a few years on end, I believe. Other than that, I know last year we held number 30 which is Arupark. We didn't collect revenue from them but we are this year because our fund balance is now down to a more manageable amount than we were before. So other than that report pretty short. I know the engineer's report is pretty lengthy. I know it engineer's report is pretty lengthy. I know for it. That's a question for us. So I think this one is going to over for any questions like I said, Christina. So with one change, the staff report was the same staff report for last month. So there was a change after we had talked to STI. Number 48 Silver Springs, the staff report says it's 44. The engineer's report went up to 40434. So that is one change from the staff report. Did you have your hand a bell to report? Yes. I got a question outside of the meeting about whether we were going to include distributed administrative costs in this. That process hadn't occurred when the engineering report for this year was contracted. It will be in next years. So we're not allowed to charge the LLADs for just general expense. And we have to give them credit if public use is part of their thing and it goes to the general fund. But we have a fair amount of administrative time in these things. And we're going to see about the engineering working with the engineer next year to have that cost covered because the district is currently paying for it out of the general fund. I don't think it should. So I believe the only costs that are captured then under the in the end-changer report are the maintenance costs so that would be part of my time and then we have the full-time maintenance worker too and the landscaping district and then under 19 you see the whole employee that helps them landscaping like the districts. Those are the administrative for those salaries that you see there. Great, thank you. Any other questions? So, Cameron Woods, there's a zero assessment there, and based on the five balance that goes on an urgency, but has there been any thought about communicating with the residents, they're the same as we would with any other LLAD that has a surplus for a deficit, you know, it's a part of the B in the past where we're going to keep things in what you would have been. You want to keep more of you, you want less service. There's a couple of the LLADs that have a part of other things, these would be one of them or just to use their surplus in their neighborhood. Has there been any thought given to you, meeting with the residents of Hammerwood, if they've got that kind of surface, is there an amenity of benefit that they would like to use that toward? Yeah, so I think to manage that question overall, we have met and discussed the different LLABs that are either upside down, have an upside down, down front balance, that have a huge one balance about ways that we could use those funds. But we can't remember what's eight. It only has electrical costs associated with it. So one of the things that we could look at is right now PG&E is being very grateful and they are going through some of the neighborhoods and replacing three lights. There's no cost for the district. But we could look at using some of these excess funds to contract the PG need to do those three light upgrades. And we could once that stuff, then we could look at going back to that landscape and lighting a blanked letter for you to send out to the residents of each one of these LLITs when we have time and room for readiness or mean with them. We're having that overall conversation for all the LLITs in particular. We didn't know, and I'm a camera with just just recl this is three months. So I created or registered and did something that I can develop and there's something to do. And that's a size of the balance for very small expense. Yeah. There's something that other residents in that. They already have a proper part and so there's always there. Yeah. There's just one of the amazing things that they're assessment. It's better than I do. I guess that's a question that we could explore a little bit. And maybe in the under, I guess, in fact, that kind of balance in the nasty golem figures. We can stop charging for 10 years or we can use this for some reason. That's a little exciting, but at least the banding in here. I'm gonna get a second one. Yeah, that's good to know. And we are taking steps to address the couple of three that are in deficit. We are, it's on the goal for this fiscal year to address the ones that are underfunded. Yeah, as there have been any other discussion or anything around the road? So I've reached out to the Ponta Ipao Maro a few times. I think you might have been on the board here. But about five years ago, there's six lights at the end of Goldorado, the very top of the hill by Ponta Ipao Maro, that were turned off for years. And they requested that those lights be turned back on when P&G and EWNN and replaced all the original street lights with LEDs. So we thought that there might be enough cost savings from converting those lights to LED where we could, the LED could afford to pay that bill. But that's not the case right now. So Goldorado did mention to reach out to them and they would look at helping pay for that assessment to keep those six lights on. And I haven't had any luck over a couple of months in trying to do. So it's a conversation I need to have an Allen. I need you to try to figure out if we're gonna just go back on their go-or or take those six green lights and turn them back off. I think, yeah, there's on the radar though. Yeah. Some questions on the engineers report. So can we do three out of the six? I think we have the ability to shut off one light if we want it. So we haven't performed electrical calculations to see where we would land, but we have the ability to. Yeah. I understand the lab goes waiting for a report from us. Does this satisfy what they need if we give it to them? That I don't know, but I can find out. I know that. I think the day manager has been there. That's the one. What let go is interested in particularly in view of what's happening with our neighbor is that we are operating in a legal and appropriate way with respect to the LID, we are. And so once this goes through, this report will be provided to Lafko. And I would expect that it may have some questions, but I expect it would be satisfactory overall. Thank you. Ken? No questions. Good. So I wanted to clarify something. So you said that you have staffed on yourself and at part time employee and another employee, basically service these lighting districts, is that correct? Yeah, so seven of the 12 landscape lighting districts are landscaped to like eastward park or view park they have actual maintenance angles in their neighborhood parks so speaking. So are we receiving funds to cover those labor costs? Okay that's all it's all built into the okay that's what I want to clarify yeah okay thank you that's what I want to clarify. Okay, thank you. That's all I had. I want to thank staff for putting in the fund balance, answering my mountain questions on the report. It's been corrected on thrilled. I just have described one of the questions. Yes. And that's under on the spreadsheet, on the L.O.A. League budget, under electricity. There's no entry for North Korea. And they do have lights and electricity. David West had a caveat saying that, let's see if he owns their lights, so that's why they have no electricity, but help or why does North Korea not have any electricity? Yeah, so Alan asked me that question today. And so I looked at all the different scribes and said, our finance office beams. And you're right, there's a gap between LOAD 44 and 46 where we have not been billed rights. And so I know the lights within Northview Park themselves are solar. Can't say that those 10 in the community are thinking, maybe they are, but I need to reach out to P.J. need to figure out. Maybe they haven't built us, maybe that bill has been blended into something else, which they've done in the past. We haven't able to identify it, or maybe they're solar. So, definitely get back to you on that. I think. No, I've never caught that looking at people all those years, so good catch. All right, those were my questions. This will end read up in public. Any comments on this engineer's report for our many LLAD in our district? Yes. Kind of need to talk to some of my sorry, but just real quick. But some other districts doing you guys imagine 48 different LLADs, I believe. Some of them were just lights and some of them are parks. Some of them have inflationary factors. Some of them are locked in. They can never go up. I know that some neighborhoods are very different. It's part A, part A and part A, and I didn't pronounce it for some part of the book. What we have is one assessment for the whole district. And we have an oversight committee that means four times a year to make sure those monies are being used appropriately, they go in a park store, but then that money can be allocated throughout the district. So I think you have to manage when your employees go to each one and build time directly to that LLAD if you were purchased a truck for maintenance costs on those LLADs. You would have to divvy up how much time that truck is spending. It just seems like a lot of extra work that you've got to do. And I think it might be some work at the beginning to create one master assessment district for the community versus managing 48 different individual elderly. And I know there's a name for it. I can't think of the top of my head, but again, sorry if you're taking the time, but that's my perspective. Other members of the public are to speak on this guest please. On page two of three are these the assessments that are going for the next contract here but are they increased or decreased from last year? I don't see what the previous 23-24 was versus 24-25. I believe there's only three of the 20 landscape lighting districts that have escalators built in. The other ones are all fixed three year over year so that we don't have the ability to increase the lot of them. That's why you're seeing these funding problems because inflation is just driving them up to high. I think there's three that allow us to raise it from the heat. Lastly, I would say if Cameron Woods is being charged more than what they're using, that money should be refunded or that tax rate should be changed. Because you can't just collect money that's not necessary and say we've got to spend it somewhere. That tax dollars assessment should go back to the people and those numbers be read assessed so that it's more of the accurate reflection on what those costs are. This might point. Great. Thank you. Barbara Roberts, I was thinking the same thing. Would that be proper? Not just to quit collecting in a certain area for a time period. Maybe you should just read, read, read, read, read, read, read, read, read, read, read, read, read, read, read, read, read, read, read, read, read, read, read, read, read, read, read, read, read, read, read, read, read, read, read, read, read, read, read, read, read, read I don't know. We don't want to be old-fashioned. They don't want to be long-term. I don't know. I don't know that much about it. But you know, that's something I took into. Can't remember what's currently being charged zero. As it's undown, it's too wide. But it's a good question of being re-union. Anyone else? On the LLLD, Engineer's Report. All right, bringing it back to the board. Mr. Patrick, comment on the question. I think 27th floor gives you the answer. The Engineer's Report, the Engineer's Report, it's the assessment revenues and there it gives the rate for each as well as the small, the number of increase. And so that gives you the summary of the children. Any other comments? Yes, Ellen? I would love to be able to do JR's idea, but it would require every district to improve it and the odds on that happening are zero and none you know it would I can't see it possibly you know working with love if you could. All right we need back to the board our actions. We have an action item on this one. And we do this to prove the engineer's report. So back to my agenda. Yes, review and discuss possible action, adopt resolution 20 2024-10. We have a motion. I would approve that we approve resolution of 2024-10. Schedule a public hearing to approve the final ILO and the You have a second? I'm so confused. Ellen Davis, say aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. So we have it next month and that's where the final acceptance is. So if there's other comments and there's other games going on, that's another opportunity to spend the show. Thank you. Okay, moving on to 8C. I did remove from the sense agenda. There are none. So moving on to our public hearing. So 9A. We are opening a public hearing for a preliminary system here, 2425 operating budget. Go ahead and have staff pick that up first. This is a very substantial amount of work starting with the old budget and then trying to reformat it, trying to develop cars. And this budget is an I know an M budget, it's just not a capital budget. It does not include capital. You have not had a capital budget for a couple of years at least. What we are going to do between now and the final budget is prepare what I would call the shadow capital budget by a shadow because you you really don't have anyone to do it. But the view is you need to know just like this part of the budget where your costs really are, which revenue can cover. Once your deficit may or may not be. For the capital, we're using up assets. We're doing NASA management plan too. But I want to be able and what we think it would cause updating the study that was done some time ago. And so we're looking to have that presented in August with the final budget so that at least you'd have our best thinking on. done without really looking at each child and making sure that the job was what we wanted and who was in it was actually doing with the job description set. We found that a couple of supervising positions were simply Xerox and different names put on it. So that's what you're seeing is the first, all right, I get 20 stickies. All right, I got 20 stickies. All right, all right, on parks, the form and position, and the position for maintenance and facilities have the exact same description. And so what we're doing is even each one the description for what they're supposed to be doing. And that's the change in the attachment 10 and 11. Additionally, we have two part-time people working in rec, and we want to convert that into one full-time position because we get better coverage, we get better consistent coverage, we get better output from the employee. So there's more than enough work to justify it and we need to have some institutional knowledge. Parks has been significantly revised and restructured with Christina's leadership and help. And what we're doing is that each of the memorandums of understanding are being reviewed and updated. A number of them didn't cover the cost. So if you know that, moving forward, they will. There are some things we have to do for public service, and we don't get paid for that. But a huge job, turning this back into a money making and cost covering portion of the district. I think Christina's led that and done a very good job at it. I think that when you look at the budget, you see some reduction in part-time salaries. That's because their costs are being covered now when they weren't before we were paying for them out of the general fund. We're not now. The other classification is a reclassification. When the grand jury made suggestions back from 2018 to 2020, Joe talked to me about it and said that my job is really a two-person job now. So I've been here six months and as my wife says what you basically do is turn around and you got a big turn around to do. And Jillett told me with a two-person job and what I found is it is. It's not just basic stuff that you have that some of you have mentioned every month to members in particular of the audience have suggested. And a lot of what they said is correct. It's taking not only the finance and HR position, but it's going through every department and seeing how it was done, whether it complies with what it's supposed to be doing. And it's a really complete review of staff. It's a complete change of how we do our accounting and our costing. So that by the end of the next fiscal year, I expect to have very solid cost analysis, benefit analysis for the board and for you in the community. Now I couldn't do that myself and in the current job she has as finance officer for the last six months. She has functioned far beyond it. And we would not be at this level at all without that work. So why not some different title? Well, because in reviewing the other titles, they don't carry the authority necessary to implement that with the rest of staff. And that's a requirement. Additionally, once you all understand, I think this district is in real danger of becoming a dependent district. Not just a fire issue, but because you've got five projects around you on the south and to the east, none of which give you any impact fees at this point or continuing money from maintenance at this point and the population there it just two of them is half is going to be half of what you have and you're the closest thing so they're going to want to come here that's going to heavily burden us So they're going to want to come here. That's going to heavily burden us. Not only doing what you need here, but doing what you have to have done, you know, for just two people to do that, the heck of an incredible amount of work. But doing both of those, and what you need to try and put you in a position to survive going forward. It's not just what fire does. It's what the others do to the distance. So even a fire's gone. The burden that we could wind up with from a 50% increase in demand with no money could clearly make us dependent because we couldn't afford. And so at that point, the water supervisor takes over. And we don't have a choice. be successful on that level of range of issues for you. So that's why I have a reclassification. In looking at that. The board next month will see the salary study in closed session because it's part of what we did for the MOU, the staff. And we hope to have new staff contract up for approval and review then with the board. But this was looked at. I'd like to add up to approval and review them with the board. But this was looked at, you know, and we looked at pricing and everything else. And so this is put at the low average for that position, which by the way is less than salary studies shows for current position, should be at. And that's without any of this other works you've been doing. So, 12, 11, 2 in the morning. So, we need that. We can't put all the people, but you want to survive as a district. There's certain things you have to have done. And that's what I'm suggesting I need to go forward on your behalf. The expenditures are summarized on page three, trying to make it easier to highlight them. So they're by account, the increases. We have, as we've reduced fire, I mean we haven't. It just reflects the difference between having the ambulance service charged to us and income coming into us and not. We did reduce a director compensation a little in this budget on the hope that you would reduce the number of meetings. So next July, into the July meeting, we'll come back and we'll talk about that more. And with a schedule for committee meeting, and if it's acceptable, we will need to adjust that. Um, I'm sorry, I'm sorry. With all of the changes, we have an initial deficit of 8.5%. That is not going to be the final proposed deficit. Some of you have heard me say, more than once, I have never in my life proposed in a public agency, the deficit budget. But I don't have a choice here. And the reason is, I want to keep 12, I mean, 88 open until there's a decision going forward. And I believe we can. And I believe our fund balance when we get down to working on this deficit will allow us to absorb a two to three hundred thousand dollar net deficit. I expect to reduce the deficit both with what I reasonably expect to earn from a recreation over the course of the year and what we have planned on the beginnings of leasing out of this complex and increased marketing of it. Once the telecommunications stuff is in, that's absolutely state of the art. There is a demand for that. And our facility is considered nicer at this point than other things that are available. So once that's in, I expect to be able to do that. Fire, I don't like smoke and mirrors. And I don't like relying on something that has been done in the past, but since Cal Fire has been here for almost 20 years, every year they've underrun their maximum budget, what they're allowed. And that averages around $200,000, not counting this year where they really tried hard and they basically cut out the deficit. So with that, with what I expect to earn on a reasonable conservative basis, I expect that this budget, as is, will generate a deficit of $200, $250,000. Going through, I've had some questions. Can I let me address those? We are going to reallocate administrative costs down to where they belong to the departments and the functions that use that. That's not all done yet. And we're hoping to have that by the August final budget. I have had a question about sports field rentals on page one of the roll-up because there's only $400-39. Well, that's because the agreements and things, the money just hasn't come in yet. So that will change over time. I've had a question on the fire budget as to why we're paying for staff development. And that's a good question because some of that originally was supposed to be for training that directly benefited us. And it's a fair question of whether that's continuing to be true. And that's something that we'll raise now, and we'll be what's next. Going over to item 9a, which is the statement of revenues and expenditures and on social transactions. The preliminary budget expenditures has never split the way we are going to do it. We're doing the best we can. We'll tell you that we're going to be dividing it into three areas, fire, wrecks coming, parks, and community center and recreation those are going to be our three tubes moving forward and there's a correction on 9a2 it's not 2121 under the general fund. It was for fiscal year 20-21. So it's 19-20-2021 and 21-22. Under expenditures under CCNR, CCR, which is item 9a, attachment 5 on page 1. This has come up to a deficit this time on their budget, $51,000. That's quite a bit compared to where they were. But the reason is they had not been allocated the cost of the audit for the two years that were done. And their allocated cost was $5,000 for each year. So on the audit accounting line, you will see a $10,000 charge now at IDN. They wanted a new computer. That's $2,000 in hardware. And then direct your compensation for that committee is now charged to that committee because that's where it belongs. So because of the salary level, the principal in that department has chosen to take a furlough every other Friday in order to save salary money for the person who's half-time. And the two principles in the department are 90% of that budget. We are allocating 10% of that to Christina because it requires that level of work from her department. Yeah. We also have utilities and electric solar charges. It's haven't been varied up to $20,000 or $50,000 or minimum. So that's in charges included there at $7,500. So that's why they're there really out. And they really have an opportunity to increase the ECMR. Those are fixed at the time that they're created. And absence some kind of assessment district, which I don't think has a chance to pass, gets at this point, is a cost, and a cost to the general fund. We have a resolution to adopt the good Mary budget. And I have, we have to, the board has to adopt the primary budget pet� 30. It's not final until August in the adoption and then it has to be final final. I think the first week of September and so may the county be. But in this resolution, we're asking to adopt the taskment one in five, which relate to funding. There is a proposed change in structure in part because we've gone through everything and found out what works and what doesn't at this point. I have a pretty good idea of that. So we want to renew it and change it. And the second sheet, 9AB, 9AB, I'm just going you get out. You had a correction, just the one that originally went out. You were on the floor? Yeah, we've emailed it. Yeah, I think that's what we're talking about. All right. And as you can see, the principal outside self stays with our superintendent. And eventually we will have a recreation supervisor. Right now, after the change in that department, we run into people at the coordinator level. And I don't know if they've saved money. But to give them the opportunity to compete against each other for the job, if they could earn. And they're both doing a very good job. We've really expanding the activities. They cover their costs and I'm pleased with it so far. We are reviewing, as I said, all of the MOUs and they will be brought up to a cost covering basis. The two, The two, the three job description there. The one for the HEM is almost the same as mine. There are differences. But this is what I need to help you be successful and to get this place back where it needs to be, back where it needs to be and to keep it from becoming dependent. It takes a lot of work. This has been what she's functioned at for the last six months, which I have seen. And I couldn't be more pleased with the level of work that we've got and what she's done. The other two are for Park Supervisor position, which is a little bit and the community center maintenance supervisor. This breaks both of those down into the actual jobs that they are supposed to be doing. Are you about done? Yeah. Thank you. All right. Questions from the board? Do we want to have a, do we want to see a presentation on the numbers in the budget? Or do you want to just ask questions? What do you guys think of it? What's on board? I'd like to ask questions. What do you guys find here? I'd like to ask questions. Okay, so we'll start with the questions. Can you talk to us a little bit about how you're doing this allocation process? Is it based on? Revenue is a based on expenditures. What's it based on? Are you splitting the kitty? We're looking at the cost of each person that's involved and we're trying to allocate that plus portion of the overhead. So for me, part of my time for Christina, her time, everybody in the admin, on the time that we spend to try and get to a fully distributed cost, can pass that on to each of the three tubes for the sections of each tube. So that, hopefully by the end of next year, we've got a very good idea of the actual hard true cost on a distributed basis of everything that we can do. So is there a specific methodology that you're using or you just looking at and go well it should be about this. No. I can't. I'm just eating. You want to tell them? So what can you specify what allocation you're talking about? Well, I mean administrative costs are going to be spread across the three new departments. Right? Okay, so. So for example administrative costs would be assigned to the fire service right? Well how much? How does that divide it up? How do we decide how much gets assigned to fire versus wrecking and then what's it? Parks. It would basically be based on how much time we're spending in each department. So what we're going to do is we're going to look at how much time we've been spending in each department and we can allocate it for a sentence now but what we're going to do is do a that what's called voucher and we're going to charge actual time to each department that we're spending each department. And then other expenses and services how do those get divided up? So I.T. services. I.T. services would get divided up by the different departments. So we have currently four different departments, but right now we have five right now, but we're condensing them down into four. It would be divided evenly between those four departments that are there because IT services are divided equally. So would that make sense for CC&R to pay the same as fire? Yes, if they're getting IT services the same as fire they would. All of them are getting the same services. The only thing that I would do differently is make sure that how if we're being charged per computer, each department is being charged by the computers that they have. So if it's emergency services or a monthly service-based service charge, everybody would get charged this year. Okay, that wasn't real clear, but it sounds like we would allocate it based on the level of services department. If they're being charged by a level, it's like the number of computers you have. If that's the way they're being charged. If it's a flat rate, say it's $100 a month, no matter how many compared you have, then it's going to be divided out easily. So that's what we're looking at and that's why it's taking a little bit more time for those items to be able to spread those out because there's more information for each professional service that we have. So theoretically for example our pie charts are going to look a little different. They do look very different, right? Well, but they'll look even more different. I mean, why would we show admin as a separate department and a pie chart if we're allocating them? Because currently it hasn't been allocated out. It has. Certain things have been moved, but the whole department of admin has not been moved out yet. So whatever remains in admin you're going to see that as we're setting right now. Okay. All right. We had some questions on revenue and expenditures. The fire equipment rental line item. What are we doing in the fact this year? It's been removed from the operating fund. So, if we receive any money for equipment rentals, where will it go? It goes to fund seven. So fund seven is acting as a equipment fund. Is that what we're saying by doing that? We've been back in Florida on this. The old incident it changed last year because the board made the decision to put the funds into the operating fund rather than it going into funds that which is the reserve. Okay. All right. So and we budgeted both. Of course, assuming that's going to be zero, we, I noticed we didn't really have a fun seven projection here. There's not because we're just doing operating five CCNRs at the moment. Usually anything special happens in the final budget. Okay. I'm sorry. Expanded to the salary expenditures that are projected here. Do they take into account the proposed personal actions? Yes. And they project next to your salaries based on just a CPI increase for the current on the back. Thank you. Can you give the consideration of one step increased that most staff get annually plus the 3%. So you're projecting a slightly 4% increase? What? Slightly. Four percent. Four percent. So on the personal actions, you mentioned that you did the research on similar job titles and salaries. Is there any backup to that? Is there a product that we can see? In close session, yeah. And was the assistant general manager part of the salary survey conducted? It was part of it. It was also, we talked to them about how creative and the trick of it is that other titles don't carry either the breadth or the authority in an organization than I need. And that makes it important to be an ADF. Looked at that. I actually been looking at that for years and other organizations to about the damage that came because I needed. So did we consider other position titles and responsibilities? Yes, I did. What were the operations manager, administrative services manager? But for this, what I want to do is basically have where people just got an expander into what he's been doing. Which is what I need. And none of those titles carry that weight, a level of detail, or authority in an organization. I need her to be able to do that. And would this propose realignment and these positions discussed and budget and admin committee? We didn't have a budget and admin committee before this because we didn't have time to get the budget out and have an admin committee. So this has not been discussed and budget and No, it hasn't. Thank you. John, any questions? Regarding the Weed of Bateman's ordinance, that we haven't made a decision on yet. Where do we need to do that fire? Or here? Should it be a fire and a emergency services committee item? Is it a board item? Wait a minute. The ordinance would never drop forward for a vote. I think you can be dealt with either way to tell you the truth. I think it would be a matter of preference. Whether or not that's directed by the board or that description is given the general man to prove it. I think it would kind of go over to direct grace to see if he wants to see the fire committee or whether it should be a board item. I'm kind of leaning towards the committee. My experience is that the committee is the one closest to that general function. I think there's other board members that can speak to it before efficiency. We chose a committee that discussion that we had there. We created a same report that was brought to the board for recommendation. I think that would be more efficient. I don't think it can't be done at the board, but recognize how much it can be brought to the board at the level I think it's just sort of what's going to be handled in committee first. I'd like to see it next month in that committee meeting with it. Other than that, the, where did we come up with 58% for fire expenditures? So with the removal of the ambulance expenses, it brought down the overall expense. So that's what the 58% is. The total expenses that fire has based on the toll budget. So when you bring down their expenditures by one and a half million, it brought account of 58%. But their revenues are still at 63%. But there's still some admin costs that aren't your men number correct? Correct. Edmund cost that our correct so admin has not been our department one thousand I have one question then I'll come back to comments what percent of Christina's time is HR? What would you say? Probably about 30. Again? Probably about 30. 30%. Okay. Okay. And that's because of all of the changes you're making. So that might be the variable that you might want to work with. Okay. That's all the question I had. Yeah. Yeah, I'll call it as a head of time. I didn't ask official times to review this like I would like to. Or the simple practical reason that you come out with time to do that. But I would give what I have. Looking at the revenues on page two of the report, Town of 226 fire apparatus equipment, and move, meaning that's being taken out of the budget, completely. Or is it simply zero out? I didn't copy anything. So where are we capturing the cost of rental? In the past, and this is two years ago, when we actually began to start doing that, I agree with you, that we started to recognize the maintenance cost for our engines that went out on rental so that the operating budget could be reimbursed for that. That's not an operating expense for our district. It's directly related to the rental. So where are we going to budget or account for that? So what we did two years ago, and like I said, it's a direct raise bill. The rental revenue goes into five seven. And then two years ago, we decided, because you're not capturing the amount to be able to transfer over the 10 percent or whatever the percentage was. All of it will be recognized in flood seven and then it will be a transfer in to fund one of whatever that percentage is at the end of the year. Is there a reason that we don't capture that in line items that it's separated as an actual cost rather than just a transfer in so that's a little more transfer. Because you can't show it as a light low, I mean, I guess you can, but we wouldn't do it until the end of the year when we know the total amount of rental revenue. And this year, we went from 300,000 to 60,000. So without really having a good idea of what it was going to be, I didn't put it in a mouth in here for a transfer. And that's understandable. I would like to request that that could either keep the line with zero because we're going to have to do this. And I don't think it's a wise idea to just do a transfer in an out of thing. It needs to be recognized that that was an expense for the rentals. So that we show that what it is or just put a placeholder like we have in the past. It is. It is. Okay. I'm just going based on the language used in this because some of these items are said to be the move and some are being zero out. So I'm just responding to what's in the report. So what I would request there is that it's not removed but if P-0 recognizes that there will be some revenue coming in based on the insurance. Same thing on account of 4610 grants being removed due to grant completion. I will be removing that line out of completely new. So count 4410, we debate and eliminate it. Is that the same thing? Not allocating anything? Or it's staying in, but we're not allocated. Yeah, it's there, but you have to spend the money. That's where the ordinance comes in. So basically you're gonna be a year behind. If you spend $50,000 this year, you're not gonna be able to recognize it as a revenue until next year. Because you're not sure that people will actually pay at one end, it's getting up and down. And we can't tax for a little bit until the following year, if we change our timeline. I'm just kidding. Couple of reviews I've been asking you, and I want to recognize Gravel for the contractual service increases. Sorry. I'm not used to hearing that. Gravel for the minimal increase on 5236 for contractual services. I assume based on previous discussion the Director of Compensation will be adjusted in the next budget. I thought something would happen to this one but that will be adjusted. Some of it's NCCNRs. You'll see there was a very small adjustment to it. They may look large but for all of the CCNR meetings, those are in the CCNR meeting. No, I'm talking about a count 5250 director compensation, which says reduced with reduction of monthly committee meetings, as well as reduction especially. So that went significantly down. I'm assuming that's going to go back up until which another decision based on how the frequency of committee was it's 10,250 right now and then in CCNRs it's over 3000 so there was it's 10,000 or reduction it wasn't like that. I wasn't eliminating all of it to be meetings. I did that one question and it's less about budget. Account number 5420 on page 45 is just a footnote. There's 980,000. There's 20,000 variance study removed. I'm just curious because it's in here. Have we heard anything on the drainage study that we spent $20,000 on? It's supposed to be coming out. Before I die, I did tell six months, didn't it? I have done concern about that study. Oh, I do too, that's why I'm asking. I have some concern. I'm not worried. I'm I'm just curious. Do we have any up to Alan? Yeah, please. I know. My guy was going to press this. I want to make sure we maintain the budget discussion. I don't want to give two out of the weeds. Okay. Got a simple somewhere. I'm sorry to catch out, but I don't want to get lost in this. So it was put on hold because of various lawsuits and the Elder Rada Water Authority has ceased the study at this point. So, okay. So, okay. So, okay. So, okay. So, okay. So, okay. So, okay. So, okay. So, okay. So, okay. So, okay. So, okay. So, okay. So, okay. So, okay. So, okay. Yeah, look, it's better than the budget. So much. OK. Roll up. We've got, you've made a couple of comments on recreation programs. $180,000 projected. That's what it was last year. We brought in $118,000. You're saying $180,000 is realistic for next year? We eliminated some of our programming this year due to not having the staffing so now that we're fully staffed and hoping to get the additional full-time person we're hoping to get all of that revenue. The line 450, it's a structure program revenue that is also offset by somewhat by this two structures. In the one 40, it's a 40-speed system. So it's 140 revenues, but it's 506% of the last code, everything's a thousand, that goes to the reference. That's 6040. 6040. 4040. So, 506000 out of that one point. Okay. Assembly hall and classroom. Is it 70,000? We are currently at 338. That's a real estate number. That's more than double we currently receive this year. We are getting lots of friends, if that's where it was at before, we have a lot of people at least. I'm just wondering if we have some questions. We have some very good response and with the work that Mike has done in getting us state-of-the-art system, that's considered very attractive. And I think it's reasonable to assume that we're going to be successful at a solid level. Forty-one, even six Jim Marivanoop, 46 this year, but it's we're projecting 40. Why is it not more? Somehow the previous years, what has passed about 60,000? Full run of fees, projecting 140,000. We're currently at just under 100,000. That's 40% more than we've heard the receiving by the physical companies. There's a quarter's worth of revenue that we have received. OK. Thank you for that. There's a quarter's worth of revenue that we have received. Thank you for that. And additionally, we're making this, utilizing the MOUs and making them cost-based. I'm not sure I may have known, I just wrote these records on how possible it is if this could be in a little larger print. I'm not that point, I have to make the call again. When my glasses are on the head, it was a little learned from me. It falls apart. I know. I know. I know. I know. I know. I know. I know. I know. I know. I know. I know. I know. I know. I know. I know. I know. I know. I And so utilities, this is 54.91 utilities gas. We are predicting the $44,000 reduction from last year. Currently we're at 88% of the families. So we're anticipating maybe $20,000 increase in the year. And so that's about a 25% increase on what we've spent. It's been fluctuating from year to year. We're thinking that the saving is possibly due to recognizing the fixes that we made to the protein tank, as well as putting in a new H-axis at 89. We were just trying to be on the conservative side and like we did this year, we got to do major judges to bring that down we can. But with gas prices go up and down, we don't want to under budget. And finally on the utilities for solar budgeting, what we currently spending, we're supposed to be seeing a little more benefit from the solar panels. Have we had any contact or anything from Brighton regarding this agreement regarding our benefits? I have made a number of calls and I am not receiving one back. I thought it might be interesting to go knock under door. I'm going to do that with you. But I used to be in this business and looking into your environment, I think the second 10 years for you to make some money. Not now. With that, I'm going too far. I'm going to be honest because there's a few general questions. I'd like to understand better than we don't have to discuss that, but I think there needs to be a better explanation on the admin costs and how it's allocated. And I recognize we're trying to do it based on how different departments use that. I don't agree with a flat fee to each department because, for instance, CCNR has two employees. Other departments have more. If there's a flat fee, it should be based on the number of employees. And so one department of the flat should be paying us. That's a huge hit to the CCNR budget. Uniform charge for use of that product to each department because each department gets one, then they get charged that. If it is not a uniform charge and is allocated to the department based on subuse, as she said, you know, there are 15 computers, We don't have to pay. But if there were 15 computers, we would be charged by the computer, that would pay 15. And so, I mean, that's a reasonably standard method of allocation. Now, I would suggest that's one standard. I'm not sure I agree with it because it was the risk of penalizing some departments with less staff targeting the same thing than other departments with more staff. And CSR is one of my examples. That's all you want. That is a significant deficit and I'm concerned about what that's going to do. I'm also, you know, this is food I'm a little concerned about some of this because I don't know how much input staff has had into this. With this only being published two days ago. Staff? Yeah. Staff is then? Yes. No. I haven't heard anything about how staff is interactive with these decisions, with these allocations, or they just told where they brought it to the discussion. How is all of this that decided. What's coming to me feels like a top down decision. And I want to understand how the staff is in the wrap. We haven't done a lot of allocations. That's what I think people are not understanding. There have been very small breakouts and allocations that have gone to different departments. I was told to do fixed costs to get rid of fixed costs. Department heads don't have and have say in what fixed costs for retiree health go into their, go into their line items because if they have people retired from parks, that has to go into parks. When it comes to an audit, it doesn't matter how many people are at an apartment or an audit, the audit gets done for every department. So that's going to be allocated out. I did talk to the department heads on things that they needed. When you're looking at a budget and someone says that they needed legal services, or they need this data, they have had input on what they need for their to continue writing their department. But there are certain things as far as administrative costs, I haven't gotten very far with that department. The only department that's really been shifted the most is our fixed costs. And those are costs that I can't ask a department head, you know, if they want to pay for a retirement house that's retired from their departments or for LACCO. You know, LACCO got to light it out in between all our departments. You know, damn, these were being a fixed cost or went into parts. So those are the things we can't really, we can't have a conversation, those we need to go in the department for the day-to-day. And I don't, I don't know, it's a few days later. That's some of these items I know the new, I know the new, you know, get it. I recognize when you start recognizing the cost reach department, and that's going to be important not just for now but with our already discussion about annexation we need to understand what it cost to do each of these things. Yes, they did that up so I fully acknowledge that. Eric? Yes. So that's why I've asked for more time with 1000 and that's why we talked about final budget being that the projected time. I used to do fully distributed costs, prepare it, and the number of organizations that I did in my own, because I wanted to know what each piece was. In my last district, we had an Excel program that allowed me to get down, which is unique, the first time in my life. It allowed us to take each capital project and get it down to the hour per employee, you know, that's specific. Well, we're not going to do that here. But the bottom line is it's going to be a distributed cost as closely to what it actually costs as we can. So we know the bottom line fundamental cost. That doesn't mean if you don't have the opportunity to say don't charge it to the department because that is your choice. But knowing the information is what I'm trying to give you. And so one comment that I have much question about, and then I'm done with my comments for that is, I appreciate Christine's explanation about documenting time and how it gets allocated. But I'm also carrying that in light of the Germanic report of how much time you're spending on so many things. My question with me is that the best piece to include right now with everything else going on? You should staff spending that much time. I've just had a number of people that work with who've had to do that in document their time, expressing all that. That's a bit laborious. And based on what you're telling me, I'm not sure if that's completely the best use of staff time right now. Well, having been a lawyer for over 50 years and having to allocate my time for 30 of that is not a pain to do that. That is not a pain when you get paid like a lawyer. No, with all respect it's not a pain when you get paid like a lawyer. It is when you get paid 20 $25, $30 an hour. It's first, it's down in the departments that we're allocating down to and so people are getting the 20 and 30 an hour are going to not necessarily be having to allocate when we get down into capital and try and see the cost of capital budget. You know, we're having Mike and Russell try and do an, uh, God, we're not under my head. Anyway, an asset management plan and the capital budget, We're not going to get down into that kind of allocation there because we don't have the money for it. We're trying to figure out basically what it is, what is going to cost to refer or replace it. So at least you have an idea of what we don't have. I understand. Not, and we're not going to go down into deep allocations there. There you're going to get basic snapshot. That's all I have for the moment. All right, I have just a handful of questions. My first point is I heard from Alan saying we're going to have three departments, and I heard from Christine, and we're going to have three departments and I heard from Christine and we're going to have four. So the ones I heard were community center and recreation fire and but in parks. Seable in arts. And you're saying seats are open. But that's not in the general fund. The general fund is going to be on three. Yeah. But that's not in the general fund. The general fund is going to be on three. I want to clarify that. And then I guess that's all of my other questions. I will, there are more opinions so that you will wait till we hear from the public. So any comments from the public on this preliminary budget? Yes, I'd pick a jigger's Kevin Cardin. I think we all see what we need at a budget community this month. I mean, there is a lot to, I guess, and a lot to go through. This is the, and I timing whatever, I'm not a part of that, but this is, you really need a budget committee before you subject everybody in the audience. So, yes, I'll try, though, otherwise we'd breathe. My comments this evening have been mostly directed. It's been primarily directed, twice, the question of how do we write size this organization given the resources that we have, the money and the staffing. I'm really concerned, not because I don't think Christina's done a wonderful job, but I question whether this district really has the resources to have essentially two general managers. It's a nice idea to work towards. I don't think in the position that we are in now that that is realistic. If we are having someone like Christina working 24 or 7 missing holidays and everything else, there's something wrong with management. This is not doing things right. I assume she is an exempt employee, or otherwise we'd be paying her over time. We cannot operate for very long on that basis. And if she's assuming more responsibilities, how is she going to be working a few hours? I don't really quite understand that. It seems like we need a full-time person in budget and HR. And if she's inadequately paid for what she's doing, then give her a salary increase. I think that's a reasonable thing to do. If she's been chronically underpaid in your study, reviews that, it reveals that. And her experience and performance justifies then give her a salary increase. It's another thing to bring on another person to be a general manager. And I was looking, I'm sorry, upon the org chart, if you had this as a general manager, whether it was for a standard or someone else, are you planning to put that person in between you and the rest of your staff because as I saw the org chart, I had many org charts in my life. Basically there's a whole lot of people, the parks and facility superintendent, the rec supervisor, and the CCM our compliance offer amongst other people are going to be reporting directly to that person. You could put all that responsibility plus finance plus HR to one individual, then Alan with all due respect we pay you a lot of money. What do you do? I don't really care all that much about what happens in line-bought. I realize you're taking the long view there, but the fact of the matter is if we don't have the money to provide services, if we become a dependent district, it doesn't matter what they want in terms of services, because they ain't going to get it. I think we're not focusing on the fact that this agency isn't in trouble. We're not focusing on what's important. We're trying to do too much. We have, we shouldn't have, in my opinion, the celebration this year because you don't have the staffing to adequately do it without working people 24-7. This is the time for austerity and rebuilding. It is not for giving everything to everybody in the hopes that then they will like you enough to give you a tax increase. Thank you. Other spend the public regarding this. Yes, the assistant general manager of position part of the session. That was the actually I was not about that was later. It's part of the budget. Part of this presentation so you can comment on it. All right, well, I'm going to just say it the way it is. We don't need an assistant general manager. But if Christina's not getting paid enough, give her more money. I don't know what you're doing, Mr. Gardner. You've been here in what, five months? It's months. I mean, I'm not going to second guess what you do or not do, okay? But we do not need a position like that at all, because then I mean, I read the description. I mean, it's quite lengthy, so quite lengthy. And I'm not going to criticize your staff because I know they're working hard. Then I'm going to tell you the changing of the way we do our budgets for me as problematic because we changed the way we report our finances when we change finance people when we change finance people, when we change general managers. And then it's very difficult to go back and look what was done before and where the money is. Now I realize that you only have to present a budget by a certain time to the county. I know that. And then come August, September, people show up whatever their budgets are because the rest of the money comes in. But we were all on the, every agency that, they're on the teeter plant. So whatever money the county says you're going to get in those letters, estimate letters, that's what you're going to get. So you should be able to work your budget off of that estimate letter. You're not going to get any more, and you're not going to get, you're certainly not going to get any less. And I know that for a fact, because of what I did for half of my fire career, first half was with the city, the first half was with the city. The last half was with county fire. That's what we did. You know what your money's gonna be as far as your taxes go. So I mean, I don't support an assistant general manager title at all. More comments from the public regarding this issue? We'll start over here. Sorry? I'll tell you first. Paul Gilpressed. Two comments and two questions that I have for the Board of Internships. So comment, I've read the reports for my rock and marble valley. And then I'm commenting on this because it was brought up at a gentleman. It's about 3.1 miles from the still. 15 miles to Elra, the village. I've had planning commission to reach out to me to ask for my opinion on it. I would encourage this board to have two of its members meet with the planning commissioner for District 2 and District 4, I believe is it is. Your board, two of you should meet. You don't need to bring the GM, he's busy enough. But they're asking questions. And I'm saying you need to talk to that board, remember to that board, because they see an impact and they see no money going to it. And I think you can get those commissioners to do the work that your GM can do, or it doesn't have a time to do. So I would encourage your board to give two board members a time to do. So I would encourage you to board members assigned to go talk to those commissioners. Because I'll fight the fight for you. I can tell you that right now. The second question I have, I'm confused on fund seven and fund one. And I'm concerned is fund one, a capital fund that you transfer money out of fund seven is, and is it set up with designated funds for your capital, rolling capital and your fixed capital and your buildings? I really like to understand how that works. Having been a resident of this district since 1998, I understood that fire service was directly funded by the rental fees that were acquired from Cal Fire and so that you had regular replacement of your apparatus. I don't hear or see that you have designated funds going to specific capital replacements that have to be looked at. So I'd like some explanation on that. Thank you. Thank you. Other right here? Other comments? Brad McMollon, camera port. I hesitate saying anything because I'm not sure how well everything is received but this ship's sinking. The ship has holes in it and it's sinking The ship has holes in it and it's sinking. And then there's efforts to spend money when the ship's sinking. When the ship's sinking, you've got to stop spending money. You've got to start figuring out how to focus energy in efforts in a way to save money. That's all I're going to say. Thank you. Other comments from the public regarding this issue? All right. I suggest that before it returns to the board and we start our deliberations, we take a five-minute break and get water back through every evening, stretch your legs and we'll be being at 931, five minutes, not long. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. Thank you. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm going to work down my back. No, I'm going to work down my back. No, I'm going to work down my back. No, I'm going to work down my back. No, I'm going to work down my back. No, I'm going to work down my back. No, I'm going to work down my back. No, I'm going to work down my back. No, I'm going to work down my back. No, I'm going to have a little bit of a conversation. I'm going to have a little bit of a conversation. I know for a long time that I'm going to have a conversation. I know for a long time that I'm going to have a conversation. and I am a member of the National Institute of Technology. You saw how the civil university in Alton, discussed the flow. Really welcome. She's got a good life there. That's well-known. She's got a great, a great, well-known supply. I'm actually more on medium. It's all spoken. Okay, let's start. Okay. Let's start. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay all in the corner. Yeah, I'm going to show you. And what is I going to show you? Okay, why can't somebody else come in? Yeah, I'm going to show you. Okay, okay. It's a good one. It's a good one. Do you read what you said? It's not easy to make a change. But I just thought I was going by Don Hanks. I said that I was going to have to go to the hospital. I said I'd call the death press. I don't know what I was told. I was told that I was going to have to how to explain it. I don't know how to explain it. I don't know how to explain it. I don't know how to explain it. I don't know how to explain it. I don't know how to explain it. I don't know how to explain it. I don't know how to explain it. I don't know how to explain it. I don't know how to explain it. I don't know how to explain it. I don't know how to You are kidding. You are kidding. So I told you. That you see what I'm like today. Thank you.