Thank you. Good evening everybody. Thank you all for coming. Welcome to the Wednesday, March 13th, 2024, Ashland Planning Commission meeting. It is so nice to actually see that it's light outside and not dark outside. Thank you all so much for coming tonight. Ms. Bernie, roll call. Please. Ms. Amy Hay. Here. Mr. Brent Chambers. Please. Ms. Amy Hay. Here. Mr. Brent Chambers. Here. Ms. Linda Wright. Here. Mr. Tim Merrill. Here. Ms. Stephanie Hare. Here. We have Corm. Thank you. And I am just going to quickly run over tonight's agenda. We will have citizen input time where we welcome anyone to come and speak to commission about anything that's not on tonight's agenda because you will have an opportunity for that during the public hearing. And we have two presentations tonight. We have a tax amendment for floodplain, including FEMA maps ordinance 2024-03. the first one for Flagstap Car Wash. That is actually on our public hearing tonight. So we just scratched through that one. Sorry. Thank you all. And then for we have two public hearings tonight. The first one is Resonant. And we have a Resonant. And we have a Resonant. And we have a Resonant. And we have a Resonant. And we have a Resonant. on our public hearing tonight, so we just scratched through that one, sorry, thank you all. And then for, we have two public hearings tonight. The first one is rezoning 23-1031 and ordinance 20-23-14 for Patriot Glen. And we have conditional use permit 24-0125 for Flagstap Car Wash. Excuse me. We have no action items tonight and then we'll have our report of committees. So if commission is okay with the agenda as presented or any changes or anything, you can approve. I move that we approve the agenda for March 13th, 2024 is presented. Thank you. Ms. Haye. Aye. Mr. Chambers. Aye. Ms. Wright. Aye. Ms. Mr. Merrill. Aye. Ms. Hayer. Aye. Motion carries. Thank you. And now is the time for citizen input. If anybody would like to come forth and speak on anything not on tonight's agenda. And see no one. We will close citizen input. Move them right along. Thank you First presentation is a text amendment for floodplain including FEMA maps Oh That's for next month you guys are apologizing. It's our first public hearing for tonight is Resonning 23-1031 and ordinance 2023-14 Patriot Glen And we'll have. So just to confirm the presentations listed are just heads up or April? Yes, you got it. Yeah. And we'll have staff come present. Thank you Miss Amos. I was just checking to see if anyone was here for M&M, but I don't think I. Okay. Thank you to provide a presentation. Well, that's okay. And just to let you know about the text amendment for the floodplain maps, FEMA has updated their floodplain maps. And we are required to adopt those and by June, we have to get them to them, I think by May. So, we're bringing you those for review. And I apologize. It did not occur to me when I made my appointment to have my teeth worked on that I shouldn't do it before planning commission meetings. So hopefully you can understand what I'm saying. Yes, we can. I didn't hear noise. Did you see it? Yeah. Yeah. All right. As we do see it. William, it. H-D-M-1. Oh, I took it out. Let's try it again. Here it is. That's me. Okay. So I took it out, I'm trying to get it. That's me, okay. I love that it's not dark outside. Oh, yeah, should we do it now? Yes. There it is. Here we go. So as I go through this presentation, you'll understand how much we miss Miss Raglan. All right. So the first public hearing we have this evening is on Resoning 23-1031, Patriot Glen, a rezoning application that we received from Mr. Steve Ferris on behalf of Wilton acquisitions. They filed this request to change the zoning from its existing zoning of rural residential, or RR1, to portion as highway commercial along 54 in the rest of the area's plan unit development. Their purpose is to develop a residential community and to have commercial pads out front along the, along 54. A plan unit development is a zoning district that allows for a lot of flexibility, but it also requires a good amount of open space and recreational amenities and other items. So, it's been a pretty good zoning district for us to utilize in the past. It's similar to what's been done over in Lara Dow. So in total, this area for both parcels and the telecommunication tower area total over 60 acres, the 60.327 acres. So the star there was the original application, and then they came back and added in the other approximately 30 acres to the west to incorporate their entire property and we'll go over their layout here in a minute. We received this application originally I think back in October but then they amended their application to add that other parcel and we received that on January 26th of this year and so this property is on the east side of 95 and west of Woodside Lane, north of 54, currently a vacant property, mostly wooded, some wet, you can see from the roadway and then there is a telecommunication tower there with an existing conditional use on the property. So to the north is Washington, Lacey Park. Maybe if I go on the property. So to the north is Washington, Lacey Park. Maybe if I go to the concept plan, which isn't there. So to the north is Washington, Lacey Park, a park owned by a pretty passive park owned by Hanna Rackowni, to the south is what's been known as East Ashland, most recently Iron Horse, which we had the comprehensive plan amendment for last year. And then to the east is Hannaver County residential zoning, woodside, estates, and providence subdivisions, and then to the west there is a private school and some single family residential. And so approximately one acre will remain RR1. That's the telecommunication tower and then the two larger parcels that are separated by that pipe stem lot up to Washington, Lacey, and by the county are being requested for plan unit development for single-family detached homes as well as cottage homes and town homes. So a mix of different types of units with the maximum density of 2.39 units per acre. They have numerous, proffered conditions that allow them. So in the traditional neighborhood, we talk about one to four units per acre and then within within the comprehensive plan, we have a lot of recommendations on if you want to get a little bit higher density, what you should do. And so those are coming to us through voluntary proffers with this application. So within that B2 highway commercial zoning district, the applicant is asking for 7.04 acres to be rezoned to B2, this is a speculative rezoning. seven point zero four acres to be rezoned to be two. This is a speculative rezoning. They do not have an actual commercial user but would market the property as a B2 use. And so here's the concept plan that we received in the application. Again, the two large parcels that are split by that Handover County property. We have just in the past week or two and speaking with Handover County further if you recall there was some concern when they did their Envision handover that they had kept woodside lane the one To the east as a major collector, but then they also added a second major collector called woodside parallel and that really follows along this pipe stem going up to Woodside or I'm sorry Washington Lacey Park. And so the town was and still is concerned about that road being a major collector but we would be okay if it were a residential road that connected to Washington Lacey Park. And so we have hopefully we'll be meeting with county officials they seem to be agreeable to have further conversations about this road here. I think it's road A moved over and put into there onto their property and it would be a more formal residential access road that would go up to the park and so there is a access road that would go up to the park. And so there is a proffer that allows for some flexibility in this concept plan if we were able to work that out with handover county. And so it does border wood side lane again that is already shown as a major collector. We gave wood side lane over to the county because we felt that was probably the most appropriate place for a major collector. If there was going to be one to access the large economic development property to the north. And so through this project and Proffers, they will dedicate an additional 25 feet of right of way to Hanover County, where actually it would end up being in the town. We might have to do another adjustment there for Woodside Lane. The, again, you can see here and I'll get a little closer, I'll get a closer view of those commercial sites. You have single family throughout a few detached, duplex type units to the north. Here in the middle of the site, you have the town home units. Those are all kind of condensed together as opposed to perhaps a more desirable mix within the community, but at the 2.39 we still feel like they are meeting necessary requirements to get through that density. There is 50% over 50% open space. There is a significant amount of wetlands, I believe the applicant may be speaking more to a newer study that they have than I had in my files. But there is also a large dominion easement between these cottage type homes and the town homes. So here's just a closer view of those commercial pad sites as well as the telecommunication tower site that's about a little over an acre and those two commercial sites together, a little over seven acres. You can see the green space there, this project has really been designed around those wetlands. Here's a closer view of the area to the north and for, I will go ahead and point out that for those town homes to be built, there would have to be an alternate access So this if they would have to make that connection across the the county property You can only have 20 units without a secondary access or they would have to figure out a separate secondary access Maybe for the Francis or something So just review some of the analysis that we went over, again this property is zoned RR1 which is really the zoning that a lot of property got when we did annexation back in 1996. We had some former planning commissioners who used to call it the CME zoning, kind of just a placeholder until someone wanted to develop. And so that's where we are this evening. There was amendment to the Comprehensive Plan not long ago and we ended up keeping the portion of the front as neighborhood, or I'm sorry, is mixed commercial. And let's see what we have here. Okay, so again, we've talked, I think I've talked about all that. So here's your, the wetland map, and as I mentioned, I think that a more formal study has been done by the applicant, and they'll be providing that to you. So under rural residential, again, that kind of comes, seamy zoning. It's more of an almost agricultural type zoning where you have two acre minimum lots. Here is the B2 highway commercial district, a lot of route one. Anything that's not industrial long route one is B2 as well as the majority of the property on route 54. So this district is intended to provide sufficient space and appropriate locations for a wide variety of commercial and miscellaneous service activities, serving a wide area and located particularly along certain existing major thoroughfares. So again, 54 and Route 1. Most of our retail, restaurant, office type uses fall under this zoning category. So the location of this district serves and is an important gateway to the community from the north, south, east and west, gateway to the community from the north south east and west Thus improving the function through elements such as lighting landscaping signage building design and layout is an important Economic goal for the town and we've included a lot of those items within our zoning ordinance But then there are a few also added within the proffers So just to give you kind of an overview of the uses that would be allowed within the B2 district, again, a lot of retail, hotel, and some service type office uses and restaurants. There are a few uses that could be allowed with the conditional use permit, anything if they wanted to do any of these uses that required a conditional use permit, they would have to come back to you all in the town council for approval on anything like a car wash, fuel station, hospital mini storage, retail sales over 25, that's supposed to be 25,000 square feet and shopping centers. So the plan unit development, it's intended to permit development in accordance with a master plan, so kind of a cluster where you're taking all your density and putting it into smaller areas to allow for greater open space. Within these communities, the location of all improvement shall be controlled in such a manner to permit a variety of housing accommodations and orderly relationship to one another to allow for the greatest amount of open space and green space, as well as disturbing fewer natural features. A PUD can include light commercial facilities to the extent necessary to serve the needs of the particular plan unit development. So the future land use map again shows the mixed business, that pink color. This, I think originally maybe we had originally talked about some interstate commercial where we felt the mixed business was probably most appropriate here. And again, this is a similar use that we have up and down route one. And again, this is a similar use that we have up and down Route 1. The residential portion is shown as traditional neighborhood. So here, just to go over the mixed commercial land use category, it's for dominant along Route 1, also located east of 95. The land use category contains a mix of office and commercial uses which complement each other by design to coexist. Workers can eat and shop in the retail and restaurant but also have office spaces nearby. It's also appropriate within this land use to have a mix of retail restaurants and hotels. They can be located in separate buildings or mixed into single buildings, a retail developments that encourage interconnectivity and pedestrian activity should be encouraged, which I'm sure will be provided connecting between the residential and commercial areas. Excuse me, sorry. So we did an analysis of the Handover County Futurally and Eucons, it is right adjacent, we wanted to make sure we were acknowledging that. So the area to the Woodside Lane area to the east of this project is neighborhood residential, 1.5 to three unit, dwelling units, they've changed the area to the South to an employment center. So office type uses there in Hanover County, and then that area to the North is their park. So under the transportation, they provided us with a transportation impact analysis. We did a review of that and coordinated with Beat Out on that review as well. They are through their profits and the concept plan, profaring to build all of the turn lanes that were recommended on 54 as well as any turn lanes that were recommended in and out of their site. Like all of the projects we've reviewed in this corridor, there is an issue, a potential issue with the Southbound Off-Ramp for 95. We don't expect any one project to possibly take that on, but this applicant has offered that prior to the commercial development they would extend the Southbound Off-Ramp. And so I think at the time of development, if we weren't ready or if we were working on the diverging diamond, we may coordinate with the applicant to perhaps, instead of building just that improvement, putting something towards the larger improvement. But staff feels comfortable with the transportation profits as submitted. I think we're very talked about that. I feel like I'm missing something. Where are you talking about all of that? So staff in reviewing this against the comprehensive plan for neighborhood, traditional neighborhood of one to four units per acre, well, I know what I missed the proffers. I knew there was a very important portion that we needed to review, but they were not cooperating and going into the presentation, so we are going to go through the actual document. And I apologize for that, but sometimes you just got to do what you got to do. And so you cannot see these probably, and I apologize if you all cannot see them, they're in the packet and they are online so the the first one is just a proper to the Concept plan and so the most recent concept plan is March 4th And it is that it will be built generally consistent with that plan There is a proper later about being able to amend that roadway if we work things out with the county. They're also profaring and that's not right. They've reduced the amount from one thirty one to one twenty six. So one hundred and twenty six residential units and it would be two point three nine dwelling units per acre max. There will be at a minimum, 50% total gross area reserved for open space. And they will have 10% of open space developed for recreational facilities. And within their proper statement that we have signed, not this one, it talks about those being available to the public. And we did ask them to add a new recreation area behind lot one. So they have the recreation area behind the town homes, and then they'll have a smaller one behind a single family lot one. No more than 30% of the dwellings can have front loaded garages, front loaded attached garages, and there shall be a variety of lot sizes and architecture for each of those units. The single family detached and single family attached units, for the primary structure, there will be a front yard setback and so I won't go through all the setbacks there. But they have a proper setback very similar to those for Lara Dow. If you want to visually kind of see what those would look like. And the covered open air porches, if they were to have any, oops, nevermind. So they have added a profit about porches. Let me see if I can find the right one. I'm sorry, it's just not, you need to have the right. Number five. What was that? 5A5 is for you. Is that what you mean? I think she's trying to find out. Yeah, but there's one that says there'll be a minimum of 6 by 8 feet. This is the wrong one. I apologize. Let me pull the right one. I'm sorry about that. They've done an excellent job of updating their profits, So I want to make sure that we, while we're here, I will show you the recreational area that was added. So they did just have this recreational area here, and again, that's gonna be for public use, but they added a smaller one here behind lot one. Well, you said play ground area. Yes, where your boots. Okay, here we go. Let's try this again There 126 units 2.39 Let's try this again, okay 126 units, 2.39. Let's try this again. Okay. So the minimum width is again in line with a large L, 50 feet for the single family lots, for the cottage lots, 44 feet. And then there's a requirement to have access if any, to the rear of units if they're on an alley. No, this one is, we like having in here no more than three single family houses on a block. She'll have the same front elevations that adds some of that variety that we're often inquiring about. This HOA document, or HOA number nine, is really talking about the HOA document that will be approved and we'll review that with our town attorney, but that they will maintain the stormwater facilities. The residential architectural features, this talks about the types of exterior finishes there. And A, talks about foundation walls. The previous proffers had talked about concrete being acceptable. And so that got removed. Talking about roof materials. The consistent design, we often talk about that foresighted architecture, so if there's a vinyl on the front, that would go around to the other sides. It could be any type of residential type. It's covered a lot in there between 1630 and 1950s. Here's the front porch one, so they added this at the request to staff that if there are front porches, there'll be a minimum of six by eight feet. That again comes straight from the comprehensive plan, talking about wanting people to have that porch feel. I'm talking about the window size, front building facades, and other one that we talk about in the comprehensive plan is having instead of a blank facade, a minimum of 20 to 30 percent of window area on that front facade. Talking about shutter height and you know these things seem kind of trivial but it really does make a difference from the road visually to have the shutter in line with the window size. Again, same thing for garage doors, minimum height, and all garages will have to be set back at least five feet from the front facade. And again, there's only 30% front loaded garages. Exterior lighting fixtures, that your accessory dwelling structure or accessory structures will match your main structure and then a minimum column size. And again, that comes straight from the comprehensive plan. You'll see here number 11 commercial architectural standards. There aren't a lot of specifics here and compares them to the residential, speculative type rezoning, building design, will the exterior be either eFIS masonry brick, hearty plank or architectural metal or other similar finished materials. Any portion, again this talks, that has a building column will have a minimum of six inches for that column and then architectural elevations will be submitted to town staff for review as part of the site plan. And I will say that with this proffer, it doesn't give us a lot of guidance. I mean, they'll submit it, but I don't have a lot that I would be able to review beyond what's already in our code. So our code already does somewhat talk about front facades and windows and such. Here number 12 is the one that has been added to allow us to work with Hanover County. Should they allow for that pipes them lot to have the road, then we would move that over, and that could be a change in the concept plan. Here are the transportation improvements. Improvements to the southbound I-95 ramp shall be constructed with the commercial development per the TIA assessment recommendations, which is the extension of that southbound off ramp. They will also provide us with those right-of-way dedications that will be needed for Woodside Lane. And so after the review of the Comprehensive Plan, the TIA, multiple department comments, staff is recommending approval of this project as submitted. Thank you so much. Thank you. And now if I would like to speak thank you. For the record I'm Henry Wilson and I'm here once again you guys should be getting tired of listening to me at this point. I want to thank your staff for doing such a good job helping me make this point. I want to thank your staff for doing such a good job, helping me make this a really good case, you know, with more going on a long time. So I'm here to answer any questions you might have as far as their plans and stuff going forward. Thank you. I have some questions about how the traffic is going to be handled. I have a traffic engineer with me. Well, I don't know how my questions are going to be deep enough. But one of the prior concerns was around woodside and that would be in a busy road. It's the main connector or whatever we call them. Sorry, I'm not close enough to my mic. And my concern is people come in going to the East on 54 and taking a left on woodside might want to cut through this neighborhood or people come in south on woodside trying to get to 54 might cut through the neighborhood. And that would be a concern for sort of the field and the traffic. And then sort of with that is once the commercial pad sites are going to belong to a business, there would be presumably a left turn or some ingress egress to those sites. And I just want to make sure that that's all been factored in from a transportation perspective, or particularly with regard to people sort of short cutting off of the intersection how it's being factored in. And I hate to I hate to cut you off because Mr. Merrill made a good point for me that because he just said a bunch of great stuff But I do want to I think we should allow the citizens to maybe speak first. Okay, and then we'll let the commission ask questions to the applicant and but not. Sorry, sorry, sorry, sorry, no. I'll check with my traffic engineer. You get to get the answer on that. Yeah, because I have a question about that as well. So yes, be prepared for that. But if any citizens would like to come and speak on this, thank you so much. Yes. And if you'll state your name and your address for the record. First of all, thank you so much. Joel Armeth, my address is 1-0-0-0-21 Wintercrest Drive. I live in Wintercrest subdivision right off 54, right down the street from Woodside Lane. I want to thank you for stopping to have a lot of traffic questions. Looking at, I'm not against the development per se, but I have a lot of traffic concerns and also water runoff concerns. And at the future planning developments of 95, that interchange doing a reverse diamond or wherever it's called. I see nothing for really improving the merge ramp. Northbound on 95 going to 54 east. It's really too short. It was designed poorly and there's no merge area, maybe 75 feet if that and I'll see any improvement for that unless you put a controlled light intersection off 95 and extend that ramp which I highly feel that's never going to happen. But there is some possible solutions to a problem. I bring a concern. I usually bring a solution. Not one of those people that just complain. But along 54, where all that commercial space, there's enough space there on their side to put around about, off woodside lane lane right there. But you're gonna be taking up their commercial area off 54. And it'll leave a lot of that traffic coming off a wood side lane right there from all those subdivisions and also this subdivision. So basically I'm asking, I see all the water there where it's at now. I don't know how they're planning to move that water out of that area and then build it up and change their green space into a really flat area somewhere else. I guess that's how they're planning to create a more solid area in the front where water stands, all 54. So but basically, don't allow no entrances on to 54. Leave that wood side lane and that whole big area into around about where you can get people coming in. They don't have to stop. It could be multiple lanes where people are coming in there and just go right down 54 and add more lanes on the 54. We still do not know how a Mount Herman road tees in the 54 right there. How much easement we're going to have? How much land we're going to have? This is the time before you approve all that commercial space on 54. We might need that donated to us for their development so we can alleviate some of those traffic concerns from iron horse development as well as their development, you know, getting on to that ramp because they're going to build more lanes right there. And I really feel sorry for the people who live off right there at Mount Hermann, those homes right there. I mean, they're eventually gonna be bought out. They have to be, because you're gonna have a road going right up to their front door, and I wouldn't want my children there, personally, with all that stuff. So this is the time to think about before you just give, come, you know, just approval for a design, think about the easements and the stepbacks you're gonna need for you're gonna need at least three Like two or three through lanes and then turn lanes for all the vehicles and then you're gonna have traffic lights up there Most likely for this reverse diamond off 95 You're gonna have controlled intersections and you're going to have backups. Today, just coming to this meeting, there's a backup always from the other side of Route 1, trying to get on England Street up to here. I had to go across the side road and cut through a residential neighborhood to get here on time for this meeting. I'm sorry I had to cut through their residential neighborhoods. I like to stay on the main roads and I really want to be considerate to my fellow neighbors by not cutting through their subdivisions, but that's what's going to happen. So I'm sorry about that. My apologies to the people I cut through their neighborhood. I should stay on the main roads where they're intended to, but please think about the setbacks are going to be required for these roads and the future improvements. So, and the easements going in and out of 54 where they can have multiple entrances along woodside and where they have a big controlled inner not a controlled intersection because that costs more money for those signage and more maintenance aspects to it. Give the responsibilities to the people that go through these roundabouts if they're designed correctly and big enough where you can have multiple lanes and they are safer they really are and also truck traffic and if you build them big enough the trucks can make a U-turn go back to some of these other areas because you know they always try to turn around at Taylor Park or do my subdivisions and they never quite make it. So, that's what I have to say. Thank you so much. Thank you. I appreciate you. And if anybody else would like to speak, you can come forth. Yes, please Good evening If you could just state your name in it. Yes for the record. Good evening. My name is June Celey. I live on Providence Park which is on the other side of Woodside Lane. So I'm just five houses away from this new development. I wasn't going to speak, but I have a couple of concerns. One is the housing density. I live in Providence Park, 211 homes. And now with this one, it's a lot of traffic coming on to 54 in Woodside Lane. But I guess my biggest concern is each time there's a development, each developer has their own traffic analysis, but they don't seem to take into account all and the other side of Woodside Lane on Providence Park, or Providence Church Road, Hanover County recently approved take a regrow of the various developments that are being made around where I live. We have Patrick Glen, we have Iron Horse, and on the other side of Woodside Lane on Providence Park, or Providence Church Road. Hanover County recently approved, take a regrow. So they all have their own little individual traffic studies, but none of them seem to take into account all of the development and all of the increased traffic from each of them. So that's my concern that. You know, when 95 gets backed up, their GPS routes them through woodside. And in this plant map, the first entrance to their subdivision is right across from Dr. Billy Smith's property. And it's just, I mean, you just barely come off of 54 on to Woodside, and there's the left into their subdivision. And then right after that is the right into ours. That first entrance is very close to 54. I don't really want it right across the street from my street, but it's, that's a lot of traffic to be coming through there. So that's my concern. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Would anybody else like to speak? All right. Thank you. Let me see if I can respond to some of these questions. Excuse me, Ms. Herri, are you closing the poll? Yes, I'm, I'm, I'm, I apologize. Yes, I'm closing the public hearing now. Thank you. Thank you, Ms. Vernie. Yes, I'm closing the public hearing now. Thank you. Thank you, Ms. Vernie. Yes, I'm closing the public hearing. Thank you. First, as far as getting through our neighborhood and people cutting through, the way we've got it, it would be tough to go ahead and run through my neighborhood because you have to go down and then up and out. Hopefully it'll get better if we can go ahead and make arrangements with Hanover County to buy that 120 foot right away I've made three offers over the last two years, but now they're gonna vote on it marks 27th and they're gonna go ahead and Before they they thought they might use that for for lane highway for the commercial development highway for the commercial development north of up there going through the park with the four lane highway but on the 27th they're voting basically take that off the comp plant so hopefully and I've already talked to the county and we ongoing discussions that right after they do that I should be able to come to some agreement with them because there's no use for them except for access into the park on that one. So I don't we don't really have a concern that will be a forland highway on woodside ultimately. Again we're giving them they'll have a hundred foot right away to go ahead and use to put a forland highway and that's always been on the comp plan as your major collector road the woodside area As far as Gentlemen spoke about it being wet. Yes, it's wet It's a lake there water features are ready on there and in fact The commercial site is site is seven acres, but to the west of the, there's only a small, maybe a coffee shop on the parcel to the west of the 120 foot right away that's on by hand over. Obviously we have about three and a half usable acres on the other side. And again, I think the plans, I understand the plans with iron sat and their commercial development, that they will probably, that they'll be a light at wood sat and possibly also at the road before that. I feel what that's going to do. Which one? Not her, right. I shouldn't forget that one. So we have two accesses going to Woodside. We have one or two accesses going to 54, which will kind of help people accessing in and out of the community. The lady did speak about the density being high and stuff, but we're at 2.3 million units per acre, and we're allowed up to four. So I think we're, you know, we come in under, obviously the maximum density. The interchange, the diamond interchange that everybody was talking about, they haven't even done the preliminary engineering on that yet. So that'll that'll be you know coming on soon I don't know it's your difficult interchanges to design I would think but you know it's coming I don't know when though and then I think that was pretty much respond to most of the questions. Thank you. Go ahead. What? Go ahead. Go ahead. Okay. What are you doing? Good evening. My name is Carl Holgren. Traffic engineer with Grove Slade here in Richmond. And we did the traffic study for the project and just to add on to what Hank was saying in response to the concerns that came up. The gentleman also asked about the off ramp from 95 northbound to 54 east and why can't that be improved made a better merge area. That's come up before. We did the traffic study for Hickory Grove as well and Hanover County and that was a question that came up and we looked into it and determined that that ramp is as far East as it can go because it runs into the I think it's a BP gas station there and the right of way tapers in really quickly. So they've built that ramp as far to the east as they can within the right of way. The question about the roundabout, that's something that has not been brought up. I'm not saying it's a bad idea, but it's something around about usually an alternative to a traffic signal. So for a roundabout to be put in at Route 54 and Woodside, that the volumes there would have to meet signal warrants most likely before V. would allow a roundabout to be considered there. And with most of the traffic from Woodside making the right turn to go back towards 95 or into town, it's just not close to meeting signal warrants. Because the signal warrants are driven by how many people would turn left off of woodside to go towards 301. And then the second speaker asked about, it seems like each development does their own traffic study, doesn't consider the other, send the area. That's not the case. In fact, in the Patriot Glenn traffic study we did. We included all the trip potential of Hickory Grove. We did that traffic study as well. So the Patriot Glenn traffic study basically just piggybacks on top of the Hickory Grove traffic study. So the Hickory Grove traffic is in there. And not just that, but we also did fresh traffic counts along 54, and we applied a 1.5% growth rate to every traffic volume, left throughs and rights, for a number of years out to the build out of this project. So that accounts for other growth in the area. It doesn't account for iron horse. That's a much bigger project, but we did account for Higry Grove and background traffic in our study as well. And the question about the location of the first driveway on Woodside and the distance from 54, the site plan is not on the screen, but all four access points exceed V. spacing standards for driveways. That's why we located them where we did. And that southern driveway on Woodside, even a build out of Patriclin, the queue on Southbound Woodside will not spill back and block that first driveway. We've checked that. So I just wanted to address that one as well. Thank you so much. Thank you. Yep. If you have any other traffic questions, I'll... Brent, I don't know if we cut you off if you had further. Brent was asking some thoughtful stuff. So, and I'm not sure who this is, excuse me, I'm not sure who this is best answered by, but you, in the good discussions with the town, there were some proffers and some looking at the, at both 54 and the entrances, and I know there's a potential change with right away with the county. But as those commercial sites come up, it seems there's going to be additional left turns for people going east on 54 and right turns that might be trying to get into the commercial through what may end up being an intersection that would side-onchips. We're wondering how you factor in a commercial lot when there's no, it's going to have a parking lot of this size, it's going to have this many people coming in, it feels like that couldn't have been sort of baked in. Just asking how that gets addressed or if it's maybe it's not a concern if the overall approach to 54s can be wide enough for multiple left turn lanes. Right. So in the traffic study we assume there'd be some commercial development in both land base and with those trips it definitely warrants a left turn lane from eastbound 54 into both driveways. So what we've recommended in the study is basically taking the, there's already a left turn lane at woodside, you know, on 54 turning on the woodside. So we'd basically be picking up that widening there and just carrying it back to the west across the properties frontage. And that'll create a left turn lane into both driveways. That on the north side of 54 where the direct is occurring all the way to 95. No, just to the just during where the property frontage right will create a Left turn lane of 200 with 200 feet of storage at the West driveway and then taper it back so that the tapering might go past the property line but across the Patriot Glen property frontage 54 will be a three-lane a three-lane roadway with left turn lanes into both drives and then preserve the left turn on the woodside as well and then at the west driveway we're also proposing a right turn lane turning in from 54 westbound. So when you refer to the driveways do you mean these two roads through the through the development or do you mean additional driveways into the commercial space? Just the two driveways that connect to 54. That are already on the site plan. The ones that are already on the site plan are on those driveways. Okay. That's right. But allowing for there may be additional depending on the businesses. There will be. Agress, right? They could also be additional entrances to the commercial. No, man. That's not the problem. They would only go in here and only go in here and over. That's correct. Yeah, the retail parcel, the commercial parcels will be served internally. Not from 54, not from 54, right? It might have helped. This might be a question from Miss Ames. Were we not provided with the traffic study or should we not be provided with it? Or it was not in my or maybe I don't have the right packet. Did y'all have it? Or I haven't been in your packet. Was it not in your packet? I didn't have it. It wasn't in mine. I can pull that up for you. It's a lot of technical information that, OK, I apologize. I wouldn't have probably read it thoroughly. Well, me neither. I just feel I just With so much good. This this This I think a lot of our questions and concerns the TIA the traffic was in last months Materials okay, and it was not provided this month this attachment And it's pretty large I think I really should have. But it's my fault. It should have been there almost coming back because we were being provided more information, or the TIA study was coming. So then that is my fault for not. We didn't give you more information. We just in the staff report, we did a more thorough analysis than we were able to do last month. OK. But I'm happy to pull that up. As I mentioned, V.R.V.U.D. the TIA and public works in engineering reviewed the TIA. And I looked over it as well. And what was mentioned is accurate. We do need that additional right away on 54 and woodside, all of the recommended. So the way at TIA works is that we sit down and we scope out what intersections we want to be looked at and then the applicant sends their consultant out and they look at those intersections and they do traffic counts and then we get an AM and PM peak number and so and then we get an analysis of the existing traffic and then an analysis of what's proposed with that new traffic. And so for example, if their build out was 2029, they also kind of bake in a 1.5 percent growth in that area knowing that there's other areas growing. But then as was mentioned, they also add in any background data. So any application that's already been approved or is under works, then that background data, even if it's not already built and that traffic's not there, gets put into their analysis. But for iron horse, for example, since we don't have an application yet, we did not ask them to include that in their background data. But iron horse, if this were approved, would have to include that within their analysis. And so the main item that isn't going to get addressed until the commercial is that 95 Southbound ramp. Everything else on 95 is functioning fine according to all the analysis analyses that we've received. Except for that Southbound off ramp. And that isn't impacted until the commercial development comes on. So the 126 residential units aren't significantly impacting it, but when you bring in that commercial, it really does. So I hope that helps somewhat, but it did get a thorough review. And I apologize that it wasn't in this month. No, no, that's OK. Thank you. And you don't have to pull it up or anything. It's very hard if you don't know how to read it. I mean, we put it in your packet. But for you, all the most important parts are the recommendations. And that's just a few lines. And it talks about the 54 turn lanes, which they've profored to do, and then that 95 Southbound ramp. That I guess that's where my concern, because that's where I wrote, where is the TI is number 13? Just to me, that's just not enough info, but maybe there is more. It's just, yeah, the transportation improvements just didn't seem so. So the transportation improvement, what they're doing is kind of above and beyond what we would have asked them to do They're going to put in the additional off ramp Spacing that we need which means getting permitting through federal highways and constructing that Improvement So here let me see what we are asking for the change so that we can have the commercial there, but we don't really know exactly what that might entail once that comes. Kind of. So they have accounted for kind of the highest type of commercial that we would see there. Okay. Okay. I'm going to get off track. Yeah. And that was just to help clarify. I appreciated the answer and it makes sense to me that they would do a a guesstimate based on what kind of business might come and then multiply that by 1.5 and use that to figure out turn lanes. It also makes a difference. I was thinking there would be direct access from 54 into the parking lots of those buildings as well as to the driveways development. So that the flow changes significantly if it's gonna be constructed where you go in and then to a parking lot of whatever the business is. So it's right for us to have the concerns and poke, but that particular concern I'm comfortable now. Thank you. You want to go? You do. I've, so Nora, it was new news to me today that the through road from the county is perhaps off the table. Have you heard that similarly? This was our parallel road. It's not unless I misinterpreted. No, it's somewhat new to us. I mean, they've been saying all along that if the data center project to the north goes through, then they would not have a need for a major collector. Which would have been the parallel road. I think there was concern by that applicant of having a major collector. Which would have been the parallel road. I think there was concern by that applicant of having a major collector go by those neighborhoods and so that's why it's interesting, that's why it got moved over. And so if that project gets approved, which would it got deferred to later, is it March this month I believe, then we have been told that there would be consideration of removing that from their transportation plan. Which I was excited to hear. I was excited and that yeah that just came like I said and within the past week. So we will be meeting with them. So that's great. It's related to my hopes with Wash Lacy Park right because I know that that park is what creates that big cut right through this development. And I would, I guess in the previous one, when you came last fall, I was excited to hear that access to the park would still be provided on a road or something that would take its place, which is now. Parking area, I'd probably it when I was in the house. Yeah, because that's one of my favorite spots. And so that's why. You can do it park. So that is all the table with the county. Yeah. I appreciate that. So my concern is about access to that park and that park continuing to be, I think, a jewel and having access to it. So the third road hearing that was interesting to me. I do agree with the soginess of that property. And I wonder if the new FEMA maps that we're waiting on will have any impact on that. It seems now those won't impact it. The wetlands have been already approved and submitted and approved on Army Corps. So there shouldn't be any changes. been already approved and submitted and approved on Army Corps. Okay. So there shouldn't be any changes. Yeah, my only, I was only wondering if that would impact what we have. It's a great question. The FEMA maps deal with flood planes and flood planes come from waterways and there are no waterways. So there are no streams or creeks. Except for that little one just to the north of the property. That's the one that is slated and creak. Slated and creak to the north, right? And I don't know how much that impacts all of the pond, the standing water that's further to the south. But again, I think as a commission, we've talked about our concern for runoff. And we've obviously prioritized that with our capital improvement funding request that stormwater management and I don't know how much that pond serves that purpose, but I you know imbalancing that with my concerns about in general I'm in favor of development there too, but realizing that that is a very very wet area as I've tried to ride my bike through it and have not been successful so I'm aware that that would I would think impact the development and the further use of that of that property and then what would happen with the standing water that normally sits there where would it go would it flow to the north to that creek which might have impact or would it come across the road or so again engineers smarter than me are I'm sure are working on that. I'm sorry, I'm sorry. I'm sorry. You need come to the microphone. I do appreciate your answering. I just wanted to let you know that we'll try to give as few impacts as we can. And that lake on that the west side there, we've only got room to put maybe a coffee shop. That's what I was doing. And that's it. You know, it'll be almost a water feature at that point. But we don't plan to go ahead and do anything with that. We stay away from the wetlands. It just doesn't make any sense to. No, I agree. And even the proposed open area or the public access space was going to be right adjacent. So I get it's going to be hard to build anything there. So just again concerns, questions, comments. That's like yeah, you know, because it's a little lake right there, you know. And I also don't know how much you can control this, but I would love to, again, because I'm a bicycleer, I would love to be able to create some space for bicycles or indoor walkers. We do talk about trying to connect neighborhoods and communities to the center part of Ashland. We're planning on putting a walk by Cycle Path down 54 and then up the road. If that's one of the components of the deal I'm trying to make with Hanover, where we would actually go ahead and take that and then run a bike path all the way up to the park. That's great. I mean, I appreciate hearing that. Yes, and everything. So again, I've been working on that for two years, trying to get them to figure it out. Sure. OK. I don't want to dominate too much more time. I think I've had most of my concerns or questions that I was taking notes on addressed. So I'll yield to Linda or somebody else. Amy, whoever wants to go. Right, so my main concern didn't involve the traffic per se. I think that the site plan and the development here looks very nice. And I think it looks like it's keeping with what's in the county across the Providence and other neighborhoods to the east. I just hate seeing a highway commercial right next to a residential neighborhood. To me, I think this was a nice neighborhood and hopefully is bikeable and walkable and I would rather see a neighborhood commercial, a joint in the neighborhood. The county's zoning or future land use, whatever it is, put that little part that the county has that faces 54 on the north side of 54 is neighborhood commercial. Now I know on the south side of 54 all of that is going to be iron horse and that's going to be office and office park and not a neighborhood type thing. But so my main thing was those seven acres I would prefer to see a zoning of something more relative to the neighborhood that's being built. I know it's speculative so you don't know what would go there. It could be very neighborhood oriented. You say coffee shop, that's certainly neighborhood oriented. But it could also be a fast food or a gas station with a conditionally used permit. It could be a lot of other things that aren't as user for our aren't as neighborhood friendly. So that was my main concern. I guess that does raise a question for me and I think I appreciate you sharing that. We put a lot of thought into how the comp plan talks about use of space and mixed can go either way. Right, mixed. And it's mixed. Is there anything profiter planned as far as the separation? I know the road is there on the clap, but the separation between or buffering between the businesses and the neighborhoods. Yes, sir. Yeah, different. Yes, we're planning on buffering all the way against the commercial as a buffer. And we'll be back here working with the staff and probably come to you guys on the CUP for that commercial when we get a user. So you'll have a crack at it again at that point. But we plan on putting in the buffers landscaping that whole thing. And Linda, for part of my thinking is that as one of the really main roads, we would a couple acres spread across that road and then it's a neighborhood. So I like some assurance that once we get to what the business is, there's going to be, you know, the business is going to butt right up against and, you know, have flights that bother the people in these houses or whatever. I work closely with the staff on that. We'll only go ahead and get a user. I don't think you'll be happy with it. And all of the traffic on 50 will go into the commercial. We'll go in. We'll be using the same road as the neighborhoods. But really, to me, should be an integral part somehow of the neighborhood. Right. And just a small amount of uses that'll be neighborhood oriented. Yes. Yes. Amy and I were just conferring over the map and wanting to make sure we saw the new map that we proposed, rather that I have an old version here, so we were just comparing our notes. In our future land use on what we just approved in the new comp plan for that stretch along 54 is mixed business, which was aimed to swim over. Unlike the highway commercial across the road. Interstate. Interstate commercial across the right. The same is this might be a question for you. I'm just curious. This is a little bit off of the path now under I don't know what I'm saying would be called but right here where it's like a little checklist from our analysis of the residential Guidelines from the comprehensive plan. Yeah, may I just ask why for use of low impact design measures for storm order? It says no and for some. So low impact design are kind of in. Is mostly anything other than a large storm palm, a BMP, which is what most developments do. And you can see on their concept plan, they're providing a large BMP which is what most developments do and you can see on their concept plan they're providing a large BMP. Honestly on the planning side we really like the low impact design we like the individual onsite storm water management facilities or maybe you put in rain gardens or have rain barrels but on the engineering side if if you ask public works, they very much do not like the low impact design and just want to have one large BMP that has to be maintained and suspected. So every few years we're required to inspect those types and we found that if you put in a rain garden, it works well when it's installed, but it's not maintained or homeowners don't understand how to maintain it or they dig out the plant material and mulch over it, or put stones over it. And so, unfortunately, the way that works out, public works would much rather have the BMP. So, most all of our applicants, while we put that on our checklist and would like it, most applicants, go the route of engineering a BMP. Okay. Which is best management practice, I think, for store modern. like at most applicants go the route of engineering of BMP. Which is best management practice, I think the four store modern. And then the same for the green building practices. Again, Earthcraft was really popular when we created the comprehensive plan. Less residential builders are going through Earthcraft certification. A lot of them have adopted some of the design elements from Earthcraft, so the different types of materials, but they are not getting the certification. It adds a pretty significant cost to get the certification, but we have found that a lot of the builders are using some of the concepts. Great question though. Thank you. And not so much. This is not a question, but just more of a comment. I know I always say this, but I am a little bit bothered. I hope I can say that a little bit bothered by that we say that this is a yes to mixed income area. I just don't see or whose mixed income are we discussed. Well really fantastic. I mean the town homes will be a lot more affordable as far as the actual price than the single-family homes. Okay so you have some smaller single-family, larger single-family, two-plex homes and town homes. But it was between three and five, kick. Right. Which is a pretty significant range as far as affordability. Okay. And only other brief micro-comment, I don't want to interrupt you, Steph. No, no, no, no, please. Because we got into the same thing. You know, I am a fan of the dark sky designation keep bringing it up. Make sure that's represented. I think I'm good right now. Thank you all. Thank you. No, I'm not. I'm not going to be able to do that. I'm not going to be able to do that. I'm not going to be able to do that. I'm not going to be able to do that. I'm not going to be able to do that. I think I'm good right now. Thank you all. Thank you. No, I had my questions with traffic and water, so I'm good. They were answered. Do you mind if I go back to the water question? I looked up the FEMA map and the creek is much further north Closer to James Town Road. Yeah, okay. Thanks For it not a consensus The only other that I've brought up in the past is that when we were talking about West 54 was that was a development that was occurring next to Kitty Kingdom. And this is occurring next to Hanover Academy. Are they aware of this as far as we know? Or have they been? That's, I know there are homes on that Western side of this proposal development too, but they're the only other entity I know that's over there. I wonder if that was. They are an adjoining property owner so they received a letter. I have not heard from them. Do you recall hearing from Hanna for Academy? Maybe off their radar completely. I know they'd love to have more students. I'm sure they will do math. Appreciate the proximity to a lot of perhaps we could get a trail connecting. Maybe. Just to help me or help my poor memory. Hanover Academy has a different access than the access we're talking about. So there will be construction, building against their perhaps. Yeah, not some of the simple ones. It depends what they what will be developed left of the, or west of those power lines, right? Because the power lines cut through. There's not any development that's going on up their head, handle the cat. OK. No, that is. Not close enough. And that would be the open area that would be designated where the pond is. And yeah. OK. So I'll pull up the, so everyone can see. So you see the North West quadrant there, that cut out, that's Hanover Academy. Okay, you have to do it. And so you can see it does but I'm afraid. That's right, I guess that's. Our lines, all is the recreation area that's proposed and then the rest is wet. And their access comes in off of Francis. And public access to that area which I was glad to hear that's a that's a pleasant proper would be through that road just to the south that you can see it's a little walkway or walkway. OK. And those are units there, though, right at the bottom left hand corner. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, that road is right where that pond is. But I know it's going to be a workaround. But because I know the pond sits just below into the west of those power lines, but. And so the area they've called out for the recreation area won't be in the wetlands. I don't know. And the only other now, thank you for pulling this map up, Nora. The only other piece that I think seems obvious, but excluded is that horizontal connector, that east west at the northern end of the property that's being paused through the park, that if a road gets developed there, then it would obviously just proceed with having that cut through and then still provide access to the park, the road, I suppose. Correct. park via road I suppose correct yep nothing else from me yeah so we think I mentioned this in the past as regards this development, but this is a really, in my view, this is a really complex piece of property to do anything with. And we have been looking favorably generally on sort of the pod mixed use kind of development where there's an effort made to have sort of cottage and town home and all because it does Overall increase the density that we're looking for broadly for for Ashland and Then I did have a number of concerns as it's articulated by some of the citizens coming in here But it sounds like they've been largely addressed through what I'm sure was a complicated process between staff and the applicant. So I'd love to hear more questions and concerns, but if my colleagues are in any kind of similar headspace to where I am, I would be ready to make a motion about this. Yeah, I do think it's going to have a significant, this and the iron horse and the new development. I mean, it's going to have a impact on 54. And is three lanes enough? I don't know, you know, I was thinking and granted experts have done this work. It's actually gonna be four lanes, two lanes, and a divided center end. Okay, I guess I was misunderstanding that. I was thinking it would just be eastbound, westbound, and a churn lane. On 54. Three lanes in front go in one direction in front of the commercial. No, I was thinking yeah, I was thinking I didn't realize. Alternate right of way is 100 feet so to a two lane divided so there would be a median in the middle. And the me lands on the north lane on the southbound. Westbound two lanes eastbound starting just where would side it would end up it was yes exactly and then going all the way to westbound to not all the way to 95 and the median is not available it's sort of like what 54 is west of 95 like they would just have plants or trees or right it's not a turning lane there would be but there would be cutouts cutouts to turn With perhaps because I do think we should have this discussion knowing what's coming with iron horse, right? Because this is going to be right across the street from iron horse and that's significant and I do think the The impact on 54 is gonna be is gonna be big and the impact on woodside is going to be big. And granted, that's county. I know that, right? That's a county issue, not a town issue. But the part of 54 that goes there, I didn't thank you for clarifying that. I didn't realize it was two lanes. He's bound two lanes westbound. There on 54 with a medium. That alleviates some of my anxiety about that. And clearly if there are biker walk lanes on the north side, that would be encouraging as well. But yeah, I think granted, the studies have been done. It's just apparent to me that that's going to impact that road. Thank you. I don't know what you're saying. I'm not kidding. Well, I think if someone's comfortable, we might be at that, even if we're not in the consists. Yeah, we want to. We're having to answer. I moved to recommend approval of REZ23-1031 and ORD2023-14 to the Ashlandtown Council is presented by the applicant. Thank you Mr. Davis. With the submitted proffers. With the submitted proffers. Mr. Marell. Aye. Ms. Wright. Aye. Mr. Chambers. Aye. Ms. Hay. Aye. Ms. Hare. Aye. Motion carries. Thank you all. Thank you so much. Thank you. And I had told him not to bring his traffic engineer, so I'm glad he did. Yes. Especially for the yes, thank you so much. All right. And our next public hearing, thank you Miss Amos for CUP 24-0125 Flag Stop Car Wash. Good evening. You might be feeling a little deja vu here. So as you all recall last year we did review a rezoning request and conditional use permit for Flagstap car wash. Since that time we've been reviewing their site plan and through that review they were, they received their official determination on their wetland maps and after that official determination which came after the rezoning in a significant way into the site plan review they realized that there were more wetlands on the site than they originally had thought. So I'll go through this if you recall condition number three for their conditional use for the car wash said that wetlands would not be disturbed. Unfortunately, with this new review in order to move forward with what they had laid out originally, approximately 4,000 square feet will have to be disturbed. Through that, they will have to mitigate, and a lot of times what that means is they'll buy credits and kind of preserve wetlands in another area. That's kind of the easiestlands in another area. That's kind of the easiest way I can explain that. So the request we had this evening for conditional use permit 24-0125 is a request from Jamie Nester of RVA wash holdings to rezone the property. Oh, I thought I fixed that. I apologize. We're not re-zoning it. We just doing a conditional use permit that I confuse you. Let's just move on. So this is an aerial. The property is located south of the Sheets property on Route 1, just south of Ashcake Road. It does share an entrance with the Sheets property. So you all re the sheets property. Let's see. So you all re-zoned the property. It is now zone B2 currently. So we're not reviewing a zoning case here other than the conditional use permit. It was an undeveloped wooded lot and again under a site plan review currently. They have a shared access easement with the sheetsets property that will be a write-in write-out because there is a median there on route one. People could go through the Sheets property and connect up to Ashcake if desired. So this is an example of the car wash on Atley which it'll be very similar in design. There, we do have our requirements for 20-foot landscape setback and a minimum of 50% of that has to be landscaped. And so here's the schematic design that came out of their site plan review. You can see that area kind of highlighted in a yellow tan color of roughly 3,500 square feet of proposed wetlands, and then roughly 4,400 square feet of additional wetlands. And so their current condition, number three, is that the confirmed wetlands on the property shall be adequately protected and not disturbed. Staff is recommending that we amend that, that the applicant must follow all state and federal requirements for disturbing wetlands and no more than 4,000 square feet of wetlands shall be disturbed. All of their confirmed wetlands on the property shall be adequately protected and not disturbed. The applicants are here. I'm sure they'd be happy to speak to this and how they came about it and the impacts if they were to move. I mean, because we obviously did sit down with them and say how can we perhaps move the layout, but it's a very tight site and it would impact them pretty significantly if they had to make that amendment. So staff is recommending a amendment to the conditional use permit, keeping all of the other conditions the same and Just amending condition number three So after the public hearing happy to answer any questions you have. Thank you so much Good evening Mike Rothermel here on behalf of the applicant I just want to introduce who's with me tonight Jamie Nester is Arthur Mel here on behalf of the applicant. I just want to introduce who's with me tonight. Jamie Nester is CEO and president of Flagstop. And Steve King is with SilverCore. They're the civil engineers on the project. So yeah, we were here last year talking about this project. I won't get back into all the reasons. We thought it was a good project and just sort of addressed why we're here tonight. The, you know, obviously my client did have a wetlands expert consultant hired before we came in for the resounding. Even experts get it wrong sometimes I guess. They had identified the wetlands that sort of linear wetlands along the southern property line. So when staff recommended the condition three that said no wetlands would be impacted, we obviously had no issue with that. When the Army Corps came out to more specifically or more formally delineate the wetlands, they identified a small area. I'll refer to it as a little peninsula area that sort of jets up a little bit into the layout of the site. We met with the town with Norenstaff and looked at different alternatives to see if we could reconfigure the site. Steve can come up and sort of talk about this, but it's really impossible to reconfigure it because you're creating more impacts by pushing some of the improvements sort of talk about this, but it's really impossible to reconfigure it because you're creating more impacts by pushing some of the improvements sort of back farther on the property if that were even possible. So we identified and are fine with sort of the cap on the square footage of wetlands that would be impacted. Our understanding from again from the wetlands expert is you know that they've talked to the state and federal authorities on this you know it's a it's a provable sort of by right through permitting it's not a very large area so we're in simply to request amendment to that one particular CUP condition. To answer any questions, brought the folks with me that can answer technical questions as well. Thank you. I will, if any citizens would like to come forth that way I can kind of do it the right way and then close our public hearing. See a nobody. I will go ahead and close our public hearing. Thank you. Are there any questions? I guess my concern in this may show a lack of my depth of understanding of wetlands. Is there the potential of impacting surrounding properties that we weren't looking at before that we now need to consider in terms of You could do the mitigation for construction, but is there going to be water that's going to like end up somewhere else and we're going to hear about that? Or does that not how wetlands mitigation works? Yeah, I don't think so and Steve I don't know if you can offer anything and I just see is not the wetlands expertise the civil engineer But the Army Corps in the DEQ have very strict permitting But the Army Corps and the DEQ have very strict permitting requirements. I believe it's going to be a two to three month process to get these permits even given the small amount of disturbance that's occurring here. But are you able to speak? Thank you. I'm Steve King with Silver Corps to the Civil Engineering Plans. In general, this is kind of just a little swale that captures some drainage when the wetlands experts come out, they're looking for certain soil types, certain plant growth, certain maybe insects or things like that, that they have a chart of 100 different things and if it ticks enough boxes, it might be considered wetlands. It doesn't necessarily mean that a lot of runoff is coming to it. It's actually a fairly small drainage area. But in our calculations for stormwater management, at the outfall point where this runs up to Route 1, we have to be under what the pre-existing runoff was. So even if we disturb some wetlands there, we're still having to accommodate with our underground attention system any increased drainage. So we actually have to reduce it by 20% based on the state regulation. When this is completed, less water will be leaving the site than is currently leaving the site. I appreciate that. Thank you. The one map was helpful to see that the impact might be on the structure if there were to be. I guess obviously accommodations are being like thinking about it the other way, not only the damage to the environment perhaps, but it doesn't sound like there's, could it damage this structure, like if it does flow that way, it looks like the impact area would go where the building, where the main building would be, but maybe that's been accounted for and there's no real concern by the, there was one, the one map that had the, there, one, the one map that had the, there that right here. Right. So if there was going to be a possibility of something happening, it looks like if anything would happen, it would impact the building. And was it misreading that? Yes. So that, the permit, Steve can correct me if I'm wrong, but the permit will allow sort of the regrading and filling inside area. That's it. And what would happened here, what we think anyway, there's sort of a topographical anomaly on the property. If you look at the topography, it's sort of all natural and flows, except for this one area, which I've sort of called the peninsula area, that just seemed to be sort of an artificial high point on the property, didn't seem to match the rest of the topography and we don't know what that was. Maybe somebody moved Earth at some point in the past or that seemed to have just maybe caught some water and maybe that's how that was created. But anyway, so the permit will allow sort of that area to be filled and there won't be any issue then And this this has been informed by the new FEMA maps then I'm a one trick pony with my FEMA maps tonight. It is I appreciate it. See all those FEMA questions for next month So again, this is wetlands, which is our Chesapeake Bay Preservation Act mapping, not necessarily the floodplain mapping, which was being a designated waterway. You got it. I have any questions? No, just to clarify, the change in the proper is, rather than saying that the wetlands have to be adequately protected and not disturbed. We're changing it to say you're going to follow all state and federal requirements because you are disturbing them. But we don't need to get into the weeds or pardon the pun of what those requirements are. We just trust that this prop for me, as you will do it. All of the engineers will take care of it. Our public works engineers will take care of all that. It's an interesting observation to me. This is very superficial. That the while route one is sort of a diagonal road there, that the building and the roads are not running parallel with it. Like I would think a lot of times when you design a building, you design it to face the road that you're on. It's just a curious observation, and it has no impact on anything, but I just noticed, you know, it's not sort of angled for the roads and everything else to get to it. It's like set at an end. This is the way Ashcake curves. Everything's carving around. Right. Like you see even the buildings below. Yeah, everything's oriented. Anyway, it's just an observation and obviously I'm not a construction expert, but it was just something that I thought was I don't have anything. Anything? In that case, I move that we approve the CUP 24-0125. Looks like stop car wash. I don't have the language in front of me. Proper amendment. I'm sorry. I don't need it. A front of me. Proper amendment. I'm sorry, I don't mean that. Couple of amendments. Here we are. Thank you. Yeah, of CUP 24-0125. Yes, with the 10 minutes. Yes, with the amendment. Yeah. Mr. Chambers. Hi. Mr. Merrill. I. Ms. Hay. I. Ms. Wright. I. Ms. Hare. I. Motion carries. Thank you all. Thank you. Thank you. Thanks. And we don't have any action items tonight, so we will go on to our report of committees. This is Paul Hart. Excuse me. I have the same scurvy stuff that our tile manager has, I think. First of all, good evening commissioners and staff, and I appreciate being here to see me. Thank you. Well, then Paulins getting bad, too. Yes,, it is I think allergies. It's all those crazy things that what I thought you might enjoy a copy With the very very few changes that town council made to the 24. Thank you so much to the 2024 comprehensive plan so with the help of Bernie. I got that sent out to you I thought just you'd like to see it and I want to once again say the very few few changes that we made in it, it was a wonderful document. But there are a couple of things I wanted you to know that the town council did vote on the comprehensive plan. We did approve it five to zero. And there were just a few minor changes, mostly in either verbiage or something that we wanted to clarify so that we aligned with Hanover County. And the two areas that I know most people were concerned about, it spent a lot of time discussing. One was the baseball fields at Sneet Street near St. Anne's Church. And we suggested changing that land use from residential to government because we thought it was so important that we try and keep the baseball fields for our community. And we thought that that might be a better way for us to suggest or a desire of a town to have them. So we approved that five to zero so we did change that from residential to government and then at the Lora Dell Luck Farm area at Lora Dell the right side of 54. We chose to keep that as neighborhood residential with an open space in the front and thinking that it was going to continue with the present-day density of Laura Dahl and no commercial development in that area. And then on was a definite, I guess a definite decision, a definite, you know, cut and dry idea of what we wanted there so that people wouldn't be one-ring well, if it's going to be open space, what are they going to do, is you know, that type of thing. So we changed that to town edge and therefore someone can still build on it, but it's only a density of 1 to 2 dwellingsings so that's why we thought to go in that direction. We approved that it was a three to two vote but we did approve that. We did have a presentation recently about data centers very interesting because we know that there's a concern about data centers so we did have a recent presentation on that. Also, Ashen is going to team up with Hanover County to install emergency vehicle emitters on all of our traffic lights that's going to hopefully help the response time for emergency vehicles to get through traffic lights. And I think there's nine of them that they're working on that. And finally last night we started working on a budget which is going to take us through until June but now is the time for citizens to share with us how they like and I'm just going to be looking at the community and I'm just going to be looking at the community and seeing the community and seeing the community and seeing the community and seeing the community and seeing the community and seeing the community and seeing the community and seeing the community and seeing the community and seeing the community and seeing the community and seeing the community and seeing the community and seeing the community and seeing the community and seeing the community and seeing the community and seeing the community and seeing the Did we see, I forget where this landed, how the council ended up with their CIP top, remember how we always see like where staff, commission, and council, did, Oh, you mean when our top 10 things were? Top five, I don't want you to, We had to decide the memory, right? I did, I got to send video, you all did. No, no, I don't want to put you on this spot. I just, I think that's always on the C. I'm happy to write it. We can know that and send it to him. We can send it. Oh, OK. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Well, send you the CIP ranking. That's a great question. I always get to see and check on the staff rank. I like to compare them as well. So we can easily send you that. And then we'll also send you the presentation on the data centers. I heard it was a great presentation, so we'll make sure you get that. Yeah, and I sat in. No, sorry, yes. There was an interesting presentation that the council heard from Dominion that I thought they had the Dominion rep speak. That was the data center people. Was that the same? Yeah. Okay, so that was interesting to hear. Very interesting. Yeah, I think you like to take note of that. I think that's what we've got to kick out of seeing that. Thanks, Nina. Thanks, Nina. Thanks. Thank you. Okay, don't keep. So you should have a copy of our manager report in your packet, and then I'll just go over some of the other items, and then happy to answer any questions you might have. So our smart scale pre-application meetings and smart scale for those who don't remember me talking about this two years ago is the statewide system to kind of divvy out money for large projects that are on corridors of statewide significant. So it's some of our larger projects. Last time we got funded the connection between Route 1 and Hill Carter Parkway along Cream and Chimney Court. And then we also got the Hill Carter Parkway North just beyond true hotels connecting up to Corals Road. We got that funded through Smart Scale. Those projects, it's a long term funding process, so those have not begun, but we believe engineering will be started in the next couple of years for those projects and then moving forward, but they are fully funded through smart scale. And so the applications for the next round, which we have every two years, pre-applications are due by the end of this month. And so we are working on those. We also continue to work with state officials on the I-95 star study, which is a kind of redo of our study we did in 2015 and 2016 to see if that diverging diamond is still our best option for the interchange. And through that we have forwarded them all the TIAs we've received through county projects and town projects in that area. So it's been really helpful that they're able to take that data and not necessarily have to replicate it. They can just put it into their modeling systems. We're in the process of hiring a new planner. Bernie and I will tell you it can't happen soon enough. We are starting interviews. If you know anyone, we didn't get a ton of applicants. So if you know anyone who would like to apply, please send them our way or if you have any channels that you could share our job ad. We are doing interviews, but I'm happy to take additional applications. I was excited I got to do the Advanced College Academies, which is ACA program, which is kind of run through Reynolds College. I got to do their amazing shake. It was so fun. I thought I might see you there. But it was a lot of fun. Got to meet with the night through 12th graders and did kind of mini mock interviews. And so if that comes up again, I forwarded out to you. It was the first time they did it, but it was really well run. And I think the students learned a lot and really enjoyed it. A lot of them came in nervous as you can understand. But it was really rewarding experience. God, we got to do that. Add it to your calendars. If you haven't heard about it, then you don't live with Mr. Chambers. The Secretariat Unveiling is March 30. They're having a whole day event between 11 a.m. and 4 p.m. Please do come out and check that out. It's going having a whole day event between 11 a.m. and 4 p.m. Please do come out and check that it's going to be fantastic. And a ton of work from the the Secretary Committee has gone into making this a reality and getting it done by the 30th. Yes, thank you. The thing you all are probably sick of hearing me talk about, micro transit, starts next Monday on the 18th. We are having a ribbon cutting right outside and I would very much love to see you all there to celebrate what I think is a great service for the town of Ashland. And then if you could also just ride it constantly so our numbers look good. It would be much appreciated. I will have them. So that's 11 a.m. on Monday, kind of ribbon cutting celebration and the mayor will be speaking and Some folks from the state and GRTC will be there as well. That's that's one that's sort of on call, right? Yes, kind of like an Uber absolutely And then next We are economic 12th staff participated in Randolph-Making College Edge Program Career Boot Camp. They too said that was kind of a two-day event, said that that was a fantastic opportunity to do a similar type of program with our college students who moved through the Edge Program. Also, Kelly Frankie is participating in the Richmond, Virginia Chamber Leadership Lab and then we are also partnering with Downtown Ashland Association on their multiple entrepreneur initiatives and so they received a couple grants from the state and they're using that for several different opportunities to train new businesses as well as existing businesses here in town. And so happy to answer any questions you may have. Thank you. None for me. I have a question. This is really odd. The new Popeyes? Yes. Has a really tall sign. How did that happen? I just coming off it's the existing Burger King, but you'll notice they also have no other signs on their building because if you have a non-conforming sign, you're not allowed to have, you're not allowed to put up new signs. And so we told them, bring your sign down and you can have all the signage you want on your building. And they decided they wanted to keep the sign. And they keep trying to put up signs and we keep telling them we're sorry. I hate I want the Popeyes to do well. I want them to have all the signs but it's a role and until we change the role that's in the purpose of the role is to get rid of those non-conforming signs so that we can get to the you know the standard that we'd like. I didn't mention which I think I should, that the Economic Development Authority last month granted a grant to Duncan, Duncan Donuts, to demolish 802 English Street, the old kind of loan max building, two story white building near a cookout, and Taco Bell in that area, so they are giving them a grant to demolish that building and rebuild as a Duncan. That is good. That is really great. It looks a lot better. And then Nora, because they're going to run for that? Economic Development Authority. Well, Jay, yes, the TataVax and Economic Development Authority. And so they have the enhancement program, but it is also a partnership with the Tata Vax. Because those, the funds that they're providing to the businesses Actually come through the town council through meals tax Because it came up today can you remind me the timing of the diverging diamond process there is no specific timing So this study we were hoping would get done, there were some issues with their analysis, but we were hoping it was going to get done for us to apply for smart scale, which would have probably put us into starting engineering and design around 28, 28, 29. But that's been delayed, so if I can delay, then it gets pushed back kind of another two years. Okay. It's approximately $40 plus million dollar projects. So it's not one that we can easily go out and find funds for in smaller areas. But we'll continue to sack away funds until we can get that done. But no, not an immediate project. And the only other one in our future at some point is the 323 high speed rail That is just out there. It is kind of just out there, but there's actually a project That is going to get started On the north end of town so north of town limits the Hanover Third rail is going to be constructed soon. So they're in design right now. I was out there the other day and saw them replacing tracks. And they have a machine that goes along the tracks and pulls up the old ones that found the new. So not related, but if you saw surveying, they have been out there surveying for it. Interesting. OK, thanks. Anybody else? Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Any body health has anything? We are adjourned.