We at the time that they were contacted in staff in June and they shared that with the City Council in July. We didn't not not only know who the donor was, we did not know what the level of the contribution would be. We were told that it would be a nice donation, that it would probably be somewhere between a million dollars and upwards of that number, but we really did not have any idea on what the level of the contribution was. And because of the respect for the family, where they asked it to be kept confidential, in fact, we spent a lot of energy just trying to figure out who the donor might be because it's a small community, and you can start to speculate with that. But that was at the wishes of the family. So we spent probably two or three months not talking about what was going on. And we certainly apologize for that. That was not the design. There certainly was no intent for anybody to hide any of the information from the community that certainly is not the personality of the city council. But that was the wishes of the family. And when you get an anonymous call that says to you, we'd like to give you upwards of a million plus dollars. If you just respect the process, we said, yes, and just tell us what's next. So that took several months of going through that. I'd say probably two or three months in the process, the family's name was identified to us, and that's when we started talking about dollars. At the same time, we asked the staff very quietly to go out and start talking about a community center and what kind of cost we would be talking about and building a community center of some size or some description because quite frankly, in today's economy with budgets and all that sort of stuff, depending on what the level of the contribution was, we needed to know whether or not we could build a community center in a million dollars or two million or three million or five million. So that was going on concurrently so that we would be prepared at the time to aid the family, identify themselves and be, we started to roll up our sleeves and actually learn the number. We went very quickly once the family was identified to learning that it was a five million dollar donation to the family. That was several months into the process and now we can start to really wrap our arms around what a $5 million donation. The city has blessed in many, many ways but it's very rare for a community of our size or any size to get a phone call and say here's $5 million of you build a community center. So I'm sharing that background with you so that you understand how we got here. I know during that process it's almost impossible to sort of work through it and the process that we were requested to work through. I know information was around the community. I know newspaper reporters started getting wind of it and asking questions and all of those sort of things. So I share that so that you understand that the position was the council was in. Soon as the family was identified, soon as we got to a point where we could actually start to talk about the contract negotiations, that's when we started talking about it through a press release and at the dice at the city council meeting and becoming much more public about it. But that's only really been in the last couple of months that we've been at that stage. We had a work session two weeks ago, approximately two weeks ago, ten days ago with the City Council, and what we decided was, during that process where we had a consultant who was looking at what you could build for, in this case, $5 million or more or less, they identified several different options. Staffs are going to go through it, but at the City Council meeting, we directed this staff at the last meeting to go higher in architect and to design the center that could be built in phases, depending on what the will of the community and the City Council is, depending on various cost levels. So what you're going to see is the 32,000 square foot option, which was the biggest option that the architects designed in different phases. That doesn't mean we're going to build a 32,000 square foot center. It doesn't mean it's going to be half that size or a third of that size. But the direction we gave to council was to build the bigger vision to our to design, excuse me, the bigger vision to set it up in a way that it could be built in phases depending on the availability of money, the will of the community, and all the things that are going to go into this decision and then to bring that back into the process. That's what's going to be shared with you tonight. I know letters are going out in the near future where we're going to start to have public work sessions with the Park and Recreation folks and the police, the club folks and the arts folks and the senior center folks and some of the potential users of the center so we can really start to put some legs underneath a community center and what we can do with a $5 million. I will also say if we could pull up the donation, the donor, in this case the Sherwood family, did put some stipulation on it. Many of you all have asked the question I know in the community, how was Van Dyke selected? When we actually heard about the issue, we asked staff to go look citywide in terms of where a potential location could be. Fairfax Elementary Building, for those of you who have been in the community for sometimes, it actually hasn't been an elementary school since I was a young kid there, but Fairfax Elementary School, which is over in the green acres area, was a possibility. There was a number of other scenarios that we looked for, but the donors put the stipulation that if you're going to take the money and if you're going to build it, they wanted it in Van Dyke Park. So that was one of the stipulations that came with the donation of the money. Another one was obviously they wanted it named in Mr. Sherwood's husband, Stacey Sherwood. For those of you who have been around the city for any point in time, he was very, very involved in the city in its early stages. I don't want to go through the biopic, because I'll probably be mess it up, but it's safe to say he certainly was a very distinguished, very involved citizen in the city of Fairfax over a long, long period of time. And so clearly, and obviously if I'm going to give somebody five million dollars, it certainly would be reasonable that you'd want it named after that donor. And so that was one of the requirements. They put two space requirements in it that they wanted a thousand square foot a rehearsal space dedicated rehearsal space that was put in there. And then they wanted four thousand square feet that was reasonably available to the community for rehearsal space and co-located with performance space. That doesn't mean it had to be a dedicated space, but they wanted space that if somebody wanted a 4,000 square foot room that they could use for performances or activities or rehearsal, that space would be available. They requested that construction begin no later than December 24, 2009, and that it would be substantially completed by 1130-2010. I mean, that's an obvious and quite frankly as we work through it. The family is getting older and those that are still living in with us wanted to see the completion of their gift. And so they've asked us to accelerate whatever we do with it as quickly as possible. And that certainly seems reasonable. So that sort of sets the tone. What I'd like to do now is turn it over to staff Mike, who is our director of public, our parks and recreation is going to go through with you. He's going to share with you the design at Van Dyke Park for for I think it's approximately 32,000 square feet. He'll go through the details. I want to just emphasize again that does not mean that size building will get built in phase one. It simply means if we're dreaming and we're looking at building a first-class facility in Van Dyke Park for a community center the architect suggested in the three options that the most involved option would be the 32,000 or whatever it is. Square foot space and then as I said whether that $5 million will not build a 32,000 square foot space. So then we're going to have to decide to you build it in phases to you build multiple phases to the city of Fairfax put money on top of that and then if so, what amount of money would they be willing would we be willing to put in. be billed multiple phases to the city of Fairfax put money on top of that and then if so what amount of money would we be willing to put in. With that is background and then at the end we're going to open it up to questions and answers and let you make sure that everybody leaves here at least on the same page certainly of education and understanding. So Mike please. Thanks Mr. Mayor. Again this is a wonderful gift and I definitely want to thank the Sherwood family and the council for working through this. And it's great that we're finally here to be able to talk about it with the community and with you folks. You see if there's a power button here. Does that help funding chances? Can you hear? Okay. The donation and the reason why this stipulation is on dates is, again, if we do not complete it by that time or don't move forward, the money would get returned to a foundation of the naming of the family. So the money would be returned at that point. The feasibility study that we undertook at the direction of the council, we looked at Van Dyck Park and the JC Wood location, and we looked at a number of factors to make sure that we could actually do this at the site We looked at preserving as much of the park as possible a synergy with the police station Developing concepts with the ability to phase in What mayors do? What mayors do? Excellent. Excellent. Developing concepts with the ability to phase in the building as well as the site for anything that is displaced would be have to be replaced or rebuilt in some way. But the ability to phase that in. Utilizing as much of the existing parking as possible to try to keep costs down. Again, determining ways to move and or replace the existing parking is possible to try to keep costs down. Again, determining ways to move and or replace the existing amenities may be improved on how the flow of the amenities come together. Reviewing previous studies, and there has been a number of previous studies, and I'll take you through those dates as well. In developing three options, one for the anticipated donation amount at the time, which was the $5 million, and could we design it for less than that and still take care of some of the needs that we have for parts and recreation, a middle option, and then what would be a max size option? And we ended up somewhere around the 35,000 square feet number. But the final version that we show you today is a 32,000. And then one of the other pieces was also with the rehearsal space or the performance space could have been used for bankwits somewhere around a 5,000 square foot area for bankwits activities. We reviewed the past studies and as the mayor pointed out, we've been pointed out in the slides previously, we've been talking, and it's pointed out in the slides previously, we've been talking about this for about 40 years. In 1967, the first study was done for a community center at Van Dyke Park. In fact, the gentleman actually worked on the actual design is in the audience. And it's been talked about over the years through many different groups. In 1996, the Parks and Recreation Advisory Board developed a study at that point in time with a recommendation looking at Van Dyke Park. In 2000, a study was also then not really a community center but really located on the amphitheater at Van Dyke Park. That was also important to take into account some of the feedback that came out of that. In 2004, the Parks and Recreation Advisory Board, as well as the commission and the arts came together with another study on the community center. And around that time, that's when Parks and Recreation was moving over to green acres out of the Johnson Sea Wood Building that served as our home for so many years. And also in 2004, mostly architects working with the location of the new police station also came up with a couple of options of situating a community center at Van Dyck Park. And finally not related to a community center but as part of a study working with the Northern Virginia Regional Park Authority, the Parks and Recreation Advisory Board did attitudes and interest surveys. Some of you in this audience may have received a survey way back in May of 2000. The results from that came out and there was some important data information in there that was going to be pertinent to any architect working on this. We secured the Hughes Group architects out of Sterling, Virginia. And Hughes Group was selected really because of all the community center work they've done in Northern Virginia. Herndon Community Center, Idlee Community Center, and Leesburg Falls Church Community Center, the Falls Church Library. They're also working on an arts facility down in Manassas. So they have tremendous experience with municipal projects and projects of this nature. And again, this was a feasibility study, not an actual design. So when you see the drawings and you say, well, I wouldn't put this here. I wouldn't put that there. Well, there's a lot that would need to get engineered. And that's we're not even there yet. That's the next step in the process. Just to orientate you to some of the things at Van Dyke, this is an aerial of Van Dyke and because the police station is so new and it's a wonderful building, we have an overlay of the actual schematic of the police station and the red box indicates where the police station. We also, we thought that was important to put on the design and really see if there was some synergies. Can we maximize the parking that's going to be there? The use of the Johnson-C Wood Building location. The other red arrow indicates the existing Van Dyke parking lot and the existing parking access and the access to the park itself. This squiggly red line is actually the area we said, you know, we want to make sure that that's that area behind that line to the top and left of that line is preserved and try to use the active areas as a place to locate a community center. Working back from that, we looked at a global view and the architects looked at a global view and came up with a concept of the whole site. And they looked at a 35,000 square foot building, what does that footprint do, the number of parking spaces that may take up, maximizing the use of the parking area at the Johnson Wood Building, and then trying to find locations to put the items that would be displaced there. These numbers that are all across this diagram actually indicate some of the amenities. Number 10 is the play area that would be moved. Number 4 would be a pavilion. This much of a footprint of a community center does move a number of things that are obviously very important, things like the skate park. We have our volleyball courts, but we try to use the existing roadway, try to prevent, create some access down to the tennis courts, moving the basketball courts to where the hard court amenities are, keeping the skate park in this option would be near the building, but we also figured, well, what if we don't want to put it there or the community doesn't want it? Well, do we have another place to put it? And we looked at those types of things. We also looked at the types of things that are important to this community, the possible locations for art and whatnot. So we started with that, but then we worked our way back. Well, we need to phase this in, the site work as well as the building. And the initial feasibility show that we can phase it in, and we can do minimal displacement if obviously if we have a smaller footprint. So the building that's shown in this overall diagram is actually a 14,000 square foot building. It has a potential for two store, actually it's a 20,000 square foot building. It's two stories in the middle. And it uses the existing parking that's there. And I don't know if you can see the arrow. It's moving around here, right here. It uses the existing parking, the existing access road. It uses some of the parking that's over by the police station right now and where the JC would, John C. Wood building was and it only displaces a couple of the amenities. So to get to get into specifics of the building, we, a 14,000 square foot building we wanted a footprint, and this is just conceptual, it's not actual design, and a U-shaped made sense initially, where you could have two add-ons on the side, the middle could be two floors, a lower floor, and an upper floor, in this case, this option has a 14,000 square foot building and it's one floor. It has some rooms in the middle, the rehearsal space, it has a large area to the right which is the performance, could be the performance space, multipurpose, multi-use, and we also wanted to have a price tag on that as well. And the price tag on that was a $5.4 million option. But that includes everything. That includes design, engineering, permitting, soft cost, like equipment, and furniture, and fixtures. It also includes contingency, site work, and the actual building cost. So it's the whole thing rolled in together. The next piece, the second option, kind of the middle option, was a 20,000 square foot facility. And again, the studies that we looked at in the past also, we'll try to identify what types of uses could go in there. Some of the activities that we have at Green Acres activities, and we might have at Old Town Hall and this one had a second floor on top of it and we have placeholders that aren't actually placeholders just trying to give a sense of scale where a teen center could go, where a senior center could go, where preschool activities, where art activities could go. Again, a lot of that would have to get adjusted and moved in a design process after getting out in the public. So this option, the 20,000 square foot option, was $7.1 million. And again, that's the whole thing altogether. The final option, the full boat, is the 32,000 square feet. And this has two sides. It says a gym, it could be an activity area. It may be smaller, or maybe the other areas might be bigger. Again, a lot of that, again, needs to get decided through the design phase, an engineering phase. But it did have a second floor in the middle. So from there, that's what was presented actually to the council on December 11th, when the council approved the agreement in a council meeting. You know, on December 21st, the agreement was formally signed by the mayor and Geraldine Sherwick. And now we have been directed to go out and get design engineering services to design the 32,000 option. That's a quick rundown of the presentation. I'm going to turn this back over to the mayor. And then obviously you folks, if you have questions, we're going to try to repeat them so they get on camera so you don't have to actually get up to the podium. So I'm going to come around and help the mayor out repeat those questions and we'll try to answer them as best as possible. And I'm sure at this point we've probably created more questions than we have answers for you. I just want to emphasize, you now know everything that council has, all of the information, I want to emphasize this is the start of the process, this is not the end of the process. The design was after we got all the various options to go out to the community and start gathering feedback. I should probably also say, if I lived in those communities, I know the first question is going to come up, what about the impact on the community, what about parking, what about traffic and all those things. I'm sure part of this process will include traffic impact studies and parking studies and all the things that certainly would go with the construction of any building. None of that has been done at this stage. So if that's a question somebody has, that has not been done yet, I'm sure that will be done as part of the regular process. But let's just open it up. Don't get irritated if we repeat your question again. Unless folks want to come up to the mic, we need to make sure that it gets picked up on the television so everybody can hear the questions and the answers. Who wants to go first? Yes, ma'am, please. I wanted to just get some working sales concerns in the I'm just a little concern that the player is so close to the parking, the drive and the cars are going. Also, wondering about what that tree can be in life in the drive. Let's grab each question just so I don't forget and we can get it answered. The first question for those who couldn't hear was, what about the existing playground, equipment and what's there versus what would end up being there and where would it be moved there was also a concern that if it was moved closer to the parking lot in the entrance way how would that impact the safety of kids playing in the parking area right yeah again with all the design elements even the the building elements where the doors go where where the room gets placed, same thing with the playground, where that all gets placed, all the proper safety boundaries and buffers need to get designed and engineered in. The play equipment that's there on a 32,000 square foot design, all that play equipment would have to be moved, the skate park, the basketball court, and the current pavilion. And one of the recommendations is one of the volleyball courts would also be removed to be able to provide enough adequate play area to meet what we currently have. The hope would be to try to use as much of the equipment that we currently have to keep costs down. It might take some replacing. We have some opportunity to probably place it in a more appropriate flow. Obviously safety is definitely very important. And that would be designed and engineered in just like traffic studies and what not that would come through the site plan process. So if I capture the spirit of what you're saying, your concern would be A to make sure at least the existing amount of play ground equipment remains in the park and B wherever it gets designed and located it's safety B obviously paramount in terms of its location to the parking and the ingress and the egress is that is that kind of year two? Yeah, you might as well see one right about it. It's free. Can't be from the area from the long night shame of the work of the town. Yeah. Yeah. One of the other things is preserving the nature of the park that we put out in the feasibility study was to try to retain as much of the tree canopy as possible. Obviously, when we get into the design phase, again in the engineering part, through the site plan approvals, we would have to identify which trees would, if they can be saved, if they can't be saved, how they are replaced, shade, tree canopy is obviously very important with any project that we do, and that would definitely be a consideration. So we definitely hear what you're saying about tree canopy being important. And just the spirit, we're going to try to take all the notes and get all the feedback and then we'll make sure that it gets addressed in one way or the other is the process unfold. So we may not have all the answers tonight because we're really just beginning. Go ahead, yes ma'am. between Green and Current Center and the Childhood and the Water and the U.S. and the Old Temple of East Rathville and the New Center because Green and your Center has currently 35% of the children's work being held, the data will last up. Yeah. Two. Less due to the mainstream access, and less due to the community access. Even the government will be working. And again, just to phrase the question for those who couldn't hear it or certainly for the television, I think the question is, and quite frankly, it's not just Green Acres, we had this dialogue in the council as we had John C. Wood which was a de facto sort of community center when that got taken, it moved over for all practical purposes to green acres. For the last two years, half of the building in green acres was used by staff during our reconstruction of City Hall. The Main Street Child Development Center is in the upper, the northern wing of the school if I have my direction right, and the senior center program is there. I think the question is what happens to that space and if that moves over to the community center then what happens to green acres? Those are all good questions and I don't know that we have the answer to any of them. I know we're going to engage the senior program in terms of getting their input on it and what they want to do. I know they've had a couple of meetings internally within their system to decide whether they rather stay there, whether they rather move, whether they move, what were their requirements, and that dialogue just has not continued at this point. So those decisions have not been made. And that will have some bearing on the size of the need of community center too. For example, if we decide to leave the senior program at Green Acres, that's a less use that would be used at a community center at Van Dyke. And again, those decisions have not been made. Let me also say if there's anybody on council who either wants to jump in, add to disagree with anything I'm saying they're not shy. They're probably well anyway, but I want to make sure they're invited to Certainly dialogue as well. I tried to get them to sit up here with me, but that was not I was not very successful with that so The To point out on the 32 the 32 could address Currently what we're doing at Green Acres if everything was to move out of there for parts and recreation So um that was one of of the benefits of the larger piece, but again, all of that decisions have to be decided as we move forward through the process. And I just want to make one last comment that I don't think you're going to be able to walk around. It's okay. My concern is preserving open space. And we already have a building that's usable, maybe it needs to be upgraded, but once you build another building you're gonna lose that open space and already it's been encroached in the city quite a bit. Okay I'm just gonna work my way down this side and then we'll come back up who? Yes ma'am please. I would like to have a greater understanding why the Sherwood family feels at Eastp be at Van Dyke Park. Besides, I don't understand why the city council say, well, okay, we'll accept that. To go with her thought is why take this open space? Why do they need to take our open space? Well, I'd be the question. The question is, why does the Sherwood family feel strongly that it needs to be in Van Dyck Park? I certainly don't want to speak on behalf of the family. I know Bob and I'm not trying to get you on the spot. I know you had probably more dialogues with the family and the attorney than others. I think it was the central location I'm only guessing in terms of why Van Dyck Park was selected. Is there anything new? And if you do, you're going to, unfortunately, I need to say you're going to have to come up here to be picked up by. I'll be sure you can hear me answer. Okay. I think that they consider various options around the city and the response that came back from the family was basically and we didn't probe them, we didn't ask them to justify their reason. We felt like it was their prerogative and the success of things and we felt like it would be workable that it was appropriate for the city to recommend that as the location. So just to add to that again mainly for television, I think the answer to the Bob was saying is the family, basically it was the progative family say if you want the donation in the $5 million contributions, here's what we're going to tie to that. It was the list that was up there, the location and quite frankly at the time we were looking at a number of different locations. We basically gave the direction of staff look everywhere. But then when the donation, now the real answer to that is we don't have to take the $5 million. If the conclusion at the end of the deal is for whatever reason the city is not interested in building a community center today and we're not interested in building at Van Dyck or some of the other things that were in that list that came with the agreement. Certainly, it's the pro, I don't think that's the will of the way the discussions are going, but that certainly is a progative. But as of right now, to the, that was a stipulation that came with a $5 million donation. Go ahead, yes. I think a lot of people that I've spoken to last summer are my neighborhood, my moms, my church. They're not opposed to a community center, but they are opposed to taking away this open space. We have such a rise in obesity. I used to be a PE teacher. Trying to get people to exercise and do all that. And now we're taking this open case where kids can't play. Now we're going to have this big building in front of this beautiful land. And we keep losing him. We lost lots of land and prostramar with the far-crop buildings. I don't understand why we have to be bought out by one family. Yes sir, please. Yes, I'm curious if there's any cream in sorry. Can I just ask one question? Was that response or so in fairness to the speaker? Did that get picked up on television? And do we need to repeat when comments are we need to repeat? I think no, you're OK. OK, great. Go ahead, I'm sorry, sir. I just wanted to make sure her comments got picked up. Is any creases to any document to site placement as it being so important, this is a slope directly behind the police station. I don't know whether it perks or not, but that area that is the most least used area of the Divank Park, cutting into the hill, placing it there, using the university drive entrance way, building a two way bridge, parking there, which would not congest the only highway parking, and having our community center on that back hill, sloped area, that is the least used, wouldn't disturb the front facade on only highway. A bunch of good reasons for putting it there, but I don't know that the engineering is, you know, pliable. Okay, let's just find out. I think the spirit of the question is, are there other opportunities on the Van Dyck side for, as a result of engineering, other things for the location of the center suggested, one possibility behind the new police department? I know at one time we were even talking about in front of the new police department. Can you share, I don't know, is anybody with the architectural firm here? No. Okay, with them, can you share their logic on how they... Again, the logic for looking at the Oli Highway 1, that's the area that's been identified again in numerous studies over the years. Two, it allowed us to maximize the existing parking area that's already there so we don't have to create parking areas and bridges or roadways or passways and Cut into a hill that obviously is is is important part of the park We also looked at how they manage the stormwater management back if there for the police station is this little Stormwater management piece that's back there already that we would be able to potentially tap into for any type of building back there already that we would be able to potentially tap into for any type of building whether it's parking or the community center itself. So again, trying to keep the costs as low as possible, we felt that was the most feasible place to put that. Now, again, traffic studies and whatnot all come out during a site plan process. That may dictate something different at that point. Just to follow up real quick, as far as the police station is a gorgeous building, but it probably wouldn't be as aesthetically pleasing if it was right on top of Oldie highway. It's nice having that front area. And even though it's parking off, there is some green space there. So having another building right on top of us, that would be right on top of us at Old Lee Highway would not be as aesthetically pleasing and it would be a congested area with police coming in and out on calls mixed in with young people going to and fro the community center. So that might be also a little bit of a concern as far as the traffic. Yes. Yes. I just a couple of thoughts and comments. My guess is I think that it's important to consider the use of public transportation to community center and the placement on Van Dyke Park is accessible to one of the Cuba's lines but not both of them. And if there is thought to not have the site, have the community center at Van Dyke Park, I think it's really important to consider having it a place where it's accessible to both lines so that seniors and young people can get there without having to depend on a car. Another thought? I guess I could just capture that real quickly before you go on. And again, I think the spirit of that question was, make sure we take in consideration the transportation elements to a community center. This location, if what you're saying is on one of the cue buses, not the second one. So if and when an alternative site has ever discussed transportation and tying into the cue bus system would be important. Go ahead. And we might as well just open space. When the driver was built in for the current police station, that already encroached in part of the parkland. One section of the playground had to be taken out and was done away with. It was a gravel driveway for a long time while the construction was going on. My hope was that it would go back to green space and that the driveway would be made straight. And it never did. It went from gravel into a hard top and it encroached to the right, into the park, where the park was. So that's a concern that that never went back where it had been. And now it feels like with the community center site being placed there, it's just continuing into the park. I wonder whether there's consideration for the community center in front of the left of the police station and to consider that space also. Okay. Again, the spirit, and I apologize for those in the room, but just to make sure that gets picked up is the spirit of that was the location again of the playground equipment and the Construction for the new police department encroached on that least the road that goes in and out of it and Consideration on maybe relocating the community center either right in front or right in back of the police department. One of the last thought is about the skate park. While I like it being there because my son, among any other kids, used it a lot. It's very, very loud. And I lived down past a country club held a pool and I conferred at my house. I would have a huge concern putting it back deep into the park because the impact on the country of Hills neighborhood would be enormous if it was moved back down by the tennis court. And I also would have a concern of it being right next to the community center building because when, especially if we keep the metal kind that we have now, I don't know if the concrete ones are quieter, but having that kind of a site right next to the community center, it's really loud. So I think that's an important consideration wherever the skate park needs to get moved to is the material it's made out of to reduce the noise from the skate parks. It's my understanding there's new technology in skate parks and there's a much quieter better version of it is. Yeah, the question was about the viewing public was for the skate park. If it is moved, how loud the current skate park is with the metal ramps, whether they're plastic or composite ramps, wood ramps or concrete ramps, they're much quieter than what our current skate park is. And hopefully that would be taken into consideration when we design or move or redesign a skate park. Thank you. Go. So what degree does the family have to approve what it is that we ultimately come up with beyond the stipulations that they made as part of the gift. That would be question one. unrelated to that, has any consideration been made to either a landswap or imminent domain to try and get the the will it center property which is adjacent to Van Dyke Park as a possible means of building in an area that could easily be leveled and thereby preserved that which is already existing? Let me start with the second question first and then we'll work back. The question was, is there been any discussion with the Willard Center and actually there's an old elementary school called Bell Willard there in terms of that being a site. I will tell you, prior to this donation and over the last several years, and I know the council will nod their head up and down, we actually thought we had a deal with Fairfax County to purchase the Bell Willard site, and that was going to become the de facto community center. This is way back before these dialogue and discussions. We literally got to the point where we thought we were ready to sign an agreement to make that happen because we were notified by the county they were going to be vacating that site and I think at the time the city just decided that was too convenient to Van Dyke and too good of an opportunity to pass it up. In the eleventh hour of those dialogue and discussions that the county changed their mind and notified us that they were going to move their health department which is now on Main Street closer to Camp Washington into that facility. In fact I think the actual special use permit for that to take place is going to be heard by the City Council in the near future. So yes that was considered and quite frankly again prior So yes, that was considered. And quite frankly, again, prior to this process, that was the location that I think the council had selected in dialogue and discussion that if there was going to be a site, it was too good to pass up and we were going to purchase the Bell Willard site. Not the Willard center is actually out on the corner. I'm referring to the old elementary school that is behind it. So yes, that was considered and the county went in a different direction, disappointing to us and took that option off the table. You had a your first question and I'm sorry, I knew this was going to happen. I forgot. I family would have to approve any of these plans and how they've been consulted about any of the designs of the building. And the agreement that they have, other than just common courtesy, and I'll refer to that in a second was, as I understand it, Bob, is the stipulation that we put up on the board. And as long as we met those criteria, that was good to go with them. I'm only guessing as this process unfolds, and if we get to the point where we're actually got a design and we're ready to move, I'm just guessing out of courtesy, we would sit down and keep the family in the loop and they're understanding and their input just because they donate a 5 million dollars. But there is no approval process outlined in the agreement other than making sure we meet the stipulations that we put in the donation list. These are the only stipulations that we show before on the agreement. Yes. My hearing's not so good. How much more space do we think we would be taking relative to the amount that's already developed? I mean we're talking about green space, but there's undeveloped green space and then there's green space or there's open space, right? We've had that discussion in the city before. So some of that is already taken up with various other, the playground and so forth. So that the site that you get when you're driving by Old Lee Highway is not of a park, like a woodland park, it's a play park. And so how much more square footage would we actually be taking relative to what we have, what's in use now? That's question one. And the other is there, when they talk about performance space, or in one of the iterations here, it seems to be a multipurpose space. Is there any idea about using this for community theater space? So it's dedicated theater space, performance space. I'll just jump in on the question wise, is there been any discussion on the rehearsal space and whether or not that could and be anticipated as becoming dedicated theater space. I think the spirit of the dialogue, and again I welcome my colleagues to jump in if they disagree or have other feedback is, you know, one of the great needs we have in the city is we look at the space is, is, nowhere is there a place you could have a banquet or a ballroom space, Old Town Hall is really the best space for that and quite frankly probably the only space I don't know what the number is but I think in a max on the first floor it's probably a hundred or a hundred and twenty people that could be held there and so for some time we actually had an offsite meeting in July before we even were really getting serious into this dialogue. We identified a space that could be used for performances or banquets or dinners or auctions or fundraisers for Daniels Ron and they're looking for a silent auction site or things like that that we didn't have and so I think in the current plan It's designed to be a multi-purpose space that certainly would be available at at least 4,000 square feet If there was going to be a performance or that sort of stuff. But clearly if the community wanted to use it for banquets or sites or locations in that regard it would be the multi-purpose. So at least the dialogue, unless I totally missed it up until now has been, it would be designed for a multi-purpose space that could accommodate both. Much like if I'm in the meeting planning business, if you go to hotels, they have big ballroom spaces. Now there are some ballroom spaces. In fact, there are a lot of ballroom spaces that are on the very far end built into the wall, will be sort of a stage kind of area that could be used or not used. We haven't gotten that far, that certainly would be one thing to consider. But I don't think that we've ever considered it being a dedicated Theodore only type space more than multi-purpose type space At least in the discussions we've had so far Going back to the first part of that question. There was the square footage I think you were looking for how much is displaced square footage amounts I mean the buildings about 32 on the overall site And the buildings about 32 on the overall site, all good to that, that's why, is 32,000 square feet. And again, we need to go through the engineering. That's footprint-cured shrink. We also have a slight increase by the police station or just some of the parking. But in the overall concept, now see if you can get the existing parking is totally turned it back into green space and that whole area becomes green. But again, the whole idea is that we need to get into the engineering piece, how can we maximize a smaller footprint and really engineer it that. Obviously the feedback tonight is very important. And then using existing parking that's there to accommodate whatever size building this filing built. Anybody else on this side, just a minute please? As anybody who's done any studies on the current view so the power can help many people go there and what they're using it for, many times I've gone to the park and it's crowded on a beautiful day. And I can't imagine the space being smaller for all the families that gather there for picnics and such and all the kids who come out there to play. Let me just repeat it again. I think the question and the spirit of the question is, have we done a study on the existing use of the space in terms of the number of people and the uses they do? The comment was that it's crowded many times when you go there, so Mike. Yes, the study's been done actually, more recently by Proud back in 2004, but in the overall, we looked at all the current uses of the park and making sure that when a building is finally designed, whatever size it is, also accommodates the current uses of the park. That includes the home school parents that go there on a regular basis all those uses in fact We're trying to be incorporating to the overall design So we have looked at that and it has been looked at in previous studies by the Parks and Recreation Advisory Board And when we get again into the site planning actual traffic counts and in head counts on a regular basis would have to be part of that that site plan Yes,. Go ahead. Hey, for more than 35 years my family has enjoyed the visits to Mandi Park. And particularly in the winter one there's no one around here. And it looks to me that the map you are going to have up on the screen, that you're intending to preserve that area around the trees. Is that true? You mean the bowl area? The bowl area? The place that we all have gotten sled riding for years, that's projected as an uplink. Yes, this area back here where the sledding hill is and then also over here in this this large bowl area. Again, maximizing as much possible open space as possible was one of the guidelines we gave in the feasibility study and would be one of the guidelines going forward in the design phase. 18 was only used by sledders with a lot of guts. I think 16 in that. In fact, there's five stitches. There's still a scar in the bottom of my chin from trying when I was a kid to do that. But 16 is the area where a lot of people I know. That's the bowl area that he's talking about that's down there. Okay. Yes ma'am, please. I want to make sure I get everybody I'm taking the other part of the picture here. It says it can't be just in the company. I'm not thinking of it with that. I'm thinking of a few things. It says there's gambling in the company. The store more of management. Yeah. We could try to win. You could swim in there, Kate. On a heavy rain. Good idea. Sure. And the evidence is that you can't hear it. Should this new building come to be, would it be inside the pool? And these plans, no. I'm sorry. The question was, after we got established that the current plan did not include a swimming pool, the question was then, why not and was that ever part of the dialogue? No, that was not part of the dialogue. I think in discussion, I know, and formally, we obviously have Oak Mar, which is just up the street, which citizens have the right to use just like Fairfax County residents do. You know here's going to be the real issue. This is a $5 million donation. The 32,000 square foot option is a $10 million building and that's without a swimming pool. I don't know what the cost of a swimming pool would add to it but I'm guessing it would be enormous to be honest with our biggest challenge is going to be figure out how to pay for anything more than five million dollars and certainly up in this case to eleven million dollars. So there is not right now anticipated a swimming pool. Sure, please. You talked about space available for dances and functions of that sort. Many years ago, we had very nice proms here, the high school, the old high school, and with this new board of facility, would it not be perhaps feasible to have function here? Certainly not to make an editor. I think the biggest restriction here is the alcohol use. If people want to do like a black tie or a fundraiser, things like that, this is a public school. And it's Janice Miller, a chair of our school board. I should have introduced her. Janice Miller, a chair of our school board. I have alcohol is not committed on school grounds at the state law. The answer was, and I'm not saying that's a plus or minus, but the answer is, one of the great limitations of the high school is no alcohol is permitted. And if you go to any weddings or any of the events that are now at Altown Hall, that's something that's been identified as important. Okay, I'm gonna, all right, let me just finish. I see two more hands that haven't had a chance and then we'll jump over to this side. Yes, sir. Just one comment that is with obviously a five million dollar donation, which is a wonderful opportunity for the city. It would be a, in my mind, my initial opinion, obviously I'm worried about the green space as well, but it would be a huge waste for the city to not take the opportunity for that. In addition to, if we're going to go in and make a development wherever it may be, if we're lucky enough to use Van Dyke in the right and right way, is to use that to provide as many opportunities for all the different aspects in the city. And I know that they went through that with the Lord and property, you know, 10,000 different groups wanted to get their, their, their look in it. And it's a very difficult thing to do. There's so many opportunities here in the city from, you know, tots on all the other seniors. I know from dealing with sports in the city, the indoor sports are lacking seriously on any kind of indoor activity. volleyball is a great opportunity for that wrestling and the very limited in what they can do with the city residents right here with the clubs and with anything else that's outside of school just for the different opportunities that they have. So with the opportunity that the city has right now, I think it is a great opportunity. I'm glad we're looking at this. Glad we have the outreach program so we can get the contacts and finance as much information as possible. But going to the 32,000 square foot opportunity with his Mike said, trying to get the smallest footprint possible, but getting the most added is definitely going to be the best idea. You know, one story, when you can definitely put two stories on it to get more meeting space, more opportunities for different crafts or for different groups to do different things, is it one of the opportunities? I think just to summarize it, the statement was, it'd be a shame not to take advantage of the donation and be if we're going to take advantage of it, get the biggest bang for the buck for the community if I can summarize it in that regard. Yes, ma'am. And then I think there was somebody up here. Go ahead. I know it's a totally community center. I just was wondering if you had any discussion during all of this on integrating the entire community to use it because although that idea is centrally located in the city, it's difficult in different areas of the city to get to it. And because it is in that area, it's much easier riding than a fairchester where it's to go to Oakmar because I can get there in three or four minutes rather than come this way. Have you talked about integrating it somehow with paths or trails or something? So it's accessible to all hearts of the city. And the question again was, has there been any discussion to ensuring that if and I could select it, how do you integrate it and make it as easy as accessible to as many different areas in the city of Fairfax? And currently I think the statement was that it's not that easy to get to in some portions of the city. Right? Just to address that, one of the reasons why I think it came up so much in previous studies as Van Dyke being a really good option besides the Johnson Wood Building was there was, it is our hub for our trail system. The majority of our trail system goes right through Van Dyke Park. There are future potential plans of trails that showed up even in the Fairfax Boulevard design to try to tie into some of the trails that we have out there. Absolutely trail connections making it accessible for every part of the community would be important. The Q bus comment earlier is a great suggestion. It was one of the things that we talked about where the Q bus line currently is to access that. The synergy to the downtown and the new library, the new high school that we're sending in right now, was also very important, making sure that it is accessible to all those points. Thank you very much for your time. There was one other hand over on this side, then we're going to jump over to here and then we'll come back. No? Okay. Yes, please. I'm sorry. Go ahead. I wanted to clarify, I was given earlier about why the Sherwood family made that part. OK. Go ahead. I understood the answer on that. Who's down on the question on that sort of name. This is a city management. City management said he's not sure why the makes things like part. So does that lead to the need that no one just tried to sway them that another site would be better? That if somebody tries to do that now in my time fund effect? Because I gave you time down a month, too. Right. And just wondering if anyone tried to convince them that a site had been better? The question for those in the back and for television was whether or not there was any aggressive dialogue between the city council and the donor on terms of would they consider another alternative to Van Dyke. The answer to that question is no. I came to us as and I know the question was asked, you know, give us the sort of requirements of it. One of the requirements and as I said, the city council originally started looking citywide and the direction was back. Now that doesn't mean if the end of the day the council says we're not building it Van Dycken, we're either going to return it or sit down and have that dialogue. I'm sure we would probably have that dialogue before we'd want to just return $5 million. But that has not taken place. We just took it at face value base. They actually drafted a very detailed agreement Which was before the council and we signed and approved with all the stipulations and it and that was one of the stipulations Okay, I just wanted to say I do know that the the attorney and Mrs. Sherwood did look at sites in the city You know the actual specifics of their conversation, but I do know they looked at other sites and one was in particular green acres. Go ahead, follow up. Yeah. Did you hear that? You did hear that? Go ahead. I do know that Mrs. Sherwood and her attorneys did look at sites in the city and what the actual discussion was and how they came out of that I'm not sure but one of the sites I do know that they did look at was green acres You had one last follow go ahead sure for design, for the building. But it also includes the cost to relocate all the things that have to be relocated. The question was about the cost for each of the concepts that include the cost to relocate any of the site amenities, whether it's playground or skate park or basketball court. Yes, it does. It does include that. For each of the options. So smaller options, less amenities to move, bigger options more amenities to move. OK. Thanks. OK. Oh, I'm sorry. That's it. I'm a sleep. It's the parking driving the size of the building. In other words, it looks like the main. I went through some of the old studies. It looked like parking was a critical element in what we've built. Is that still the driving force? The question was about parking is that if you drive it for the size of the building, it is a driver for the size of the building. The bigger the building, the more parking spaces that are required. It's the rough standard for a community center. Building is about four spaces per thousand square feet. So that's that really limited us because we wanted to again preserve as much of the park in the open space and Sarah's possible. But and if we're being frank, another major driver is just sheer cost. I mean, I don't think you'd have to be living under a rock if you didn't understand the kind of position the city is going to be in this budget. The assessment is going down. And so cost is a big driver as well. Go ahead. I like to address that issue of revenues. Quite frankly, if you take the long view, as many years, you know, the actual payback to the city by the cost of the whole. We do this really well. People want to come here because there's another amenity that they couldn't get someplace else. So I think in a long term, we actually get revenues, sea revenues, and there's a whole bunch. One last question. I'm having trouble with square footage. And a 32,000 is approximately what comparison to the police next? Is that right just to clarify? Is that the side, the right side? Yes. Other people we have back there, problems with realizing how many square feet a thousand hours and so forth. What I'd like to see the city do is offer some bus trips to the citizens out to local community centers that the staff sends, it's really not considered so that we can get a sense of what the size and the amenities are in those particular facilities so we get some good ideas right back. Okay, right. And I'm only, because he's sitting close enough as that, did you guys pick that up on television or do we need to repeat that comment? Just a yes, you're okay? All right. Yes, ma'am, please. Kind of may be along that line, but if we actually do progress, instead of looking at that picture from here, it would be nice to have a meeting where we go and we could open it around and it says well this tree's gone and this is gone and this is gone. It's going to be a theater so we can actually see it instead of on it. That's a great idea. We actually have learned that lesson. We started doing that more and more in the community with some of these projects, so we certainly can do that. The question again was, can we ever stake it out and actually have a meeting out in Van Dyke Park so people could see the stakes and what gets to placed and how big the building actually is and feels on the site and the answer is yes, we certainly can. Okay, let me just sort of, yes. Yeah, a couple of points. One, as a park immigration professional, I was actually involved with the chairmanship of the 2020 commission, which looked at the need for community center a few years back, I would say a few years back. And I too am concerned about the loss of a green space and also certainly visual impact with the school of like going down a lead highway because right now you have a wonderful view of the playground people playing and participating and I hate to see that loss I hope we can really think about that as we figure out where the final place would go but secondly I tend to think of what a wonderful opportunity this is for the city and what I love Van Dyke Park like everybody else in this room but what a wonderful opportunity this is for the city. And why I love Van Dyke Park like everybody else in this room. But what a wonderful opportunity for us to have a real whole sense of new activity in the park. And I don't think it's going to be as well as there. I think it will, if you can, increase the value of that park as a wonderful asset to the city and to its location. A couple of points I wanted to make is one, I hope that the city will look at some options, not just for funding this fall out of the billation out of city funds, but perhaps a couple of private partnerships with communities around the country that have built community centers with support from endowments, from foundations, from private sector support. And this is a wonderful opportunity starting right now for the city to really look at that and say, are there some of the funding opportunities out there other than who just public taxes are a good good donation? Why do we need to do this right? Something's gonna be not just for today, but for 15, 20, 25, 30 years down the road. We might make sure we have a facility that's gonna meet not only the current needs, but looking at hats. So I hope those are some things that the city will look at. And the other question I have, I guess the question I had was, so what's the timing on this holdout? This is a wonderful grassroots effort. But what follows after this in terms of the timing of the timing for my? I'll study. Good question. I mean, I think as you saw on the schedule, we're working back toward a goal of breaking ground. And I don't remember the day was a January of 09. Is that was at the date in the agreement? Somewhere around there. I mean, the very next step is I know during our work session we agree we were going to have a working session which will be televised with some of the stakeholders in terms of the use. I know the police youth club, the arts leagues, park and recreation, the senior center. We're all folks who are on that list if I didn't leave somebody out. Commission of the arts. Commission of the arts. And so we're going to have a work session with them to gain their feedback on help us sort of identify some of the community needs and then I'm sure we're going to have more community this is I said we kind of view this I think is the beginning of the process but we're trying to accelerate it as much as possible and make the decision. Are we going to go forward as a community or aren't we and if we are are, then we want to try to get to those decisions as soon as possible. And our budget process, which, again, I'll say, we can't just totally ignore it in this, starts in early March. So that will all be part of this dialogue. I'm going to guess over the next 60 days or so, I would guess that we would try to accelerate the process. Okay. That's a yes, ma'am, please. Thank you all for the city giving us the opportunity to speak and look forward to more of that. Along the way as this progresses, this some friends in the neighborhood. Just again that the environmental impact of the green space voices speaking I just want to echo that our concern that minimal trees and wildlife have attacked me taken in the process. We're also concerned too just for what we value so much about the party is that there's open space, there's room to run, just room to beam, we'd like to see that and preserve. If I had a choice not to have an event and I target certainly prefer that, I also just want to second the motion to look at the possibility of less invasive ways such as you mentioned about maybe the police station hillback there or something else that might not be the invasive. Just concerns with a lot of declaring at the blend of the state, hoping this will be that loss of habitat. So environmental impact was the first concern I was mentioning. Certainly the children are primary concern. The kids love to come from school right after school any more. They get there right over there and be in the Daniels run. I'm sure other schools too to play in the park. Families join together. So we would not like to see the laws of the playground. I think they've lost some already, as was said, before to at least building and just help the children won't lose anymore. Also, just want to lift up a voice for the children in the late Hall apartments, you know, have a yard to play and you don't have any open space because of their living situation. There are other town homes along the university drive and such. You just know where to run in an open place. So just want to lift up a voice for them. And also just want to speak on behalf of myself and others in the neighborhood. Just in terms of considerations, we hope that we'll be made along the way. We moved here five years ago and we can see stars. And just to consider now you go out, there's so much light pollution.. It's happened just here in our city in the last few years that starting to think we'll be telling the children what it was like when we can see the stars and fire. I'm seeing this happen in our own time. So I'm hoping there could be some way that we can take that into account. I know with the building of the library and the city buildings I counted like 20 lanterns on two street clocks. And then if you multiply that by eight or 10 blocks, there's just lights, lights everywhere. Because I looked out my own window, I can see the lights of the city now with the blend of the clearing. I can see the lights right here in this high school, all night long, burning, all these things. All night. So just hoping the bad life doesn't become another big hurting life. That's it. I know they're safety concerns and all that, but I just hope maybe we can consider that in some way to preserve that. Also just generally, they were building up, not out. That's good for our environment, but we'll have to have that. So where that's doable possible, I would vote for two stories, three stories rather than plowing way out. Anyway, thank you. Thanks so much for listening. Let me just summarize by the most important part of a presentation that was the introduction of her daughter. Is it Claire? Hi, Claire. Thanks for coming out tonight. We appreciate it. I think just to summarize that, just so we capture it first, again, for television is certainly concerns around the environmental impact of any development that take place, minimizing tree loss, maximizing open space, certainly light pollution, and some of the things that would go along with that building up as opposed to out the preference that other locations at least be analyzed as part of this location or part of this process and if other locations outside Van Dyke couldn't be considered then maybe other locations within Van Dyke over to the police department either in front which came up and and other issues did I summarize that okay okay thank you yes ma'am in the back Okay, thank you. Yes ma'am in the back. I think I did. She wants to be for arts and I can understand that but I don't think it should come with this regulation that it has to take away so much land for our children. When I look at the this picture you gave us, it looks like we're losing you might have. I would say so long to be 68% of the park area, not the soccer field, in the end will still be open but the starting fields don't have skate park and don't have the swing that you don't have the the jungle gym in the sandbox we're gonna lose about me it looks like 60% of that space right there and I agree with the lady over here that it's so crowded right now I think it's big all those people and put them into a significantly smaller space and have it not be very, very crowded. My question is, consider that as well. Okay. And again, I think the summary is the concern over the open space, but the playground space and all the other interactive things are in the park and how do you shrink that down into a little more limited space and still have enough for everybody in the crowds and the people and all those sort of things. So we'll capture those comments. Yes, sir. First off, I'd like to thank the family for making such a generous offer in the city. I wonder what the thing with the family does there. Second, I think it's worth thinking about not just about what we're losing in terms of green space. I've lived in a lot of places around the world and I wouldn't say the city is ideal for green space but we're a lot better off than a lot of places. In addition to Van Dyke Park, we have other parks and we have Daniel's Run Park which has a lot of room to move around. I think it's more thinking about the additive value that this community center offers. I've looked at the drawings, I think the ball of the drawings. What we've just add to our community relative to what we have now and how much green space relative to the green space available to us now, available to our children to play it and I have two of them who use a lot of that space including Ben like Bar, or we really want to move. And I just got to note that I guess we are picking up most of the audio feeds so I assume you'll cue me if we're not. If you're having trouble hearing it in the audience then we'll repeat it but we're going to stop repeating the questions because it sounds like we're okay with the television in terms of picking it up in the audience, then we'll repeat it, but we're going to stop repeating the questions because it sounds like we're okay with the television in terms of picking it up in the audience. Let me see if there's anybody else on this side. Yes, please. There, the remodellization, modernization of downtown in the city of Fairfax, the city has incurred enormous debt. We're going to be paying for already for quite a while. So, you're looking at options, $5 million in there, and you might want to consider this kind of paying in that one. And you might want to consider this kind of pain in that one. Pointing will take you. Okay, I'll go back over here. Yes, please. Yeah, I was just wondering about, this is a good segue from the environmental impact. In terms of the building construction itself, I would really want the whoever to consider a quote unquote green or lead construction such as stormwater storage, low B.O.C. paint, sound dampening, improved sighting, recyclable materials, energy efficiency, and this is a real opportunity for the city to show that we are a green, tree city and we care. And I just I haven't heard anything about any kind of that type of construction. Only because, only because we haven't even gotten that far, I mean. But, and actually we have discussions, and I think there's a work session that's coming up in a couple of weeks to talk about what green and leads and all that, and looking at whether or not we should be changing our zoning ordinance to encourage that and require that on city-built projects, similar to what other communities in the region are doing. So I know that dialogue and discussion is coming. And part of the RFP, when we go off with the design and engineering services, one of the criteria that we'll be looking at is with the architect firm that's working on it, is their experience with green technology. One of the reasons why we also selected Hughes Group is the building or the project that they're doing in Arlington right now is lead certified. It is a green project. It's got a green roof. So it was really exciting for us to see if there's a way to incorporate that into this type of design and we'll be looking for that obviously cost-sensitive too. I thought one more thing. Sure. Has there been any thought to parking being under like the library versus out taking up more land. No, I mean I think the concept quite frankly was to try to co-use the parking that was built out in front of the police department and the parking that will be built out in front now that John C. Woods there. So I think that's the first criteria. I would just tell you, my gut reaction is we've learned the hard way that when you start building underground parking, you put a price tag somewhere between $15,000 and $30,000 per space. That probably in itself would make a cost prohibitive for us to consider at this point. Okay, let me just say, is there anybody here tonight who hasn't had a chance to ask a question or express a comment? Yes, ma'am, please. Oh, I'll give you two questions. And then we'll go back around and you try to get everybody incorporated. I'm actually very enduous here, so I don't know the facilities very well, but I just want to get green acres fully utilized. Is it, are you planning on keeping it going? I mean I know I could. I tend to class there. It's a very nice place for classes. Sure. Is it fully utilized? If you fully utilize, we have a number of new activities that are starting. We are using it to its fullest that we can right now. We do share the space, whether it's sharing the space with Main Street Childcare, also share the space with a number of rental groups, everything from Boy Scouts to musical groups and so forth. We do get more and more requests for new activities. The thing that kind of limits us, and I'll be honest about, is the, some of the accessibility for certain rooms and how we can use those certain senior activities or even mums and strollers if you come into the main entrance. Can you get that to it? And where the locations of the bathrooms are? And as far as the future use, we haven't had that dialogue at all. It's kind of hard to jump to the conclusion that green acres is going to be vacated and the senior center is going to move over before we even have a dialogue of what's the use going to be at the community center and what size of community center and all of those 30 issues. So we have not had any dialogue on what the future green acres would be yet. But I would anticipate clearly if we vacated and I would just say what's not anticipated at least in any dialogue that I've been part of, is the Main Street Child Care Development Program which uses probably 40% of the building I'm guessing? 30%, 40%. The upper wing is not envisioned I'm moving under any scenario into a community center. That doesn't mean that limits it. But, and I can tell you, I think it's safe to say that the green acres community is gonna have very strong feelings in terms of the future use of what happens to Green Acres. And we have not had that dialogue either. I was curious because it seems like it was a sphere that gives us really more of a theater performance space and it sounds like the city needs kind of a space like that perhaps and wondering if it isn't worth looking at. I mean that's only 5,000 square feet that they really stipulate with accessory services that wouldn't be that much bigger and that's a much smaller building even than the smallest one you've looked at yet. There's wondering if there's been any look at a building that really is more specifically that use and not everything else added onto it. I'm sure that dialogue is going to come up at some point in time in this process. We have focused on more the multi-purpose community center use as opposed to as the question came up earlier, a theater type use and that doesn't mean it won't come up at some point in time. It doesn't mean it won't be considered at some point in time, but that's not at least the current dialogue that's taken place. Okay, yes, ma'am, please. I was wondering about if the court take real good care of the storm, the water that's coming down the creek from the area because we have every time they fill something up there, we've got more stormwater down our grid and a few types it comes up for everyone to fly. There is times or things comes down to them. Well, yes that will be a very important. I mean one of the nice things about the way the city does business is even when we build our own projects we have to follow the same zoning, the same stormwater drainage, the same consultant studies, the same parking, the same traffic impact that a developer would have to follow. So we don't sort of shortchange the process since it's a quote city business. Yes, all of that will be an important part of the dialogue. Anybody else who has not had a chance to speak? Yes, in the back of the room, sitting down and then we'll go standing up. I would just like to express my appreciation to the family for this wonderful gift and do feel that it is a great opportunity for the city. However, I would hope that if the city finds that the location is not ideal, that it does pursue a conversation with the family and hopefully can find some location that would be more and amenable to address a lot of issues like our open space, location accessibility to all parts of the city. My be concerned about the location of Vennag Park is parking and the accessibility on an awful week highway. Um, if any of you have ever, ever, ever, traveled on both the highway, try to get in and out of the end act part around five o'clock in the afternoon for any reason, it is completely backed up into the park, as well as back up onto home drywashed. And when you have a community center, you want a place where people are not going to become frustrated and trying to find a parking place and then wondering how long it's going to take to get out of this. Probably a lot of you have been in a full track. And we all know that when in a minute and a half or we have to wait upwards of an hour so it's to be able to even begin moving. And I would hate for the cities to invest in a location where there isn't good accessibility. I don't see how in the world with the place of community center at Van Dyke and only have one way in one way out and that's the only Highway. I just don't think that that would be a food move and I think it would be a trap from what we're trying to do in having a community center. So I would hope that this be taken into consideration and that is another location which again is maybe on public transportation route. Yeah, it's more accessible to other parts of the city that again the city council approached the family about reconsidering location and being able to make this green possibility. Okay, yes ma'am. I was positive. I came back from a comment on the old behind it. I went with forward to the traffic these days because it's not just five o'clock on the highway. It's morning rush, afternoon rush. Two hours, high school hours, elementary school hours, they leave us hours. Thankfully, it was on a weekend. And it's just very congested stricter through the air. So my question to follow in that is, how do we continue to maintain dialogue about this, aren't you? How do you keep us abreast that our youth is still receiving comments on how we have, how did that happen? Well, yes, we are still receiving a request and you know this will have to be and will be a very public process. You know, I would urge you if you all you know you can just call City Hall and they'll send you a copy of every agenda that we have automatically by email. Make sure you're on that list. If you have a pencil and you want the number to call City Hall to request that it's 703-385. Is it 7800? Is that the right 7800-385-7800? Call and get on that information or on that list. That way you'll be notified of the agenda. It's going to be on the agenda. I'm guessing quite frequently over the next couple of months. So watch it. I'm sure we're going to have another outreach meeting at least during this process. If not more, we've tried to not limit ourselves just a city hall by is demonstrated by this meeting at the high school. It would have been over at the police department to be as convenient as possible, but there was a scheduling conflict. So I would anticipate the next one might be over there but so yes it's a very transparent process and I would urge you to send emails you can go on the city website and you can send the council emails just by clicking their names on that it's very easy to do we get a lot of emails so if you feel strongly do it because if you don't somebody else will either on one side or the other. So that certainly is a good way and my guess is when you send us an email you'll probably get a response and you'll probably get a response from everybody. So I would anticipate this to be a very public process and I know from our perspective we want to hear your feedback and we want you to be part of the dialogue in the process, you know, as it unfolds. So I would say watch carefully over the next couple of months. The reason we sent out a mail invitation to this meeting is just to make sure that we didn't tell you you have to watch television or you have to follow our meetings to be notified and so we're certainly follow that practice. Yes, ma'am. I should know the answer to this but I can't remember. What are your plans for the old library? The old library was part of the redevelopment project. The game plan is the current proposal was we sold that property to the developers or about to. It will be torn down in a residential condo project will be built. Now I will just tell you in full disclosure this is not the greatest market for residential condos right now if you follow the market and I will tell you the city is having dialogue with the developers where they're wanting the city to consider other options than just residential condos. I think the conclusion has been, let's just watch how the market unfolds. It's sort of take a deep breath and continue the dialogue. The original game plan is they actually would take possession of the property February 1st and then very soon thereafter, tear down the building and start developing. I don't think that's gonna happen in that timeline. It doesn't mean it won't happen. I just don't think it's going to happen as quickly as we all anticipated it would happen. So, um, have we considered? I think it probably came up, I know, a dialogue with the City Council. Right now we have a signed agreement to sell it to the developers that's been in place for years, every, every several years since we developed it. That doesn't mean the council couldn't say, you know, what if you can't build the current plan then we're going to take it back. I don't, there's a lot of issues there because there is a signed contract in agreement. It doesn't mean it's never part of the consideration. It's not part of the existing agreement but that doesn't mean it won't change somewhere down the long line. In fact, it's already been suggested by at least one member of the council's the dialogue has gone forward. Anybody? Yeah, John. I just want to interject here. It's very easy to come to counsel, maybe to speak, to make a wish of life. And all of us involved in doing that. So you're going to have to speak louder, because I don't think this has to hear you at all. I'll come over here and talk to you a bit. It's very easy to get public hearing at council meeting. All you do is show up. There's a list that are clerk teams and you just sign your name that you want to speak and it's easy to get. So that's another option for staying involved in my new voice. For those of you who don't know our meetings are the second and fourth Tuesday of every month. They started seven o'clock and there is an agenda item after the regular public hearings. It says comments about public on any item that's not on the agenda as Joan said so you can come up and talk to us there as well. Any other comments that have not been shared or anybody has not had a chance to express a viewpoint or a question. If not, let me see if there are any, anybody and I know we need to wrap up here for timing and everything else. Is there anybody who has a burning comet they want to make that's already made a comment but wants to add something new to it? Yes, ma'am? I have a question all along the track. It's following tomorrow night. But now there's something about meeting. If you're about how many trees the golf course wants to cut down, it's making the green. Outside the top. Is there any other questions? I'll answer that question. Is there any other questions if not on the community center? It's 9 o'clock, which is probably a good ending. I know I certainly will stay here if there's any questions. Staff will be here. Everybody on the city council, why not everybody on the council just stand up in case somebody doesn't recognize their face if you want to corner any of the six members of the city council. Jeff Greenfield, Gary Rasmussen, Gail Lyme, Patrice Winter, Scott Silverthorn, Joan Cross are here. The question was, thank you very much by the way for coming out. We really do appreciate this. And I want to emphasize where at the beginning of the process, no decisions have been made. There's not any sort of secret of discussion or agreement that's been made. Your input's going to be very important and that's what a small town is all about and providing it. The question is, tomorrow night for those of you who certainly live along the Lehighway, I cannot read that prompt if you're giving me a, I can't, I'm sorry, I can't see it. Yes, there is a public hearing tomorrow night on Army Navy is considering tearing down some trees for expansion of the facility. It is on the agenda tomorrow night. The meeting starts at seven o'clock at City Hall. Thank you very much. you