you Good morning, everyone. I got 9 o'clock, so I'll go ahead and get started. This is June 13th meeting of the 2023 value adjustment board. We'll go ahead and get started with introductions. How about Mr. Geter? You start Good morning. I'm William Geter. Vabb attorney Jonathan Griffith Vabb staff Peggy Sidman Council Secretary Vabb Clark There we go dominant coming school board appointed citizen member. Dr. Laurie Hershey, school board district 7. We'll lay in the city council district 3 in Vap chair. Charlotte Dashers, citizen member via city council. We also got our property appraiser, Ms. Morgan and her staff. Thank you for joining us this morning. First thing our goal is to finish around 950 or so so because myself and Councilman Johnson will be here soon we do get a 10 o'clock meeting. The first order of business is the approval of the May 16th, 2024 VAB meeting minutes. Can I get a motion for approval? I'll make a motion for approval. All in favor we'll do this by voice all in favor of approving the minutes. Please say aye. Aye. I'll pose a nay. our actions, we have approved the minutes from the May 16th meeting. Item number two, public comments. I do not see anyone here. I do know Mr. Geter there was a letter you received that pertains to some of the previous deferred decisions that we're gonna take up on action item number five, but would you like to read that into the record now? This letter is from Julie M. Schwartz. She's an attorney with Renert Vogel Mandler and Rodriguez. She is the attorney for the petitioners on the original three VAB petitions that were deferred at the March 14 meeting. Her letters address to the Duval County Value Adjustment Board, re petition numbers, 2023-268-299 and dash 317. Dear value adjustment board members, we are writing with regard to the three reference petitions in which the special magistrates findings of facts state that the correct milligrate to use in the income approach to value is the 2023 milligrate. The property appraisal objected to this at the March 14 VAB meeting and adoption of these decisions has been deferred to today's meeting. After correspondence from the property appraiser in our office, the VAB attorney produced a memo on the issues with a recommended course of action for the VAB. Additionally, the VAB sought guidance from the DOR on this issue. And an advisory memorandum dated June 11, 2024, the DOR concluded that the special magistrates use of the 2023 final millage rate was consistent with professionally accepted appraisal practices and recommended that the VAB employ the 2023 millage rate to the aforementioned petitions. We agree with the DOR's conclusion and recommendation, and we believe that the decisions comply with the law. Thank you for your thoughtful consideration of this matter. As stated above, we respectfully request that you adopt a special magistrate's recommended decisions and the reference case is very truly truly yours Julie M Schwartz. Thank you Mr. Jeater. I see no other public comments so I'll move on to item number three which is deferral request from petitioners. As of the time the agenda was sent out we had none and I'll move on unless anybody has any additional information. Okay, thank you. I'm number four deferral request from the property prazer's office. We do have one number 2667. My understanding this is the same issue that we're going to discuss when we get to item number five, but you still wish to defer this. I know that there's some time needed for responses by both sides or did you want us to lump this into what we're going to take action on today. Okay, so got it. So we will move the item number one there, 2667. We will move to action item number five then and we'll take that up today. Okay, everybody good with that? Okay. All right, so now on to action item number five. So this has been the one that has been with us for quite a while. This is the one that the property praise our office used the 2022 milled rate. The special magistrate said 2023 milled rates what should be used. We did get an answer from Department of Revenue, late on, I believe it was Tuesday night, and I was going to read the conclusion, just so everyone is on the same page. I hope everyone had a chance to read that Department of Revenue Advisory, but their guidance is pretty clear, and I'm just going to read it for the record. Based on the specific facts in Duval County for the 2023 assessment year, we concluded that the special master rates used the 2023 millage rate is consistent with the results of applying the statutory standard of professionally accepted appraisal practices. I currently we recommend that the VAB find the use of the 2023 final millage rate in the disputed recommended decisions to being compliance with Florida law. So that's again this was the question we asked them and that is what they came back with. It less anyone wants to discuss further. I do have a motion that I'm going to ask for and that'll be the motion to essentially correct me if I'm wrong, Mr. Jeater. We are going to approve all of the previously deferred decisions on this matter, which is essentially ruling that the use of the 2023 military is what we found appropriate. Mr. Chair, that would be correct with the exception of two recommended decisions of those 12 in which the property appraiser has stated that there appears to be a mistake on the face of the recommended decisions. In one case, the property appraiser has said it appears the special magistrate may have considered one figure twice and that affected the value. And then on the other one, both parties agree that there appears to be perhaps a typo or perhaps some sort of an error. It's my recommendation that those two be sent to the special magistrate with the request from the property prasier and the response from the petitioner and that the special magistrate be asked to determine whether he made a mistake and if so to correct it and if not to explain why it's not a mistake. Thank you so should we not approve them at all today for the military portion at all? Should we exclude them? Have a go back to the special magistrate and then when it comes back. Because I thought we'd be able to approve the military portion while also remaining the backness of them. Do the chair. One suggestion because all 12 have a question of the 2023 military. So if the Bab Board were going to approve the 2023 milligrate, you could take the motions in three parts. The first part would be a motion to approve the 12 using the 2023 milligrate. That clears up that issue. Or the 2022, whatever you choose to do. The second motion would be to separate as Mr. Geter noted to take a motion to remain to the special magistrate, so they still have the finding of the 2023 millichrate with the on 2707 I think there's a agreed error to remain and then have the special magistrate send that back. And then on the second motion would be in regard to 2023, 25, 12. And there's not an agreed error, but to have the special magistrate review and then send that back. But if all 12 have to do with the 2023 millage rate, then maybe you take that first motion, visa V all 12, and then have the other two. And this will make a difference when we come subsequently to number six, where you approve deferred recommendations, which ones you're going to approve and not. So if you make those motions in those three orders, it might be helpful. Thank you, and that Ms. Pinkstuff. If you make those motions in those three orders, it might be helpful. Thank you. And that, Ms. Pinkstaff. Thank you. Through the chair, if we could, we have already conceded that whatever the DOR's recommendation would be is what we would follow as well. But we would like the opportunity, Ms. Morgan would like the opportunity to just make one comment with regard. That's okay. Absolutely. Thank you. Ms. Morgan is recognized. Thank you so much, Mr. Chair and to the VAB committee. Joyce Morgan, DuVoc County property appraiser 231 East for Seyth Street. So as previously mentioned, we did receive the ruling and as we talked about in our last meeting, we will adhere to the ruling from the Department of Revenue. However, we do want to go on record this morning to say that we still do not agree because we stand firmly behind our concern over fairness, equity, and consistency in the decision. The property appraisers office, as you know, is charged with ensuring equal treatment of each and every property owner. We cannot treat property owners differently by adjusting their taxable value using the newly adopted milligrate for those who file a petition. I always expect my team to be consistent in the application of the methodology used in the appraisal of similar and like properties. We stand by and believe the motto that's on our website, fair and accurate for all. Again, resolution of the milligrate issue is about the consistent application so that every property that is valued by my office and my staff is valued using the same methodology across the board. So, you know, again, we adhere to the ruling because we agreed with sending it to the Department of Revenue, but I just needed to state that for the record. Thank you. Thank you, Ms. Morgan. To the board, going back to what motion I would like to see, I think we should take up. It's actually all 13 because we'll include 2667 at the same time. It would be all 13 and then that way we take up. They all follow me. We do want to include 2667 correct property appraisers office. Okay. So it'll be the 13, it'll be the 12 plus the one from item number four which have to do the milled rate issue. We can take all those up to approve. Ms. Edmond. Through the chair. So in number five there was a deferral request from the property appraiser office for 2667 and they are not requesting that to be deferred at that time. At this time. That's correct. So I think we're saying the same thing. You are okay with us taking action today on the one listed in number four. Okay. Okay. All right. So I think we're saying the same thing. So we have 13 vad cases and I'll read them all out And the motion is going to be to accept the special magistrates calculation using the 2023 Millage rate as an acceptable appraisal practice for the following decisions case 268 299 317 Zero to I'm sorry 2512 2517 2519 2535 2597 I'm sorry, 251-2517-259-2535-2597-2603-2614-2707-2742 and 2667. Can I get a motion on that? Mr. Jeater. Mr. Chair, just a comment. I suggest that it's a bad precedent to bifurcate your acceptance of these recommended decisions. I hear the property appraiser loud and clear that they are not going to object to the millage rate issues on these two remaining petitions, 25, 12 and 27,07. You can do it however you want. And I mean, the way you propose to do it is, if it happens, it happens. But I think you should simply not accept 25, 12, and 2707 at this point. I think you should defer your acceptance of it, send it back to the special magistrate, and then rule on it in Toto when it comes back at the next meeting. Okay, thank you, Mr. Chair. I don't think I heard that the first time, but that's fine by me to do as well. We'll just do it. The next time it comes back to us, we're basically gonna remand them back today and we'll take up both issues, which would be the milled rate and then the two separate ones, each have a separate issue. Correct? Is that what you're recommending? Sure, well It will be a nine issue at that point, but yes, sir. Okay, so I'm going to reread the whole thing again and I'm going to, we are not going to do 2707 or 2512. So the motion will be to accept the special master's calculation using a 2023 milligrate as an acceptable apprais, 1, 9, 2, 5, 3, 5, 2, 5, 9, 7, 2, 6, 3, 2, 6, 1, 4, 2, 7, 4, 2, and 2, 6, 6, 7. Can I get that motion in a second? I'll make the motion. Okay. All those in favor of accepting the special matter is calculations of the 2023 military as an acceptable appraisal practice for the cases mentioned Please say aye. I all opposed say nay by our actions we have approved those previously deferred decisions Okay, so with that we're now going to take up the two cases that Mr. Geter just mentioned So the first one is on case 2707, and that is a motion to remain the recommended decision for 2023 2707 to the special magistrate to review for errors and to submit a revised recommended decision to the VAB for consideration. Can I get a motion on that? Okay. Second. All in favor, please say aye. Aye. All opposed say nay. By our actions, we have approved the remaining of that decision back to the special magistrate. The final one here is for case 2512. So the motion on this will be to remain the recommended decision for case 2512 to the special magistrate to review the evidence and determine if the tax calculation was accounted for twice. I get a motion to move. I'll make the motion. Second. We have a motion in second. All in favor of remanding case 2512 back to the special magistrate, please say aye. Aye. I'll oppose say nay. Okay, by our actions, we have approved have approved reminding that one back to the special master's rate as well. So I think we're cleaned up on item number five with the understanding that cases 2512 and 2707 have been remanded back. So we're now onto item six with this which is the action item and I believe we've had a few things change up here but I believe the motion will be for the approval of the special master rate recommend decisions with the exception of 2512 and 2707s. They are on the spreadsheet, correct. That's correct and it's just for the record is item seven. just for the record is item seven. Okay, I think I printed out the draftage and the... All right. Okay, so thank you, Mr. Dredge, and Mr. Cummings, for pointing that out. So the motion is to approve the special master rate recommend decisions with the exception of VAB case 2512 and 2707. Can I get a motion in a second? Okay. All those in favor of approving the special mastery recommend decisions with the exception of case 2512 and 2707, please say aye. Aye. I'll pose say nay. By our actions, we have approved the special mastery recommend decisions with the exception of the cases mentioned. Let me just look at the updated agenda. Okay, other business. So, one bring this up again. We've touched on this really going back to the September meeting, the organizational meeting at the time that was brought up. Did we want to look at advertising the VAB attorney position at the time we was brought up. Did we want to look at advertising the Vaboterny position at the time? We decided not to. There's been a lot in the news this year about single source contracts, direct contracting on the city council side. Councilman Johnson is still running a little late, but he could back me up on some of those conversations we've had. And just looking at some of the other counties, a lot of them advertise their Vavaternity every year. It ends up being the same person every year. We would certainly expect, Mr. Jeter, you would apply, if we were to advertise it. But the way with the process would work, if we decided to go on this route, and advertising the vavaternity position, which again, I have the job title procurement director. My day job, it's a good practice. We are RFP out a lot of things usually every three years usually go with the same person or the same service provider a lot of things But we just want to make sure we're getting the best value and the best product The way it would work is that the VAB chair and the VAB clerk would work to make sure that in accordance with Florida statues There's actually Florida statutes on the qualifications Experience levels what the minimum rate a number of other things are HR group would then advertise the job for a set amount and then the 2024 VAB board which some of us may be on us, some of us would not be on it, would look at all qualified candidates and potentially make a consideration based on that. So I'll open that up to discussion on if there's an appetite for that. Yes, Ms. Hershey. I'm just going to say that the school board also has had conversations about the need to consistently go out and bid and see who might be interested and what other options might be available. So I would support that idea. Mr. Cummings or Ms. Dasher? Any input on whether to support or not? If not, I could just ask for a motion and we can take a vote on if we want to choose the route of advertising the job because again it's not a vab chair decision. So could I get a motion on the advertising of the vab chair for the 2024 vab moved. Can I get a second? Am I allowed to second it, Ms. Edmund? I'll second it. So all in favor of advertising the VAB attorney job for the 2024 VAB year, please say aye. Aye. All opposed? So we have a 22 vote with Mr. Johnson, not in attendance. How, what does 2 2 vote mean? So a 2 2 vote is not a majority so it doesn't pass. You may want to take it up again next time, but that's for your consideration. Okay. Well, thanks for your consideration. And again, I'm always going to push for that in any function I'm a part of, just because I believe it's good practice in any industry. Yes, Mr. Gere. Mr. Chair, I'll point out a couple of things. One, under the law, you cannot meet unless you have an attorney at the meeting. So if you do advertise for a new attorney and go through this process, please be sure that you're ready to hire the attorney at the time of your organizational meeting because by law, that has to be your first agenda item because you simply cannot, you're not legally allowed to meet. law specifically attorney hiring by commissions are excluded from the legal requirement that you advertise. You are allowed to hire an attorney just without going through that process. If it's something you choose to do because you think it's prudent and what you want to do, then of course that's within your discretion. But don't get caught without an attorney. And my contract expires on September 30th with this board. And so if you engage somebody for the 2024 board, make sure you've gotten that done and are ready to roll with your organizational meeting. Thank you, Mr. Jeater. Anything else, board have anything else? Anybody else have any other business? Do you wanna point out that the next meeting is going to be on a Wednesday, Wednesday, July 24th, and that should be, I believe, our last VAB meeting of the year for the 2023 VAB Board. Okay. All right. Anything else from anybody? If not, we are adjourned.