Expansion, renovation of the firehouse. John, do you want to take over? I do. Thank you very much. Sure. I do now. Okay, thank you. That close? Yeah. Can you, is that good? That's good. All right, thank you. I do. And it's always a pleasure to come in front of a council. I'm gonna jump a little bit off topic to start with. I just wanted to let you know that the Wildfire mitigation project that we did this summer up on Far Away Road. I think by all accounts was a real success. Not only did we do the common areas with the Snowmass Homeowners Association, but we also got a little over 30 homeowners, private homeowners, to join in and remove some dead and dying trees from their property. I look forward to next year, I think we've got another plan for the same area, maybe some road easement work. And also I'd like to thank all of the firefighters, the police department and the citizens that helped us with the 911 remembrance and that we'll never forget. I think that was a real nice community thing. So to move on, the, just doesn't seem to be functioning for me. There we are. There we go. Okay, thank you. You know, we're a special district, but in many regards, we act like the town of Snowmass Village's fire department. 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That's why we thought we'd be here tonight is to keep you informed. So I'm going to bring you back a little in history as to how the snowmast fire district was started. Back in 67 and 68 this is kind of in that era of photo. I don't have the exact year. We really were not in anybody's fire district. Aspen soon came on board and took it into their purview, but they didn't take all of it. So as time went on and they saw the need, there was two citizens here, Bud Rogers and Assistant Fire Chief Bob a flock cart. They had, they were visionaries of the district. They actually went to the Espen Fire Protection District and said, hey, maybe we can form our own little substation up here so we don't have to wait a half hour or 45 minutes because that's about how long the response time was back then. But their spirit brought on a whole new vision and that was that the snowmass Wildcat Fire Protection District started its own fire department. So two years later after going through all the courts and de-annexing from the Aspen Protection District, they formed their own fire district through the district courts. Soon thereafter in 1971, they were virtually given this property by the American cement company. They cost them $10. And they built three bays. You can see that the left hand side, the administrative offices, were not a part of the original station. That's these over here, and it doesn't work. It's not working, yeah. So, the thing I want to point out about this though is the station was built on filled that came from the Picking County Airport at the time. And it also was constructed in a very short time frame. Five months is what it took to build that. This may be some of the cause of why there's problems with the station today. This is the core of the station. And it's definitely showing some signs, and I'm going to show you a little bit more here as we go. So I'm going to bring you through a couple of remodels and stages and then 74 is when the fire district finally realized that they needed to have some resident firefighters. They had a good volunteer force but they really were relying on horns and sirens to call everybody in and they were also handling their own dispatch. 911 wasn't a part of the picture in 74 so you would actually directly call the 2212 number and get a firefighter there and they would page out the system. In 87 and this is when snowmass village was really starting to build up, you had the pines, the two creeks subdivisions, Alcrete Town Homes. A lot of the subdivisions were building up and we actually needed more equipment, more volunteer housing because it was getting to be very expensive to live here here the average person that owned a home wasn't coming down to volunteer We found out soon that we needed to provide that opportunity and and to take care of people in order to respond appropriately So this is the final addition to the station and this was done in the mid 90s and it was 20 years ago and we added that third floor you can see on the top and that was basically resident housing and we remodeled the kitchen area and we added a day room which actually allowed us to park the vehicles more appropriately. So, here we are today, 2016, and this is where we came from. Looks pretty good on the outside, doesn't it? It's, we take pride in being a nice facility in the area, but it really doesn't tell the true story of what's going on with the building. So that's why I'm here today. So ten years ago or so we started to notice all the doors were starting to show a little bit. So as firefighters do, we got out the plane or you know, filed that door down. But it just kept coming. It wasn't just one door. It was all the doors. And what this does is it creates a problem because if you see in this area here, that's the sleeping quarters right here. And the fire trucks are right outside. And when you have doors that start to not seal properly, now all of a sudden, when every time you start that engine up, carbon monoxide and exhaust, it's just not a safe scenario for the firefighters. Started to notice structural wall failures with cracks and fissures. These are some beams that are in the station you can start to see here. We're getting cracked. This would never be allowed by building code, by the way. They actually had too short of a beam and they married two beams with this metal plate. You can see how they did that. And you can see how this is starting to bow and crack just from the weight of the building. This is the side of the fire station that's probably giving us the most problem. That's the east, northeast side of the building. You can see where the landscaping is starting to fail the sidewalk failure. And also that this patio and structure, you can see how it's up against the building right there where it should be against the building right there, where it should be, and right here there's that big gap. Now we've since gone in and tried to do a little bit of drainage corrections and some exterior improvements to try to improve that, but it really hasn't fixed the problem wholly. Here's some more evidence where the building you could see here, now how that has all been falling away. And it continues to do so. Especially in the spring time, we did some drill bore holes that we can look at and we can measure the amount of moisture and it seems like all the snow comes down our way and into brush free. Recently and this was taken about a year and a half ago but we had mold problems. We mitigated the mold and actually did some corrective measures to that crawl space area with ventilation. And even today we got a report that we have some mold returning that we have to take care of. And we do because we're talking about firefighters living in that station. We need to try to make it as safe as we as we can for them. need to try to make it as safe as we can for them. This is some other examples of the deterioration that's very difficult to go back in and try to correct. You can see the moisture problems, but this is actually a side foundation wall. This is a sill plate with the building is sitting on and they're rotting to the point where that is also contributing to those floor joists and beams dropping down. This just kind of shows some deterioration in the actual under floor area. You can see back in here we've since plugged some of this moisture up but it's coming back. In other words we're getting a little bit more water pressure than we can actually fix and the foundation itself is just starting to really slide down the hilt towards the chapel. A little bit of moisture problems more to show you in that slide. In some areas we've even gone to the extent of putting in some fake little pillars here to try to give that a little more support in areas where it's totally deteriorated. This is probably one of the more concerning things that are there is that all of the gas lines that feed the fire station underneath seem to be taking on this real. Underneath seemed to be taking on this real rust problem. We did find a small leak when we were down there a little while ago. Now we don't have any, but this is the actual problem that exists there today as well. So, what are we doing about it? Well, we did two actual two independent structural engineering reports. One was done in 2007 and that report basically outlined some potential problems. And because we were looking at what we could do to fix it. Well, that report didn't really fare very well other than to say that there's not a lot of exterior problems, but underneath to try to fix those problems that would be very costly and expensive. And then again in 2013, when we were looking at what we could do, we had smugorgorgan mire come out. They actually did help us with that drainage correction. And that was just a minor fix to it though. And I have some more details with that report that I'd be happy to share with people if they want to come down to the station with us. Constant plumbing problems. My fire system fire marshal has to put a trash bag over his computer every night because we're having roof and leaking problems. We bring them out to repair it. It's just it's a flat roof. It's really not helping us out too much there either. But that's a roof problem. John, that's a plumbing problem, right? No. I agree. But I wanted to just expand a little bit. But there are there are plumbing issues with the apartments and everything. So this might take a little explanation, so bear with me. If you see these are compressors, these are our breathing air that firefighters use for their SCBAs on their back. This would never be permitted in modern fire station building. In other words, and they're also in danger because of the storage problems we have, this truck you don't want to hit any of these cylinders. But this is where we're getting our breathing in. Normally they would be piped to the outside, they would be in a separate room, a clean room. In other words, this is what they're breathing. And so this is one area that would need to be improved with a new facility. This also would be something that would remedy, is there a bunker gear gets stored in a separate room. And that's for several reasons because if they're in a fire, you're bringing contaminants into the bay, you don't want that. And this right here, you can see when the ambulance is start exhaust hits their bunker gear and the like. So it's not the right way that a fire department should be operating. Tight equipment storage. You could see we're packed in here pretty well and sometimes they say, well, why do you have all that stuff? Let me be clear, is this ATV and this levitator's already been on five trail rescues this year. These are the town bike trails that people are riding on and also up on the ski hill with the improvement of mountain biking, which we certainly like to bring to town. It's made us step up to the plate on how we can respond to those emergencies. Yes, SkiCo has mountain patrol up there, but they're handing their patients off to us and many times we're going up there and actually helping to provide the best comfort for that patient with this type of material. You can see it's tight. If I wanted to pull those out, I have to actually wait and pull an engine out first. If I really need this brush truck in the back here, I have to pull this ambulance out first so that that truck can respond. We're backed up and it seems like no matter how you place them, that's the one you need is the one behind it. The equipment that we have, some of it has to be stored outdoors. This was actually designed as a temporary facility. We were looking at station replacement back before the great recession and we thought this kind of put us in a but our storage is not being stored well outside. It does us fairly good but it's not the right way to go. This is very expensive equipment that belongs to the community and we have to provide for it. So, as I said before, this shouldn't be new news to our community. We've made it known. We've been to Rotary several times. We're really trying to make sure that we're not remiss in at least informing the community that there's some problems down there. As a matter of fact in 2011 we really got serious about how we were going to approach this and we brought some citizens on board. You can see their names there. They're recognized in the community and since 2011 we've worked really hard doing our due diligence. We've researched all the available lots that we might be able to go do parcels in town that maybe we move the station to. We've also looked at how we best approach the community and whether we remodel or whether we rebuild. And it's come down to that we're going to stay where we are. It's the best opportunity. There are no other available parcels that really work well that wouldn't extend our response time. And so this is what we're bringing to the community. But in that, when I want to say the strategic plan, the number one priority, and it reviewed a lot of different things, including budget and workplace things. The number one item was we got to figure out what we can do to fix the station. Not only for us, but for the next 45, 50 years. Our community is growing again, and we need to make sure that we have the right facilities for it. So with that, I'm going to ask Chief Thompson if he take the microphone away from me here and go and explain some of the things that we're looking at doing. Okay. First, thank you for giving us the opportunity to kind of put this out there. I know there's a lot of I know there's a lot of discussion around the community, $17 million. It's a lot of money. But I can also tell you that we've spent the last year trying to figure out exactly, looking at the old strategic plan that they did. We went through that and looked at what our needs were, our needs analysis. And there's nothing fancy, there's nothing overboard, there's nothing in this station that we don't need. We took the station from three stories, which currently is now to two stories, which spread it out a little bit. But in the end, that saved us money on stairways and how the station functions. So we actually cut some square footage. I've heard a lot of talk about how do we need such a big station. This is a pretty encompassing station because we have our employee housing. We have our administrative staff, plus our uncalled firefighters. And there's nights at 15 people sleep in this building at night. And it's 24 hours a day. And I think that's part of the reason that it's failing after you know 40 some years that's that's some some hard use of the fire station so I wanted to kind of go over now what we were it quit again well you were doing really good with the point I can't see the pointer. But there it is. OK, so right now, here's our current parking lot and the current footprint of the fire station. Over here, that's a workout area and the gardens. That's another thing that I've also heard is the gardens are a very contentious issue with some of the people. And we want to help to try to find a new place for the garden. But unfortunately, we're going to need that space. It's a very limited space. We've got a major sewer line that goes through here. So we're having to adapt to that with the building. And then also over here, this is a 60 foot easement. So we can't use this whole parcel. So where we're going with that is flattening out the fire station to two floors, which we're moving it this way. There's a couple other reasons. If we push the fire station this way, we would have to do lift and fill, which gets very, very expensive. And putting it over here, cut a lot of costs because of the slope of the lot. So that's one of the reasons that we did that. Yeah, see if I can, you were a lot better at it than I am. Where's the go? Sorry. I'm pretty good with a computer too. Okay. So this will kind of show you the footprint of the new fire station. The, get the mask. That's what here it is. This is the training tower. This is the tallest side of the fire station. It is no taller than the tower or the hose drying tower that we have now. So our hope is that it won't look any worse and it'll actually look like a smaller building. The green area, the back is the employee housing. This is where the firefighters, their day rooms and things like that. The nighttime, they'll be closest to the fire trucks during the day. They're one floor away. And part of that is, we want them to be as quick as possible getting to the apparatus. And that's the reason for some of that. The yellow portion is the community public portion of the building. And what I mean by that is, one of the things that we lack in CMS Village is emergency operations center. We have a bad flood or we have a real hotel fire. We have no place to meet with Salvation Army, American Red Cross, God forbid that we'd have to deal with FEMA, but we don't have a location that we could bring those people in. Nor do we have a place to deal with press and some of the other things that come with a big incident. So besides a community room, when we first started speaking with the chapel, they're booked all the time. And they said that this would be a great amenity to be able to bring people over to our community room. So that's kind of how it's set up as a walk off area that we could let the community use it there. You know during the day or at night, it's not going to impact our services unless there's an emergency. And besides that, it'll be a great training area for our firefighters to sit down and get, you know, school, book type learning. In the center of this, the square, that's the original 3 Bay Fire Station. That was built with bridge girders. One of the things that we held onto this forever in the planning process and the building process and the blueprints to try to save that because we figured we could save some money. It turns out that it would cost us $200,000 to replace that over remodeling it. And it's got a flat roof. And one of the things that we found out is a snow load is so light on it that we couldn't even put a new roofing material on it without going over the snow load. So it's very limited to us. The other thing to bring up, and I brought this up originally, this is no normal building. The because it is an essential public building, the roof has to be 110% whatever the building code for snowmess village says the roof has to be. And that's a standard in emergency management. So that's one of the other things that we're trying to meet. Therefore, we're getting rid of that. The $200,000 just doesn't make sense to keep a 40-year-old building that we have to work around and the huge girder, so it's the other problem. Now to get back to the outside a little bit, this is going to be the road access to the parking area. The parking area is over 50 spots, so we've gained approximately 20 some spots. That'll be able to be used by the chapel where Anderson Rancher and their busy times. And we've worked out so we can actually add some parking in these spaces. One of them was where our access were our old driveway into the parking lot. But this needs to be expanded to 24 feet. And I think that that's going to be good for all three users of this area with Anderson Ranch and the chapel. So that's kind of our hope. ranch and the chapel. So that's kind of our hope. The next one. I can't see it. So this is conceptually across the front of them. We didn't want it to look like a service garage. We spent a lot of time trying to break it up and some of the shorter doors and some of the taller doors. As you can see on the left side is the training component, and that's the one that's the height of the current station. The interior, like John showed you, we're very, very cramped, but with this new design, we're going to have room to put all of our apparatus and separate rooms for filling air bottles, for cleaning our gear, for cleaning our backboards. After we come back from the bicycle crash, you know, we put 30 backboards in the floor and clean them in the apparatus, but that's not healthy for any of them. This is the entrance into the training community room downstairs. That's the corner looking at the employee units on the back side kind of looking toward where we're at right here. Just to kind of close, we had a really successful event with a lot of people. It took everybody in public safety and I think the community should be really proud of this thing went off without any hitches. And we just kind of close it with the picture of that success and hopefully that you have some questions or ideas that we could get to make us successful, I guess, is where I'm going with this. Thank you, thank you. Chief and John, appreciate it. You're welcome. You're welcome. This is actually a brand new building. I mean, you're not using really any of the existing facility. Not anymore. Like I said, through those engineering evaluations, mechanical plumbing and electrical, they said it would cost us more in the long run to remodel what we have now, then to tear down and build new. So what happens when you have to tear down this facility where are you going to go on a temporary basis? We have to have an interim fire station. We were working in one area, kind of got turned away by the Home Auto Association, but we're looking at some other sites. But we're going to have to do a temporary tennis bubble type with some office trailers. We've got a deal to move some of our residents into apartments. That isn't finalized but that gets our residents at least to stay in the village. And the costs for that temporary time, are they built into this $17 million request? No, yes and no. No, it's not built into the $ 17 million is actual construction costs for this building. Okay. The hard cost for moving us off site and to a different location is money that we've been saving by taking additional mills up to the 6.601 that we started in 2015. And we're going to use those funds to pay cash, to move ourselves and have a temporary location. Okay. How long is it gonna take from start to finish? That's the other part. If we move, we should be able to get this done in a year. They were giving us, if we stayed on site and did like two phases of the building, we were looking at up to two years which jacked the prices, you know, skyward. And the logistics of trying to keep the firefighters there, work with Anderson Ranches, their agenda, and what they've got going on in the summertime just didn't work out so we need that space and Where the parking lot's going to be for staging and things like that so we need to be gone So only equipment that's your counting on having for Possibly the news across the street stuff that may be going on I'm assuming is going to fit in here. Or will we be getting a remodel in five years because the equipment's not going to fit in there. Right now, everything plus future expansion back to the needs analysis that we did is the square footage. So yes, we've got room to expand. There's room under the bays that I have an affection name for, but it's 14 foot ceiling since we don't have to do fill. And there's room to put additional storage offices. We've got some egress problems, so you know, couldn't be living space. The other side that we've planned in part of this process is the side toward the west could have more employee housing units built under the station or under the base. So yes there's expansion built into it that we're not going to do but there's square footage to do it. Covered square footage of it. Yes, yes, yes. We've basically taken advantage of every square foot we could on this lot, based on where the property line is for the chapel, where the sewer line is on the east side, and then of course going toward brush grid grow. We lose a lot if we go toward brush grid grow because of the fire trucks and the pad and the uses that the firefighters have for that pad and for the- So the $17 million cost as far as the budget goes. I know you have an architect in mind. And did somebody locally price all this stuff a GC or how did you come up with the $17 million budget? We have contractable with Charles kind of architects. Right, that I know. Yeah, we went through the procurement bid process with them. We've also picked FCI as our contractor through a QP process. So they're giving prices based on our schematic design and then working it up. So I mean what's the chances of this 17 million and I know there's some general contractors in the room knowing what I'm driving at is going to be driven up to 1922 me. There's contingencies built in. It's also I think because they don't know My experience with how they're bidding this out. This is high This is high just for the reason that some of this, you know, there's some unknowns here. But the thing that I think that, you know, the contingencies, I think we're very well set. It looks beautiful. I mean, just don't doubt. And I hope you get the room you want. And I'll have a lot more questions on the mechanical side later down the road. Of course, Tom. Yeah. On the financing and how much? Because I've got huge heartburn because I'm doing a project that down in basalt, that's went a million dollars over budget. Then you don't talk about it. Yeah, no, no, I absolutely, I'm there. I went back to our consultant that's helping us, owner's representative, and said, you have to make sure that we can live with this before we move forward. And he's assured me that, and I think he's the guy that knows. So I have a comfort level just based on what we've done through that. If I'm wrong, you can scold me on that. I know we're in a sketch plan situation here basically, or not even in a sketch plan situation. But I think 17 million is high as well, I do. But what I'd like to see more and we could discuss it I think 17 million is high as well, I do. But what I'd like to see more and we could discuss it another time and how you can fill that void to make 17 million work. I mean, I see you poor guys plowing that driveway. I think it should be a snow melt that driveway. I mean, to have the fire engines come out on a snowy day, it should be snow melt. So I mean, I don't know if you would have that figured in there. But I mean, yes, I do. And it's probably more of a, I'm scared because when people go off the Alchord Grove, that's where they slide into is into our parking lot. I want them to be able to stop. They hit our parking lot. Right. It's good. Thank you so much. You know the good. The thing that drove snow melt, we don't have any location for... You don't have a boiler location? Well, we don't have any place to pile snow. Well, I know, but you know, I mean, you don't have much space to put an outside room for a boiler for a snow melt situation because your insides are going to be pretty full with housing and other agarats. Like I say, you know, and I'm telling the truth when I say it's an all-encompassing building. It's functioning 24 hours a day with 15 people a day. We were on a thousand calls a year so it's not a quiet place. It's a very busy place. Our firefighters are in Whitty Creek right now helping on a fire. A while in fire. So, you know, we've grown up and we forgot to grow the fire station with us. It's kind of where I'd like to close. How many bays are on the current or the design you've got? There's going to be eight total. And that's how many trucks you have? No, we've got more than that, but there's some that are considered not first There's going to be eight total and that's how many trucks you have No, we've got more than that, but there's some that are considered not first out We have a backup ambulance so the first ambulance would have to be gone before it goes and of course the ATVs and things like that They're going to be in a maintenance bay on the far end that we can do oil changes on our small apparatus and things like that on the far end that we can do oil changes on our small apparatus and things like that. So you will have some vehicles double parked as you do now? Yeah, not like we do now. Just give you examples where John showed the fire truck behind an ambulance. When we just got called to Witty Creek, they had to move the ambulance out of the way to get the fire truck out to go to witty creek So that's what we mean. It's it's just slows us down right? So that was one of the things when we were designing the station that we made sure that you know the ladder trucks and the first out apparatus the first out of ambulance The first out chiefs vehicle those are front to a door How many employee housing units are currently on site? Right now we've got seven with the new design we're going to go to six and that was just based on space but we also have room to put four more on the side when there's funding available in the future. But you don't feel it's appropriate to put that in at this time? No. And like I said, it came down to space in the station. We don't want to start building on the other side because it would increase the cost of the building because of utilities and different things that we'd have to put on that side of the building. But your need is to only house six firefighters. That's what we've seen historically over the last few years. Those are the resident firefighters that move here to come to work for us. Right. And that's their one or two year place to live until they move into housing or what we're seeing lately is they find a girlfriend. They can't live there anymore so they move to employee housing or down valley. And Bill, that doesn't include your on duty staff that's there daily. So in other words, those are your resident firefighters that supplement our five member or four member crew on a daily basis. If you get a good size incident for people, it's a great start, but it's nice to have the backup that they live there and on a nighttime basis, that's a nice resource to have. In our quarters for our daytime people, there's gonna be eight rooms. How many guys join during the day on staff are on that call? Well, go ahead. Five is the minimum staffing. During the winter, we put on one additional for the ambulance because we know that we're going to run transports off the hill. And then some of our part time, our residents, are have to do shifts to pay for their housing. That's part of their agreement that they've made with the district. So sometimes we'll have seven or eight people working. Try to not do it during the off season. We try to do it when we're busy and when we can utilize those people. Thanks, good. When you're successful with the ballot question, what does your timing look like going forward? If the voters okay this, there's a lot of work that goes forward, since I just did it down Valley, we would not see the money, the bond issue, earliest is March of next year. So we have to be able to, over the winter, work with you, with planning extent process and get some of the stuff hammered out. And then come up with a temporary location and get that all located. Like I said, we have cash to do that. So that's going to be the first step is get that temporary location But I don't see any reason that we wouldn't be asking for a demo permit for April next year if this passes I hope to break around next spring yeah, and in reality the longer we wait the more it's going to cost Yeah, you know and we're fully aware of that, so we want to move with some speed. Great. Great. Well, thank you. Anyone else? Listen? No. The only other thing that didn't bring up, we'd love to have people come by and let us show you the fire station. It's hard to show it here. So if you ever have time, you're coming by, stop by, we'd love to take you down and show you the parts you don't see of the fire station. Do we have to go in a crawl space, you mean? No. Just I've been there before. Well, thank you both. John, Chief Tom's are welcome. Thank you very much. Thank you very much. It's a very good welcome. Thank you very much. Thank you very much. Very, very good presentation. Thank you. OK. Next is public comment on the agenda. Anyone? I'll work from the front to the back. Read, OK? Come on up. I just have one quick question. Just for the money. I have something we have a public comment for the labor firm. I'm 17 million pound product and hopefully wouldn't run over that. What is the actual cost? We can't, Mike. Mike. You cannot hear your dollar. You've got a couple of microphones on your side. And introduce yourself just so that people know who you are. Mike, Sarah. Snowman's Village resident. And just have a comment or a question on the total cost with interest of, with the 17 million. So that all depends on when we sell our bond. We're going to do it at the most opportune time to be able to get the lowest interest rate. How it's going to be on the election question is maximum 28 million. So 17 million, you know, you buy a million to our house, what's your interest over your 20 year plan. You can almost always count on it doubling. So, 28 million is the worst case scenario for a $70 million bond. And we hope that we can get different interest rates and lower interest rates. Right now is a great time. That's a sure after the presidential election of what the climate for interest rates will be. But we're going to shop and do the best job we can of selling our bonds and not pay more interest than we have to. So 28 million. 28 million. Thank you. Worst case scenario. Thanks. Read. This is the regular public non agenda. Yeah. I read Lewis, a snowmass village resident I am currently serving on the tourism board. I wanted to bring it to the council's attention. I've attempted to run additional space to open new stores on the Snumass Village Mall. And I think it's important that the council knows that the landlords are not working with businesses. I looked into a possibility for maybe what the council might look into. In Berkeley, California, they've actually gone to a vacancy tax for commercial space. What we have on the mall at this point, in my opinion, is blight. They're empty spaces. They look bad. The town isn't collecting any tax revenue. It's not adding any additional foot traffic to the mall. And it's just sitting there. There's one space I used to be in that space. That's been empty for almost a year. Another space has been empty for I think 28 months now. Just thought you all should know sort of what's going on in the background and if this vacancy tax is a way to perhaps encourage a little more economic vitality up there, there are some articles online about, like I said, Berkeley, California. Thank you. Thank you, Reed. Thank you, Reed. Anyone else? Pat, come on up. Sure. Good afternoon for the record Pat Keifer 90 carriageway and I have to say that a fire station at 17 million sounds pretty cheap compared to the 47.75 bond debt load on the 250 property owners in base village as a result of the 2006 ski co and town of snowmast Village Intergovernmental Agreement. Along the lines of supporting the fire department, for your reference, base village owners through the Metro, base village metro tax district, paid $886,423 for a fire ladder truck. 833,000 of that was from the residential owners and about 53,000 was from commercial properties such as those owned by related. But this public comment, I just wanted to share that so that you know that we do contribute above and beyond what you see us normally talking about. This public comment is about a 67% tax increase. It was a surprise to me that there's a tax district that has a pending 67% increase in taxes that has not been voted upon or approved by either the tax paper payers or the district electorates. Last month I expressed why base village residential owners have PICC and County open space tax board envy. Because they have taxation with representation and that's the purpose of the post card today. I'd like you to take it with you as a talisman. Because on the back, it talks about taxation without representation. And we want to move that to taxation with representation. By the way, I would happily vote for the $17 million fire station. The second reason that we have envy of the Pitkin County Open Space Tax Board is they have a proactive and monitored financial management system. We also asked last month that town council members voluntarily relinquish their GID board responsibilities and appoint base village residential owners. voluntarily relinquish their GID, board responsibilities, and a point based village residential owners. Because we're the folks that pay these taxes, and we ask that you do that before the fall elections. The answer to the question of what tax district has a pending 67% increase in taxes. It hasn't been voted upon or approved by the taxpayers or district electric. That's the general improvement tax district, GID, where the town council acts as the board members. Today, you should have received via email to volunteers that actually own property in base village. that actually own property in base village. And we're not able to join us tonight, so I've volunteered to read their emails for public comment. Dear town council, I would appreciate you're considering the following. My name is Terry Griggs. I co-owned base village capital peak property and paid all of the special taxes and assessments placed solely on base village owners. As a Colorado registered voter and being over 18, he tried not to smile at that. I've volunteered to serve on the general improvement tax board, kind regards Terry Griggs. We have a second email with the exact same wording from Luellan Griggs. In contrast to any other tax district or HOA board, there's appears to be no process to nominate or vote for GID board members. So we've taken this public forum to volunteer to people to assist in governing the GID. Before fall elections, we strongly encourage that the town council members relinquish their GID responsibilities because you all don't pay these taxes and replace themselves with folks like Terry and Lou Ellen. I remain reluctantly but by necessity, a base village activist. Thank you. Thank you, Pat. Thanks for that. Anyone else for public comment? Okay, seeing none, we'll move on to the consent agenda. I see none. We'll move on to the consent agenda. Do I have a motion to accept the consent agenda? Motion to accept. Second? A second. Any discussion? Hearing? Yeah. Bill? Go ahead. So, Yeah, Bill. So when do we plan to bring the MOU for the Ok October 4th? Mm-hmm. Got it. You're discovering? Yeah. We're still working through it. I mean, what I do is I just kind of bump it back. Whenever it's going to be ready, we're aiming for that. But I mean, obviously, I've been meeting with you guys trying to show you where the drafts were at. And once it's at a stage, we'll bring a schedule. But honestly, with that one, it's been bumped probably three different times, which just hasn't been prepared. So the last time I went from, I think, this mean to that number 4 meeting. So I do that with the grain itself, actually. But with any block, it should, you know, I think that's a realistic goal. Okay, great. We just, as a question actually to my fellow counselors, are we set on the time for the special meeting on October 6th? Overset for 9 a.m. Yeah. I think we all kind of deal. Do we all agree on that? I'm set to bring cookies. Okay. Right. Just send me one. The importance does take care of. Billy, did you have a question, comment? Oh, I just that comment that we've made before about them all. Yeah. I mean, is that something that comes up at a meeting? I mean, how, I mean, that seemed like a need for discussion. If you guys wanted to consider a vacancy tax, you just say, hey, Tom, manager, put that on the list, and let's get that scheduled. There's some research in, let us know how it works. But I, and I'll understand, I'm gonna take that direction from you guys, if that's something you wanted to get scheduled. Certainly. So this is, but this is more of a landlord situation, isn't it? And I don't know, I don't know, Berkeley specific, but I know there has been towns that makes it, creates extreme disincentage to have invading properties. And in a high profile area? And we're on main streets or wherever they can do it. And it's true, I sure, if there's demand, and they can, you know, if there's truly demand and landlord's choosing not to fill a space, attacks like that to work. If there's not demand, it's pretty dangerous to make that tax work. So I'm sure what re-retell you is that there is demand and if the landlord's not being responsive, I can't speak to that. But there's ways to create a disincent of debate and see. Well, I would just like to know a little bit more about what's going on. And I don't know if that's a work session or a meeting or whatever, but I mean, clearly there's something happening and I would like more information. And the information that I would be providing is, how does that, how does the example that you brought up in Birmingham? Yeah, I mean, I think it's difficult for staff to find out what's going on with landlords on the wall. Yeah, no, I agree. I don't know how to go about doing it, but there's obviously some sort of issue with the landlord. And how do we, I mean, you said there could be other people that want those spaces, but you're not 100% sure in that the landlord is being difficult. But I said as a vacancy tax only works if there's people that want to be in the... Right. Well, that's what I'm saying. How do we find out if there is interest and if they're just turning people down or not responding to people? Yeah. I mean, we have no way to compel that information from the landowner. I mean, what I could provide you with information on, here's how a vacancy tax would look. Here's what it looks like. Here's a pros, here's some cons that you look at it. But it's not trying to find out if there's actually people that want to be in those. We wouldn't have a way to find that out. Well, I see no harm in finding out than what it's going to look like on the vacancy tax. What it would look like? Yeah, I mean, what are you talking about? I mean, there's the vacancy tax come to the town, obviously. Right? There's different ways. I mean, if it's a tax, it would take a vote of the people to approve it. If it's a fee, it would take a vote of the people who approved it. If it's a fee, we could come up with a bunch of opportunities and show you what they might look like. There's no doubt in my mind we can do that. But as far as a landlord-tenant relationship, we wouldn't be able to report on that with any accuracy. Will you haven't heard this from any other people? So this is the first you've heard about it. I mean I know I've talked to read about it in the past in the last two years I know it's not my attention that he's a difficult to do for him. And I know there's frustration with the amount of vacancy on the mall. There's no doubt about it. Well is it you in favor of having staff get some information together on what one of these things look like? Sure. I mean, I would be curious how that would work. I mean, I do agree with what Reed said before. I mean, you know, they moved to none of that one space where 81615 was to another space. I think with the idea that some bigger tenet was going to go in there. But yeah. Just to be clear, in Reed's particular place, 81615 was with a different landlord and when they relocated to the west end of the mall that was with another landlord. So not landlord to landlord okay Landlord made a landlord beat right black acre to white acre Okay, so I don't know let me just pull some information together and pull some information Let's see what it looks like what it says in the meantime maybe we can you through our own channels of communication contacts, see if we can find out anything more. Okay. So we have a motion that's been seconded. Well in favor? Say aye. Aye. Aye. aye aye any opposed? No okay moving on. You get a time frame on that to live with the ball because. Two clearly can't go on to a ballot this year. Okay okay so next is administrative reports. So Clint and John, would you give us an update on the status of the base village documents and agreements, please. Yeah. You'll recall that back on December 21, 2015, the council approved ordinance number nine, which was a conditional approval of a major PUD amendment to the base village PUD. That ordinance was conditioned, there's a couple of pages of conditions, a major PUD amendment to the base village PUD. Ordnance was conditioned, there's a couple of pages of conditions. A lot of it was on the fine tuning of the 10 agreements that went along with that ordinance. And those were the revised subdivision agreement, the development agreement, there was an easement, a termination of some old base village agreements, the community purpose agreement for building six, a revised housing agreement, a services agreement, an agreement for the base village lot to events, events plaz, as a community purpose, and that ordinance gave the applicant a snowmess acquisition 90 days to submit those documents. They did submit all those documents by the deadline for staff to review. Shortly before the deadline, there was a lawsuit filed by a former partner. I don't want to call him a partner. A potential purchaser of a set of Lot 3 in base village named Sunrise that we're going to purchase Lot 3 from Snowmass acquisition. Snowmass acquisition terminated their purchase and sale agreement and that action was challenged in court by sunrise. That lawsuit was filed in late February. The agreements to comply with the ordinance were submitted in March and one of the over arch overarching conditions included in Ordinance 9 was the fact that building 6 would be assured to the town to continue to function as a community purpose. That with the pending litigation, sunrise as the plaintiff in that litigation filed what's known as a Liz pendence, and that is noticed to the world that there's litigation regarding the subject property, which was lot three of base village upon which a portion of the events plaza and the entirety of building six was located. That pretty much made it impossible for snow mass acquisition to perform on the to provide to the tone the assurances that building six would continue to operate into the future as a community purpose. Accordingly staff informed the applicant of that and staff, the applicant asked for an alternative situation and staff suggested that there needed to be an absolute cash security to ensure that if building six, if sunrise was successful in the lawsuit, that building six and building six could not function, that the town would have gotten an appropriate cash security to be able to create a community purpose elsewhere. Whether it meant to buy the land, use a different building, whatever it was. The applicant did not submit an agreement to that effect. They went through some pretty heated litigation with sunrise. At one point there were two lawsuits The town not wanting to be in the position of forcing them into something that they didn't want to do. There was not a time frame for those conditions to be determined to be fulfilled. There was a submission timeframe, but not a timeframe for staff to absolutely, so in other words, and then it did not say, and then staff will have 30 days to approve. So staff informed them of the potential option of security for the community cash security. They did not want that at all. And then I think you probably saw the newspaper last week that sunrise and snow mass acquisition have resolved both lawsuits and both appeals. Those were dismissed with prejudice, which means they cannot be refiled. And the Liz Pendons was ordered, released, and discharged dismissed with prejudice, which means they cannot be refiled. And the Liz Pendons was ordered, released in discharge on Thursday afternoon. On Friday afternoon, the appeals were then dismissed as well. Over the weekend, actually last week, when after the lawsuits got dismissed and the appeals were still pending, the applicants, no mass acquisition submitted to town staff the one agreement that was in dispute with regard to the security and it did not have the security because they were now, there was no cloud on the property at this point. They submitted that. It was in substantial conformance with the approval given back in December of 2015. Those were submitted and reviewed over the weekend, and they were signed today. So as of earlier this afternoon, the conditional status of ordinance number nine from 2015 was removed and it is now final and will be recorded tomorrow. So all those agreements were executed and the ordinance is now final. Thank you Unbelievable really if you want to have a comment Well the problem is is that no one that's watching on TV can understand your comment I will and if you'd like to take the microphone and identify yourself I will identify myself. My name is Stuart Nathan and I've been the only president since Hayden Lodge has been in existence and turned over by the developer to the actual owners of Hayden Lodge. Hayden Lodge is a 14 unit residence in base village. It also has in it the tree house, which is operated by the owner of that particular space, which is ski co. We've asked since January and filed emails with this council regarding our ability to participate in these 10 agreements. We've raised objections. We've been very specific about our objections. We've asked to participate because most of these agreements have great impact on those people who are owners of residential units within base village, i.e. Hayden Lodge and Capitol Peak. There has been a constant attempt to ignore us irrespective of the fact that we have tried to participate and many occasions have been here through various members and representatives stating our position that we need to participate and we have great objection to these 10 agreements. Now we find out after it was announced in the paper on Thursday or Friday, I think it was this past Friday, that there was a settlement of the lawsuit between sunrise and related and all of a sudden over the weekend, magically everything is done and now all the agreements are accepted and now the conditions are dropped and this is now final, this plan. I find that to be almost unbelievable, and where we've just been ignored, and where the people who are impacted and affected by all these one-sided agreements, where they're passing on more and more things to the residential owners and SKECO nor related have any responsibility they can just pass these things on and we've had no participation and it's no different than what Path Keeper said to you earlier. Taxation or charging without representation and not being able to participate in this. We are the people who are impacted by this. You should certainly recognize that and your counsel obviously has no problem with doing it the way he just stated it. Oh, well, we just approved them all and this unconditional will be recorded tomorrow. I find that just unbelievable under the circumstances given how we've attempted to participate since we're the people who are paying all these fees and expenses that are charged and where the clauses are being used by SkiCo and their enterprises without any charge and all kinds of things like that. I'm not going to go into all the details. We've sent you emails, we've sent you letters, and we've detailed all of our problems with this. We've yet to be able to participate, however, council in any of this. It's apparently it's between the town and the related and the people who are impacted get taxed or they have to pay for these expenses without any say-so in it. And I think that if you try to pull that with your people who are your citizens of this town there would be an uproar and an uprising. And I find it to be very repugnant the way this has been handled. And I'm really objecting, strenuously, to this thing becoming unconditional. We're in favor of base village moving forward. We're not objecting to base village moving forward. We're objecting to how it's moving forward. And who's getting impacted and who isn't? We think the expenses and these fees, just like in the metropolitan district where we're paying enormous amount of taxes. Excuse me, I apologize. I'm sorry. I didn't know how to do that. I really find this to be, well, the only, I think, comparison I can make is Russia, where things are done in a way that the people have no say. And the people who are impacted by this have been ignored, totally ignored. And we have to resort to something here and I find it to be very unfair. And I'm sorry that the mayor isn't here today because she has certainly said things to us where we were going to be at least addressed and have some participation in this process. But apparently that's not what council feels is, and I don't mean council's, your council, I'm talking about your attorney. I find this just reprehensible and I want to register my protest on behalf of not only the myself but the other owners of Hayden Lodge and the other owners of Capitol Peak. This is a disgusting result. result and How many times have you met with the people from Council from from the Hayden Lodge and Capital P have you ever met with any of them you were the staff to really find out what's going on Yes, when I Couldn't give you the exact I've had regular conferences with Pat Smith. I was about to say Pat Smith and that would be a real football. Pat Keifer and Bruce Smith. Oh, probably was a Freudian slip on your part. Well, Pat Smith was a predecessor to the developers and Bruce Smith and Pat Caffer. And as a result of what they brought up, did you pay any attention or did you make any modifications that might have dealt with? Yes we did. Yes we did. Yes. Well we'd like to know what they are. And just to back up for just a perspective. And I think Mr. Dresser hit it, but I want to reiterate the point. Throughout 15, 2015, we had nearly 12 months of public hearings on this. On base village I'm talking about, on the PUD. There were lots and lots and lots of opportunities to comment on every aspect of the PUD. and lots and lots of opportunities to comment on every aspect of the PUD. On December 21st to 2015, when the council had its final vote to either approve or not approve that PUD, the vote was to approve on that night. All that's happened since then was to actually bring the documentation for lack of a legal term. I'm going to use the word contract, whatever you want, but to bring the documentation into compliance with that approval of December 1, 21, 2015. Every comment that was provided before that, the council agreed to, that said, make sure this is incorporated into, all throughout that approval process are in these. So to think that there was something afterwards, I think, is there's some misunderstanding of what had happened after December 21st 2015. Well, have the 10 agreements ever been made public? The drafts? Yeah, on December 21st, 2015, all those agreements are there. You can go back and you can see everything that was in there. And you will see That substantially yeah, there's some tweaks between some words and whatnot, but substantially the agreements are largely the same Largely the same so live when we first got our look at those agreements and we made our comments You're saying that yes, you made your comments, but we are ignoring them because those 10 agreements are basically the same as they were when the ordinance was passed. Is that what you're talking about? And so normally I can tell you, I really don't like to get an argument in these meetings. So I'm trying to do this as an informational process, so I'm not trying to argue with you. I just want to make sure that I'm inserting the facts into this discussion. So please don't see me as being argumentative. But what I'm trying to explain to you is the approval on the 21st of December laid out everything. I'm sure you've read the ordinance. It's, you know, it's extensive in the detail that was provided. In that ordinance, it mandated or directed staff to finalize the documentation on a number of agreements. Mr. Dressard, list of those agreements that we went through. It went through everything from housing agreements to the PUD guide to all the detail that needed to be finalized. That was all submitted by the developer, by March 21st, and then over the last several months, we've worked through those that finalization. Mr. Drescher pointed out the one issue that we could not get to any final determination on was the building six agreement because of the lawsuit. After that lawsuit was settled, it was easy to bring, it was easier to bring that agreement into compliance. And that's, and once that determination was made and it was not a Mr. Dresser, it was on my behalf. I mean, the ordinance mandated or gave me the authority to make that determination. He and I of course worked together on that. But once I said, yep, this is, this is as the council approved it. Then we were able to execute. I appreciate what you're saying with respect to the issue that you had with respect to that parcel and what was going to happen. But we had greater issues from our perspective then just that issue. We tried to tell you what our positions were and what we thought was wrong and what we thought should be done and how it should be done, but we never saw what was. You need to remember, that approval happened on December 21st. That was an approval, but then the agreements were to be submitted by the developer. But all the agreements were as part, and I don't mean again, I'm not trying to be argumentative. You yourself said that the agreements were submitted in March. They were finalized, but the drafts were all there on the 21st. And I mean, what I would encourage you. There's no point in you're addressing it any further, because the result is as I've stated. Okay? You have not paid any attention to the people who are most impacted by it. You've just gone ahead and done what you wanted. And I'll respectfully disagree. No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no the residents of base village who you won't even let vote because that's in your original when ski co was a part of this that we would have no vote on anything. And I find that to be very repugnant. But you must be satisfied with it. I hope you are. Thank you. I can say that the agreements are in compliance with the ordinance that was passed after a year's of public hearings. Okay. Pat. By the way, just as a point of information, this isn't a public hearing on this. But if you have some things you'd like to say, please go ahead. I appreciate that, Bob. Because I've been coming to most of the public meetings that were held last year and did meet with John Dresser, headkey for base village for the record. Did meet with John Dresser on many of the points prior to December 1st, as well as post December 1st that concerned us. I really have to sit down because I'm enormously disappointed at the outcome enormously disappointed at the outcome of the decision of the town of Snowmass Village to sign the 10 agreements. If you look back to when base village got started, as I understand it, 55 people approved base village, which was roughly 3% of the voting population at the time. That means that 97% didn't vote for it. I look at what we've got in place today and I wonder how many of those people know that you're going to have the equivalent of 10 and 12 story buildings at the front of the base village. Excuse me for interrupting you, but I think that your number of people who approved the base village back in 2004 or 5 is off. I'm quoting. It was way more than 3% of the population. I'm quoting Mike Kaplan from SkiCo at a presentation that he did in August. I think Pat, well, Bob's trying to tell you is it was a 55% vote for 45% against. Yes. And you said there were 55 people that voted. It was a much larger number. I may be an error. And I think that's what Bob's trying to go from percentages. I'm trying to keep it in perspective. Thank you then. I misheard Mr. Calford when he spoke. But I really do wonder whether the people of snowmast village understand that when you have 125 foot building at the front of base village and a 95 foot building and if you take 10 feet per story, that's a 10 and 12 story building at the front of base village. I look at the agreements that are in place and based on the calculations that we've made, that will be a 40% increase in taxes and fees on the owners in base village. I wonder if Council understands because these agreements were not reviewed in open public forum. These 10 agreements were drafted and put on the website. And my analysis of the shows things like we're going to lose $580,000 a year, over a half a million dollars a year, is a result of requiring the vice-war properties to be categorized as a hotel. Because base village company, master association and its infinite wisdom just changed that from residential to commercial, which drops their assessment rate by 75%. That costs the base village company $580,000. I mean, it's a simple calculation. But that's not a council. That's not within the council's ability to control. What isn't within the council's ability to control, and what is in the fine print of these 10 agreements is the ability of the developer who sat right there and said, the developer will pay this, the developer will pay that. And then when you get to the fine details of those 10 agreements, the developer has the ability to shift those costs to the Base Village Company Master Association and to the Base Village Metro Tax District, which the predominance of those fees and taxes are not paid by the developer. They're paid by the residential owners. 80 and 94% as I've passed along to you in the primer of taxes on base village. And these are the things that because these agreements were not discussed by council, and were not discussed in a public forum. We did not have the opportunity to weigh in on the details of those agreements and we will suffer accordingly. I'm sorry that you feel that you didn't have the ability to weigh in. The drafts, the drafts of those agreements were in the agenda and the packet for December 21 and probably before. And they could have been brought up at those meetings. And if there were fine print, as you say, they could have been brought up at that meeting but is best to my knowledge and is best to our knowledge sitting here, it didn't happen. It was only brought up after the fact. While those 10 agreements were still under negotiation and I believe that was the word that was used and I went through line item by line item and provided council and staff with the areas that we had concerns about. I mean, one of the things that we talked about was Andrew Dant sitting right here and saying, we will get with the people at Capitol Peak in Hayden with respect to an aquacenter or access to a swimming pool. The mayor said that will be covered in the pool agreement. Well, there is the pool agreement. Well, there is no pool agreement. But there is, it does require that there be access to building 10 AB when the pool is there and that is in there. And that was what was discussed. I recognize, and again, I don't want to be argumentative. I just want to put the fact in that there was a request to be on 7 AB. There was some discussion regarding it, but the final direction was to have that access to be on 10AB. The developer committed right here at that table to get with Capitol Peak and Hayden on that subject. He did not. Related does not represent us. I understand that they have made several commitments. It's like the Ice Age Discover Center, which I believe is a fabulous idea. But the question I have for y'all is, who is paying for that? Who is losing the tax revenue out of base village? Why is it that base village is going to be responsible for the camps for building six now? I understand that you made the effort to exempt the owners of base village phase one, which is Hayden, Capitol Peak and vice-right assay Hill, from those camps fees for the 14 years the developer gave them to you. But you didn't exempt the phase two owners So what am I gonna say when I meet a phase two owner and they're talking to me about the enormous fees that they have to pay because the developer passed on the cams to legitimately passed on the cams through these 10 agreements to them What do 10 agreements to them. What do we say to them? Hence that the postcards that I gave you, taxation without representation, move it to taxation with representation. As Stuart said, we're happy to go forward with base village. You received our ballot with these six propositions with solutions on them on how to go forward with base village. But what just happened in this room is these agreements permit the developer as I stated in the proposition and I don't know how many people mailed these into you. But I gather it was several. It permits them to shift cost to base village who currently have a tax mill rate of 93.747. Plus our base village HOA fees equivalent to 53.538 mill for a two bedroom unit. Plus the 40% increase that's coming for base village phase two. That would total a mill rate of 187.285 mills. And how does this compare to what you all pay as regular? Count of snowmage village owners. That would be 44.247. Pat, that's not a fair comparison. If you include your assessments, you're comparing it to the base tax rate and the assessments for many other properties, not within the base village, you don't know what those are, and you're not including those in your comparison. I'm not including capital P K to weigh assessments. I'm not including capital PKH away assessments. I'm only including developer, afflicted, base village company, master association, fees, so that when we snow melt the plaza for the use of all skiers, so that we provide free parking for everyone who attends Thursday night concerts in the summer. Those are all base village fees that are generally available to the public that are solely funded by base village owners and that's all I included John. Okay, but those agreements that were made in 2004 roughly and did not change with this most recent approval in December 21st. And what I'm sharing is that that isn't what I'm talking about in terms of the 40% increase in taxes and fees that we see coming with base village phase two because you're doubling the plazas, right? You're adding more snow melt, but the property owners are only going up by 60%. So you've got a 40% gap to start with. And then we've exchanged these emails back and forth. And my math, they're security with your math somewhat, and that with the limelight coming in, and that was a major change from the O4 approval to the 15 approval. That goes to a commercial, going to commercial property tax. That tax rate is almost four times the tax rate. So the GID and the Metro district, which collects property taxes, will be collecting four times the property tax assessment on that specific property than they would if it had remained residential. If and only if the assessment of that property is of a manner that it actually increases it because I know in in Hayden, in Stewart's building, and their two components, just two hurts building. The residential properties and ski coves tree house. Ski coves tree house, even with the four times tax property rate, the property value is assessed so low that the residential property owners still pay more taxes. It's right there in the PIC in County tax database. So you can understand our frustration and while we speak off the top of our head, the facts that we've accumulated over time are pretty substantial. I can show you the math on how we're going to lose $580,000 because of the maneuverings of SkiCo and related with respect to the limelight. Well, the unintended consequence is the vice-roy goes commercial as well and that's how we lose the money. We fought that. Stewart in particular led the effort to keep limelight as it was described to the town council as a residential property. Everything, everything in the PUD, refers to building five as a residential property. If it had stayed a residential property, wouldn't be having this discussion in terms of losing $580,000 a year out of the BVCO budget. If we have fixed cost and it drops the revenue and the income like that, what are we going to do? Well, base village company has an unlimited ability to assign fees to us, unlimited. This is the situation that we're sitting at now. So I look at this and I remain stunned, and I'm not sure what action will take after this. But having spent pretty much a year and pretty much on a first name basis with all of you and it's generally a pleasure to see you around town. I appreciate the effort that you all have put into this. But if I've said it once, I've sent it, said it more than a dozen times. In person, in email, with the support of all of the owners. The town of Snowmass Village has not treated as a result of today's revelations, part time, property owners well at all. I remain enormously, enormously disappointed at the actions and the results that it will have on our community as a whole and base village and in particular. Do you have any questions for me? Yeah, I just supplement my comments from before. First, I am sorry. I apologize that I was upset when we heard your attorney tell us that tomorrow it's being recorded. Thank you for the notice. You know, you faced, you'd not, this composition of council, but prior council faced where they had made a mistake and shouldn't have allowed a transfer from one developer to another without at least some consent to this body being able to approve who the new developer is. You are now putting yourself in the same position related as announced for all intents and purposes that it's selling out and there's going to be a new developer. But yet you have no control over what the terms of that or what happens or what you may impose to make sure that they assume obligations with entities that have liability, have real assets. You have no control over that. You let it go again because I guess you don't have any concern about that. Whoever wants to be the new developer can come in and take over from related. And, you know, I don't know how you, if you're so concerned about this development, have no real tools or any kind of, be able to stop if it's not satisfactory or the person is not somebody who you feel is a reputable person. Now, you can sit here and hope that it's somebody good, but you don't have any assurances and you have no tools in your tool bag to stop it. Any more than you had any tools or your predecessors, in office had any tools to stop, because there were no legal provisions in the agreements that gave you any of those abilities. And I would have thought that maybe having, sting me once, your fault, sting me twice my fault. I'm using better language than the normal saying. But I guess that wasn't important to you, Council, was it? To have a provision that you would have some ability to control that? Also, I mean, you let related say that, okay, we'll exempt and we'll pay these fees for the 14 years. But they have it within an entity that has no real financial capability. They could just walk away if you don't insist that somebody who comes in to take over related position in this deal doesn't assume it and related lets their entity, whatever it is, go, they take all the money out after they sell and then they're on the hook and it's a naked corporation with no assets because they've taken all the assets out. Who's going to get stuck if they don't put up the money when they were supposed to be exempt? Who's going to pay for that? If you put that in any agreement, anywhere council? I don't think so. So we have great reason to be concerned and we have great reason to be upset, particularly when there's just two of us here today to hear the announcement that, oh, it's all going to be upset, particularly when there's just two of us here today to hear the announcement that, oh, it's all going to be fine. Tomorrow it's all being recorded. That's what got us upset. I think this has not been handled in a way that is very fair to people who are really active supporters of this community, and particularly for people who live in base village, who are full-time residents there, they're not considered voting residents by of this community, but yet they're paying way more than their share under the circumstances. I think it's a disgrace. I really do. And I think it wasn't handled in a way that I think is equitable there. And who do we have to turn to in this situation other than the council and the members of the council to try to assist us in some of the inequities that have gone on here. And I guess I heard the response. Well, we don't have any responsibility for that. There's some of that stuff was in an old agreement. Well, the old agreement can be addressed in this was being asked for for an amendment. And there are certain things that you, as elected officials, could have put forth and say, look, you want this amendment, you want this new plan to go in effect, you're going to need to correct some of these inequities. You're the people that had the teeth and the voice to force them to do that. But apparently there wasn't an appetite nor a decision to do that because you didn't feel you needed to do that for the people who hold. I mean, you know what? I'm sorry. I kind of resent this because we had, please sir, I want to address this. Okay. The fact is I was on planning and commission before I became council. And none of this came about during the planning, during the sketch plan, during the preliminary plan, and during the final plan. Now all of a sudden we're getting bombarded with emails and I appreciate your concern and I not only appreciate it and I feel for your concern. And now if you have full-time owners over there, why can't they vote? Why are they not registered to vote? They're not permitted by the 2004 document that is in place. They're not allowed. No, if they're a full-time resident, there's no reason in the world why they cannot vote. That says they're not vote. They cannot vote. Well, they just cannot use parking lots. Well, I'm not finished yet. And we've let me finish, please, because you had you had your stand. Give me a second. And you know, again, I resent being yelled at like this. This is. I apologize. I apologize. Believe me. I believe we have all spent hours and hours getting ordinance number nine together for this village in this community. We wanted to move forward maybe more than you do, maybe so. But in the same token, when you bought into that place in 2004, it was always a buyer's beware type situation. I don't know what your agreements were. I didn't see the contracts. I didn't see them, and I was not on council. But if I was on council, none of those contracts would have been none of my business because that's between the developer or who sold them to you. Now I didn't have, or we didn't have, privy to those type of contracts in regards to what your taxes were going to do and what they're going to do if the rest of the village gets built out. Now, meanwhile, the world fell apart and everything went off the edge of the world. And everything went dormant for a long time. And we all know that and this community wants this to happen. And I know that for fact, this community wants that those green plywood boards to go away and be done with this. And I believe you do too. Okay. I really believe we don't have any control. I'm not aware of any control that we have in regards to the annexation of the vice-right turning into residential and the taxes going down and so on and so on. And every, Pat, every one of your emails, and we listen to you, I listen to you, and I read your emails. And I feel for everything and every one of the homeowners. I just, I kind of take, I just feel offended by how you're bombarding this council with all the hard work that we did to get this ordinance nine moving and to get this community to another platform and to another level. We are really trying hard, very hard. And I don't think it's fair for you to yell at our counselor and in regards to what's happening. That's just how I feel. So. Well, all right. Well, we're expressing that we feel we've been stiff ironed by him. Well, I do, but I just can't sit here anymore and take this at him. No, I'm not saying you. I'm saying we feel we were stiff armed by him. OK, and I apologize. We obviously, we were sitting here intending to find out what was going to happen and what was going to go on in terms of the ultimate process for these 10 agreements. And we got the proud announcement by the proud bearer of the news. And so it was, I'm just telling you that it didn't get us hard. And I'm sorry that the, and I don't mean to offend you. And I said that some of the stuff was done, most of it was done by your predecessors, okay, not by you. And certainly, as I I recall because I was here Back when the approval was going forward and the vote was being taken and how ski co-gotta a lot of their temporary employees To become voters for that and how that all occurred and you know that as well as I do so the and even then the vote passed with those people being added Now how how can we move forward? Well, and yeah, well, the real question is you're moving forward. We're now moving backward. Okay, I'm going to put a stop to this discussion. No, no, no, it's all right. I think you've both had an opportunity to say what you needed to say, get some things off your chest. This is not a public hearing, so I allowed you to speak and I think everybody has had a chance to say what they need to say. So personally, I'm sorry that it didn't work out the way you had hoped it would work out. And we are going to go on and listen. Well, I just wanted to say just like two things, even though I said I'm not going to say anything. I just want to first of all think that. I mean, I know how much time and effort you've put into this and week after week and coming to the meetings. And I think everybody knows that, you know, the decisions we had to make in December, it was very conflicting. I lost a lot of sleep and truthfully, after we made the decision, I cried because I was so emotionally exhausted. And we are doing the best we can do. I think we all want this village to be the best that it can be. And I think that you have to realize that you've had some victories. I mean, you know, you with your parking in the garage and in various things. And I mean, it's not all for waste. I mean, I know some of these things aren't how you want them to be, but it can't all be perfect. It's not necessarily how we want it to be either. I just, I really wanted to say that, and I do appreciate it, and I do, I mean, it's conflicting, and it's really hard to deal with, but I think that we did it because we felt like this is what we needed to do to get to the next level. Thank you, Lewis. And I appreciate your compliment. You have to understand that before I came to town council, I did go to the part-time residence advisory board. And I did go to the planning commission. Good to go to the planning commission. The first time I attempted to speak in public comment, I was told that there was not time to do that. I went to the town clerk and asked for her advice in council. And she said, just go for it. So I did, but it was not a warm reception. So I didn't go back to planning commission with that reception. And what I appreciate is the gracious hospitality of town council in allowing us to speak. I remain concerned that part-time residentsmass Village has delegated the authority to the developer to tax the property owners within the community and with that I'll be quiet. Thank you for being so gracious. Thank you both. I apologize again. I don't mean to offend anybody. Councilor. Thank you very much. Okay. Next up, administrative reports. So, oh, I'm sorry, town council reports. Yeah. I'll start with you, Alyssa. So I had the privilege of going to the Rath to Board meeting for Markey. OK. Love those Rath to Board meetings. There was two things that I was going to say from the Rath to Board meeting. One is, I'm sure we'll be getting noticed about this, but in October, I don't know the date. But they will be closing the A Street bridge for 10 days as a mini closure An anticipation of the big closure that's gonna be the 90 day closure Next all guest I think so That's gonna be happening and then they I sent an email to Markey and I also sent an email to Dave Peckler but they are, they've been undertaking this, what is it, report for the integrated transportation system and they paid a very high compliment to Dave Peckler and his staff because they were given these different zones and they had to they were given these different zones and they had to collect information from the different zones and they said that Dave Peckler and his staff were absolutely fantastic and they couldn't believe how fast they got the information and how well they worked with them and they didn't say about the other communities they said it about ours. So I told Dave and he also said that Anne, Martin was instrumental in that as well. So I thought that was a really nice compliment for our village. And that was what happened at RAPDA. Was there any discussion about the cell phone locator project that's, you know, part of this half a million dollars that EOTC is covering, yeah, the entryway study? Well, so this is what I asked you about, remember? So I was confused because, you know, these people, the one that gave us the feedback on Dave Peckler and said how great they weren't getting information. I was like, why are they doing this study and when the town of Aspen or EOTC is also funding this thing and Clint can answer better, but it's all part of the same study. It's just their specific parts that Raffta is examining and C.Dott and all that stuff and it's all part of the same thing. Same thing. Right. Client, did I explain that right? Yes. Basically the entry to ask when is a specific component of the broader RAPTA analysis. And is that analysis actually happening now? We started that time frame where they're tracking people. Is that, I'm not the technical guy, but what I understand is they're always collecting that data. And then once it's collected, we'll extract whatever date we want to extract. I see. It's being collected. Yeah, they said that they're, they're look, there's, yeah. But the next step they said is small group meetings and public official meetings and They are looking at Light rail from intercept into town as a replacement of the BRT Intercept into Aspen. So, and they said, they said traffic is through the roof this year in the mountains, and that it's up 7% at the tunnels this year. Even though they've tried things like busting and stuff to sort of curb that traffic, it is up 7% this year alone. So yeah, that's what, I mean there was more stuff. Okay. Mr. MZBZ gave a presentation on transit TV, but those were some of the bigger things. Good. Yeah. Thank you. Bill. I had a conversation with one of the merchants on the mall who suggested we look at possibly striping some of the numbered lots to improve parking efficiency. I brought it up with Dave Peckler, and he seemed to think that it would only have effect in the summer. The winter it's covered with snow. And he was somewhat skeptical if we could increase parking by even 10% if we did it. But he did say if it's something that we wanted to pursue, we could experiment with it, maybe in lots, seven and eight, or somewhere on the number of lots, just to see if we do gain some efficiencies. Yeah, I heard this weekend that trying to park in the number of lots was really difficult. I mean, the town was bustin' at the seams, I think. And I heard stories of people looking taking a half hour to look for a parking space going up and down the number of lots, especially Saturday night. Yeah, it's a good problem to have. Well, yeah, it's a good problem to have. It was, yeah, it was busy. If striping, the lots would reduce that problem somewhat, and maybe there's a benefit. Yeah, I mean, it was a busy weekend. I mean, I can't remember a balloon festive that was so busy. I mean, the rodeo lot and all the overflow was packed. So it was very popular. I mean, and I was at the wine and the food and wine, and boy, at one 30, that place opened, and there were tons of people there, right at the bell. And I don't remember it being as busy as crowded in previous years as it was this year. It wasn't just in snowmass either. I got several pick and alerts about the bells being overcrowded. Yeah, the bells were over there, etc. And Roger was going on in town, so it was pretty much the whole valley. There was a lot of stuff happening. Upper valley. Mm-hmm. Yeah, it was a busy weekend. Anything else? That's it. I had a Rwappa meeting last week and the primary subject was the aquatic nuisance species inspection program which wrapped up right after the But there is more additional shortage of funding as some of the federal agencies have determined or told us that they can no longer support it. And Mark Fuller put together kind of an outline which I sent to everybody I believe today of the problem and the need for at least the request for next year to move this into a seven day a week inspection program and the cost to do that. Mark is interested in willing to come to one of our meetings and discuss with us the program and the cost and the cost and funding and so forth. And I just would like to know from all of you if you think that would be worthwhile, if it would be valuable, if you have particular questions about either the program or the funding. And if so, we can try to get them on one of our agendas. You know, I've read your email, Bob, and I guess my first concern is how many, you know, this is concerning the boats that come in out of Rudeye and would go into Lake Powell and do vice versa things or rifle gap or wherever, you know, anybody could put a boat in. How many boaters do we have in snowmess? I think you hit the real, I mean the real key question is how much does this affect snowmess village? Where, you know, we're not around the corner from Rood Irozwar, I get it. And I don't really know the answer. I do think that it relates to our tourist industry, even though... In a sense, on your email, there were certain amounts that possibly communities, municipalities, can each go forward with. possibly communities and municipalities can each go forward with. And it was basically about $5,000. And- Which I think is what was in the budget for this year if I- 2,500 is what you guys added for the 2016 budget and we actually kept that in for the proposed budget for 2017. Yeah. Anyway, I don't want to rule it out because I don't have the answer to, there might be 35, 38 boats sitting in somebody's garage that I'm going to offend. I don't know. But the bigger issue, I think, is the muscles getting into the hydro plant at the dam, right? That's right. I mean, that's more of a problem. Well, that and infecting the frying pan from the fishery perspective. Yes. Yeah. So I think it's bigger than just the boats. I don't know how many people have boats in snowmast, but I don't know how many people the inspections actually caught if it's. Yeah, you know, I had hoped that Mark would have had the statistics from this season, but he didn't have them at the meeting and he didn't have them in this. So perhaps if we invite him to come to talk to us, we can bring that with him. Yeah, I think it would be good to know how effective are the inspections. Is this a big problem? I mean, obviously having like an introduction of invasive species is going to be an issue. Yeah, I mean, the problem is that once you get it, once you get these things, they're so hard to get rid of. Right. So it's such, it's really a preventative program and I think it's difficult to determine its success unless you say, well as long as there aren't any muscles that were successful. And also to the best of my knowledge, these muscles are not in any, I believe they're not in any of the waterways in Colorado. So we've got Kansas and Nebraska on one side, we've got Utah on the other side, and both of those states have infections. These muscle infections or infestations. So with the portability of boats and people moving from place to place, where the middle of the sandwich. And I sense the feeling is that it will only be a matter of time if we don't have these kinds of inspections. I'd have no problem with having come in and explaining a little more of it. I mean, because it sounds like it's on the budgeted and- Flint, what might look like a time when we can add, you know, a half hour to our agenda? You know, our agenda? I was just wondering that I didn't pull up the agenda, but the fourth I believe is the night we're introducing the agenda to have a cheat sheet You got the poster adoption and budgeting production The night being introduced the budget would make some sense to me Okay, the poster adoption. I don't know how long that'll be. You've seen it a lot. I don't expect that to be a long discussion. Budget would be probably an hour. And the MOU, depending on where we are, if that could be. You know, just guessing an hour maybe. So that meeting on the fourth? The fourth of the tenth would seem to make sense. Why don't I email Mark tonight? For the 17th, the agenda is just adopting the budget. Yeah, ideally it'd be great to get input from you guys. In the fourth. I mean, if he could be on the fourth and you guys could tell us in the 10th, hey, that makes sense. Go ahead and put it in. Or, you know, it's beyond increase the funding right and then we could have it ready to go for the in the direction you guys give us for the 17 say I need to get a postcard. I wonder if you screamed better. Okay. I'll ask him if he can come in on the... Yeah, really. Here you are. Careful, no, you're on PV. It's just kid. I'll ask him if he can come in on the fourth and as a secondary the tenth. We'll see what we can get him in. Thank you. Update on core. We had a joint meeting September 7th with GCE, which is a Garfield Clean Energy Council and clear itself. And basically, topic is everybody wants, I think everybody wants basically a part of core nail. Because core seems to be one of the only organizations out of the three of them and have money. But when it comes to long term and big items, they like to put something together for all three organizations to be on the same page, especially when it comes to energy efficiency for affordable housing. And the boards, we probably had about 21 people, consisting of all three boards there, will consolidate down to maybe three people from core and three and three. Garfield County obviously has the land for a lot of these solar farms to be at, possibly, and Garfield County doesn't have the money. So they want to make it clear that clear and poor know that the land is available through them. But their funding is very low. Just as it is an unincorporated Garfield County getting for monies from Raffer and stuff like that, they're not getting much response from those parts of Garfield County. And how far does CORE want to go with their program? And they want to basically stop at the tee at this point, but they are going more. I mean, is Garfield County suggesting that they would contribute the land, but they don't have any money? Well, they haven't. No, they want to be paid for the land. They haven't committed to that yet, but they're just saying there is land available at this point that more solar farms are in the making for the type of efficiency that they're looking for. For instance, some of their goals, not necessarily, but their emission reductions, asmons are already 30% below 2004. Picking counties is 20% assault is in progress of adopting their goals. Tennis Thumbass is 20% below the goal of 2009. And so there's a lot more happening in this end to the Ruyin-Fork Valley as far as rebates. When you say they're below, you mean we've exceeded our goal? Yes. Oh, good. Right. Okay. So, you know, the 2009 goal. The 2009 goal. I said I didn't heard. Oh good. Right. Okay. So you know, the 2009 go to 2009. I didn't heard that. So that was still you. I see you've got core on the schedule for after election day. But I still want to get more in here at some point. And if that list you guys just tell me where you want to keep that right in list. And you guys. Okay. When you want to, we keep that running list and you guys, tell me when you want to get them scheduled and we'll work with them soon. But basically, the GCE people, they came up with, they threw it at us before the meeting, not before the meeting of 15 page wish list. And we got together. We had quite an intensive meeting. We had an hour and a half lunch meeting before we got to meet with them two Fridays ago, and we basically said we can't take any action on this yet. We haven't even had a chance to talk about it as a board yet. But anyway, everybody has the same goal in mind when it comes to some of the big items. There's no reason why all three boards shouldn't work together. And when you say goals, those are specific. Energy efficiency goals. So snowmasses 20% below where we had targeted, we would- Targeted below 2009. Okay. In addition to that, we're getting x number of percentage of our energy from renewables. Is that included in that goal? Or that's... That's why I need to have Mona explain that a little bit more because this was just handed to me the day of the meeting and not necessarily explained in regards to where the efficiency is. We had an update, 10 of these scheduled with them. November 21st to hopefully give us kind of a little, where those numbers were at. Travis just told me that they might need to push that date back because they might not be completely finished with their analysis by that date. But really what it is, we work with them, they help us figure out where we are achieving those goals and help us figure out some strategies from there. But that date was a rough number we threw out there. We're hoping it was going to stick. The whole work with them to get an update with Moan and the rest of the organization. It's a very interesting board. I mean, we during the board meeting, you know, we were in a Carpendale. There's a third street center or something like that. You know, one big room and it was really getting warm in there and Odden got up to try to adjust the thermostat and he couldn't. And then, 20, 35 minutes later, somebody else got up to adjust the thermostat. And I raised my hand and said to me, I asked a question. I said, who remembers the VCRs with the blinking 12 o'clock on? Yeah, I'm going to get a kick out of it. So it's a lot like those setback thermostats. Everybody sees them, but doesn't know how to work them. So let's keep it simple. Let's just concentrate on the simple stuff first. And then we'll work on some of the bigger things. Yeah. Yeah. Well, thanks Tom. All right. If that's what we've got, then I'll take a motion to adjourn. I'll motion to adjourn. Second. Second. All in favor? Aye. Aye. And we are adjourned until Next week No, not next week till October next month October 4th. Yes. Thank you. Thank you all That's a Tuesday That's right. It's the day after labor of the election No, I think it's a day after a high holiday. I know you keep forgetting this. I do, I keep forgetting it. I'm going to go to the next room. I'm going to go to the next room. I'm going to go to the next room. I'm going to go to the next room. I'm going to go to the next room. I'm going to go to the next room. I'm going to go to the next room. I'm going to go to the next room. I'm going to go to the next room. I'm going to go to the next room. I'm going to go to the bathroom. I'm going to go to the bathroom. I'm going to go to the bathroom. I'm going to go to the bathroom. I'm going to go to the bathroom. I'm going to go to the bathroom. I'm going to go to the bathroom. I'm going to go to the bathroom. I'm going to go to the bathroom. I'm going to go to the bathroom. I'm going to go to the bathroom. I'm going to go to Thank you. I'm sorry. Thank you.