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I'm going to go to the next room. I'm going to do it. I'm going to go to the next room. I'm going to go to the next room. I'm going to go to the next room. I'm going to go to the next room. I'm going to go to the next room. I'm going to go to the next room. I'm going to go to the next room. I'm going to go to the next room. I'm going to go to the next room. I'm going to go to the next room. I'm going to have to go back to the next slide. I'm going to have to go back to the next slide. I'm going to have to go back to the next slide. I'm going to have to go back to the next slide. I'm going to have to go back to the next slide. I'm going to have to go back to the next slide. I'm going a lot. No. I find that. That's what we're going to basically say. We don't sign the IGA agreement Right, that's what my feelings That's where I'm going No 40 what's that no 40? County I will go into the detail of this. Well, there is actually a decision point in this. You've got an IGA that came from them and then we have an IGA in front of you that essentially says, it's 2 million you figured out. Hey, and if nothing else, the peanut brittle is awesome. Or I love this. John Peacock might say, you guys got a good point. I'd love to come back to you with a Solution I was in the place I had no Wi-Fi I had to resort to paper no, why wait where could you have been? Grand Mesa. We have a cellular connection right it didn't work. Oh darn Somebody rings. You don't need to be sure to sign in the back. The R&C one signature. Hey Jason. That's her. I don't know if you got a good lead. She said, you know what I'm always getting in the middle of the room. That's the two red ones. There's one in there, John. There's five years in a John. They're, they want to take a look. They're going to tell me it's one five years in a row. I'll be getting short. Again, I can't take it out. I can't take it out. I can't take it out, specifically. But I know they've had issues. Yes, yes. They don't bring that interest. Well, you know. That one. I'm just We don't decide it. We decide. We completely agree. Just to give you an answer whether that's up. Hello, Mr. Steve. Okay. So are you going to stay here? I think it's fair. No. So are you gonna stay? I think it's fair. No, I'm not. Oh, wait. We got candid. So how are you? I've never saw you after I saw you when we walked in. I never saw you. I was crying by him. I never saw you. All I got open is true. We were home by 8.30. I'm in the process over here. So your videos down here. I'm giving my comments back to you. I'll just stuff but I have to do it in all these years, but I'm just gonna have to run it in all these years, but I'm just gonna run it in all these years, but I'm just gonna run it in all these years, but I'm just gonna run it in all these years, but I'm just gonna run it in all these years, but I'm just gonna run it in all these years, but I'm just gonna run it in all these years, but I'm just gonna run it in all these years, Okay. John, you have to do good afternoon, sir. You do? I'm multitasking. I'm multitasking platforms. And I actually have paper too. I'll read you. You can't read. You can't read. You can't read. Did you guys come? No, I mean, I actually have that. Thank you. Thank you. You do something all for too. I'm not sure if you're going to get it. I'm going to get it. I'm going to get it. That sounds like mother pot. I don't know. That's about it's been 9. Maybe I should have some on the record tape. What's mail? No. Who's male, no? you I'm going to do it. here Welcome, son. Here. Butler. Hey, Burr. Here. Cooker. Here. Thank you. Item number two is for public non-agenda. Don't see the hands raised out there for that one. So we will move on. Item three, council updates. We'll start down Mr. Cooker today. Anything for right now? I have nothing except I guess I would like to say I think many of us were at the celebration of life service for Carolyn Purvis and it was I thought one of the most moving and meaningful services I've ever been to and I'm sure it was a great tribute to both Bob and Carol and they have so many people there and so many people caring for them. Yes and she will be very well met much missed. Mr. Wilkinson. Yeah next Tuesday at Anderson Ranch they're going to have their holiday open house which I encourage everyone to check out. They have the children's ornament decorating from five to six, and then they have the open studios from five to seven. It's really cool, because you get to walk around the campus and take a look at the different artists, and see what kind of art they're putting out, and you can buy some of this stuff that they have. It's a great way to pick up some gifts for Christmas. I intend on going, because it's a great event. Thank you. And for the people in this community that we have a loving tree, get together tomorrow night. No, it's Mark, Marky Butler talk about that a second. Six o'clock at the silver tree? It would be five. I'd be there late. No. Five o'clock at the silver tree. But that's all I have. Marky, we doing council updates. Oh, well, it's good to see everyone here and I want to thank the community for showing up. You already did that. Well, thank you. Okay, then I'm sorry. Sorry. Fred, Fred did that. Thank you, Fred. You're welcome. Tornado is the trees of hospice, the loving tree here of the Selvertree. I would encourage many of you or anyone to come to the event. It's all about a special time of the year as we all know as we go into the holiday season. And we've lost some major people in this town and our community. And I personally suffered of the death of my brother this year. And so his name will be read amongst many names to our night. So please come. It's free. And Joan Beamis will be speaking. Billy will be talking. Robert DeWitter will be speaking. And SilverTree puts on a nice spread. Yes it is. So thank you, SilverTreat puts on a nice spread. So thank you SilverTreat. Jason, nothing for me. Thank you. Then we'll move on to item number four. This is entitled Aspen's Key Company Seasonal Update. Mr. Kaplan Steve's School over here. Welcome, gentlemen. Thank you. Thanks for having us. Mike Kaplan, CEO of Aspen's Scheme Company. And happy to be here again for a semi-annual update with town council and the crew. Join today by Mr. Soule, GM of Snowmass, and Steve's going to talk mostly about a recap of last summer and preliminary thoughts on next summer as well as a little bit for this winter but we're well into this winter. Also have David Perry and David is no senior vice president. Mountain division is going to give a bit of a business update, sort of the health of the business. And then Christian NAP, our vice president of marketing, is going to talk a bit about our marketing poaching and strategy from a brand and from a brand standpoint and some of the changes. We've started to implement since he arrived here six months now, right? Almost. Almost six months. Time flies, right, Christian? I have a few opening comments. Basically, there are sort of two words. I'd like you to sort of think about as I make these comments. First is the competitive nature of the industry right now. I've been talking around the community about this and I think it's more competitive that it's ever been, particularly for us in our niche here because people are, I think, targeting our customers. I'll talk a little bit about that. And then once again, I am optimistic and I'll talk a little bit about why. And once again, I am optimistic and I'll talk a little bit about why. First in terms of competition, I've been speaking for the last few months about the fact that during this downturn over the last couple years, our competitors have been building hot beds in hotel rooms, you know, 1300 new hotel rooms in the Rocky Mountain West just since 2009. Some major new hotels, it definitely, truly destination mountain resorts. And while I wouldn't wanna have been, want to have been the developer of those hotels, those operators are out there with directors of sales and marketing and whole staffs out there trying to sell those rooms to again, destination, skiers and snowboarders. So it'ss out there trying to sell those rooms to again destination skiers and snowboarders. So it's competitive out there. Our salespeople are seeing it. Our hotel salespeople are seeing it. And you know, they're also being aggressive on attracting new airlines. They're being very aggressive on, you know, going after international markets. Our top international markets were always sudden there's a big presence on behalf of our competitors in those places. So you definitely have to be active and aggressive out there. And so we truly appreciate the collaboration we have both with the town council and snowmast tourism and this entire community to go out there and compete and to have American Airlines starting service. The 15th, just about a week away, direct mount stop service out of Dallas and L.A. is huge, it's huge for this community and really appreciate your support there. It's Christian, I'll talk a little bit more about that. But in the meantime, we gotta make sure we're working together to really drive overnight occupancy, right, and working together on that. And you see the vice Roy, what are they in, I guess year three now, right, going in the first full year where they've got all their rooms in the inventory and for sale and available. And it's a lot of additional rooms in this valley and in this community. And so I think we get a work hard together to make sure we're trying to fill those beds and drive visitation here. And I think we've been meeting with Russ recently and some members of staff to talk about how we do that and how we shift. Maybe for more of a defensive mode, it wasn't that long ago when we were sort of trying to talk about how we do that and how we shift maybe from more of a defensive mode. It wasn't that long ago when we were sort of trying to slow things down overall as a community. Not so much in snowmast, but as a community. And now again in that competitive environment, we need to be working together to make sure we're competing in a destination resort marketplace. And then finally, I think we know what's going on or not, with base village, obviously Eastdale and those guys are out. Trying to, well, first of all, obviously the foreclosure. I think that's steady progress and generally good news, and maybe Billy said in the paper. But the next step is obviously to get a developer in there and get things moving. But in the meantime, I'm very encouraged by the silver tree being taken over by Starwood. And by those guys coming with a long term plan to flag that property, redevelop that property and sort of update it and bring it up to current standards. So encourage you guys to do everything you can to make sure they can stay on their timeline and allow that to happen. I think that's key for this community. And then finally, I typically remind this group of this number and it keeps changing every year and growing, but we shouldn't lose sight of the fact that we as a community and we as Aspen Scheme Company a ton of money into snowmass over the last eight years and The recent tally sort of I had to double check it my jaw dropped. It was $95 million over the last eight plus years Basically an unbound improvements improvements much of that going on You know right now with the old camp restaurant You know the list. It's the gondola. It's the Six Pack. I was up skiing with John Norton today. John and Robin and John hadn't been around for a while. And we're riding this year blisslifting. He goes, wow, this is cool. What else? You guys have done everything you could possibly do in snowmaths. Oh no. That's what Sule said. Good job, Steve. So, yeah, you're fired by bringing Norton back. No, again, you know, as we tend to take things for granted and I think it's important to remember that obviously all the things that this community's done from the Droskey property to this facility were in to the Rec Center. It's an amazing place. I went for a bike ride with John. Rigny was fairly new to the snowmask community. Did the rimshell this fall? We sort of stopped and looked around. I said, what do you think of snowmaskers? This place is unbelievable. And anyway, we tend to take it for granted. So I think we all need to remember that. And then finally, I was looking at the mountain, the in Snowmass, sort of the winter guide here, that the sun did. And it's incredible. We got this number one, this listing of accolades here. Number one in Transworld, Snowboarding Resort. Number four overall in Ski Magazine. Number one for family programs. Number three for grooming. Working on that. Yeah, number four lifts, terrain parks, service, overall satisfaction. Again, that's some of those things are specific to the mountain operation, but overall it's a testament to this community and the commitment to get service and the overall experience. So that's why I'm optimistic. I think I'd encourage all of us to not beat ourselves up too much. And let's make sure, especially with the guests coming in this time of year, as I keep saying, community psyche counts. And we should be proud of what we have and happy and excited about sharing the bounty, as we say, with our guests. and happy and excited about sharing the bounty, as we say, with our guests. Finally, I've been talking to some of the other, the city of Aspen and Pitkin County and I don't know Russ if you've met with your counterparts over there yet. But I've been encouraging those other jurisdictions and I do the same to you guys. To collaborate on, I guess what I'd say is a multi-jurisdictional sort of strategic planning effort. I think we have an opportunity to collaborate more in terms of who are we as a community of the mid and upper valley, I'd say, or maybe even the entire valley. Who do we want to be in the next 10, 20 years? And I think it'd be worth sort of a strategic planning effort with all those groups sitting down. Again, we have these great facilities and natural assets in this open space and these connectiveness that I think if we work together on sort of presenting ourselves to visitors and competing in the marketplace, I think we can be more successful, especially on a year-round basis. So I know that Russ meets occasionally with his counterparts, and I think John Peacock's going to bring that up, and I'm going to work on Mayan to see if we can get a group together and start talking about that and being a little more intentional in who we want to be over the long term. So I would love to see you guys supporting that effort as well and participating. Thank you. term so I would love to see you guys supporting that effort as well and participating. Maybe we'll just keep moving and then stopping us questions at the end. You guys are okay with that? Sure. I'll hand it to Steve who, as I said, is going to talk a lot about its summer and a little bit about current conditions maybe. Well thanks again for having us here. Before we get started on summer, I wanted to thank the town for the support that you gave us with our early opening. I know the Dave Peckler put on some extra buses from the rodeo lot and the town did not enforce permit parking during that early season. I think that that contributed a great deal to the success. I know our guests appreciated it, certainly. I did as well. And just for the record I want to say that when we made the call to open early there was an honest three feet of snow on the burn. There's another 18 inches that were forecasted over the weekend and of course as soon as we made the call the wind picked up and we picked up two inches so that being said I still think it's the right decision. It was met with an awful lot of enthusiasm. And I think that the people up and down the valley came out and the ski depreciated it. And I think it was the right thing to do. So thank you for your help on that. Before I get going, quick mountain update, speaking of snow, it is absolutely amazing how far you can stretch six inches when you haven't had any for a while. The storm last at all week are weekend. We picked up six inches out of there and today we opened up some of the runs off the face of the knob. You shoot and moonshine. Opened up some of the runs down there off of the lower part of the burn. Timberline and whispering Jess and wine skin and we're going to begin to work tomorrow setting up Alpine Springs and high Alpine for this coming weekend's opening and I'm about 90% sure that we'll have Alcamp open as well, the upper lift there so things are looking up. Those groomers, I'm not sure how they're doing. You see one by him a beer. Nice map you have there. What's that? Nice map we have on your iPad app, so I just found you the other day. I'm good. That's our marketing department. Did you say high alpine or stillpine spring? High alpine. The ski,. The skiing up on high Alpine is good. You know, when you get down towards the bottom there, it starts to get a little bit thin, but there again, the cats and snowmakers are in a great job. So we'll have a good opening on Saturday. How much you, I'm sorry, Jeff, the wall. Let's don't get greedy. How much you're able to blow? A lot. I mean, we've had a tremendous snow making season. You know, we had some good cold temps to begin with. And certainly the temperatures that you're seeing out there are perfect for snow making. So we are, like I say, we're completed with our snow making down through a little, what we call a little max park Which is lower green cabin and where coffee pot come together all the way over to the bottom of the Alpine Springs left We're focusing now on Makaha and once that's knocked out we'll have Makaha assay hill and then also We'll start work over on the terrain part there on cabin a little bits and pieces So guys are pretty close to having this thing wrapped up. So it's been a good season. So let's talk a little bit about summer. Oh, it's interesting. I'm missing some bullet points there. Oh, there it is. You have to be smarter than the machine. The big news this year was the opening of our free ride trails, our gravity trails. We opened the vapor trail on July 1st. That was the trail that we worked on the fall before that and got completed. It's probably worth noting that the guys had to shovel through about 8 feet of snow to have that thing opened on July 1st. But it was met with a lot of positive feedback. And it was really our first gravity and free ride trail. We also start to work on gravity logic and the funnel trail. And I want to note that those are not the names that are sticking. We've got a whole list of names that we're going to choose. And before the Exxonverse Trail map comes out, we'll announce what those names are. But for lack of better ones, that's what we're using now. We started work on those in mid-June, and we were able to open up just sections of those as we got them completed, which allowed us to give our guests up there and our users kind of a taste of those trails before they were completely done. And there again created an awful lot of excitement and a lot of positive feedback throughout the valley here and the whole community. One of the things that we did when we had gravity logic here is we opened up the gauntlet to try to encourage all those riders that came from all over the state and all over the western United States for the downhill to get over and ride that gravity logic trail and there again we're just very very good strong feedback on that and the word spread fast. So we now have a complete trail system. We've got these downhill trails, these free ride trails that complement our existing cross country trails. And all of our downhill trails are completed now. So we're going to be able to open next season and just start right off with the full trail system. So I'm curious, did anybody get a chance to go up and ride that Grabby Logic Trail? I did. Great. So for those of you that didn't, we've So I'm curious did anybody get a chance to go up and ride that gravity logic trail? I did. Okay great. So for those of you that didn't, we've got a short film clip here that kind of will show you what you missed. And if I can figure out how to load this. Thank you Christian. That's easy. I'm not sure if I can do it. I'm not sure if I can do it. I'm not sure if I can do it. I'm not sure if I can do it. I'm not sure if I can do it. I'm not sure if I can do it. I'm not sure if I can do it. I'm not sure if I can do it. I'm not sure if I can do it. I'm not sure if I can do it. I it's all that I've been. I found myself by the river, jumped in. It's all the nothing I'd be lonely. Lonely, lonely, lonely. Lonely, lonely, lonely. Lonely, lonely, lonely. Lonely, lonely, lonely. Lonely, lonely. So as you can see we've made a lot of progress over the past couple of years here. And those free ride trails are an absolute gas if you've never done it. Call me next year. I'll get you set up with a lift ticket and take you to D&E and get you with the downhill bike and all the gear so you can go up and do it first hand. It really is a very unique experience. So. I'm very walking it for you. You do it on my robot. I do sell a rent body armor. That's right. It is. Sure it is. I'll take it from personal experience. You need it. All right. So in addition to our biking program, of course, we've continued with the activities that we put in place the summer before, which included fishing, disc golf, climbing wall, and the hiking. It's a couple of activities that were new for this season that Camp Aspen Snowmass implemented was number one, the guided family hiking, I'm sorry, a guided family camping that we have up in the metals area. That proved to be a very popular program. And we sent out about eight or 10 groups. And as you can imagine, they were people who had never ever camp before. But it was absolutely remarkable how much they enjoyed it. And it's interesting, you know, when you talk to those people and they've never camped and you've given that experience how fired up they are. But so they go up with a guide and they'll cook a gourmet meal over the campfire. They'll do some sunset hikes and fishing wrappers pond and then, of course, sit around the fire at night and they just absolutely loved it. And we've got several trips on the book already for next season. So, the great program. We're going to continue to build on that one. The other one that we implemented this year was our mountain biking 101. And we felt very strongly that we needed to, you know, in conjunction with the opening with these new bike trails that we have, lessons available for people, both folks that have never been on a mountain bike before or intermediate riders that just want to improve their skills. So, the camp has some snowmasses and along with some of our ski and snowboard pros, but together a very good program and we had good success with that. We took a lot of folks out, never ever got them introduced to the trails and hopefully are we're converting them to be hardcore riders and come back year after year. So good programs and we're going to continue to look at new activities as well up there. So let's take a quick look at the numbers here. It's trending the way that we had hoped. Ridership was up 9.3%. Revenue up about 14%. Of course, labor had to go up just a little bit as well. But it's heading in the right direction. And I also included the numbers here from our capital expenditures over the last couple of years. And this total is about $360,000. So what this really demonstrates is the fact that we're committed to making this summer program at Alcamp work and These expenditure is worth for all of the summer activities the fishing dock at the pond the climbing wall all of the trail construction to disc golf, etc. So it's not cheap, but it's the right thing to do and as I say, I think we're headed in the right direction This next slide is a graph that I wanted to put up here just so you could see the the difference between back in the first three years 2007 eight and nine. That's when we were running the Berlin game lift. That's when the town was running the Berlin game lift and you can see the difference in the spike there and Elk camp when we started our activities up there. So there again you can see also see we've got a ways to go our revenue is less than our labor but I think that with our programs up there the completion of our mountain bike trails We're gonna make a big jump so Moving on make a big jump. So moving on. Moving forward. We want to build on last summer's momentum. There again we developed a lot of energy and a lot of buzz over those gravity trails. It's interesting to see how many people that I've talked to said you know I can't wait for winter but I really can't wait for next summer to go up and ride. So that's good. So we're going to build on that momentum. We're going to complete the tie-in of the vapor trail. That's that gravity trail that goes from the top of L-camp. The trailhead of that particular trail starts about 200 yards below the top of the lift. In order to access that you have to ride to summer road. I've got a preliminary approval from Jim Stark and a four service to complete that single track to the top of the lift. I still need to get with Kevin Wright and the Department of Wildlife to be sure that they're okay with that, but I don't think that there's going to be any issues, but I do have to get that approval. So we'll make that completion. We'll start that just as soon as the snow melts up top. We'll also be building a espresso and that's a cross-country trail that takes off from the top of the meadows and connects to the trails on the west side of the hill. We had every intention of getting that done this year but to be perfectly honest I just ran out of time on it so we'll be starting that next year just as soon as the snow melts. Now this next one we want to design and lay out additional gravity trails, flow trails. The idea being behind that is I want to stay ahead of the game on this thing and if they prove to be as popular as I think they're going to be and the business levels dictate, we want to have trails already laid out and designed so that it makes the whole approval process and the whole construction on these things that can happen in a much faster manner. I want to be ready to pull the trigger on that when business levels dictate. The idea is to go next year and open up like I said, we'll have all our writing right from the very beginning. And but I want to have these trails laid out So we'll be looking at that next season. And trying to come up with it. I like to have a trail all the way from the top of Alcant, another free ride trail down. And also do some spurs off of the existing free ride trails, just a little short sections that may be more difficult than the trails that people have got a variety of things to do. And then of course, we're going to be exploring opportunities for new summer activities. With the passage of Mark Udall's bill, we suspect that the approval process and the ability to implement new summer activities that maybe we thought would not be approved in years past may be possible. So we're taking a look at some different things. I mean, we have been exploring and thinking about Possibility of an Alpine slide even. Now, there's a lot of things that have to fall into place before that moves forward, but there again, We want to be ahead of the game and be thinking about this stuff. So we'll be taking a good hard look at that. And then we'll be capitalizing on, sorry. You're talking about summer activities, and I know if you're the right guy to ask or you're marketing guys, the right guy to ask. But I think you know our marketing committee is working on a mountains and mammoths initiative which the idea of setting a program to attract families out here or extended periods of time. I am wondering if anything you are doing with your on-mountain stuff or your marketing stuff collates with that. You know that'll have to be, we've discussed that, but I think that's probably something that Chris, you could speak to our David. But certainly one of the things that I, when I said that we're building on last summer's momentum, I meant to also say that we're working with your marketing department, a Dave Elk, and then looking at different events for next summer. So, I think that we're working closely with the town, and I know it would be happy to entertain any ideas or thoughts. But Fred, it's something we're thinking about because everything that Steve just described, including some of the future amenities that they're discussing would be very complimentary to, again, creating a better package in the summer. There again, the success of this whole summer program really depends on the ski company and the child working together. It's just like what my set said at the start of the whole meeting So we need to work together on Last but not least we want to capitalize on our new restaurant which will be completed Thanks, thanksgiving of next year 2013 We've already had some inquiries about some night and private events up there and You know, that's really going to be the corner storm for our out camp area both in the summer and the winter. And there's a photo I think you've seen that before. That's how it's going to look a year from now. So you said 2013, you mean 2012? I'm sorry you're right, you're right, 2012 though. My apologies. No problem. Are you on schedule with that building? I'm sorry. Are you on schedule with the building, by the way? I'm sorry. Are you on schedule with the rest of us? We are. We're on schedule and on budget. This is a shot that was taken shortly before Hider construction pulled off. I have to say those guys did a great job for us. They worked very well with us during our summer operation up there and we're very considerate of our guests and our, you know are trying to want a summer operation. I can't say for, I don't mountain bike, but I do hike up there. I'm sorry. Sorry you can't hear. Okay. I don't mountain bike, but I do hike up there and fairly often. And it really thought that those guys were doing a very considerate job. You know, you knew there was something going on, but it didn't interfere with anything you were doing. So, you know, kudos to them. What do you guys? I'm glad to hear you say that. I mean, certainly there was no question that was the construction site when you got off the lift. But, no, they were very considerate, and I thought they did a good job with it. This is a shot that I took last week and you can see the building in relation to the top of the gondola there. I'm very happy with the way the traffic flows around that. We open funnel on the piercine on Sunday and of course people were shoving off the ski in around the building and it's not going to be a problem at all. So things are working well with that restaurant. And as I say, once this thing is finished, it's really going to be the finishing touch and it's really going to be the cornerstone for our whole L camp area up there. So that's all that I have. I'm going to turn it over to David Perry unless anyone has any questions or else we can answer questions at the end as well. John, what's the quick question, Steve? I'm a gravity logic course. It's really great. And I enjoyed it. I don't get much air off of those, but that's okay, I make it to the top. What do you do about those jumps in the winter time? Is there any kind of conflict with your skiing operations? You know, the gravity logic crew, they're so good, they've done a lot of these trails, you know, across the country in a different skier. If you'll notice, all of those jumps and those big table tops, they're in areas where you don't ski in the winter. Well, you may ski there, John. That's it. That's good. There are off the main trails, and there shouldn't be a problem with those, and there won't be a problem. But you don't take them down, and you're just going to leave them there. Oh, no, no, you may be thinking also we've got that one big wooden structure over there at the junction of Yeah, power line and it's back in the trees and it's not gonna interfere at all with the scheme Thank you Everyone Well, maybe I'm gonna be try to be uncharacteristically brief. As you know, I know they know they know they'll be appreciated. It's like you guys do. But you know, I can't go anywhere without my occupancy graph. So this is like my sidekick. This is a look back at last summer, just a backup what Steve was talking about, and certainly the figures that you folks see on a regular basis. This was last summer's occupancy on a daily basis, and anything above the line here is positive, and realize what a positive trend we saw this past summer in occupancy. So it was very encouraging to see. I'm going to jump ahead to what that means to. Now this graph in a different position in the marketing board talked to you, showed you a version of this. But this is this past summer, Mountain Town taxable sales. Like the Bayam trip, this is made in August. They don't have full September, October, in here yet. This graph shows all of these different mountain towns, some snowmaths to Veil, to Mountain Village, to Tell You Ride, which is Crested Butte, Aspen, Ava Winter Park, Silver Thorn. Let's go on. The bars are the relative sizes of the economy. So, you know, Drainage, which is a regional center, of course, is a relatively large economy, but the one to really look at is this bar graph, because it shows the percentage change year over year. And leading the pack here at number one is snow mass village. So this is really impressive. A head of veil, well ahead of aspen, and everyone else. So to see 14 percent growth from May through August in taxable sales in this town, I know you see the sales tax numbers, but it's really nice to see it in comparison to other mountain resorts. You know, when we ask ourselves why, you know, we've all achieved it. I think it's a combination of factors. I think the additional activities are in the maturity of the things that are going on here in the summer is definitely a draw. Of course, the well-established events and music are a draw. But I also believe that, you know, good brands and places that do a great job with service are the resorts that recover most quickly after a recession. And we often said we want to try and do that to do a tremendous job with our guests while they're here, even during difficult economic times. This graph I think proves out that you add in reasonable lodging rates this summer, which Snowmass certainly has, and is continued to have in summer, have helped this recovery. So, let's hope this is a trend that continues for all of us. Let's switch to winter quickly back to occupancy. So, this is, as of November 15th, the most recent one we have. And, of course, everything above the line is positive. Huge bump in here in early January. All of January actually looks tremendously strong. February here, where Marty Grah now is on top of presidents is particularly strong. This business is really a transfer from here in early March last year with the later Marty Grah. And this is the change in the spring break weeks. But overall, a really good trend for occupancy for this coming winter. And with the snow and what Steve's doing with his six inches of snow is going a long way. It's good for everybody. So Dave, how much does it move during the year? I mean, you're forecasting out for that. Are you just enormously see a lot of movement both up and down? Two things. It's a good question. When we see trends emerge up and down early, and we see them as early as September and October, those trends always translate into actually increased trends as the winter goes along. So this blue line, for example, is last year's actual occupancy. And so we have to look at the fill-in between the current trend and the blue line in some places to get to last year's numbers. So there's still lots of fill-in to happen, especially here in late February and March. We have a lot of booking still to make. Yeah, that was my question. What I'm looking at here are bookings, is that correct? This is reservations. So this is pace. Yeah, so this is versus the same day a year ago. So yeah, so the red line versus the green line basically, and then the blue line is last year's actual occupancy. So, and the red line is the current rate of bookings. So that's, and then the difference differential is in this zero line here. So yeah, the trends do tend to stay, but we still have So that's, and then the difference differential is in this zero line here. So yeah, the trends do tend to stay, but we still have a lot of work to fill in. Let's say there's a short answer to that. This is, once again, a comparative graph to an aggregate view. I don't have a full list of resorts that are on here, but there's about seven resorts in this aggregate view. So this is looking back, sorry, looking ahead at this winter and how occupancy, this is a resort-wise, this is asthma, and snowmess combined, we don't have this for just snowmess, showing how the resort and occupancy level compares to our six and seven of our top competitors. So, you know, it shows from an occupancy perspective at least we're trending ahead of competition. So there's some encouragement there in these kinds of graphs. Dave, do you know how the activity relates to both lift ticket sales and lodging tax sales and regular sales tax? Yeah, there's a pretty good correlation. We tend to see lodging percentages and growth go up or come down at a higher rate than we do actual skier visits. So you might get 4%, 5%, 6% increase in lodging, occupancy, we might get a 3% or 4% in skier days. Same thing when it goes down. So if we drop 5% in occupancy, we may only maybe drop a couple of points. So it's interesting. It's more muted when it comes to that. The second part of your question was about taxable lodging. We ought to lodge it to you. Overall sales tax? Yeah. Coralates very closely. We found that the closest correlation, if you can look at one single measure, is occupancy If you're at a second one in, of course, this average daily rate, which is a close factor of occupancy. Because we hear more people are not necessarily skiing when they come here in vacation. That's why I was wondering if it's not skiing as much as they're spending more. Right. We've seen, we track percentage of people that do it in our ski. So we index skier days against occupancy days. And it's true that there's been a long-term trend of more people staying and not skiing. But it has to do with an aging demographic too, in some regards. So mass actually does much better than a lot of resorts, where percentage of people that are actually ski is very high. where the percentage of people that come to actually ski is very high. So those are my graphs on the business forecast. So like Mike said, we're feeling optimistic at this point. We could go and wear a dry spell. I was getting a little nervous, but a little bit of snow and the forecast is good. We should be in great shape. So I'm going to pass it over to Christian Dupton, you on the marketing. Hi everybody, Christian NAP, the newest member of the team, started back at the end of July. So just four months or four months. I was previously with Vale Resorts for 13 years, spent time at various resorts around the, in their company in Colorado, though, Eastern, Bever Creek Vale, and Breckenridge, and couldn't be happier to be here. And Aspen Snowmass and working with this team and these incredible brands, and so I look forward to working with all of you. I've worked quite a bit with Susan already and Beth and her team, and it was great partnerships going on there, and we're gonna only enhance that going forward. So I'm going to give you just a quick overview of what we're doing from a marketing standpoint. And where the brand has been was this was the kind of the brand platform we were working with, quality and invitation, respect and come live. The experience was the brand promise that we were putting out there in our advertising. We made some changes and we've kind of shifted that positioning statement to be more around and focused on the authenticity of our destination, on the stylish, sophisticated nature of our destination, and the approachability, which we think is a very key factor. The pinnacle of adventure in cosmopolitan mountain living is a statement that came out of this work. It's not something we're using as an active tagline or anything like that, but we're just using it to help with our tonality and the creation of our advertising. And we feel like this is the right approach. Aspen Stomach says a lot of things that are different. And Mike highlighted earlier, we have a lot of competition out there. And we have to make sure that consumers understand why they should come here over Park City or Vail or one of our other key competitors. So that's really important and how that manifests in the ads. You've probably seen the ads by now or read about them in the paper perhaps. But we came up with a campaign, Factory is our agency of record as well as the SNOMAS Tourism. And they came up with a concept before Aspen. And basically when we're saying that, we're saying that, you know, before Aspen's nomass, things, you know, we set the trends, we're the original, we're the inventor, you know, we have one of the longest history and heritage of any resource in this country. And we need to stand on that. We're an innovator, trendsetter with X games and other things that are happening here. And we wanted to kind of put a line in the sand and say that, go out there and show it in a very artistic way. You can see the publications we're going to be in, you know, have been and have insertions yet to go. We've developed specific targeted creative around a lot of these magazines. They're not just blanket ads across every magazine. We're really targeting and talking to the audience and the reader of those particular magazines. We're also working in collaboration with Snowmass in terms of making sure that we're not duplicating efforts in ski magazines, so it's like a back-to-back ad, we're allowing the Snowmass tourism to have an ad, and then we have an ad, same with some of the billboards, we're sharing that space as well down in the front range. So, working very together and leveraging leveraging the plan. So some of the ads, if you haven't seen them, I said, it's basically saying before Aspen, winter was just cold. And that Aspen is truly redefined what a winter experience can be, for guess. This one focuses on snowmass. And Mike also mentioned the accolades that this brand has particularly received. And we wanted to highlight a lot of those. And we talk about number one ranked family programs by the Readers of Scheme magazine. One of the top terrain parks, the number one overall resort and trans-world snowboarding. It's the most widely read snowboarding magazine in the world. It's a big, that's a big accolade. And so we highlight that. But of course, putting out the family message. You know, snowmats definitely is a differentiated between the treehouse, the facilities, the skiing scale lodging. It is a truly an incredible opportunity for family vacation. We focus in on Gretchen, a hometown hero here in snowmass, and you know, again calling out the accolades, showing that, you know, people, you know, athletes, authenticity, these are people that are real people. They grew up here and they became superstars in their own right. And we also have Torin Yator Wallace, the salt, just turned 16, I believe. Just landed his first double cork, something in the pipe and he's, Torin can now be in the Olympics. As you've heard, Sochi is going to have half-pipe skiing. So Torin could be an Olympian for Aspen in a couple of years time. So we wanted to focus on him. This was a back cover of FreeSkier Magazine. Another one, another collaboration, another differentiator is key for us. The X Games is, as an outsider looking in until recently, we were always just blown away by the X Games and that partnership and what that means for this community. And it definitely gets everyone's attention, let me tell you, and it's a global platform, and it's only growing. And as they expand their brand, and we work to make sure that this is the premier stop in the winter sports arena. So that's the advertising. But you know, that's just a little bit of a tip of the iceberg of what we're really doing. And this slide is really designed to make you feel uncomfortable and just all the stuff that's happening and marketing and sales. It's, I mean, it's crazy. I mean, you think about all the stuff that's going on. I mean, in the old days, you just did an ad campaign and you ran a bunch of ads and maybe threw out a direct mail and a couple other things and you're good to go. Now it's print, it's mobile apps. You mentioned Billy, you mentioned our app, social marketing, all the different facets there, all this stuff happening on the web search. So how do we sift through all that? It's really important. I can tell you this, that we're very actively moving into social media. We've been there for a while now, and we're investing more bandwidth against it, focusing more and more on it. If you're not familiar, here's some of the areas that we have, Aspen Snowmass branded content. We have an Instagram page. We have a FlickrStream, over 2,000 images loaded on our FlickrStream. These are viewable by anybody. We load all of our imaging there. So if you ever need an image of Snowmass, just go on there and do a search and you'll find thousands of images from our brand. Vimeo is a really cool video sharing site that we use to showcase all of our video in very high content. We're pushing out videos almost every week around current events or happenings or snow events. So that's a huge part of what we're doing and how we're telling the message to potential guests. We also load our videos on YouTube, almost half a million uploads there. We have a Tumblr blog as well where we're showcasing current content. We even have a Google Plus page. This is probably 50 res even have a Google Plus page. This probably 50 resorts now are on Google Plus and we don't know if it's necessary going to take off but we want to make sure we're there if it does and there's some cool functionality there that we want to take advantage of and so we're making sure that we're where everybody is. Four Square is a very important piece of the puzzle for us. We have, we have geolocation has become big. And because of our city nature of both here and in Aspen, a lot of people are used to checking in where they go into their venues. And so we have check-in set up at all of our VON Mount venues on the lifts. You can check in and find out of specials. And we have over 10,000 people that have actively following the Aspen's Nomads brand on four square. We of course have a Twitter page, approaching 9,394,00 followers and growing daily. That's a great way to reach out to our guests at a media see. And Facebook, approaching 25,000 likes on Facebook and growing quickly. So if you're not following, if you're on Facebook, you should definitely encourage you to follow Aspen so much just to see what's happening. This is where we load all the videos, all the photos, all the deals, all the stuff going on to keep our guests informed. We're also doing display ads. These are, you know, banner advertisements. And we're spending more money on banner advertising than we are on print advertising, just to give you an idea. You know, and so, and people don't realize that that they don't see that as much But trust me if you're in Dallas one of our key fly markets or L.A. or shaggy and we're gonna be serving you an ad We're gonna cookie you we're gonna follow you. We're doing geo. You know We're doing targeting behavioral targeting serving these ads up to people that have a Pensity to want to come here and showing them an ad with a deal and then getting them the link over and convert and transact with us. So it's a huge part of what we do. We're also putting the final touches on a new mobile app. So Billy, that one, you'll have to delete that one eventually. We will be sending out a notification, but we will be launching an entirely new app in the next couple of weeks. And it's going to be really cool. It's going to be able to display your number of days key, total scans, you're actually mail purchase lift tickets through it. And it will be able to check track your runs via GPS. As we've been floored to call me and tell me about it, that's how I found it. Yeah, that's good. We had an app. We are going to sunset that and this is an RTP bill app. So it's tied in with our point of sale system. And it has a lot of future capabilities as well and Whistler and all the intro west resorts are buying into this too. So there's going to be an ecosystem around this app. It won't give us epic mix type auto check-ins, not tied to your RFID chip, but it will give a lot of those benefits without us having to make that investment of all those readers. We're also developing a new website. This is a little sneak preview of our new website homepage. This will launch in February. Working with one-to-one interactives will be state-of-the-art website. Huge, huge project for us. And again, just serving up ways for our guests to better navigate around our site, to better understand what we offer, showcase, better, much better functionality in terms of how we work, show social media and all that stuff that we're doing and integration across the site. And we'll have a new web, a mobile site as well, which is a huge, huge growing industry. Lastly, just to quickly highlight of the air program, you know, I want to thank Snowmass and the foresight of my predecessor, Jean and the team, and to getting those American flights on board. And this is a huge differentiator for us and those flights will start and I can tell you that the Dallas flight from American is looking faster than I've ever seen a flight book and a new market for them. So it's a phenomenal success. LAS more along the lines of the United flights. United is definitely stepping up their game and they've added a flight out of LA on a non-stop basis. So to have this American partnership, to have the marketing that they're putting behind this, almost half a million dollars with a marketing support. And some of that is what we're contributing to collectively. And then some of that is their own monies to support this new flight. And I can tell you, I was with my counterpart from Telly arrive the other day and they're losing flights. They're losing seats. And a lot of these communities are struggling with these huge management revenue guarantees. And we here at Aspen Stomas are not, we don't even have, I mean, yes, we have some marketing support to get these off the ground, but that's it. And there's other communities out there that are paying millions of dollars to get these flights to come into their communities. So, we are in a very enviable position. And so, great foresight there, and we'll continue to work with American on getting that. It's a great example of a public-private partnership, for sure. Q. Christian about the American, is there anything we have to worry about with their reorganization role? No, not at all. We've been in touch through Bill Tomsich. He's been in touch with Gary Foss and all the key partners there. And they assure us that its business is usual. It's purely a reorganization. I'm sure a lot of you read articles about it. They were the only legacy carrier who hadn't declared bankruptcy. So they were saddled with this legacy, pilot unions and cost structure that the other airlines had been able to shed through their bankruptcy proceedings. And so it's going to allow them to play in a more competitive space. And it should allow them to be leaner and more nimble and be able to add flights as, you know, and hopefully if flights are successful here, they'll continue supporting that and even add incremental ones in time. So I don't expect anything out of the blue. This is just a little chart to show you how many flights you know, historical air service has increased. We'll be at 214,000 available seats this year and we're back to probably close to the highest levels ever for the airport here over 30 flights a day in the winter. So it's an exciting development for us. And hopefully, you know, and we know that those seats will translate into occupancy for all of us here and skier days for us on the mountain. Are you running the bus from Denver as well? The bus? No, the bus is gone. What Grayline has moved out, we will see me as really the only provider of ground transport from Denver up. So if you get stuck and you can't get into Aspen, what are they going to do? Then they will provide buses on call base. If you want to just take a shuttle, that's the only way. But yes, they have provisions. If they have to reroute you to Denver or Grand Junction, there will be buses waiting. They'll pick you up and bring you up to Asperg. Right? Again, I want to go back to this sub-er marketing program and this mountains and mammoths. I remember talking, and I can't remember whether I was talking to Russ or somebody that was the thought that this was starting, something like this was tried and I think it was veiled and it wasn't terribly successful. This sort of family innovation program. Are you aware of that and do you know where that program and if or why it failed? I am. It was called Epic Summer and it was basically. It was a good word. It would be careful. Yeah. Yeah. That was my idea. It's actually Rob Katz's idea. And it failed miserably. But basically the concept was it was an all inclusive, you know, from guide you from day, you know, from like a six, seven day out of tenor area. And you know, with a shuttle van and a driver and a guide and the family was flying, they picked you up a Denver or take you up and then there was programmed activity for seven days straight basically, for the fan, you know, everything from going to Rocky Mountain National Park to doing activities at the various mountains and transporting the families around. And you know, it's hard to get a price point that's palatable, you know, on the front end of those things. We know inherently we're not in an all-inclusive type, you know, market. We're not a cruise ship, you know, and that's not how ski and summer has ever really been sold in these destinations. So it's a huge, you know, it's going to be a huge learning curve to get people on board with that concept. And quite frankly, you know, when you bundle all our activities together, especially in the winter, with lift tickets and everything, it becomes a very high cost of entry price point. And so your target is a pretty small group of people. That's not to say we couldn't work something like that. I think my recommendation, that would be not quite something that program, and just take a few different aspects of it and create a program around that and not try to bundle an entire week of activity together. It just isn't something that people want to date down days. They're retired and they're struggling. A lot of time in the van too. And I appreciate that because I thought I had heard that there was a problem with the I guess the point I keep harping on is the you know the adage you come for the winner you stay for the summer and it seems to me if we can do something to attract people here on some basis with some sort of program. Once you get here people fall in love with this place and you know summers are hurting time and you know you summers are hurting time. And you guys have got a client list of mile long, the largest got a client list of mile long. If somehow you can develop a program, and clearly not as extensive as what you did in Vale, it's something that will grab a family and say, you know, let's try it in the summertime. If our recidivism rate is 70% in the winter, if you get somebody out here in the summertime, I'll bet you will be equal to that or more. So I'm just encouraging you to do it. I think, you know, Steve mentioned earlier, this family camping concept. I mean, there's something there. I mean, in camp asmons, snow masses, extremely successful. We've just got to build on those programs and hone in on the ones that are successful. And I'll say it on Alpine Coaster would be a slam dunk from a profitability standpoint, just getting people up here to go and do that, it'd be an attraction. It's something we should think about. Okay. Is there all of it? Yeah, prepared comments. Very good. Let's move on to some questions. A few of the things that over the last few years, one of the areas that snowmast village has been, I think, you know, working towards and dealing with our counterparts is the free bus service between Aspen's Nomass. Do you gentlemen see that as a, you know, a good product to continue because it is one of those areas that we do have problems trying to, for some reason, talk our Aspen and County folks into to say in our EOTC discussions that, you know, we believe it's important for all of us to do that. And if you, when you're talking to these folks, can sort of highlight that in your discussions with those other people, it'll help us because it is expensive to run this. As you guys well know, because you help fund it, you know, in a lot of these other areas to the Stomach Village and to the Raffta Group. But it's an area that I think that we really need to continue to remind folks of that you can come to the Stomachas Aspen area and you don't have to bring a car. You don't get that commission when you sell that car, of course, but at the same time, these guests can come and get on a great transportation system where they might not in Atlanta or Houston, Dallas, LA, but they can do it here safely and efficiently and comfortably. So we can, you know, put that somehow into the message to people also. It helps other than just the X Games that, you know, you guys and we all move all those people. John, do you have a? Well, I actually had a question. I've been up on the mall several times and after the lifts are shut down in the evening and we have the Skittles lift that's running. And it seems to be there's a lot of people out there in the evening that would enjoy sliding in some manner down to the bottom and right, the Skittles back up. And I know it may involve some lights or something, but it seems like we're missing an opportunity here since the skittles lift is already running regardless. Why not create some nighttime activities for the families? Because I see a lot of kids out there. I saw two young men turn away because they went out there with their snowboards and they thought they could ride down and then come back up on the skittles, but that's prohibited after the shutdown and I understand why because you need to have ski patrol out there and there's some operational issues but I really think it's since we're well that could be one thing yeah you know I think maybe a nighttime lift ticket where you could because you have to somehow create some revenue to pay for the staff that you keep on but anyone getting on the lift at the bottom with a snowboard or a ski, you might be able to capture some revenue to justify that. But running the lifts until 8 o'clock at night and just having it, I mean, this is about 6.30 there and only 24 people had ridden it down since 4 o'clock. And And you know, that's a considerable expense to run that lift. I think we're not utilizing in a manner where we could capture some more excitement in the evening rather than just having it shuttle up and down and create some vitality in the base village and the mall. And I know there's going to be resistance in the community because of the lighting situation, but in the summertime the sun's up until after nine o'clock at night and if the skittles looked as runny to 8 I don't understand what kind of opposition I understand it will be opposition but it's one of those things that it might be worth taking a look at. What was the success factor of the little thing we had over here on ASA. Was that very successful? Tupetown. Tupetown. I was at ASA mountain on that microphone. Tupetown, you know, it did okay. It wasn't very successful, but there really wasn't enough room for it. It wasn't a proper tubing hill. So we are actually looking at, you know, different winter nighttime activities along with some of the summer activity planning Steve reference. We're also looking at winter and hoping to combine those and have stuff that runs in the summer that also run in the winter, particularly at night. We are still sort of finalizing those thoughts and plans before we go through the Forest Service and you guys again. So we're looking at all options. We've talked about skittles over the years and honestly felt like is it really enough to get into a big discussion about lighting that when in the end it's not, it's just lower fanning hill for skiing or snowboarding. It'd be great if we could do a tubing hill. But as you know, it's just lower fanny hill for skiing or snowboarding. It'd be great if we could do a tubing hill. But as you know, it's so constrained down there. We haven't figured out a way to light that and offer enough stuff to make it worthwhile. So, I guess the short answer would be we're planning on doing that in the future, probably involving the gondola, probably not every night of the week either, you know, we're going to have to get that thing stabilized. Maybe something we do on weekends or something and do something on the Meadows area. So you're thinking of having some sort of nighttime skiing up at the Meadows at the top of the Gondola? Or activities, I would say, more than skiing or snowboarding. So yeah, tubing, could you do, there's a number of ideas that probably should spread rumors yet. But. So that's been our thinking. I mean, I don't know. Jason? Just one question. And one of the major things I think factoring in our marketing plans is around this discovery, the ice age, the whole thing. We didn't hear you guys mention that, I don't think at all tonight. Is that part of the conversation you guys are having or how do you see that factoring in terms of branding, snobassing that relationship with this key company? We think it's a wonderful discovery. It's, as we, you know, I hear Kirk Johnson speak. We think it's a wonderful discovery. As we hear Kirk Johnson speak, I've heard him, I'm going to, you guys same thing, hear him speak half a dozen times. He get more excited and he learns something new every time you hear him. So we think it's a great opportunity for the village. And we're working, as you know, John Regney's very involved. And so we're working closely with the Tuss Force and this legacy committee that's looking to build an organization and a stronger plan. And so we're participating and we think it's sort of too early to say, yeah, right now we're going to do this for this winter. But we're excited about it and want to collaborate and partner and make it a big part of the guest experience. I mean, I think we're still doing the dig up there. We do some small things to allow, you know, the guest to experience some of it, but I agree. I think it's a great opportunity and to matter of waiting and figuring out what the plan is. And we want to be a big part of that plan and partner. Have you thought about putting these lines up on Doddler as people ski down pointing out the location is that something that even the museum or us want to do? Yeah I don't know if we talked about that I know we had the trail up there right that's got a few signs on it. We've got the kids ski school it's got a neutral they're gonna put up there with a lot of different figures and life-sized figures of the animals. But also, I think, is Mike alluded to. John Rigny into Tussport has approached us about having interpretive science and interpretive areas on the mountain where you've got a view of Daudler and maybe, you know, things that would identify what may have happened on Snowmass Mountain 100,000 years ago. And we certainly said that we were interested in taking a look at those. But we're still waiting to see what sort of concepts come up. But it's, you know, leads to the mountain management point of view. And we're all in favor of that. But there again, I think it's still too early to see where we are, Mr. Vester. Steve, does Aces handle what PDA at the top of the L camp? Or does the ski company do that? That is ACEs in collaboration with the ski company, ACEs in the Forest Service. All right. OK. Are you still involved changing the subject a bit with the base village and thinking about little Nell? Or are you sort of out of that game for a while? Or can you enlighten us a little bit more? We're of out of that game for a while or can you lighten this a little bit more? We're always wondering about that one. I just want to put you on a spot where you're going. I spend a lot of time on base village daily, every day, including every day this weekend. So I think we'll always be involved. But we're watching this next round for now. You spoke about adding beds in the valley and that kind of stuff. I want to make sure hopefully, because I believe it's appropriate to have your company and the crowns involved in that. And I would hope that that is still a discussion at least to do something like that. Yeah, no, we continue to repeat that to all interested parties that show up around here. Good. Other questions we have at the C-Compat at this point? Excellent presentation. Good. Good job. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you very much. Seriously, we, I think we, very optimistic about what we have here. And it's because I think our partnership and collaboration and I'd love to continue going forward. So thanks. Thanks for your time. If you're allowed to receive a small souvenir, we're almost. Good. We have hats that you can probably wear this winter. We can get a meeting. Except that. You're required to have helmets. All the employees have to wear helmets. So you're passing out hats now? How much do they wear? Oh, it's so $50. I don't recognize the Skew Patrol. That's the problem with the helmets now. I don't know who those guys are out there. That one. No, no. No, no. Thank you, sir. Thank you.. Thank you. It's a gorgeous helmet. That's definitely needs one. Thanks, Rhonda. And I'll keep it. Just try to hug me. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thanks again. Thanks, guys. I do have a question. I want to ask Perry, did you pick out the pink pants for the ambassadors? Absolutely Can blame me. I think some women are after you right now. You know after hearing four years of Ambassador is complaining to me about how they weren't visible Is that you Markey? I think that's you, right? No, that's Andy Brum. You're brutal. Very good. She lives in. Thanks again. Thanks, Mike. Baltimore. Thanks, John. Come on, Florida. Thanks for the pizza. Sure. No. What is it basketball? Let's take a five minute break. Good. OK. I'm going to go to the next room. I'm going to go to the next room. I'm going to go to the next room. I'm going to go to the next room. I'm going to go to the next room. I'm going to go to the next room. I'm going to go to the next room. I'm going to go to the next room. I'm going to go to the next room. I'm going to go to the next room. I'm going to go to the you you you I'm going to do it. you you I'm going to go to the next room. I'm going to go to the next room. I'm going to go to the next room. I'm going to go to the next room. I'm going to go to the next room. I'm going to go to the next room. I'm going to go to the next room. I'm going to go to the next room. I'm going to go to the next room. I'm going to go to the next room. I'm going to go to the next room. I'm going to go to the next room. I'm going to go to the next room. I'm going to go to the next room. I'm going to go to the next room. I'm going to go to the next room. I'm going to go to the next room. I'm going to go to the next room. I'm going to go to the next room. I'm going to do it. you you you Thank you. The committee has a question. Community signage regulations related to the temporary off premises and sandwiched board signage. Mr. Conrad. Mr. Bueno. This is fairly limited in scope as well with regards to the signage regulations that I was hoping to receive some direction tonight, how you'd like for us to proceed, specifically regarding areas of enforcement, the sandwich board signage and other off-premise signages, including banners. So we last spoke with you in March. At the time there had been a complaint received concerning a banner along Pany Hill and the point of the discussion was that we didn't really want to necessarily go after all the banners at that point in the season and that we'd rather do something more comprehensive. So one of the difficulties with you're trying to do the sign code and rewrite regulations for sandwich board signs and banners is they're only around during the season. And so, you know, we really didn't have, we hadn't photographed some examples of what was occurring last winter. Now we have, we're going into this season that sandwich board signs have kind of been tacitly approved or authorized allowed for a number of years. The planning department once received complaints and be cited most of the banners are the sandwich board signs that existed in the mall at that time and a group of individuals came to the council and indicated that they was really essential for them. Some businesses do have visibility problems and they made their case. Otherwise because so and so was able to have one they should have one too and you can just imagine how the discussion went. Essentially the planning department pretty much has not gotten involved in signage within the mall and has relied upon the landowners to manage their tenants. Each of those properties in the mall have comprehensive sign plans and they're all pretty much outdated and obsolete. However, our code does not grant me authority to go in and amend those plans without their consent. What we started to do a few years ago, well actually several years ago, was develop a new comprehensive sign plan that would work for all of the properties within the mall, their own little zoning for signage. And that's essentially where we're trying to head this thing towards again, certainly with regards to the businesses that do put up the sales signs and fill their windows with sales, sales, sales, and overdo it versus. I mean, when is too much, too much, or is it necessary? And in these economic times, you kind of have to be a little bit more sensitive to try to assist these businesses to be able to sustain themselves. So what I try to bring to you tonight was the fact that there, yes, there's a fact there are sandwich board signs in the mall a number of them and they are not permitted as temporary signs and it would be easy to have them all removed however there is there are more now than there were say a year or two ago so I mean there could be some way that there could be some limitation or control put on this some communities and the code that we were writing way back when had a standard as far as maintaining, allowing some signage as necessary for businesses that could demonstrate that they were, let's say, a bill, one of the businesses up on the second level. You could make an argument that they should be able to have some sort of a mall, plaza level sign or indicator look up or upstairs. The somewhere around corners are in awkward spots where they don't really get the visibility. So if they do have signage in their window, well no one will really see the window less than in front of the business. So there's nothing to draw them to that location. So as I put together a chart for you that show that some communities do allow sandwich board signs. It's on page 8 of the packet attachment 3. Park City, Utah, they're permitted in private clauses under a master sign plan. the public property, the public property, the public property, the public property, the public property, the public property, the public property, the public property, the public property, the public property, the public property, the public property, the public property, the public property, the public property, the public property, the public property, the public property, the public property, the public property, the public property, the public property, the public property, the public property, the public property, the public property, the public property, the public property, the public property, the public property, the public property, the public property able to do business. There are some other communities, the Asman has permitted with some limitations, Mountain Village. You can have one within 25 feet of your business entrance. So usually it's in the direction of one business. Certainly the sandwich board science should count as part of the total signage for that business under a sign program. There should be some standards that they cannot obstruct what would be the pedestrian flow through the mall or where people are likely to trip on them. The problem was that happened the year that I convinced the enforcement was that they, people are all carrying their skis and they're all swinging around talking to each other and nobody's looking around and they're all exiting the plas the mall and they're not really looking down and so it can be dangerous. So what I needed to have here from you tonight is really what generally what are your thoughts as far as sandwich port signs and then we can move on to banners and then we can deal with enforcement in general So I mean it I think council recognizes and that you know being a resort we do need to you know allow our businesses to Try to sell something It has been a problem up in both sides of this fence over the years because as Chris said, I think it is something that, when somebody is carrying their keys, their kids, and everything else, and they have to run into this little sign, it gets a little bit obnoxious once in a while. Same time, I think we do need to allow businesses that aren't on the main thoroughfare ability to try to hope somebody to bring them into the down the hall or whatever. Chris, when you've seen these signs, I think at one point I counted like about 18 sandwich signs last year and I walked through the malls like wow, you know, it seemed to be quite a few of them. Well, Dave Bellick just gave me a number for this season that's even more than that. Oh really? Almost 10 more than that. So yeah, there's a proliferation and there's quite a few and there's a difference between, the purpose of having signed code regulations is enough as enough and then it reaches a point where it's kind of in your face that you think that if you throw out your name off it enough or sale, sale, sale, that that it's going to translate directly into profit. And the purpose of any attention getting devices being signage is to first notify people that there is a business of a certain type of service or product. Nearby, they see this and they go, there is this is a restaurant where there is a retail, women's clothing or whatever. And then give them a general direction on how to go there. Because frankly, you can be in the mall where you don't really see all the businesses. Because you're not, some of them are underneath covered areas and some don't have to wear the signage really jumps out at you. You don't really see the hanging sign because you're not perpendicular to it to have a good viewing view plane of that angle. So what I would really like to proceed with is to develop the regulations and we have some already drafted out. Work with the property owners up there as well as the tenants. Photograph the existing condition to see why these businesses, some may have two or three signs, some just one. Why they believe that they may be necessary for their own particular situation. Develop what would be because I don't really want to deal with a permit per se because the sandwich board sign, I can't have a little export on the concrete that I can go out and check every day to make sure that it's right there. But somehow we were able to regulate it. And there can be a way that perhaps maybe you do a certain business needs a little more than something else needs an extra sandwich for the sign because there are two points of entrance that you can get a variance. The current variance procedure for a sign code is the same as our planning commission process, which is a 30 day notice and by you know the seasons well on its way before you could ever get the variance for the sign that you need for when you're about ready to open and just now started thinking about signage. So we're going to work on a way that administratively there can be some flexibility in what is done or a brief process. I like the plan of meeting with the mall owners. I think that's a great idea in developing a process within. That's exactly what I was going to owners. I think that's a great idea in developing a process with them. That's exactly what I was going to say. I mean, personally, you are dealing with private property. And the mall owners have got rights. But they ought to be concerned about it not looking trashy, that it looks inviting and not overwhelming. So they ought to be as concerned about too much signage as we are. Yet, again, you still got to have signage. So there's, you know, what's enough and what's too much. And it seems to me that's something that should be thrashed out with the mall owners and with the tenants and get agreement on it. So that, so that everybody's happy. Once you've got agreement, turn that into a regulation. And then if you got a variant or have some administrative process where you have to vary it. But I don't think we're in a position to say this is enough or this is too much. I think that's up to the landlord and the tenants. Now, what I really needed to hear tonight is if you felt like this shouldn't happen. Because, you know, sandwich board signs in some communities, they just absolutely don't want them. They don't occur and that would be fine with me as well. If that were really where we'd be headed. I wouldn't want to be doing a lot of work at a staff level to create regulations to permit a signage type that is not acceptable. So, and the most I have with the land owners is that they have comprehensive sign plans that they themselves wrote or their predecessor previously. That said, this is what I really want and none of them sandwich boards, and yet they allow them because they have their tenants. And they're fairly silent and they're leaving upon the town to do enforcement. But what's funny is, and John can jump in if I'm face here, but the person who's in violation of the signage regulations is the landowner, for even if a tenant puts a sign up and it's illegal, that they are there would be cited for his own violations. So I think we really need to work hand in hand to come up with something that everybody's buying into as we go forward. Well, as I look at your chart, vast majority of towns allow them in some way, shape or form. Well, about five of the nine that I listed, yes, have some allowances for sandwich for signs. So I guess the issue is how much is enough and what is too much. And I don't know that we're in a position to say that. I'd be working with the property owners and then we'll come back with an overall program that's more comprehensive in. As an amendment to the signing regulations and to go to the Planning Commission, their recommendations would come to you as well. There's probably a flash. I don't know if we want you to work on that. Yeah. Jason? I'm There's probably a flash. I don't know what we want you to work on that. Yeah. Jason? I'm in favor of some flexibility, but try and find a balance of how much is too much and how much is enough? John, what was the sentence John Dresser? I'm a question on the size. You know, I'm good with the discussion on evolving that into what's too much or what's not enough. This says in your code that freestanding temporary science shall not exceed nine square feet. Is that both sides? Is that one side? I mean, it's a three by three, is it half of a three by three? The sandwich board sign to serve for the entire season, is that a temporary sign? Yeah, but then we're going to have to do a lot of work on fine tuning these things. Well, it's the size that we need to have a standardized definition of what is acceptable under that. I agree. The sign code has not been amended as long as I've been working for the town. I mean, it's long overdue, so it will be coming. Well, in that regard, because it included as part of our packet, we're some of the exempt signs, and you get into the dimensions of those exempt signs. And those are out of date, too, and they need to be looked at as well. For example, the real estate exempt sign, you're only allowed three and a half square feet for a real estate sign, which translates into a eight and a half inch by eight and a real state sign which translates into a 8 1 1 2 1 2 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 2 1 1 2 1 2 1 2 1 2 1 2 1 2 1 2 1 2 1 2 1 2 1 2 1 2 1 2 1 2 1 2 1 2 2 1 2 1 2 2 1 2 2 1 2 2 1 2 2 1 2 2 1 2 2 1 2 2 1 2 2 1 2 2 1 2 2 1 2 2 1 2 2 1 2 2 1 2 2 1 2 2 1 2 2 1 2 2 1 2 2 1 2 2 1 2 2 1 2 2 1 2 2 that's smaller than what's out there. Exactly, so all these really need to take a look at. That's more of a long range look rather than what you were asking for us today. I think it's all kind of becoming to you. The urgent matter is we're going into a ski season. I have a responsibility to enforce a signage regulations. I'm not really excited to go up there next week and call for the removal of all the sandwich board signs that are up there next week and call for the removal of all the sandwich board signs that are up there. I think we need to come up with some kind of a solution that has a buy and buy the community and the business community as well as Council and is consistent with what we really want for signage and to assist them so that their businesses are identifiable and that people have a way of understanding what product is being sold at that location. And but a reasonably sized sign that does it. We don't need to have air filled balloons and we don't have to have all kinds of pickings and spotlights and all kinds of other things. We need to be tasteful. At the same time, we need to be, well, ahead of time, some of these folks have spent, you know, a couple of $500 on their signs, putting together and I would rather say, you know, next year, not gonna be a lot of the havin' or they need to be in and out, you know, in a more of a temporary thing instead of all, you're wrong. John Wilkinson, John D John Dresser and then Markey. I'll defer to council member. Okay, Markey. I'm a believer that you've got the right solution, Chris. Sit down with the folks, come up with a plan and bring it back. I don't want to get into the debate of what size and what font. That's not the purpose of council. So. I don't know that I go that far, but I also wouldn't try and regulate the size of each sign and where it can be kind of stuff because you'll spend three months doing that. The season will be over. It'll be a whole different recipe next year. Exactly. I would suggest that you come in with some sort of overall rod parameters that you want fulfilled, and then toss it to the landowner to get together with the tenants and decide, hey, this place tucked up in here, needs better signage than the guy whose patio stretches out to the middle of the mall. But if you spend a lot of time regulating real-iter-sign and just understand, I think that's a whole separate subject that from what Chris is asking you about here today, you're talking about visual clutter on the mall. But you have to balance that between visibility for businesses because in the same instance, this community relies on those businesses being successful. So do you wanna hamstring them to the point that they can have a sign the size of that clock that no one can see or do you wanna be reasonable? I think you're best off going for an overall largest, what the town is willing to tolerate in the biggest sense of visibility, and let them decide inside of that. This is how we're going to do it, because it could very well be that the guy is back in the nook in the cranny needs more or two to get people there. The person that's right there with a storefront may not need anything. Absolutely agree with John and and there is a size of a sandwich board sign that is just too big a sheet of product. Right. Right. That's probably too big of a sandwich board sign and some can be dangerous because they're too small. So but other than that no I I don't really want to get into that. What I wanted to do is a comprehensive sign plan amendment that all of the mall owners have all signed off on and that they will apply. So I don't even have to go up there and deal with it. They shouldn't be allowing it and their tenants are find it acceptable as well. So. So you anticipate including sandwich boards in the comprehensive sign plan. An allocation for sandwich boards would be- Yes, and as far as to keep the size- That's right. The one community that has that the sandwich board signs count as part of the overall signage for that business, the business then makes the value judgment how much signage do I want on my window or do I need to get it out on the sandwich board sign where it's doing me more good. So we've been working on it. We're able to come forward. I just needed to know if you wanted me to come forward. Come forward. And I would, I would think that it's almost a master plan for you to adopt. And then they have to come back annually each year. This is what it is because our tenant mix has changed. Our, actually our physical confines can change. If you try and legislate, you're gonna be doing this for a few months, every single year, because it's gonna change. Why are they gonna be coming in for amendments? And the biggest problem I have is, we don't have a position of the ability to amend a comprehensive sign plan simply. It goes to the Planning Commission of the town. Councilman Muswell will be a minor PED amendment. And so we're going to try and come forward with something that allows us to adapt much easier. And where the landlord owner would be more willing to allow the town to take an initiative to amend their sign code, because we can do it quite simply. What's your anticipated timeline on coming back to us or something like that? January. Oh, this key is going to be basically over. Yeah. Well, we got to get it done. We got to do it and do it right. And quite simply as far as banners, the thing I needed to know is you've seen some banners in this community that are those where the beer distributor prints them up for the various Restaurant or bar or whatever and there's a distinction whether they're there for an event or whether they're there for For the season they're rather large in size typically and I just kind of needed to know what your thoughts were as far as what you have seen our Banders permitted under the cycle I'm sorry, well as happy hour is it Are banners permitted under the cycle? No, 10 for your. I'll, I'll, I'll, times a year, whatever, and they can pick their event and you just let it happen. So- But our big air Fridays, do we have signs up for that? And we put some of those things up, don't we? Okay. These are marketing arm. So you're not too, you don't a big problem with with banners. I have a I'll tell you what I have a problem with this permanent banner something that is that is on the mountain that's facing permanent temporary signs like a banner. I think that was where this began as we began to see permanent banners hanging out on the and I'm opposed to that. I'm not opposed to a Banner for Special Event or a Bigger Friday, something like that. But something that gets out there the first day of the ski season and is there on the last day I'm opposed to. I have a much lower tolerance for Banner as well. I think I agree with Fred. I like it for events and in very short limited application. Okay, but not prohibited. I'm not prohibited. Like when Gurney's open, I know they had a banner out. What? A grand opening banner? A grand opening banner? Yeah, kind of a grand opening. It was up for what, two weeks or something. And I didn't find that to stay for. I found it helpful to know. I'm open in a new management, you know, when someone puts those kind of banners up. Well, that's something that's... Right now banners aren't an exempt sign, and so we don't really know when they go up, when they come down. So they need something, have to get a quick permit for that specifies the time frame. You're talking not the ones under the bridge you're talking the ones up on the ski hill. The ones on the other ski hills, another discussion. We're going to get you some photographs of whatever may be coming up this season. I mean you guys have to make some decisions as far as the ski hill but my time is run out. I think tonight we just really wanted to find out, you know, is this a good investment of time? I've worn you ahead of time from experience working in another community. A sign code can be one of the most complicated bodies of legislation you can deal with outside of housing policy because people take their signage very personally. So again, I think we've heard it's a good investment of time and engage landlords and Entenance and looking at the majority of these towns that you list in your list They're all pretty limited in terms of how you can apply banners special events and civic events Which I think is reasonable So let's go ahead and look Chris Tackelism Yeah. So let's go ahead and let Chris tackle this one. And tackle the banners. And I agree with John, we've got to come back with something here pretty soon. OK. Can't wait till the end of the season. One last question for you. One last question. Yeah, because no one really defend as if it was a fine temporary permanent. If a slope side bar has happy hour every day from 3 to 5 and they have a banner that they unroll at 2 o'clock and roll back up at 5 o'clock, is that an event? Is that a temporary event? Is that permanent event? Is that a permanent sign? Is that a temporary banner? Yes. Okay. Good answer. Good answer. Good answer. Good. Well, we do we've been operating, as I said in the report, as we operate pretty much on a complaint basis. But, but if there's one business has a sign up that's a violation and there are others right next to it, we're going to be citing more than just that one. We don't want to do selective enforcement. We have the potential for a lot of enforcement right now. Yeah, let's just ride it out and look for a solution. Sounds like a plan. Yes, thank you. Thank you. 80 else on regulate that you want to Bush on with you. Now you're just going to work on all that stuff there. I had the L-tongue regulate that you want to... That was cool. Bushed on with the... Now I'm just going to work on all that stuff there. Open house signs. Just no neon. Yeah. Oh, I like neon. That's prohibitive, so it was moving signs. Like I said, this will be one of my things I'm getting from all the series. Okay. So let's go. Next to. This is item number six, resolution 35, series 2011. Dross the acquisition IGA. Mr. Pores, Mr. Dresser, listen on here. Great, let me start, Mr. Mayor. We also, I just want to acknowledge and thank John Peacock for joining us Tom Oaken and Dale Will and feel free to come on up if you'd like to. Again tonight we wanted to. Russ, yes. I don't mean to interrupt. But I really don't like council meetings to go on too long. I've heard that. And I've written the material here. As I understand it, the citizens of the town of Snowmass Village voted to tax themselves in order to provide money for the purchase of the $2 million for the purchase of the electricity property to be paid out over seven years. And that's what we authorized. It is my understanding that the Open Space Committee in connection with their collection of this money to be paid out over seven years is looking for an additional $40,000. To be paid out concurrent with that. That's a treasure, his fee. Right. I am not willing to do anything more than the citizens of this town authorized us to do. They did not authorized us to pay $2 million and $1. They authorized us to pay $2 million. We have not signed this IGA and I think you folks got a real simple decision to make. If you want the $2 million, we signed the IGA that has been proposed by the town and you will be paid the $2 million over seven years. If you don't want to sign that one, you're not going to get $2 million over seven years. If you don't want to sign that one, you're not going to get $2 million. So you have a very easy decision to make. We have had some discussions with John, and he's in Tom have thrown a number of ideas at us. I don't know if you'd want to give them an opportunity to kind of share their thoughts. Again, John also prepared, we have an IGA that came from the county. Those IGAs didn't speak to this treasurer's fee. And you also have an alternative IGA, which is essentially, does what you just said, Fred. Here's $2 million less, any collection fees or any administrative fees, and that would be up to the county to deal with within that $2 million. But my point is, I don't think we pay a dollar over $2 million. How you guys want to whack it up is up to you. But we're not going to pay any more than $2 million. That's what the voters of this town authorized us to do, and that's what we're going to do. We need to. I don't know if the listing audience understands the discussion. I'm not having a problem. I was cutting a little short there. I think we have to go through a little more discussion there than what Fred likes to do right now. But it is one of those things, I know, times here that has been a concern. When you, we do these elections, don't we list out all the dollars that are going to go towards, you know, interest and everything else and the collections, you know, when we normally do these things, when it goes to the electorate, so Tom, when they are asked a question that you know everything or? No, what you, and come up to the microphone with you today. Sorry. I'm Tom Oak and I'm County Treasurer and my office actually collects all the property tax in the county and distributes it to all the taxing entities like the town, the school district, and so forth. And so typically, when you pass a voter approved property tax, as this one was passed, basically you were asking for an extension of the tax at $500,000 level, 200,000 of which initially was gonna go to the first meeting. And so what's done then is you actually put a levy on the property tax bill that about this time year, the assessor's office says year total assess valuation is whatever. And in order to generate $500,000 from that valuation, Mary Ann basically just calculates what the tax level he needs to be to generate $500,000. So that is the amount of your levy. We put that on the tax bill, send it out to all the taxpayers. We actually collect 99.9% plus virtually all of the property tax eventually. plus virtually all of the property tax eventually. And so what you're living is just 500,000. In addition to that though, as part of living your property tax, you get some additional revenue on top of that. One is you collect interest on delinquent tax payments. Basically, we charge 1% a month if you're delinquent. And so whatever we charge on your property tax, we distribute back to you. And in addition, there's another property tax on motor vehicles that you don't levied, but you get a portion of because you levied property tax. And I think the statute's actually in your packet. And what it says is that you receive a percentage of the total motor vehicle specific ownership tax, it's all. You receive the percentage of that that the property tax you levy bears to the total property tax levied in the county. If you don't levie any property tax, obviously you don't get a share of the motor vehicle specific ownership property tax. And so in percentage terms what that motor vehicle tax has been running in terms of percentage of the property tax, the total property tax that's levied. This year it's about 2.3%. So you receive your full, plus an additional revenue equal to currently 2.3% of that, or an extra $46,000. And statutorily, the Treasurer's Office, my office, levies a collection fee for property tax. For most districts, it's 5%. For municipalities, it's 2%. So if you do the math on this, you actually, over the life of this property tax, you come out ahead because the amount of specific ownership tax you get in addition, plus interest on delinquent taxes and so forth, is typically going to be more than your 2% collection fee. So, too, and I really think this is just a misunderstanding. I mean, Mary Ann and I have emailed back and forth and she acknowledged that yeah, you do get specific ownership tax in addition to property tax. And in fact, to, I brought for you. This is my, to be excused. Elections? For you, so far this year. Thank you, sir. Oops. Don't tell your silence. And again, just a little times, maybe, for the public, you know, again, we committed, and this was somewhat unique. We fixed the amount that was being generated every year over a seven year period. The mill levies would fluctuate to generate that amount of money. For the first five years, that generates 200,000. And then in year six and seven, it would go to a half million for a grand total of two million. So it's a two percent treasured fee equating in Fred reference number, the total is $40,000. So we've looked at this scenario that Tom is describing. So again, the purpose tonight is kind of to disclose this, have everybody understand it, and see where we want to go. Could I ask a civil question? Is the 2% on the total or over the five years or 2% per year? It's on an annual basis, for example, this year and correct me if I'm wrong. You know, the town will get back $196,000 and you'll keep approximately 4,000 to cover that 2% fee. Yeah, it's on the actual collections. So as we distribute $100 to you, we deduct 2% off that. And that's basically what's shown at the top here is we have distributed on a cash flow basis this year $5,216,000 or actually that's what we've collected for the town because your total property tax lovie is way in excess of $200,000 or the $500,000 that's actually in the $5 million range. And so of the total revenue shown at the bottom, which is $5,216,000, at the top, we have deducted $101,745 approximately as the's fee on that collection. And so we have distributed to you 5,114,000 out of that 5,216,000. But what I wanted to point out is the Treasury's fees at 101,000 are less than MVSO here stands for Motor Vehicle Special Donorship Tax. That's the additional revenue. And we've given collected for you and distributed to you 118,000 of additional revenue that you wouldn't receive had you not levied $5 million in property tax. So the town actually, over the period of this property tax levy revenues and will distribute to the county for the dress deacquisition just to million dollars. So you'll, I mean, so you make a little money on this. Just the way the property tax system works. The most other districts that are paying 5 percent. Yeah, but my special district, the Fire Department, I'm paying 5 percent when you're here. You're paying 5 percent. There you don't come out ahead. You're actually a little bit short. Although the percentage that this is amounted to probably 10 years ago, motor vehicle tax was coincidentally 5 percent of property tax collection, so it pretty much offset it back then. It's been declining, so that's where we are now. When I discuss this with Mary Ann, she said, okay, I understand. You know, there is an offset. All she was concerned about was what if MVSO drops in the future to be less than 2%. Exactly. And in that case, yeah, you might come up a little bit short. But right now you're a little bit long. I think the likelihood that it's going to drop below 2% is pretty slim. Because basically part of that tax is based on a declining value of your vehicle. When you go and register, the largest part of the registration fee is the so-and-orship tax. And as your vehicle ages, the amount of that tax decreases. So as people purchase new vehicles, obviously we're getting more and more tax, but in the recession, people haven't been purchasing vehicles and vehicles are getting older, and that's why the tax was falling. But I think we're pretty much bottomed out there. I guess, you know, the big picture in Marky and then Jason, go ahead. I guess this is a standard procedure. We all do. We all pay you guys. We're not doing anything unique in this situation because initially when I read this thing, I was like, guys, you know, we went to the community. We said $2 million is a number. And now it feels like we're getting nickel and dime maybe for this other $40,000. So I guess that was the trouble I was going to come on. We're all working, it's the same county. Do you guys really have to build and take out that 2% or is it something that you could just say, look, guys, we're getting this money As a county world doing it we're all in some as philogen. We've additionally added more dollars from some as philogen Other than the county so that's where the rub was getting that it just felt Maybe in the in the explanation initially it was a little bit more you just want a little bit more out of it So it's like oh come on guys Marky and then Jason and Jason and I. I have to make this really simplistic to the listeners and to my little tiny brain. And that is, so when you were talking about Marianne would get a bill and the drosity would be on it. The collection is, again, it's Marianne. You're not going to send a bill to Snowmass Village for 40,000. Is that correct? No. We- No, it's the individual taxpayer. We deduct that from your check for proper- The town's check. The town's check. We sent- We sent- We sent you- So they collect all the $1,000 and one month. Very, come on up. We sent you. 2001 month. We come out revenue of $2,000. I'm going to get your microphone. Right. So if you look at this sheet, we collected for you so far this year, $5,216,000. But the amount of the check we sent to you is only $5,114,000. Because you took the two percent. The duct right off the top. The treasurer's fee. And that's a function of the county treasurer's office. So we were going for any property tax collecting. And let's say Aspen had done the dross the acquisition. And you were contributing $2 million to Aspen. Well, Aspen isn't deducting the fee. We would still be deducting the from the property tax. So, we have to. That's what State Law says. I have to deduct that 2%. So I understand how the fee gets managed. Now, whoever set the 2% refresh my, is that my code? The state legislator. State legislator. So we can't get around that. No. Well then. What's the problem, Jay? What's the problem? Huh. Well then what's the problem? Yeah, what's the problem? That's two questions. I think the MVSO What what is the original intent of that if there's additional revenues coming back to the communities Presumably that's to serve some benefit other than offsetting Was 2% in in fees is it's really another form of the property tax. I mean, your standard property tax is on real property and improvements and also on business, property, fixtures and stuff used in the production of income. So that's the property that's taxed by, what we think of as property tax. Motor vehicle specific ownership tax is a property tax on, you know, on vehicles as a type of property. And so it's a property. I don't know why, but the state said, OK, and that tax is levied actually at the state level. But all of it is distributed locally as essentially an add-on to the property tax. So when you levied $2 million in property tax, you get this additional property tax on vehicles as well that's over and above the $2 million that you levy. And that's just so historically. That works. That's just been money that kind of comes in and goes out for the most part. We don't see really anything to do with that. It goes into our general fund. It goes into the GID. It's a portion to whatever tax revenues we collect and so we're not going to fees on that. Of the total tax is collected for picking county. Oh, it's a portion. Yeah, it's based on that. Whatever portion snowmass assesses In relation to the total of the county is the same proportion that we get of specific ownership taxes Which are our personal property tax Portioned amongst the county and the districts and the municipalities according to the percentages of the real property tax collected in the same way. So, the same thing is that the property tax collection is according to the percentages of the real property tax collected. Okay. I understand that. So, another question. Okay. So, for zooming, you're going to be collecting and dealing with the tax collections, property tax collections coming out of snowmess anyway already. Is there a correlation in terms of real costs that your office is incurring to kind of equate to that. I mean the purpose for the Treasury's fee is to reimburse the county for the cost of collecting property tax. So that's our staff, that's the assessor's staff, that's, you know, that doesn't all that kind of stuff. It's a fluctuation. Does it? Yeah it, does it, you know, does it add $2 million? Well, out we haven't really looked to see, but that's the theory behind the legislation that says county treasurers deduct a fee for the collection of the tax. So the counties don't have to put all that effort in when actually that effort benefits mostly all the other tax indices. Rest in John Peacock. Again, just to be clear though, again, this is over the last few weeks, months as we've kind of educated ourselves on this. Again, it doesn't sound like there's any discretion on that 2%, it's mandated by the state. I think it was different from expectations. But in terms of that 2%, does that go into the general fund for the county? What's fun? Yeah. Yeah. That's where the expense is for the collection of taxes. Right. The assessor's office. Right. The assessor's office. Done. Just building off of what Russ was saying that state statute dictates that we collect this fee. And I believe that the, you know, the fee isn't necessarily set to whatever cost each county is incurring. It's a set rate and it's a set rate that were required to collect. I think based on the idea that we're not having differential fees for different districts and different districts or political subdivisions being burdened differentially for the cost of assessing and collecting property taxes, which over the course of the year is significant. And so, and this is something, it's a collection fee that's really implicit in all property tax collections. And so there's no effort to nickel and dime here. I think this was just something that as staffs became aware, felt as important to be putting in front of you as a council to make sure you're aware of how the full transaction works. But there's not a lot of flexibility on the revenue side. Otherwise, we would have looked at that. And it's also implicit in property tax collections. All property taxes are charged. This collection feed offsets the costs of collecting the tax. Obviously then you have the expenditure side what you're expanding against it. Now for every 200,000 that you're collecting each year off of the mill levy for the assessed value here, you are getting that extra is at 2.4%. So this year it's about 2.3. So while you've levied that against the property values here in snowmass to collect the 200,000 so in that neighborhood there. And then with the deduction of the Treasurer's fees, which would be, you almost see, you come out just a little bit ahead on this. There's really no effort to not be transparent about this. That's why we felt it was important for us to have that public claim. But I did it and it does drop below 2%. Provided that it doesn't drop below that 2%. And that's what I would offer, you know, for counts. that doesn't drop below 2%. Provided that doesn't drop below that 2%. We kind of all get stuck. And that's what I would offer, you know, for Council's consideration. If that's the risk that we're trying to manage is to combine those amounts. And if the net collections then, you know, if the collections net of the specific ownership tax become insufficient, you know, your net collections are insufficient then to cover the obligation, then you do whatever those net collections are. Does that make sense? Did I want more time though? Well, so, for example, that's the barrack stop. Yeah, that's that's basically that would be a way of getting at the backstop, but you guys can do it on appropriations. It's not through forgiveness of the treasurer's fees. And that would be one way of getting at it where I think all the parties then are probably managing their risk and expectations. Fred. I'm going to go back to the initial presentation before us. And that was from the open space that there would be no extra costs, no extra fees, no extra expenses. Two million dollars is all that we're going to be, all we were going to have to collect and pay. Okay? There's now an extra cost, there's now an extra fee that we were to wear of that may be covered by this motor vehicle tax refund to us and may not be. I don't want to run that risk. I don't think the citizens of this town voted to have us run that risk. So if there is a fee to be collected, we seems to me either, either an open space pays for it, or we deduct it from what we pay open space and pay you the fee. But either way, we don't pay more than $2 million and not run any risk. So, we're paying the fee. It's just a question of the fee is getting paid. It's just a question of who's paying it. So, I guess what's the pleasure of council again? I'm not sure, yeah. You know, with the way the again, this, you know, you've got it. I'm not sure, yeah. You know, with the way the state statue is and, you know, trying to understand, because it's not that simple to understand. The same simple and saying, we're going to send you a million nine hundred and sixty dollars, you know, and forty thousand, you know, we did it acted, but you know things don't work as simple as that, you know with property taxes there is this assumption that you're going to be paying 2% you know With Fred over here, I I feel very close to what he said because I do believe we said a number we said to the community Hey, we're gonna pay two million dollars Okay, it's we're gonna be paying a little more it sounds like because to make a check make you a hole for two million We've got to come up with this two percent somewhere through this motor vehicle thing so you know To not have every special district and us always saying well, you know We told you that we were only paying you this money now We've got to go back in and figure all this stuff out. It's why I asked up front. Are these numbers that are initially set up when you go to the electorate and say, you know, there's this much of interest you're gonna pay and all these other kind of things. We don't ever really put treasurers for you in those kind of discussions, do we? No. So. But when you do, if you pass a general obligation, debt question and What what that authorizes you is to levy whatever you need to generate the net revenue that you need to pay that debt and so in that case Marianne or you know, where the finance person is for the district, knows about treasurer's fees, knows about specific ownership tax, looks at the calculation for their district and says, you know, I have a $2 million debt to pay and maybe I have to levy a little more than to know him in order to net that. Bring that up. So that's what's authorized in that type of question. No, you know that. And I guess back to the beginning and Fred to kind of your distinction of well, we only agreed to pay 2 million. That is what the agreement was is the town of Snowmass agreed to pay $2 million to Pitkin County as partial funding for the drosty acquisition. The way you chose to raise that revenue is through property tax. You could have just taken it out of fun balance. You know we couldn't have taken it out of sales count. That wasn't an option. It ended up number. You know, but you chose a revenue source that has those are options, these complications with it. And that's not paying the county extra for drosety. We're just asking for the two million for drosety. And how you get it is up to you. And how you get it, I think, you end up from your revenue source. Over the time period, if we do all the accounting and come back in seven years, I'll probably be able to show you that net of the treasurer's fee, you collected more than $2 million in property tax interest and motor vehicle specific ownership tax, all of which are part of the property tax levy. Judges and well, lip-fred finishes. I'm just wondering why the risk and the burden should be ours. I think I was trying to offer a solution to take some of the risk out because I think the concern that we're hearing from Mary Ann, I think that we're hearing from you, is if that specific ownership drops below what that treasurer's collection fee would be and what I was suggesting is writing the provision or amending the IGA so that okay well if those if that nets out to be less than what you would need to produce the, for the two million or whatever the payment is scheduled for that year, you pay what you can. Does that? So for example, for the UN staff, you have to work out in a minute out for tonight. First, for example, if the property tax and specific ownership tax came to 190,000 instead of the 200,000, then you're obligated to that 190,000. But if it's generating revenues net of the treasurer's fees adequate to pay the 200,000. We just pay. Then you pay that. And then that manages the risk, I think, on your side. John, welcome to the address, Mr. Dresser. I'm going to get a couple of questions. Is there any sunset provision of the MVSO? Is that going to- No, it's constitutionally mandated. Okay, so that's not going to go away. Now when we authorize $2 million for the purchase of the property that was in present dollars correct Yeah, it's a It's a number right, but we're paying 200,000 over five years and five hundred thousand in the last two years. What is the present value of that two million in year seven? Again, it's a fixed number. That's what's unique. It's generating the same amount It's two million million over seven years. I think originally I calculated the present value because we were talking about that. You know, it was obviously less than the $2 million, right? Right. Because of the cost of inflation. In the county, you're going to pay interest because they didn't get their $2 million upfront. Right exactly. So what is it? So you remember what that number, yeah, low mean or covering it because we put out 17 million. You had to make that right there, right there, which is it? And we're getting it back in. What's that one point? 17. Do you remember what it was, Dale? It was a big item. I don't know. I don't speak, then he does. It doesn't really matter. Okay, yeah, right. Yeah. But what we agreed to was two million over seven years. Right. Two hundred thousand a year for five years and then five hundred thousand for two years. I guess my point is, is that we're really, we're paying it, but it's devalued a mountain over the seven years. And I was just kind of interested what what that difference was because that on top of the motor vehicles special ownership tax is going to be less than two million over the period of time. No you're still paying two million. You still pay two million. You're just the value, yeah, your interest in inflation and all those kind of things you're taking to the fact, right? So, you know, but the inflation over the state of interest We don't really care about that It's not our problem. We're just gonna give them two million whatever it's worth. We went through that and John brought a care about that Yeah, okay, Marky or actually A lot of things to say I have a lot of things to say. I guess Tom, I wonder is this MVSO number, this is what we are collected through 1132, 2011. And I wonder, you're telling us that is $46,000 over what we collected last year? No, no, what I'm saying is currently as a percentage of property tax So the Ship taxes are running about 2.3% of property tax of County why if that stayed consistent over the seven years in the future, and you'll have a $2 million in property tax, you and we collect for you two million in property tax, you'd receive $46,000 in specific ownership tax. 2.3%. You'd pay $40,000 at a 2% Treasury speed. I get it. You deducted off the top. And so, Ned, you'd have $2,000,000,000 from which to pay $2,000. Right. Who pays that tax? The motor vehicle-specific ownership tax. The motor vehicle specific ownership tax? Yeah. Vehicle owners. When the register, our car, the portion of that registration, annual registration fee is this motor vehicle tax. So the taxpayers of snow mass village pay that tax? Those who want to pay that tax? Those who want to pay that tax. Those who have cars. Right. And the only thing that changes the amount we get is the way because it goes up $2 million which town of Snowmass Village taxpayers are paying. They're also paying the MVSO. So the fact that we get a bigger ratio, it's still snowmass village residents that are paying those taxes, same as if it was out of the general fund. The other question I had was you mentioned Delinque and Interest on taxes and I see that that's $985 for the year. Isn't that truly compensation for the loss of the use of that money? No, it's, it's statutorily 1% a month. I understand, I understand. I understand that. Right now, interest rates, you can't take that money and invest it in a one percent month. But you're not getting it in a timely we manner so you're being compensated later for the loss of the use. Right. Okay. Yep. And that is we break interest down on in two categories here. Interest on the current year's taxes. Right. And interest on prior year's taxes that we call the link one. And so the interest on current year taxes is about $6,000. And with respect to John's offer of, we'll make it over in the long run if you come out short. I would just add to motor vehicle specific ownership tax, since you get additionally. Also, interest on taxes that you get. And that's, I mean, the one who worked, I have no problem agreeing to that because the chance of it coming up short is really minimal. And if we were short, it's going to be really minimum and we're talking $100 or something. We are talking $200,000 or the $200,000 a year, what impact would that have the MVSO to us? You'd receive proportionately less. How much? So basically, $2 million over the total amount of property tax, levied in the county, times the total amount of motor vehicle tax collected over that time period. So basically you would, you know, at the current rate, you would, over the life of the tax, get $46,000 less, and specific ownership tax, then you would, if you levied the $2 million. Okay. Ready? Anything else, Fred? No, not right now. Okay. Markey? I had two questions. When we put the initiative on the ballot and received authorization of 2 million, we can't reduce that authorized amount of taxpayers without going back to the electorate, correct? No, you can reduce, you can't increase. Right. Okay. Thank you for that clarification. Secondly, it seems as though there really is no option Other than what John is proposing in terms of a backstop provision Is that correct? I mean, I'm listening to this this discussion. We got the two million dollar deal We've got some discussion around the MVSO We heard John speak about kind of a backstop provision, which I'm comfortable if you guys could work that out. Other than that. I think there's three options. One, I think there's one. I'm not suggesting this one that you would accept. One, you pay the 40K. Two, you have the motor vehicle tax. We wanted to make sure that was understood and acknowledged because that was the issue. The question John was the question I asked is the taxpayer is paying for that plus the property tax were assessing plus the county open space tax. So I just wanted that to be clear. And the third option is really reflected in the IGA amendment that's in front of you that John drafted that simply said, we'll send you 200,000 a year. And if you want to take, we'd be legally obligated to take that 2% out, they would. And Russ, is that still your recommendation that we go with the amended IGA as it's proposed? That's cleaned understand understand, you know, I think what John just put on the table though, you know, I'd be happy. And there's first no real time pressure on this next week. We will have a special meeting and we'll be on the 12th and we'll be looking at our property tax and you'll be setting the mills for that. I think you can go ahead and do that, you move forward. And if more time is needed to work on this and you're comfortable with the motor vehicle concept, I just wanted you to know who pays for that and how that works. I'd be happy to sit down with John and his staff and particularly with his offer, kind of make this explicit within the IGA. If you're comfortable with that, we certainly can do that. But we have in front of you as an amendment is very clean and simple to understand. Fred? Yeah, Marky. I mean we do have a choice. Well I just understand that now. Okay, it is a very clear choice. Yeah. And it's the one I am truly recommending that we do with the taxpayers of this town, in the voters of this town, told us to do. And that has sent the county $200,000 for ideas and $500,000 a year for the ensuing two years. But the county does with that town was asked to contribute $2 million towards the purchase and the town selected the method of payment to be property tax, which implicitly comes with a 2% fee to the treasurer's office going along with that method of collecting those funds? I mean, basically that's on the town in a way we should have understood that. If we didn't understand that on the front end, that's kind of on us. But there's a way to solve the problem. And that is simply to do what we were told to do. And that is send them $200,000 a year. But then you can't honor the commitment of $2 million of a usual property tax collection process. I mean, you know, the 2% that we are dealing with that you guys are charging, it's the normal thing that property taxes do. And I think that, you know, my feeling is I like to make a motion that we work on, have staff work on the most recent discussion and direction that John and Tom have come up with where we take that difference out of the motor vehicle, especially the motor vehicle, specific ownership tax to cover the difference. And you, Russ and John, Mary Ann and Tom work on that to get this thing amended to use that method. Because we did a quote poll of property tax button. And the bottom line is those funds available through the MVSO wouldn't be in our pocket. Anyway, but for what the exacting was for. That's the whole part of that. Second. Second by Markey. Further discussion? All those in favor, please signify by saying aye. Well, I've what? Well, Billions, I have no- And having them do you guys direction to stand? Direction to stand. Right, right. We have to work on a the hybrid that John had suggested. We're just not in the other clarification. Any other questions? Just wanted to make sure that's what we're doing. That's what I think we did. You want to direct their staff to you? Not really. I don't want pay that bill. I'll be happy to take that direction. I don't want pay that bill. Okay, John Wilkins welcome. So we're not doing any action on the resolution 35 series 2011. No, that wasn't made that we didn't bring that forward. So we don't need to do anything on that resolution. No, okay. Technically, I suppose because it was noticed, you should probably introduce it. It can die for lack of a second. Well, but that's what I wanted to clarify before they vote. Yeah. I guess I would suggest that you introduce it and either table it or let it die for a second. I would suggest that you table it because it is a generic resolution and when we come back with a different exhibit it will work good. If you deny it, it is an effect. Could be interpreted as a rejection of the resolution in IGA propounded by the county. So, with your direction to staff, I would ask that you move second and table resolution 35. Then in that regard, the IGA agreement, is that in the same vein? Well, you were going to decide which exhibit to attach to resolution 35, either the proposed new one or the one approved by the county. And it sounds like from the motion, if it carries, you're going to want to have a different exhibit. But it would still be to the same approving resolution. Okay, got it. Call the question there, Bill. So actually, we need to, I think John's suggesting that we would make a motion to approve resolution 35. Second. So if there's already a motion on the table, do we have to take this? That's okay, so he's the chair. He can hold that in a bayon. Yep. So that was Bill and Jason. Bill and Jason. are you motion on the table? Let's take this. Mr. Chair, he can hold that in a bayonet. So that was no in Jason. Bill in Jason. Motion to table, please. I move that we table the resolution. 35. 35. Second. Second to budget. Thank you. All is in favor of tabling I I know we should table it to a date certain okay can we deal with this by next the 12th no I think John's gonna need time to get back I'm sure in half an hour they could get I can Should we go for July 19 to Thinking January That's right. Yeah, I think we January 9th would be our next meeting in January. Okay, so it's table list till January 9th 2012 And all those in favor of that table That date I I'm those opposed Not even call the question on the direction to staff So now and um, and that was at Billy. What for the record Fred is abstaining from that. Oh, okay. You are I can't have staying. No. Then I vote against tabling. I vote against. Okay. Let's get the tabling. Okay. So now then for the motion to have both direction to staff, you guys. Work on this. We understand that direction. And so I just need to know that it's the consensus of council. John Wilkinson. Just clarification, we're talking about on page 20 of our packet option B under item two. You described it and you discussed it. I just want to make sure that that is what we're referring to. Page 20 of our pass. That's in Bill's motion. That's just the description you referenced, John, is just a historic background in the discussion of the legislative process. History of the motor vehicle vehicle specific ownership tax. Specifically, as I understand the direction, you're asking town and county staff to work together and understanding the county commissioners would also have to be involved to specifically work on some backstop language so that if there was a scenario or MVO didn't offset that too much of the workup. Yes. Yes. Yes. And that's in your direction to stand on. All those in favor of that? Hi. Hi. Was opposed? Hi. Okay. So, forward one on that. Motion. That direction. Gentlemen, thanks for your time tonight. Thank you for coming. John. Thank you very much. Gentlemen, thanks for your time tonight. Thank you for coming. John, thank you very much. I just want to acknowledge the partnership that has made this, you know, really amazing, I think, a amenity for the whole community. And thank you for this discussion. So what's the name of this property now? It's still working on that. I think that's a tougher issue than what we just discussed. I can't believe that. I think we'll be believe it's probably back in front of the council when to talk about the management plan. Don't know the date of stop my head. Sometime, what's in the neck? 45 days. We're having great public events. And we'll see that a recommendation will bring that back. Very good. June, we're January 9. Thank you. You might. Jesus. I've already got two. Oh, very good. I need one. Thanks, Dale. It's not very green, John. Oh, no. 2000 and 2000. I hope it's based on the trail. They're under. I don't know. That's a feature of being. I mean, I'm sorry if you guys can do that. Beautiful. Get those things. Get them now, because they do run out. He's being greener this year. Did you know if you save him for seven years, the calendar's been Thank you very much. We're going to move to item number seven. The manager's report. It's forced. Let's see. Thank you. Couple of things. Anything else you need at this point for our special meeting on Wednesday? We have a packet to you. The marketing board will be here. We've invited the FAB and also we've done our typical notification to the business community for a marketing board meeting. Have we heard whether FAB members will attend? We don't have everybody that chair has dealing with some health issues and but we do know a number of them will attend. So we will have representation from them. some health issues and but we do know a number of them will attend. So we will have representation from them. Good. And also just wanted to acknowledge that the Roinfort Conservancy has sent us an email and they are from Mark Fuller and requested some time with you to present the watershed plan. We have discussed this. The last time we discussed this, we asked them to first present to the water district. They've done that and now they're asking for some time with the town council. So just wanted to see if this is something you wanted to schedule. So be in the January, February timeframe. Probably should, I think. Would you hear the discussion and see what their desires are? Very good. We'll slot them in. I don't think I have anything else to add. OK. Moving on then, agendas for the next rest of the year. December 7th, special meeting, which is this Wednesday. Then the 12th, special meeting. I will not wait the meeting on the 12th. You will not be the 12th. We hope it's very, very quick. The only substantive component of that is Hunt will present road projects for 2012. And then the GID special meeting with a special meeting. Okay. And then December 19th, the regular meeting. Right. So right now, it sounds like Mark is the only one we'll not be here on the 12th. Okay. Moving on. Item number 9, food with meeting minutes for September 19th. Mayor Boino, I apologize. It looks like two sets of the same minutes were put in. Should have been the 19th in there also. So we'll just bring that back at the next meeting. Okay. So we have nothing to approve then. Well, you can still approve this one. It's moved. It's the second session. Right now. 21st. Yeah. Second. Yes. Motion by Markey I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I We have my page refreshes itself. Calendars and comments. So Jason, we have anything down there for council comments, committee reports and calendars. Happy to see the snowmasticist back in print today. Different paper. Aspen daily news. That should be fun. Otherwise, Rudy, Water and Power Authority meeting this week. So, okay. That is all. Markey. Nope, I don't have any. Again, tomorrow night Tuesday is the, having tree. Yeah, having tree. Is the silver tree at five o'clock? Hi. Thank you. John Wilkinson. Yeah, just as a reminder, Nick's, The other three? The other three. The silver tree at five o'clock. Aye. Thank you. John Wilkinson. Yeah, just a reminder next. It's next Tuesday and on 13th, the Anderson Ranch holiday. Holiday Open House. And Rafft is taking a hiatus in December. We won't have a Rafft and meeting till January. Okay. That's also the night of the 13th, this also the night of the As of Medical Foundation awarding of nonprofit gifts and at the Jerome. So everyone's invited to that. Fred, just like the report that Mark and I have completed the review and update of both John and Russ's contract. Russ's contract has been signed. John is reviewing our revisions and I guess Reese has been to us and hopefully we'll get his wrapped up as well. Very good. Okay. Now there, I don't remember 11, executive session. Tom Council now meet an executive session pursuant to CRS 24-6-4024. And it's not as close to municipal code section 2-45C to specifically discuss three items. These are conferences with an attorney for purposes. I'm going to do it. you you you Thank you.