Good evening. Good evening. I'd like to call to order the Ashland Public Arts Commission for a meeting for tonight, November 14th. I'd like to open the meeting with citizen input. If there are any members of the public present that would like to provide public input on any matters related to public art, whether they are on the agenda or not, please come forward now. Begin by stating your name and address for the record. I live over there. At 106 B South Railroad Avenue. Can you repeat your name for me? Joseph Murphy or a JP Murphy. Thank you. It causes a lot of trouble. We were having a discussion the other day, Arthur, and I about band books as public art. Little free libraries establishing like little free libraries strictly for band books. I'm trying to come up with clever names for it like free band aids or things like that. But it was just an idea that we were to discuss it because it's way in a way it's like combining two art forms. And apparently band books are a big issue here. I know that we think in Incas, one of those band book, we think in Incas, one of those band book libraries. It was a project for a Girl Scout, apparently. Okay, very good. See some of them here. I think my friend Lauren Elmont told me that a friend of hers, some Hanover Democrats, was actually put together one. I contacted them. I sent them a message a couple of days ago. I haven't heard anything back from them. But I said this thing, and I did that just we were discussing, I'm thinking, okay, I'm here to just have any merit. It's the whole thing. The idea of just a little mini library for books that people don't, you say you shouldn't be reading. So, and really that's about it. Does anyone have any questions from Mr. Murphy? Come on, I'll make a comment in that you know the the public public Pomoky Regional Library system is Crossed several counties and I have heard at least one In a Verkandy border of supervisors member talk essentially about dismantling the system. And so I think it's interesting that, Ashland is in a position to be able to do something that the county can't have any control of. So I think that's certainly something to consider. Thank you. Thank you for sharing that with us. Martha? Ms. Miller? We have a number of, I'm sorry, is there any other member of the public who would like to make a statement or comment? We'll move on to the discussion items. We have several on our agenda, the master plan, and a community engagement draft questionnaire. So I'll throw this to Ms. Miller. Sure, thank you, Ms. Bax. So I shared with all of you via the agenda some examples of some public art master plans. There are more than you could possibly ever fathom reading through. So I selected these for us to kind of look at, but you know, with the encouragement at our last meeting, that if there are others out there that you find particularly speak to you or you found to be well done, to please come forward with those comments as well. And I'm happy to attach those to the minutes. The reason I chose the ones I did is I felt like they represented a wide variety of approaches to a master plan as well as being geographically kind of close by or neighbors, especially the Richmond Virginia plan, which doesn't mean we have to follow exactly what they're doing but it does speak to kind of what the trends are in the Commonwealth when it comes to public art and funding streams related to those. So really this is kind of an open discussion. I don't know if people want to go kind of commission member by commission member, I'm going to plan on jotting down some notes just so I can kind of get everybody's feedback and then I'd welcome also any other plans that you have found recently that you may like and then I can again attach those to the minutes so I don't know who would like to go first but we can always start at the far end and work our way this way not to put anyone on the spot necessarily but Miss ball if you want to any thoughts or comments? Sure. Do you want me to give you comments on each of them or? It's honestly, it's up to you and how much, I can also include, you know, more detailed comments in the, in the minutes. I think the idea is to kind of just spark a conversation and get things going. So I guess the two that I was most drawn to after looking through all of them was the Ashland Oregon Plan and then Richmond's plan. What I did like about the Ashland Oregon Plan was just it seemed to have similar goals of community engagement and also supporting artists page 11 it has a whole section on why public art that I thought was really lovely and then Also the connection with a civic planning within that plan and then with Richmond Virginia I found their prioritization ranking really helpful and clear the civic planning within that plan. And then with Richmond, Virginia, I found their prioritization ranking really helpful and clear when developing their plan. It kind of, I think it created a clear path to achieving whatever it is we would like to achieve. And then I enjoyed the statement on authenticity that was on page 24. And then with Arlington, I would say the key definitions I felt like we're helpful so having like definitions of what we're talking about so we're all on the same page and we're having a discussion and then the relation to other plans on page 21. So those are my thoughts. Great, thank you, Mr. Brill. Sure, so I've done printed out some pages from each one of the plans, things that I liked. And I'm gonna start with Duluth, and I'm gonna start with the title of the Duluth plan. Duluth defined, art is Duluth, Duluth is art, this is Duluth, Georgia. A strategic public art master plan for enhancing economic growth and community character. Economic growth is the main reason why we are here. Back in 2012, the National Gevernous Association released a report called New Engines of Growth Fibros for Arts Culture and Design and it was the basically foundational justification for creating arts and cultural districts, encouraging states to create ordinances, allowing municipalities to create these districts. For the main reason that it is an economic engine and Duluth recognizes that you know, front and center, the title of their report. So, while art is many, many things, and art for art's sake is absolutely unquestionably of value, and I believe we are all born artists, and I completely have the utmost respect for art arts education. My wife is a piano teacher. I have taught many different art forms. The bottom line when it comes to government, why are we here? We're here because the town has money to spend and they need a entity that decides how to spend that. Why do they have money to spend? Because of COVID and the CARES Act, and why was the money put there? It was put there for economic boost. So, there's a really interesting thing here about functional art, and I love functional art and several years ago when the trolley line was being developed. I went to Josh airtown manager Josh Farer And I said you know if you're gonna be adding Benches and trash cans on the trolley line trail Why don't you take benches and trash cans from the arts and culture district, move them out there and commission new arches and trash cans and benches and Basically double the money so like I looked it up a bench cost about $750 So you know put another $750 towards a bench and You get a $1,500 bench for $750 Because you're gonna buy a bench anyway. And so you're getting a $1,500 piece of art for $750. And his response to me was, yeah, but then people are going to ask me why I spent $1,500 for a bench when I could have got one for $750. And the answer that crosses political lines, all of this is political, is because it is an economic tool, just like hotel tax incentives. And we're not all going to agree on what kind of art we want to see. The public certainly isn't going to agree, but hopefully what we can get the majority of people to see and understand is that art in the end isn't economic incentive. Now, why is it in economic incentive? And then you get into all the other cool reasons why it makes it a more desirable place to live. It attracts businesses, it attracts tourists, it makes people feel like they're more welcome. I mean, all of those things that art does are part and parcel. But I think it's really important to knowledge from the get go that the main political goal in this is economic. I printed a lot of pages. It's a really cool one and the Duluth one. The pages didn't come out very well, but it's a really creative kiosk. And I'll show you guys a picture of it. And I've thought all along, if we're doing informational kiosks around town, why do they have to look like every other town? Why can't they be something really cool and be commissioned as art pieces? One thing I like about Duluth and several others is it lists a number of goals. So while we have our mission statement as the overall mission for the Public Art Commission, I think it would be really great to develop a series of goals that can be offshoots of that and be a little bit more specific about how we are doing this. There is, in one of these, it talks about sign ordinance. And this is something I've had a conversation about for a long time with the town and with council members. And while Ashland does allow for murals on buildings, what is interesting is that municipalities have different interpretations of what constitutes signage. And the general conceit is that if the artwork represents a service or product that business provides, it is a sign. And one of the examples I like to give is if you had two buildings, a camera shop and an ice cream shop, and the camera shop had a mural of Norman Rockwell's soda fountain, and the ice cream shop had a mural of cameras. Neither one of those would be a sign, but if their leases expired and they swapped properties, suddenly both of them would have signs. So what I would like to see is the town have a very liberal interpretation of what constitutes signage versus art. And on that note, before I wrap up, I know that we are not here to administer the arts and cultural district. But at the same time, looking at these plans, so much of these master art plans cover not just permanent art installations, but they cover performance art, they cover all kinds of art. And so I think what is important to look at is that the master plan we come up with will inform how the arts and culture district is administered. So I think that's pretty much it for now. There's like I said, there are some things that I like about some of these, particularly how they enumerate the goals. Richmond has a really nice flowchart in there. It's about process. So there's some really cool stuff. And there is one issue that comes up a couple of times in these plans. And that is the private funding of art. And the thing is that art is speech. And art in public spaces is something that I don't think money should control speech in public spaces. So I think we have to be very careful about donations, private donations, and that we don't allow money to control the content of the art. So that's just something to keep in mind. All right. Thank you. Thank you. I took a little different approach. I looked at the links that Ms. Miller provided with us with. And I was trying to find an example out there of a smaller community, a community that was more similar in size to Ashlyn. And so I came upon a very comprehensive public art master plan for the community of Brazlton, Georgia. And there are a community of about 27,000, if my memory serves me correctly. And I'll share the link with everybody a little bit later. I'm meant to send it in advance and I didn't. But anyway, their public art master plan is very comprehensive. And what I found really interesting was their master plan appendix, which talks about the governance of their program, the use of funds. which talks about the governance of their program, the use of funds. It talks about a session of art, and it talks about RFPs and collection management. So I think the appendix of the very least could be helpful in informing some of our future discussions about our master plan. That's all. So I took a look at Duluth and I felt that that was, I made it to Bigger Town than Ashland is, but it felt like they had a lot of similarities to us. And I particularly liked how they had the small town feel. They have a lot of the same elements as we do. And it seemed like they really tried to include everything a pride in community I think is what they were really focusing on and I feel like we can have that there and I think that's the one where I read that before they formed the Public Arts Commission, nobody really knew Duluth was on the map. And then once it was formed, they have created this amazing community that's really focused around all kinds of different art. And it's not just visual arts. It has the performing arts. It has sculptures, it's not just paintings. And for the Richmond one, because that's so close, I really liked the way they made their flow chart of their decision making process. It seemed like an easy to understand and communicate to anybody that, you know, between us and anybody else that would want to submit because I feel like that is important to make, you know, how we choose very clear for everybody. That's all I have. That's good. I, let's see. I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I I mostly looked at, I looked at Richmond's the most thoroughly, I guess, because they were the closest, but I was thinking as I was reading through it that they are much bigger. But I love the idea of using the plans that are already there so we don't have to reinvent the wheel because there are so many good ones out there. I was also drawn to the Ash and Oregon one. I like the idea of starting with what we already have. I loved creating a map of what's already out there for us and really starting with a really strong foundation and then setting our goals from there so we can sort of see where we are and then where we're going. I liked the use in the Rich and One of, I think they called it something. I didn't write the name down, but they were referring to the plan as like, say you wanna remember, it was like the, like a comprehensive plan. It was some kind of like name, like a creative city or something like that, like to draw you like, not only like, Richmond is an art city, but it was, I wish I could just pull it up and pull it down but anyways I thought that was a good idea. Let me see. They called it something. Maybe it was... Your fast reader, Martha. There it is. The revealing, or maybe that's not it. I don't know. But some kind of name, I like that idea. Oh, I like just the basics. Like, what is public art? So anyone reading it could get a feel. What exactly are we doing here? Let's just break it down a little to the basics. I liked having the pictures in the master plan. I thought that was that was nice sort of simple comment, but yeah, so what we currently have and building on that oh, I love the idea. I don't remember which plan it was, but they you know collaborate with the Ashland Strategic Plan, so you know, which I assume we're gonna do, but just you know breaking down the Ashland Strategic Plan, so which I assume we're going to do, but just breaking down the Ashland Strategic Plan and then how can we connect it with the arts? So we're meeting two goals at the same time. I feel like there was just so much, but I guess that's mostly it. So thank you. Awesome. Thank you for your comments. Councilmember Abbond, do you have any feedback you'd like to provide? If I can talk. I know. I apologize. I'm gross, I sound. At the end of the respiratory infection and for some reason I'm super irritated today. So I apologize. Well, like all of you, I think there's value in all of the plans that Martha presented. And, you know, I kind of ran through what really pulled me in with each one. So I think it might be a good exercise for us to actually document that individually in terms of what really spoke to you about each plan. So we can actually coalesce and put that in action. And just off the top of my head, like I also loved Duluth simply because they not only put together a really clear and fun and engaging master plan that everyone could understand through definitions of, you know, what is public art? Why is it important to this community? But their emphasis on community input, I think, was important to their plan, and I think it's very important to us. I mean, just basically asking, what is Duluth to you? I think that's a wonderful launching point, and Martha's questionnaire addresses that as well. Like until we understand what Ashlyn means to Ashlyn, I think that's our first step to forming a master plan that's gonna resonate with everyone. And I just found tidbits that I really liked in Arlington. I love how they have developer projects where they try and integrate the artistic public art into the process. If you're gonna build this building, how can we as a commission incorporate public art? And I think it was Ashland who makes it part of the whole process. If you are developing something over 10,000 square feet, then you have to have a public art component. And I love drawing in our artists early in the process to have an impact on private development. I think it was Arlington as well that had an emphasis on artistic engagement and planning. They have folks when things are coming to the table to kind of weigh in what's possible here in terms of public art and engagement. And then, Ashlyn Oregon focus groups, I think is a wonderful idea. And once we collect that public input, initially, once we establish what is Ashlyn to people and how do we express that artistically, publicly, I think focus groups are a wonderful idea. Alexandria, they have an annual work plan. I think we're going to like definitely try and develop a five-year tenure program, but actually, you know, putting our feet to the fire with an annual work plan. I think it is very smart, so we can really work towards those goals. Enrichment, and I know a couple of the other ones, they're big on a percent for art, on their capital improvement projects, meaning if anything's coming to the table, if for instance, it the table, if, for instance, this is not underground utilities, if anything's coming to the table, then let's build in a little percentage where we're funding public art, which I think is a wonderful idea to pursue. So those are just some of the things that jumped out at me. And again, I think if we can collectively pull what really spoke to us in terms of what would be meaningful for our master plan, I think would be incredibly valuable. Thank you. That's really valuable feedback. And I agree, Miss Abbott, that's actually what I was going to ask everyone to do. I wanted to get everybody kind of together to hear each other's thoughts in person first because if you're like me hearing what other people think sparks new ideas or interests. And so what I would ask is following this meeting if, you know, within the next two to three weeks, I know we have the Thanksgiving holiday coming up. If you wouldn't mind synthesizing kind of your thoughts on paper for me and just sending those so that I can compile them all together and kind of put it in our work plan, work session notes. And then if, you know, we, as we're going along the process, we can remember and call back to those suggestions and see where there's overlap and maybe where there isn't overlap. I think that's an excellent idea. And then the other, only other comment I'll say before we kind of move on to the next thing unless anyone has any other comments they want to add to this section is, is, Miss Abbott is absolutely right, right? This is, you all are here because you're artists and you understand art and you have a certain level of expertise, but you're also here as a representative of this community and a public service role. And so forming this master plan is going to be a balance between the both. What do you think is right for the community as an artist in an appointed position, but what does the community actually want out of public art? And that's where the community engagement process is. And somewhere, I think the best master plan is kind of somewhere in the middle, right? It speaks to what the community is asking for and it reflects the community's desires with the expertise of the artists that are sitting here on the commission. The last thing I'll add about a plan is again kind of to the point about a work plan or something. My goal is your staff liaison in this is to shepherd this process. So it's not only an inclusive community process, but that it is an actual useful actionable plan. We are very big on that here at the town. Our council talks about it a lot. We go back to our strategic plan all of the time. We are not a locality that writes a plan and sticks it on a shelf and says, good job. We go back to it. We hold ourselves accountable for kind of measuring to those goals. And so That's going to be my you know my kind of Charge to you all is to make sure that we we come out of this at the end with something that is actually very actionable And is connected to the town strategic plan because ultimately this Finish product will go to town council for adoption and they will have those same questions right how does this mesh with a strategic plan and the goals for Ashland overall so just keeping that in mind too as we are looking at things any other comments on these other discussion on this these plans I do have I do have a comment so I was on the branding committee and very proud of our results. But before it came to the committee and by the way we actually decided unanimously on what to do for the branding for the town. There were two workshops which were very heavily attended and it was asking the very question about what is Ashland and I'm wondering do we need to go through this process again or can we not pull from results of those workshops? I'm sure those, I know those notes exist somewhere. I would say it's not, it would be interesting to look at them, but I would also say given the amount of time that is elapsed and how much change in population in the growth work experience, I think it would be still valuable to go out and ask those questions to see if there has been any change. I mean, some threads, I think it would be still valuable to go out and ask those questions to see if there has been any change. I mean, some threads, I think we can guess will stay largely the same. But it's also about making sure that the commission, the community feels like the commission has come out and made an effort to ask about this specifically and that they have had the opportunity to provide their feedback. Any other questions or comments? Okay. Miss Bax rather than us playing ping pong would you like me to just move on to the draft questionnaire? Please do. Okay. So next up this is just a draft questionnaire that I pulled together. Again, as you can imagine there's plenty of these out there and this should not be a surprise, but many of them are identical. It seems like everyone has kind of had the same idea. So again, do not try not to reinvent the wheel. I tried to pick and choose questions that were applicable to our community without making it too long to discourage folks from participating in it. Before we get into kind of the content of the actual questionnaire in any comments or suggestions that you all may have, the distribution plan is that this will be distributed as an online survey on all of our channels, as well as in print form at pop-up events. My hope is that we can come to a consensus around the general content of this questionnaire this evening, and everyone is an agreement that we're in a good spot on it, so that I can kind of go out with it on Saturday at the light of the tracks event. I think that's a great opportunity to kind of kick this off. There will be a lot of folks there as well as kind of other events throughout December and that gives folks an opportunity to participate even if they're not online as well as at least in both versions I plan to provide a Spanish translation as well so that our in both versions I plan to provide a Spanish translation as well so that our Spanish-speaking population can also fully participate in the survey should they have an interest. So with that I'll leave it open to kind of comments, suggestions or questions about any particular components. I've made some notes about this and I really didn't have any edits or recommendations for items one, two, or three other than that those three questions seem to be about Ashland itself and I didn't know if it would be helpful to put just like little headers like about Ashland and then those three questions and then the next four through eight seemed to be about art in Ashland and then the last section was about demographics. So that was one suggestion I had was to add headers. As far as the sections themselves, after reading through numerous questionnaires, I was wondering if it would be helpful to add a section identifying the types of art, because we're all artists who are familiar with the different types of art that are out there, but our community members might not have that vocabulary to understand what we're talking about in the questionnaire. So, for instance, a section that says identifying types of art and then a number of bullet points such as sculpture, murals, earthworks, street art, light projections as a form of art and then maybe category of other. A second section that I miss back, I'm sorry, I don't mean to interrupt you. Are you saying you'd like that to be a question or almost like a key? Like a reference key. Something for them to check. Just like item number four, which let me see. Let's go backh, shh, shh. I'm gonna go back to your questionnaire. So, question four, what types of public art projects would you like to see? And I think all that's good. So I would suggest maybe item number five, and then have a check box, and then list these, a check box, and then the type of art for each one of those ones that I suggest or Whatever the group comes to a consensus on okay my suggestion is just a for instance Another section worth considering would be asking about asking the people who are filling this out What their awareness of public art is in the community, such as, again, little check boxes for them to check any that they feel are appropriate. Check boxes such as, when I visit other cities towns and airports, I'm impressed with the public art that I see. I notice public art in Ashland. I would like to see more public art in Ashland. I would like to see more public art in Ashland. I would like Ashland to be known for its public art. And then not to be too lengthy on this. Another section I'd throw out for consideration is asking people what their relationship with art is. You do have something similar to that, but what I'm suggesting is like, I make art, I like art, I'm neutral or I don't understand it. It would be helpful to know where our audience is coming from and what their understanding of art is. is. Anyone else? I got some thoughts. So this multiple choice form is a little bit problematic because it's very restrictive. I think at the very least, every question should have another option. I think of it like a magician telling you to pick a card, but he's only giving you an option of very controlled cards that you can choose from. So, you know, what's the first thing that comes to mind when you think about Ashland? It could really be anything. You could phrase it if you wanted to limit it to these choices, which of the blow do you think about first when you think about Ashland? But to ask that open-ended question, the first thing that comes to mind, for me, it's not any of the things that are on this list. What do you think makes Ashlyn unique? Again, there are so many answers to that. And we went through, this is why I bring up the branding workshops, because we went through a lot of this. Ashlyn's geography is certainly one. Ashlyn's political environment and contrast to the surrounding political environment. I mean, there are so many choices here that to limit it to, you know, a few multiple choice seems to be, well, I see it as problematic. When you have visitors, you take them in Ashland. And certainly these are all valid choices, but other would, you know, just like at number four, other police specify. I like the, you know, number four, what would you like to see? And please choose up to five. It'd be nice to have a point ranking order maybe. So that not only are you checking boxes, but people are ranking them in order of priority. And that way we can actually score these things based on the responses. Rural or impact should public art have in Ashland. And again, it has another police specify. And I'll speak to Mr. Murphy's comments since an input, because one of these is park conversations about issues facing the community. And certainly what he's suggesting would do that. But, okay, we're on number six. What should be per your locations for new public artworks in Ashland? Parks and trails, railroad tracks downtown, Pavilion Gateways. What's left out of here, and I find this kind of a recurrent theme, what's left out of here is England Street between Route 1 and the Rarer Tracks. Generally when people think of downtown, they think of the Rarer Tracks, and the Main Street District, downtown Ashland is actually the Main Street District, so downtown Ashland is actually the Main Street organization, and the Arts and Culture District begins at Route 1 and goes down England Street and crosses the railroad tracks and includes, you know, railroad avenue. But I think that is a all-too-common too commonly overlooked area of town when it comes to focusing on art and events and that sort of thing. How do you think public art projects should be funded? And here I'll go back to when art is privately funded, that should not control the contents of the art. And I'll speak to the Secretary of State as an example of this, because it's a really borderline case. So it is on private property, Randolph-Macon College, is being paid for with private funds. But the town has agreed to maintain the statue. And there are people who, animal rights activists who already are, you know, offering some backlash as to the statue. And I'm not saying that that should mean that, you know, we shouldn't have the statue. I'm not saying that that should mean that we shouldn't have the statue. I'm just saying that whenever there is public money or it is on public property, there should be a rigorous open process of discussion to determine what goes there and not simply by virtue of it being donated, it de facto occupies public space. So I think that's really important. How do you want to put that in the questionnaire? That's a good question because it's a really good question because the, I just see it as a problematic answer, private, refunded art. What does that mean? And I don't know if it's the best question for this survey. Do you live in Ashland? If so, for how long? I have had people comment that this reeks of the come here from here dichotomy. It's like do you get more of a vote because you've lived here longer? I don't know that question really, I know for demographic purposes, but do people, does how long they've lived in Ashland have an impact on how their opinion is considered? And then finally, there's the ethnicity question. And again, I don't know if that's really inappropriate, for sure, for demographics. But I mean, imagine if that was on a ballot when you went to vote, you know, how long have you been a resident, you know, with your ethnicity. I just find those questions to be inherently problematic. I would just add about the demographics question. There's a reason they're optional, and that's the reason. I think for me and again I'm following best practices of all the other public art surveys that I looked at which was probably a hundred. It's more to hold us accountable to make sure that we are actually getting results from all of Ashland, right, and a true demographic sampling because to avoid the perception that we are only getting responses from the people who always provide responses. So it's an effort to force accountability, but of course if someone is not comfortable answering that question, they absolutely do not have to. It's not a required response. Same as the age. The length of time that someone has lived here again, that's more for out of curiosity, but if it feels like it's going to turn people off, you know, I'll leave it up to you all if you want to strike it from the survey. But I think it those kinds of questions can be instructive for us going forward. And then the other things I'll say about, and then I'll go back to make sure I'm capturing the other edits is, you know, overall, as you all are aware with surveys, the balance is to be inclusive, but not so, so exhaustive that people don't want to take it. So you have to make it approachable enough, and certainly adding other to every question is not, you know, a bad idea. I think that that's totally doable and a good solution. And then the other thing that I'll just say quickly before I turn the mic back over to whoever has comments is think about this is just one of the community engagement tactics of many that we are going to do over the course of this. This is like dipping our toe in the pool of public opinion about this. This is a starting point. And so all those kind of bigger questions around how people feel about this and the detail, that's where the focus groups come in. That's where we sit down at tables with people and small groups and really say, you know, our survey responses indicate that, what do you think about that? And then we get that more qualitative data to complement the quantitative data that we've collected through this survey. So this isn't the end all be all. It's just the kind of like let's take the slightest temperature and then really dig into the meaty stuff. Let me just say that on question 11. I didn't even notice the optional. So maybe if we put that in bold or added the check box decline to answer either one of the other because like I said I didn't even notice that was a part of the question. Sure. Anyone else? I would like to say that I do agree. I like the idea of I think you just cover everything if you have option for each question just if there's more input than you you're not sort of boxing yourself in so I like that idea. I also would love the idea. Just, I know, I like what you just said. Like, we're just dipping our toe in. And I like that it's short and concise so that people want to do it. But I do wonder if maybe we could just include a general, do you have any other input, you know, just so that maybe someone has a really cool idea out there. So those are my two things. I think that's good. I think people need to be actively, if not aggressively, invited to provide input. And what that's my concern is when you offer limited options, they're just going to, you going to stick to what's on the page. But if you invite them to, you just have that other box or you asked at the end for other comments. I think that's a really good solution. For question 11, just to, I don't know how it is actually done, but if you can choose more than one, instead of having to just choose one. Yeah, it's set up that way and I can also put a description that says, please select all that apply. I like that too, yeah. Yeah, very good. Without adding too much more to the length of this, one other note I had about another thing to add would be a question. Would you be interested in participating in a focus group about Ashland's public art? And it would just be, yes, please contact me or no. Thank you. I love it. I like that. That's me or no, thank you. I love it. I like that. That's a great suggestion, thank you. Any other comments or suggestions? Yes, go for it. Miss Miller, how is this going to be disseminated? Is it an online option? So I'm going to do it online through all of our channels. And then I'm going to do some paper versions, like PDF printouts, both in English and Spanish. They're going to have them pop up at events that we're already going to be at, light up the tracks, things happening throughout the holidays, as well as I plan on taking copies and leaving them at the library and the YMCA and kind of other local places so that folks can also access them there. Well, I have two thoughts. One is on on racing at the city. I absolutely had to ask me an option optional, but I think it can also give us a little bit of insight. If they, for instance, I don't, you know, mark that they are within the black community or the Hispanic community, and we see a trend towards functional art, I think that's incredibly valuable information if people are willing to share it. So I think it's absolutely worth capturing if people are willing to share it. So I think it's absolutely worth capturing if folks want to provide that. The other thing is, I'm absolutely going to take Arthur once and all of you one step further. I don't think we should have any answers for the first three questions. Simply because what we really want to do is get a part of what Ashlyn means to have to them. And so let's give them an option to fill just up your head. Three answers for you know what is Ashlyn to you. Because I think we're gonna capture a lot more than than kind of just being very leading with these choices. But I think instinctually we all know that this is what most of us appreciate about Ashland. But I'm thinking there may be young families who want to say, what is Ashland? It's family friendly. What is Ashland? You know, as a small business, it's nurturing for business. So I don't want to limit the kinds of answers that we're going to get by having a kind of preform list. I think it was Richmond that did that. They just asked questions and they didn't have any answers. It was just all sort of essay style. Can I say, go ahead? No, I'm just saying just for the first three, because I think that kind of gets, but I think we need to help people kind of understand public art, you know, and I think the other questions are excellent. So they can spark ideas. I mean, it's culture, I didn't think about that, or functional art, or so those were just what? May I suggest a compromise? And please tell me if you all feel strongly about the open-ended suggestion. My concern from an execution standpoint is some people are turned off by surveys that aren't easy to do, right, where they have to think. And that it takes more time, especially during a to do, right, where they have to think and that it takes more time, especially during a community event, right, and we really want to get as many answers as possible. I will say in the digital version, these answers appear in random order with each person, so they're not all listed in this exact order for the same person, they're randomized. exact order for the same person, the randomized. So I think the other allows it to be there. The other reason that I think having these kind of pre-loaded answers could be instructive for the group is it will give you kind of these thematic buckets that you could kind of say, OK, well, overwhelmingly people seem to think history or trains. And so maybe whatever big public art project we do first should be a reflection of that theme, because that's what a lot of people here identify with. And then that kind of open-ended conversation, again, is a good, the focus groups or a public meeting are a very good venue for that, where you can do word cloud exercises on post-its on the wall and really get people kind of brainstorming. And those groups are seated with people that are more predisposed to that kind of feedback or want that. And I'm open to, obviously, tell me your thoughts. I'll say, I wonder another compromise idea is because I really like what Kathy, uh, Miss Abbott said, like I just don't like the idea of hear your answers, you know, even with the other. I'm wondering if what if one through three, it's just the question, no answers. But then we find a question like 12 that has these there, like in a different way. So basically you're asking them the media, well it comes to mind and then you're not leading. So they say their answer and then later in the survey you have these, like almost like reforming the question in a different way so that you could sort of do what you're saying to. I don't know, That's sort of my idea. That's a very test approach to AB test. I love it. I love it. This is year-old survey. It's really, this is data you're going to need to use and to inform your conversation. So it is ultimately, I'm just here to kind of throw out alternatives as is misabot. So really it's up to, if you feel strongly about the open-ended and that's the way you want it to go, then that's the way we go. Well, what I like about that is people can skip over that if they don't want to write down an answer, but then towards the end, you have it in this format so that at least they, but you haven't led them to their answer to the being, I really like that approach. Yeah, they get to get what they feel out first and then we get to, yeah, with they make it easier for them if they've right let's make it easy if they were like stymied they can get to the end and be like oh finally an easy question. When I was looking through this I also looked at number seven and I'm wondering if checkboxes. When I was looking through this, I also looked at number seven, and I'm wondering if we can kind of put some examples of what is a public art project? Because I would have different answers depending on what the public art project was. You know, like I could see a private sponsor into help get supplies for an art activity in the community with children or something, you know, but I had the same concerns that Arthur would have with a private, you know, company funding, something that we're planning for the town. So. Yeah, and I think the does so most all of them have these questions because it's really about taking a temperature of what the taxpayers appetite is for funding public art through a government process, right? And so that's part of why that is there. And it's kind of specifically vague for a reason so that when we start working together to hammer out process with you all about how art is funded, about how art is accepted, then that's where those concerns are addressed. That's ultimately up to the commission, not where the money comes from, but what strings or not are attached to that funding. And so I think those concerns can be addressed kind of in our process in terms of like our RFP and RFQ process, our donation acceptance agreements, that kind of legal framework, if that is a priority for the commission. Yeah, I mean, I understand that part. I think what I was thinking about is just that it says art projects. And so I just think, oh, that's a mural. You know what I mean? Like that. So I would answer that question differently depending on what was listed there. I see. So maybe like a parentheses after projects. Yeah, that's just like a couple examples of things. And Grant we're all like coming at this for as a perspective of artists so it's we're gonna look at it from our own lens as well. Any other comments for our review suggested edits? Okay, so I think my feeling is, and please stop me if I'm wrong, the consensus is that numbers one through three should be open-ended questions, maybe short text answers. I'll have to put a word limit on it because I know some people will give me two paragraphs, which we welcome, but maybe not in a survey format. And then adding kind of a twist on that question with choices at the end as Miss Severin suggested. I see lots of non-sets good. For all the questions that have multiple choice adding another to those as well with a short text box for folks. And then adding a little bit more clarity around what a public art project is, as well as a question around the actual types of art, mural, sculpture, things of that nature, as Ms. Bax mentioned. And then Mr. Brill suggested number five, making it more of a ranking to force a prioritization. I think it's helpful information, you know, because you know what their highest priority is of five. Mm-hmm. Yeah, you'd rank from one to five. Yeah. So we have all the choices, but we are only allowed to rank five of them. Well, it says choose up to five. I can change the structure of the questions so that they can actually rank them all. If we want to force them to kind of rank them all, I would suggest we limit the choices. Yeah. Because there's a long list. So I can pull it down a little bit to kind of bigger buckets. So it's not such an overwhelming prioritization exercise for folks. Probably half a dozen. Yeah. I just did this for a playground. It was a long list of ranking. It was not fun. And then the last suggestion I think, and please tell me if I forgot something, is number six, Mr. Braille's suggestion to make sure we include England Street, which is a good point. So I'm going to suggest that maybe we change that second choice along the railroad tracks, downtown, and England Street corridor, and just make it all one. Because I think of downtown as England Street, but I do understand that a lot of people don't think of it that way So I think calling that out specifically is is good Is there any Number 11 either making optional and bold or adding a decline to answer? Yes, and then allowing multiple selections yep selections. Yep, not it. Okay, anything else? Adding a question about the participating in a focus group. Yes, with contact information. Yep, I've got that on here too. Okay. Well thank you all. This was really helpful feedback. When you're writing a survey as a solo person. You can only capture so much, so thank you. It's been really helpful to me. So I'll look to get these edits done tomorrow, so we'll be ready to kind of get it out there hopefully. I can do a trial run. I will be at the light of the tracks event on Saturday at a table, so I may try to have a couple copies there and see, but I'll talk a little bit more about that during our staff report. Before I close out this community engagement section this is not necessarily listed but it's more of conversation or just as a heads up. So as I mentioned after the questionnaire period happens we'll go into more of a focus group process. We'll go into more of a focus group process. My hope is that obviously nothing much is going to be possible during the December months. Everybody is very distracted with holiday cheer and all that. So, my hope is that we can get two or three maybe depending on interest level on the survey focus group scheduled for the January February timeframe. And we can talk up, we have a, we should have a meeting scheduled in January and we can kind of talk through that a little bit more. But I'm going to look at dates. I need to secure locations before I do that. But we'll try to do a variety of locations that people can get to easily. The Ashland library is one. And there's a couple other locations that we can certainly choose for these and the goal be varying locations and times of day so maybe some during the daytime, some during the evening I thought about doing maybe two community focus groups in town and then depending on interest reaching out to some colleagues I know at the Art Department at Patrick Henry and Randolph-Macon, and seeing if we could maybe grab some time with their students as well to see what they think about public art to capture that kind of lower age population. It could be helpful input to have. So stay tuned for that and we'll coordinate dates. I would say attendance by all of you at every focus group is not mandatory. It may actually be easier because of the public meeting clause to not have everyone at every meeting. And so we may kind of divide and conquer on that. And that way the kind of the ask on time is spread out for people. OK. Any questions for me? I have a question. So on that subject, when it comes to communication, it seems like it will only need once every three months and that's the only time we can all have a conversation together. This can be a very, very long process. Well, I would imagine we have a quarterly meetings, regularly meetings kind of in our charter, but there is a clause in the bylaws that special meetings can be called. And I would expect that we may want to try to hold a special meeting in February, just to catch up on everything and keep the process moving along. So that's definitely something that for us to discuss based on workload as well as kind of another project that I'll chat about in my staff report later on. Okay. All right. Well, thank you all. Thank you. Thanks for keeping us straight and putting so much hard work into the master plans and the questionnaires. and putting so much hard work into the master plans and the questionnaires. It's fun. We have an action item on our agenda for this evening. Yes, ma'am. Okay, this action item, and apologize for not giving you all heads up about this. This was kind of a sudden thing that came up with town council. The kind of background on this is our town council was looking at kind of all of the bylaws and the term limits for all of our committees and commissions and notice that kind of everybody kind of had their own rules in place about term limits and there was a desire to create consistency on that. And so at their meeting on October 3rd, town council actually voted and the public art bylaws as you all are familiar because we just did them. They did initially include a term limit of four, four year terms. So this action is really just to, it's more administrative. It's to bring the our commission bylaws into compliance with council policy. So this is a very just to, it's more administrative. It's to bring the commission bylaws into compliance with council policy. So I have updated the bylaws to remove the term limits. And I've attached a revision of those bylaws. The only change to the bylaws that were made is the quote you see below, which is an individual shall not be reappointed by town council to the committee if he or she has served four consecutive terms of office unless no qualified applications are received for the vacancy. If you have questions about this Miss Abbott can also speak further to it since she is on council, but council's desire and removing term limits is a reflection of not only the size of our community that it is small and sometimes we have not a huge pool of qualified applicants for our appointed positions, but also the time and scale it takes to really accomplish big projects at the government level. And if you have someone or individuals on a committee or commission that have really hit their stride and are in the middle of something, it would be a shame to kind of cut that term short and interrupt that process. That being said, that does not guarantee the position, you know, in finitum, right? You still have to re-interview at the end of your four-year term. Should you be interested in continuing? You would still have to re-interview at the end of your four-year term, should you be interested in continuing? You still have to reapply, re-interview with sound counsel, and be reappointed. So it doesn't guarantee that someone stays on forever. There is still that reappointment in interview process. It just kind of simplifies things by taking term limits out of the equation and making it consistent across all of our committees and commissions. And with that I'm happy to answer any questions or if I can't I will gladly hand it to Miss Abbott to answer that question. Well said. Any questions? Okay and if questions. If there are no questions, then we'll need to put this to a vote since these are your bylaws. With that staff recommends approval of the revised public art commission bylaws. COU-174. And miss backs, you can ask if there's a motion? Is there a motion to pass this? A motion to approve the revised. Is there a motion to second this? Aye second. Okay. And with that. All right. I will motion pass. Now Ms. Ball. Yes. Mr. Brill. Aye. Ms. Bax. Aye. Ms. Hollander. Aye. the next item on our agenda for this evening is our is reports. We have community member reports. Does anyone have anything to report along this? And I'll just add a note of clarification. I did throw this on the agenda because you're well-seasoned public art commission members now. This is an opportunity and if you have nothing to share today that that's fine, but I do like to, we do like to provide an opportunity. If you're out in the community, you've attended any kind of public art event, or anything that you wanted to share with your peers in the public about generally arts and culture happening in Ashland. This is a great venue to just kind of discuss that or just provide an update or share something. So it's completely optional. I'll share something and I only know this because I saw it on Facebook and I wish I had known about it. But Divine Assist didn't art show. I think it was last weekend. And I think maybe because, and I try to stay on top of the stuff, and I missed it. So maybe we can reach out to, I don't know, at least the organizations that are in Ashland and just let them know that we want to know about their events because we want to be able to share it and publicize it. Thank you. Yeah, I was unaware of that as well. the city of Richmond Public Arts Commission. I want to share a couple of things. The City of Richmond Public Arts Commission has their meetings on the third Thursday of each month at 430 in the afternoon. Super convenient. The meetings are open to the public and if anyone on this commission is interested in seeing what goes on at City of Richmond the meeting is open to the public and if anyone on this commission is interested in seeing what goes on at City of Richmond Art Commission, those meetings can also be attended remotely and I'd be happy to provide a link to that. The Richmond Public Art Commission also receives announcements of upcoming and this is for all the artists on this board, upcoming RFQs for art projects around the country, and they list that on their Facebook page. So public art, RVA, is their Facebook page. So if you're interested in seeking a project, maybe you'd want to check that out. And then the last thing that I'll mention is I signed up for this earlier today The rich men pack has their own RFQ section and they have a mailing list And so I put my name on that mailing list to see what projects that they're sending out to the community So I can see those and see how they're structured and all that I have one more thing. I found this fascinating. This is from Arlington's master plan. And I don't have the page number down because it didn't print out. But I want to read this out. In general, the pace of public art opportunities might be outstripping the capacity of artists and arts organizations to respond to them, particularly in regard to artists' ability to work in public space in the ability of project sponsors to access and follow best practices for community engagement and project management. So, I mean, basically they're saying that it's hard to find artists to respond, qualified artists to respond to these RFQs, RFPs. And I think that in that context, we have the opportunities set the bar high as far as incentivizing artists to respond to whatever we put out. Anyone else? Two quick things. Sure. I don't know if any of you caught it, but in the addendum of the Richmond, uh, master plan. There's an organization called Forecast. They've been around for 45 years. And they're all about public art. As I just wanted to flag that, the link is in the Richmond thing. Um, but, you know, they have tons of resources. So I think it's definitely something to keep on a radar. And the second thing is, uh, if you missed it, Secretary it is the grand marshal of the holiday parade on Sunday. So I think that that's going to be a sight to see. So spread the word. Yes, I second council member Abbott's suggestion about forecast. I actually spent quite a lot of time. I did a webinar with them kind of leading up to our conversations. They provide they do for profit kind of consulting on public art master planning processes, but they also have a lot of kind of public resources out there for smaller beans like us that maybe don't have the budget to hire an external consulting company to come in and do their planning process for them. So I would encourage you to check them out as well. All right, with that, I will go onto my staff report. I'll try to make this quick. So it's just kind of a recap since we last met. So we gathered with Ashland Dance Academy, the town staff, and members of council and muralist Michelle Hollander, for ribbon cutting in front of the new greetings from Ashland, mural at ADA. I hope all of you've seen it. Surely you have if you're driving by, it's beautiful, and really is a sunny kind of welcoming sight as you're coming across the tracks. And then in more mural butanza news, we have another lovely piece of public art, which has been done by artist Katie Groton-Haler. Arthur, do you know her? Is that my same name, right? OK. Katie worked with me on the State Fair Project. How do I pronounce her last name? I don't want to mix. I believe it's Groton-Tollars. She goes by Katie Teardrop. OK. Groton Tall, I didn't want to butcher her name. On the wall of Wagner Jewelers, right where the red caboose on ramp is. And I think we've mentioned in a previous, she did the mural at Artistic Fusion, here company as well with the Ashland kind of train on it. So again, I love seeing all this public art popping up, kind of organically around town. It's great. And then kind of onto forecasting for you all, it just as a heads up, we've not discussed this before because we were kind of waiting on agreements, potential agreements from property owners. But we are currently in conversation with two property owners at the corner of Thompson Street in Route 54 and Route 1, specifically the Wawa and the tobacco hut property. And we are having verbal agreement from them for easements, small easements, at their curbside for the placement of a welcoming archway, a welcome to historic Ashland kind of thing. You've probably seen them in other localities. The survey work is in process. I believe the on-site process has already happened. We're just waiting on the final plat. From Timman's group, our on record contractor. And then we will work with our lawyer to draft up easement documents. Once we know those kind of legal things are in motion, then it is the desire of town council that this commission be charged with overseeing the process of commissioning this archway design and the implementation within a certain budget. This is what council would like the commission to use the kind of set aside ARPA funding for. It could be a really kind of monumental project and a great opportunity for this Commission to kind of very quickly say this is what we're here look what we've done. As well as being a really amazing place making opportunity, as you all know those kinds of archways, especially with our kind of busy 95 interchange, it's the hope is that it will 95 travelers will come off and they'll see it and they'll say, wait, what's down there? I'm going to keep going and venture into our downtown. And so I just wanted to give you all a heads up that's kind of why we're pushing the master planning process and probably soon very very soon of while we're pushing the master planning process and probably soon very very soon after or maybe even before the master planning process is finished I imagine an RFP process So we may be kind of working into the master plan a little bit backward, but we need to get kind of those Logistical things in place so that we can get those RFP RFPs out Because for those of you that aren't familiar, those ARPA funds do have strings attached. They have to be committed, not fully spent, but committed by the end of 2024. So we have to show proof that the work has been contracted in this underway. And so that's kind of the deadline we're working with here. And so we may need to be beating a little bit more frequently. Again, with the legal documents, it's kind of a hurry up and wait situation. So we'll see. But we do have every verbal agreement from both Wawa and the tobacco hut owners that they are amenable to it. It's taken me up two years of emails to get through a agreement, so I'm just happy that we've made it this far. And I think we can pull this off. So, and again, if anyone has any questions about this project, please let me know. I would encourage you to start looking out there. There's examples of gateway arches. I think that some are very typical, right? And some are very artistic. And I would say that I, in Miss Abbott, correct me if I'm wrong. My impression is that there is a desire at the town council and certainly at the town manager level of having this be unique, that this be artistic in some way. In keeping with, you know, the taste level and everything that we've come to know of Ashland and place making, but that this is an opportunity to be expressive and kind of really give people an idea of what Ashland's about when they come in and not just be a copy of another one that another locality has. So exciting opportunity, I think, for us. And then moving on just right here, we have our 2024 schedule of meetings, assuming we're sticking with our same schedule. So our next meeting will be January 25th and then meeting quarterly, regularly beyond that. And then special meetings as needed. next meeting will be January 25th, and then meeting quarterly, regularly beyond that, and then special meetings as needed. I'll send out calendar invites and everything before the end of the year. So those are marked on your calendar, but please do take a look at these dates and check your calendars. And if you anticipate conflicts, please let me know so we can reschedule. And then just a couple of events to make you all aware of some we've already talked about. This Saturday at 5 we have the light up the tracks kick off celebration. As I said, I will be there with a table handing out Santa hats that say center of the universe on them. So if you want one, please come get one. I'm also going to have copies of the survey. If anyone would like to attend, this is completely voluntary. But if anyone would like to attend, as is completely voluntary, but if anyone would like to attend as a member of the Public Art Commission and help collect survey responses at the event or just talk to folks about the commission, you are more than welcome to come to the table and hang out. It should be a wonderful event as you probably saw when you came in. We have a gigantic tree this year which we're very excited about lighting up and there's going to be the Ashland Dance Academy dancers are there so there will be you know arts performing arts and things like that going on. And then of course the holiday parade which Ms. Abbott mentioned with Secretary it as the grand marshal. And then December 2nd is the Ashland Christmas market. This is the fourth year I believe, third or fourth year. And I spoke with downtown Ashland Association today and whether pending the interest already is through the roof. But it's going to be the biggest they've had yet. There's going to be local makers and artists set up all over town from town hall all the way down to the Ashlandanna for Shopping Center where Huddle Up is that shopping center there. So there will be artists all over the place selling their wares. So I would encourage you all to come out and shop and support local artists. It really is a great event as well as our local businesses will also have sidewalk sales and things of that nature too to get folks to spend money in the brick and mortars. And then finally this is looking ahead but planning is already underway. The town has provided funding yet again to culture works and Richmond. This year we've provided them with enough funding for two community arts and culture events. When the past years we've only done one. These are supposed to be hyper local kind of neighborhood level events to really engage historically marginalized communities that have not had access to the arts. And so I'm in the brainstorming process with their program director now to kind of identify those locations. In the past we've done stuff in such field neighborhood. We did, we brought some artistic performances and things to the end of the year party for the elementary school last year. So I will, once I get with them and we kind of decide what our priority locations are for these events, I'll make sure that everyone here is aware and your participation is welcome. If you wanna come help, we always need a lot of hands because it's kids and they're everywhere. So we always need lots of help with that. So I'll be sure to keep you all posted on that. Does anyone have any questions for me on my updates? Couple of comments. Excuse me, a couple of comments. One, the shopping center you're referring to where Huddla Lubb is, is called Ashland Town Center. So I'll also ask a white piano studio is. Thank you. And speaking to the gateway, so I was on the complete streets workshop panel, which was five or six years ago. I'm trying to remember when. And it was really neat workshop, and we walked all around town. It was about the walkability of Ashland. But one of the things we did identify was the need for a gateway so that people knew there was things down, you know, towards the rail tracks, as well as something right when you come off I-95. And you know, I've had conversations people who work in Ashland, who have never gone one foot further west than yet, they absolutely have to. If they work on the other side of Route 1, they've never crossed Route 1. If they live on the west, work on the west side of Route 1, they've never even been to the railroad tracks. So it's really important to have something that draws people down. And I've put a lot of thought into this gateway idea and I would encourage people to look at Culpepper, Virginia and what they have, they have two pairs of posts on the either side of the street and what they do is they put up these basically banners for different events so you could change it out for let let's say, light up the tracks or a train day, whatever we happen to have going on, strawberry fair. But my concept for it has been to make the posts themselves, whereas Kohlpiper just has sort of a very modest, sort of raw-dye iron, Victorian kind of lamp post-e kind of things, we could make these into really whimsical, you know, some things that, you know, that make a statement. But when we talk about archways, I don't think we, I'm not saying, you know, exclude the idea, but we don't necessarily have to have a permanent thing crossing the street if we create some really cool art posts that allows whatever is crossing the street to be changed out for different events. Yes, that's a good point and I think that's what will be exciting to kind of during the RFP process. It's not to be overly prescriptive. There will be a very finite footprint that they can have per the easements and the sidewalks that are there. But I was also on a public art forum and the public art director for Arlington said they just did something very similar to what you're describing. It gives the illusion of an arch. It curves, but it doesn't actually go the entire way. So there's a lot of different ways that you can do something like that. So that's where soliciting those designs, I'm excited to see what we get. Okay. That's it. Okay. Okay, that's it. Okay. Does anyone have any business before we close this out for the evening? No. I'd like to thank our Ashland citizens for coming and spending their evening with us tonight and with that. This meeting is adjourned. Thank you. Where is the Louvre, Georgia? Where is the Louvre, Georgia? Any other places to go? you